Hazbin Hotel / Helluva Boss Thread - Now a Griefing Thread

[AnOminous]

Are angels also ascended mortals same way demons are? Or are angels actually primordial?

I'd assume a mix because Adam's an angel now apparently. There are two kinds of sinners too, sinner demons who were once human and hellborn demons like imps and hellhounds (and royalty like Stolas).

I feel like the same has happened for this Angel/Husk pairing that the show has been trying to push. Angel/Husk was a pretty popular ship I recall after the pilot released, even though both characters only interacted like once in the pilot iirc.

I hate that ship and it utterly sucks they imported it.

 

[The Fair Lady]

I hate that ship and it utterly sucks they imported it.

HuskerDust is hot garbage and the fact they're forcing it so hard makes it even worse. Which is sad because they could've had a perfectly fine father/son relationship. For those who don't know, Husk is stated to have been in his 60's-70's when he died whereas Angel was in his 30's, so the ship is especially weird.

 

[Bob Barbas]

Are you sure it's not just
View attachment 5826956

Yeah on some level the whole "Web of crime" thing just sounds kind of retarded. Like okay, maybe on paper it sounds good but then you sit down to think about it and realize "Nah that's fucking stupid."

 

[Roger Dennis]

I think the only thing Viv cared about in this show were the songs. They’re shockingly decent. Not perfect, but definitely not unbearable.

What the fuck happened?

 

[Varretnon847]

Since there was discussion a little earlier about child sinners in HH, I just had this dumb thought. Since sinners don't seem to age, if you were to somehow get sent to hell as a child, then would you remain as a child indefinitely? Because that would suck.

 

[Boson]

What songs did y’all like the most and which the least?

 

[mindlessobserver]

Media aimed at children can tackle these issues, and do so well.

The sad thing is, the adults in charge of making this shit are too immature to deal with the subjects themselves.

It's just like when some of us claim to not want "politics" in our media, we don't really mean it. A lot of media does contain messages that could be interpreted as "political," and can pull it off quite well.

CS Lewis, Louis Sachar, Dave Pikley, Dr Seuss, even JK Rowling are able to insert political messages into their works, even those intended for children.

However, the people I speak of who do it are actually smart enough to do so effectively and intelligently.

The real problem we have is that the people who try to make such content do so very badly. Or they draw upon woke ideology, neo-marxist ideology, or LGBTQP ideology, which everyone knows in their hearts is bullshit, and only adult children (like Vivzie) find it remotely appealing.

I agree, I wasn't saying Kids shouldn't be exposed to complicated questions of politics and theology. I am saying the people making these sorts of things need to be adults. Not the viewers.

Why even have such a dumb rule? Clearly, the exorcists don't care who they kill, and Charlie would have more of a leg to stand on why she would want the exterminations to cease. The Hellborn are MORE like her people than Sinners, and they're getting stuck in the crossfire of something they don't even deserve.

At this point we should just assume viv doesn't have a clue how to world build. After all, Charlie is not just a hellborne, she's literally the princess of hell, and in the finale of Season 1 she basically reveals her powerlevel as a literal demon prince. The exorcists went after her "first" which not only broke the supposed compact, but pretty much triggered an outright war between Heaven and Hell by drawing out Lucifer.

Now, this could still be done, if Viv bothered to spend the time, you know, explaining the rationale. Maybe a couple episodes focusing solely on Heaven and how Lute and Adam decided to go behind Sera's back for reasons important to them.

The show is just...Rushed. Viv seems to have grand ideas in her head, but has absolutely no clue how to actually pull them all together into a logical whole.

 

[The Fair Lady]

What songs did y’all like the most and which the least?

Favorites - Hell is Forever, You Didn't Know, Respectless, Stayed Gone
Least favorites - Welcome to Heaven, Whatever it Takes (though I love Zestial's part)

I like most of them tbh.

 

[Retink Retunk]

What songs did y’all like the most and which the least?

That's a tough one, I don't think any of the songs are amazing as they're all ok at best, but favorites would be Hell's Greatest Dad, which was ruined by the ending, Respectless, which seemed to force the name of the song into itself too much, and maybe Stayed Gone, but that also fell apart midway through. The worst by far for me was Out for Love, that was just shit and forced.

I am saying the people making these sorts of things need to be adults. Not the viewers.

That's the annoying thing about it, good animation and ideas ruined by juvenile antics and the inability to make an interesting point besides shit edgy teenagers like, example of that being heaven is as bad as hell or capitalism is le heckin' bad.

 

[mindlessobserver]

Since there was discussion a little earlier about child sinners in HH, I just had this dumb thought. Since sinners don't seem to age, if you were to somehow get sent to hell as a child, then would you remain as a child indefinitely? Because that would suck.

If we want to get theological, this really depends on the denomination. In Roman Catholicism, a Baptized babe dies innocent and is immediately redeemed. Unbaptized children are sent to Limbo where their souls will mature in Purgatory. If they pass judgement at this point they will be ascended to heaven. This is probably the origin of Viv's "Redemption after Death" mythos incidentally.

Protestant theology is a bit more...complicated and really depends on who you ask. But in general its assumed children are redeemed immediately.

All denominations agree however there is no such thing as children born in the afterlife. The transfiguration removes biological impulses. Including the need for reproduction. There is an argument to made even gender becomes a meaningless concept at this point.

The gnostic heresy has a bit more interesting take. Gnostic Christians believed in reincarnation, so their assumption is a Soul that failed to be judged, as in the case of dead baby, returns to the creator for another go around. While the Gnostics have other issues, I rather like this particular facet of their theology. The entire concept of Catholic Purgatory (which I don't like) probably stems from Gnostic reincarnation. IMO from a protestant perspective our lives already ARE Purgatory. We are put on this world to be judged. If we pass judgement we ascend. If we don't we are condemned. But in the case of a failure to render judgement, a just God would indeed reincarnate a soul.

 

[Bob Barbas]

Can't have a righteous serial killer if he is getting off to it.

Honestly I think this just all comes back to what annoys me the most about the show, is Vivz is too much of a pussy to have genuinely bad people in the show. At least not on the level you'd expect to find in hell. It's always some whiney fag shit.

Where the fuck are the serial killers that ejaculated on their victim's corpses? Like again this is fucking HELL right? Why is it all just literal and metaphorical faggots? Where are the genuinely depraved motherfuckers?

Oh right they just cease to exist or whatever because Vivz is a bitch and can't commit to the bit.

 

[InJailOutSoon]

I genuinely would not be surprised if Viv took a lot of things from the pilot Hazbin fanworks to use in the show. I remember those theories and fanworks about Vaggie being a fallen angel/former Exterminator, even though it had been established that she was a sinner from (I believe) El Salvador.

I assume Viv also didn't want to get into a controversy on why Vaggie is in Hell. At first, Vaggie was a sex worker who got murdered. People would accuse that's slut shaming or something since sex work is valid nowadays. Then, it was heavily implied that Vaggie committed suicide, and I know that would open up a whole can of worms. So, Viv probably decided to choose the best option and just say Vaggie was originally an angel. Now, whether or not Vaggie was first a human, we don't know yet. Frankly, I can't tell which one I would rather prefer.

Where the fuck are the serial killers that ejaculated on their victim's corpses?

You made me think of Satellite City when you mentioned that...maybe it's for the best that was not shown in Hazbin Hotel lmao

 

[Bob Barbas]

You made me think of Satellite City when you mentioned that...maybe it's for the best that was not shown in Hazbin Hotel lmao

In fairness I am being a bit facetious and hyperbolic.
But my point stands.

I think the truth is obviously that deep inside Vivz knows you can't "fix" someone who is genuinely fucking deranged. But again, this is probably why it would've been a better idea for this series to take place in some version of Limbo rather than Hell itself.

 

[Yeshuash]

If we want to get theological, this really depends on the denomination. In Roman Catholicism, a Baptized babe dies innocent and is immediately redeemed. Unbaptized children are sent to Limbo where their souls will mature in Purgatory. If they pass judgement at this point they will be ascended to heaven. This is probably the origin of Viv's "Redemption after Death" mythos incidentally.

Protestant theology is a bit more...complicated and really depends on who you ask. But in general its assumed children are redeemed immediately.

All denominations agree however there is no such thing as children born in the afterlife. The transfiguration removes biological impulses. Including the need for reproduction. There is an argument to made even gender becomes a meaningless concept at this point.

The gnostic heresy has a bit more interesting take. Gnostic Christians believed in reincarnation, so their assumption is a Soul that failed to be judged, as in the case of dead baby, returns to the creator for another go around. While the Gnostics have other issues, I rather like this particular facet of their theology. The entire concept of Catholic Purgatory (which I don't like) probably stems from Gnostic reincarnation. IMO from a protestant perspective our lives already ARE Purgatory. We are put on this world to be judged. If we pass judgement we ascend. If we don't we are condemned. But in the case of a failure to render judgement, a just God would indeed reincarnate a soul.

The unbaptized children go to limbo/purgatory is not Catholic doctrine. That's from Dante's Divine Comedy.

 

[AnOminous]

The unbaptized children go to limbo/purgatory is not Catholic doctrine. That's from Dante's Divine Comedy.

A lot of Catholics do believe that but it isn't in the Catechism which basically says it's up to God. Not even the Vatican has taken a definitive position on the issue. This is about as close as they have to an official position and is not itself canon.

https://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/cti_documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20070419_un-baptised-infants_en.html

At first, Vaggie was a sex worker who got murdered. People would accuse that's slut shaming or something since sex work is valid nowadays.

And now we have no reason for those silly Xes that were previously supposed to have something to do with how the sinner died. And the even more retarded implication is maybe she was human, got murdered, actually became an angel, but then got sent to Hell for REFUSING to murder a child.

 

[Seventh Star]

Frankly, I can't tell which one I would rather prefer.

The answer is none. This woman is a pathetic spineless pussy. She is only still going with the show because of contract, she has no passion for the show anymore at all, it's the type of tumblr girl that has fifty projects and side projects and side projects to those projects that never go anywhere.

Also lets not get autistic about christianity, show's not that deep to be woth it, even if it drove me to read about early Christian denominations at 4 AM.

 

[PS1gamenwatch]

The answer is none. This woman is a pathetic spineless pussy. She is only still going with the show because of contract, she has no passion for the show anymore at all, it's the type of tumblr girl that has fifty projects and side projects and side projects to those projects that never go anywhere.

Also lets not get autistic about christianity, show's not that deep to be woth it, even if it drove me to read about early Christian denominations at 4 AM.

And people still associate the show with that Verbalase video

 

[FatalTater]

What songs did y’all like the most and which the least?

I can't tell.
A couple songs I sort of liked but then I realized I just liked the tone of the singer's voice.
Some of them just remind me of other songs, either from musicals or from 1990s-2000s radio.
I had to listen to the music separately from the show in order to judge it, since the scenes did NOT flow together well to the point of making the whole thing irritating.

Now if you will excuse me I have to go try to get "Sincerely Me" from Dear Evan Hansen out of my head.

 

[InJailOutSoon]

What songs did y’all like the most and which the least?

If we're just going on the songs alone, then these are the ones I did like with no particular order:
"Stayed Gone" (This is probably my favorite song out of the season)
"Respectless" (The beat is just really catchy)
"Whatever It Takes" (Less for the lyrics and more for the instrumental; I'm a sucker for rock balleds)
"Loser, Baby" (Come on...you know why)
"Hell's Greatest Dad" (Love Sara Styles but she really shouldn't have interrupted thus song)
"More Than Anything" (Wish it was in a better show)

Musical wise? Uhhhhh...."Stayed Gone"....and that's it. It's the only song I felt had any proper buildup to be a musical number. From what I can remember, almost every other song just randomly popped in. (Or maybe I'm just biased because Vox sang it and he's one of the very, VERY few characters I liked in the show)

I probably mentioned this before somewhere, but I would seriously like to get a couple of my aunts opinions on this since they have actual experience in musical theater. They most likely have more knowledge on the subject than me. Then again, I would have to show them the show itself and....yeah, let's keep it that way.

 

[Resident Knievel]

I just hope future episodes wont each feature three musical sections...

Phrophetic