GPUs & CPUs & Enthusiast hardware: Questions, Discussion and fanboy slap-fights - Nvidia & AMD & Intel - Separe but Equal. Intel rides in the back of the bus.

It wasn't just Bulldozer. AMD's foundry was never as good as Intel's, leading to all kinds of quality problems, and there would be compatibility issues once in a while. The fact that they dumped GF and are now on TSMC doesn't register. "We bought Opteron servers and they blew up, never buying AMD again," and that's the end of the story.

More recently, when Intel disabled AVX2 on AMD CPUs in MKL, many people assumed the problem was AMD. One colleague of mine was telling our customers, "Don't buy EPYC, because AVX2 is broken on those CPUs." Of course, then AMD's in-house alternative to MKL, libFlame, was a piece of shit, which certainly didn't help them any
That's pretty sad. I mentioned a server project in the future. I'm pretty sure now it's going to be a AMD 5000 series, power consumption and all that. Sucks people still have stereotypes about it because of a problem over 10 years ago.
You often see a new process node debut on mobile first, since the chips are smaller and clocked lower, thus not as sensitive to yield. Intel might be skipping 4 entirely for Arrow Lake desktop, but since Meteor Lake desktop got cancelled, we'll see.
So you're saying the best time to buy a new intel laptop is soon? Also interesting info.
 
Sucks people still have stereotypes about it because of a problem over 10 years ago.
I don't think I've seen a group get so caught up in the "I had a bad experience with company X 10 years ago, I'll never buy them ever again" than pc users. Usually it doesn't even have to happen to them personally, they just have to hear about it happening to some other random dude on twitter/ reddit.

Considering almost every company has had a messup at some point, it's amazing they can even find a brand to buy that passes muster.
 
That's pretty sad. I mentioned a server project in the future. I'm pretty sure now it's going to be a AMD 5000 series, power consumption and all that. Sucks people still have stereotypes about it because of a problem over 10 years ago.

I don't think I've seen a group get so caught up in the "I had a bad experience with company X 10 years ago, I'll never buy them ever again" than pc users. Usually it doesn't even have to happen to them personally, they just have to hear about it happening to domme other random dude on twitter.

Considering almost every company has had a messup at some point, it's amazing they can even find a brand to buy that passes muster.
Deep inertia like this is why so many things are the way they are. People will refuse to change unless they are painfully forced to.

Hey, is a EPYC 7282 a good CPU at $100?
 
I don't think I've seen a group get so caught up in the "I had a bad experience with company X 10 years ago, I'll never buy them ever again" than pc users. Usually it doesn't even have to happen to them personally, they just have to hear about it happening to some other random dude on twitter/ reddit.

Considering almost every company has had a messup at some point, it's amazing they can even find a brand to buy that passes muster.
Part of it is probably money. But the other part is wanting the "best". AMD broke once so it always will now. It's very autistic, which fits a lot of people into PCs honestly.
 
Part of it is probably money.
Yeah that's a factor. PC buyers, especially high end, will be the sort to tell you that "Pffft, a $2000 gpu is cheap compared to other hobbies" while simultaneously having a meltdown if they get a lemon $100 pc part.

Bonus points for comparisons to movie tickets/ cost of buying + owning a high end sports car.
 
Yeah that's a factor. PC buyers, especially high end, will be the sort to tell you that "Pffft, a $2000 gpu is cheap compared to other hobbies" while simultaneously having a meltdown if they get a lemon $100 pc part.

Bonus points for comparisons to movie tickets/ cost of buying + owning a high end sports car.
If someone tells me a 4090, a 2000 dollar gpu is "cheap", I want to know what they're smoking. I still think a 4070 super in the 600 dollar range is high, and that thing can play virtually any modern game at mid to high settings depending on what it is.
 
What kind of hobby is cheap compared to a $2000 video card? About all I can think of is fucking Warhammer. I don't even think model train spergs tend to spend that much.
Hiking: $2,000 is overkill. You have enough to buy perfect gear for any weather and money leftover for permits. I guess if you extend to camping the budgets get bigger, or if you include gas to get to hiking spots.

Photography: $2,000 barely gets you a decent camera+lens solution.

Firearms: $2,000 gets you a nice pistol and enough ammunition to get comfortable.

Racing: I mean, look at gas these days…

Costs of hobbies varies wildly. But something that’s different about traditional hobbies and building PCs is that PC parts will become obsolete much faster. For that I consider PC gaming to be a pretty expensive hobby even if you pirate everything. You can save a lot of money by being happy with lower resolutions and lower settings. There’s no reason to run at 4K Ultra for everything. It doesn’t affect gameplay.
 
My problem with graphics cards currently is that videogames that need high end ones are stupid slop I won't spend five minutes on, on the other hand for AI stuff, even the high end consumer graphics cards are severely underpowered and you do not get a lot of return on that investment. For 55 bucks a month you can rent quite a lot of server time with A100s. If you wanted to buy an A100, you'd have to add a zero to that 2000.
 
I don't think I've seen a group get so caught up in the "I had a bad experience with company X 10 years ago, I'll never buy them ever again" than pc users. Usually it doesn't even have to happen to them personally, they just have to hear about it happening to some other random dude on twitter/ reddit.

Considering almost every company has had a messup at some point, it's amazing they can even find a brand to buy that passes muster.
"fool me once..." and stuff.

there's also the difference between a getting fucked by statistics and dealing with a dud, or having to deal with a company's poor product or operation. if the company is shit and doesn't care in that aspect, why gamble your time and money if something changed, even 10 years later? even more so when you got stuff you know just works (until it doesn't and said company gets added to the shitlist itself).

 
"fool me once..." and stuff.

there's also the difference between a getting fucked by statistics and dealing with a dud, or having to deal with a company's poor product or operation. if the company is shit and doesn't care in that aspect, why gamble your time and money if something changed, even 10 years later? even more so when you got stuff you know just works (until it doesn't and said company gets added to the shitlist itself).

Because shit changes and it should be a basic human ability to re-evaluate a product lineup 10 years later?

If company is still shit, by all means pass. But if you instantly judge a product bad now just because a product they launched 4 generations ago was bad, that's just dumb. Asrock mobos come to mind.

No pc product "just works" and you can find someone having issues with literally anything from any brand.
 
Because shit changes and it should be a basic human ability to re-evaluate a product lineup 10 years later?

If company is still shit, by all means pass. But if you instantly judge a product bad now just because a product they launched 4 generations ago was bad, that's just dumb. Asrock mobos come to mind.

No pc product "just works" and you can find someone having issues with literally anything from any brand.
but why spend the time and effort re-evaluating when the shit you already have a) works and b) the next shit will most likely too based on past experience? it's much faster and simpler to check "is the next product from the company I'm already using shit? no? alright" than gamble, assuming you spend the time reading reviews first to make a conscious purchase. if it's shit you have to do that whole process anyway, but if it's not you don't, especially these days where it's mostly about features/price.

keep in mind I'm not talking about shilling for/against shit on the internet but how to buy stuff for yourself. what other people do with their time and money is not up to me.
 
Because shit changes and it should be a basic human ability to re-evaluate a product lineup 10 years later?

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.Especially if the last time it broke cost you over $1m in lost business.

If company is still shit, by all means pass.

AMD's last ROCm update broke everything. Again. There's a reason NVIDIA has something like an 80%-90% share of the GPU business, and that reason is AMD.
 
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I get that your thing is you have to relate everything to data center, but I'm talking average PC users.

I couldn't really care less about what data centers buy and for what reasons.

It'd be like if someone started talking home HVAC and I brought up the commercial air handlers I work in that you could park a semi inside of the filter area.
 
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I get that your thing is you have to relate everything to data center, but I'm talking average PC users.

And I was talking about Opterons here:

This particular discussion had been ongoing for three or four days when you jumped in.

I couldn't really care less about what data centers buy and for what reasons.

I don't care what you're not interested in. I'm not the only person in this thread who is interested in computers that aren't toys.

It'd be like if someone started talking home HVAC and I brought up the commercial air handlers I work in that you could park a semi inside of the filter area.

No, it'd be like if people were talking about CPUs ranging from laptops to servers, and you jumped in and demanded that every part of the conversation that didn't involve stuff you like immediately stop.
 
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