Hazbin Hotel / Helluva Boss Thread - Now a Griefing Thread

Do you believe that this series will turn to shit?


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This is only a joke you’d make if you’ve watched the whole first season. This seems like one of those things where he wants to make fun of the show for having gay retarded messaging (which it does) but also he clearly likes the show to some extent and has a soft spot for the characters. That Sir Pent is way too cute for someone who wants to make fun of furries lol

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Again I'm getting more "envy and jealously " vibes off stony lonesome with this one. It reads less like an insult and more like he wishes he didn't have right wing, borderline neo nazi stigma attached to his name so he could work WITH vivzie and spindle horse on the show. Probably thinks his writing could save it, a sort of "I can fix you" mentality.
 
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Sorry, this is unrelated and i'll go on some autismo rant: Let me try to think this backwards. Why do you need "legal permission" to go to earth? I cannot find a real reason, only fanon excuses. That implies you need certain qualification but Blitzo sure as hell has zero and this would not be a secret. There is no way the police doesn't know he went to earth and killed people. So it it can't be "interfering too much with earth upsets heaven/lucifer" (another fanon). But it that's "legal" then what could possibly be "illegal"?
Honestly, the core issue is that in HB Hell is too separated off from Heaven, and in doing that, they made rules and regulations make no sense. Going to get a little spergy, but if they had one guy well versed in even the Old Testimate, the answer would be simple, the demons that are legally allowed to go to earth are the Jewish rendition of “satan” as seen in the Book of Job, and have/need express permission from Heaven/God to spread sin and tempt humans. This can serve Two Purposes.

1: Since Heaven is involved, you now have an excuse to temper what your characters can and can’t do. Sure Succubi can seduce humans, but they can’t use lust powers on them, it must be consensual, and oh look, your gooner bait race is now less problematic. Infesters can posses humans, but they can only whisper to them and implant ideas, the human must act on that idea themselves. You can show how they manipulate humans, but when they fight other demons, oh look, they were actually holding back and now IMP are in a fight of their lives.

2: it adds a reason that BLitzo needs an unregulated book. Heaven focuses on the masses, and him going through legal channels will bring him face to face with the Heavenly Host, and even if he lies about why he needs it, they will know when the crystal or other means to reach earth is used, and IMP will then have eyes on them at all times making sure their approved mission statement is not violated. However, someone like Stolas is a non-entity. Powerful? Relatively speaking, yes. But what’s he going to do with access to the mortal realm aside from his farce that the Goetia call duties? Whine on reddit about his wife and how gay and sad he is to get karma? Join some Role Play server on Discord and live out a gay fantasy he can jack it to afterwards? He might go to some furry convention. Oh no. The book is a blind spot, and that’s what just what Blitzo needs. The sins, even the devil himself won’t care he’s killing humans, because they despise humans, why would it come up in a trial? But Heaven would care. And if the angels found out, issues would arise and consequences would be certain. (How many of us would pay for an animation were one angle beats the ever loving snot out of Stolas and/or IMP for the crap they pulled)

Issue? This is something I pulled out of my ass this morning a minute after reading this comment. Bigger issue? This requires Heaven to be good and hell to be bad. It requires an actual knowledge of scripture and theology and bending it just enough without it snapping. In trying to be the edgy pre-teen what if heaven bad hell good, but still keeping hell as hell because HH is about redemption, you can see that the world building is twisted into this gordian knot of terrible.
 
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Sorry for the autistic rambling, it's just, the show had an actually well thought out premise that only works due to how the world built itsef.
This is why Vivz is so frustrating as a creator and as a lolcow. Most animation cows just entirely suck and have no redeeming features, with the exception of people like John K (who obviously influenced Vivz to some extent although I think she has denounced him like everyone else has), who has no personally redeeming features, but actually did contribute to animation.

Vivz seems to have the ability to come up with good ideas and then totally wreck them.
 
In an earlier post I made a point about how the sinners being more powerful than hellborn doesn't make sense since lucifer doesn't like them so I'd reverse it. One way I would is they are not only slaves but are also resources that are immortal and are exploited endlessly by the other denizens. If you have any ideas of how it would look like let me know.
 
Infesters can posses humans, but they can only whisper to them and implant ideas, the human must act on that idea themselves.
This is basically Wormwood from The Screwtape Letters. This whole series would have benefitted greatly from Vivzie actually studying C.S. Lewis. Nobody else has done demons better in a work of fiction, odd considering that he was a devout Christian, and despite not being Catholic, writes like one (that is a compliment if coming from me). Or maybe not so odd.
 
So is the joke that Viv hates Christianity, or that Charlie hates Jesus?
the Joke is Viv doesn't understand christianity and Charlie's thoughts are literally Jesus' thoughts
WRONG! The joke is that Sneed's Feed & Seed is supposed to be called Chuck's Feeduck and Seeduck.

But yes, Vivianne doesn't understand Christianity outside of a small crash course. It's almost as if she created a "High Fantasy" version of it.
How does this help Asmodeus at all tho?
It doesn't. Because she likes Ass-mon-dorkeus, he can do shit like pull a deus ex machina and such.
Oh Abel. It's sad, isn't it? Worse yet: you and "Sim Pete" will be lover fags, never mind that the real Abel and especially apostle Peter would beat the shit out of someone for questioning his sexuality.
 
Seeing a lot of people talk about the legality of Hellborn going to Earth and all that jazz, I decided to put in my own shitty thoughts on the subject. Incoming long tangent:

In Season 1, there was some hinting of how the rules of travel to Earth worked; you got to go if it was part of your duty as a certain species. For succubi/incubi, it is to seduce humans to be lustful. You can even make the argument that hellhounds could go to Earth as well to serve as bodyguards for other Hellborn since they are naturally stronger. Now there are strict guidelines to follow when you're up there. You can't let humans know that you're a demon (otherwise you get a DHORKS situation), and you can only use your powers on human for them to commit the sin you represent. They serve as a temptation. Why? My guess back then was that the more humans to commit the sin, the more powerful that Deadly Sin becomes.

Now here is where IMP comes to play. Imps obviously aren't supposed to go up to Earth. They don't have human disguises, no powers, and (before the whole asmodeus crystal reveal) no way to get up to Earth. The only way our main crew was able to was because Stolas lent them his grimoire (which in hindsight is very stupid on Stolas' part because it seems you don't have to have any inherit power to be able to do the spells. Meaning that if IMP wanted to, they could have used any of the spells in that book.) So now IMP is able to go up to Earth, not only just revealing to humans that they are demons, but killing them as well. Even if you ignore Hazbin Hotel's overpopulation plot point, the fact that IMP is just killing humans willy-nilly goes against hellborn tempting humans to commit sins. Which should be a big no-no for the Deadly Sins.

Now how has IMP gotten away with their business for season 1? Well even though they do advertise it, it's not very well done mind you. They have a commercial that is ran on channel almost no one watches at a time when it is least viewed. And they have a billboard that is more nonsense than actual advertisement. And this is in the location of IMP city which is most likely inhabited by other Imps. And I doubt imps are going to be blabbering this to any of the higher-ups. And any Sinner that passes by? They don't give two shits about the legality of this business and will probably just use it.

There's also just IMP getting away with this by sheer luck alone. Verosika can't spill on them because she'll get in trouble for causing a fish to turn into a monster by the booze she was drinking. The Cherubs can't tell Heaven because they've been kicked out. And no one believed the DHORKS. Of course, that doesn't mean that their luck won't run out. Stolas has to reprimand them for getting caught because if they get in a trouble, HE gets in trouble for giving his grimoire to them. And you could suspect that time would be coming eventually.

Of course, this never happened because the show decided to become a yaoi drama in season 2, basically scrubbing away any of those potential stakes in season 1. It's why the asmodeus crystal even exists in the first place; so Stolas could give that to Blitzø so he didn't have to have sex with him anymore to do his business. (Though he could have just also continue to give out the book without the sex contract attached to it no more, but whatever.)
 
Now how has IMP gotten away with their business for season 1? Well even though they do advertise it, it's not very well done mind you. They have a commercial that is ran on channel almost no one watches at a time when it is least viewed. And they have a billboard that is more nonsense than actual advertisement. And this is in the location of IMP city which is most likely inhabited by other Imps. And I doubt imps are going to be blabbering this to any of the higher-ups. And any Sinner that passes by? They don't give two shits about the legality of this business and will probably just use it.
if the pilot is cannon then they have been seen on live human tv
 
if the pilot is cannon then they have been seen on live human tv
It's not. Unless the new episode is going to be a redo of said pilot. Which would make the new episode canon.

If that's the case, I can't wait for that episode to ruin more of the lore and continuity of the show.
 
Of course, this never happened because the show decided to become a yaoi drama in season 2, basically scrubbing away any of those potential stakes in season 1.
Ultimately, a lot of these minute lore details will be either hand waved or overlooked in service of the show being a comedy. No doubt there's an entire page on TV Tropes of autists filling in these gaps, but I wouldn't hold your breath for a more thorough explanation in season 3.
 
This is basically Wormwood from The Screwtape Letters. This whole series would have benefitted greatly from Vivzie actually studying C.S. Lewis. Nobody else has done demons better in a work of fiction, odd considering that he was a devout Christian, and despite not being Catholic, writes like one (that is a compliment if coming from me). Or maybe not so odd.
Lewis hung around with Catholics like JRR Tolkien (who was disappointed when he became an Anglican) and was greatly influenced by Catholic writers like GK Chesterton, so it's not so surprising that he knew how to write like one. He was also a great fan of mythology and occultism as a young man and studied Norse, Greek, and Celtic mythology and the Icelandic sagas, all of which no doubt had some effect on his writing later in life.

I'm actually glad you brought him up, because Lewis is a really good illustration of the problem with so many modern-day creatives and why so many of them seem to pale in comparison with people like him. Lewis was a very smart man with a vivid imagination who was incredibly well-read and intellectually curious. He also had a life full of experiences, both positive and negative, that went on to influence him as a writer, person, and theologian. His mother died when he was a kid and he was left with a distant and demanding father and got shuttled around to various schools and tutors. He served in WWI as an infantry officer, lost several friends, and was nearly killed himself by an errant artillery shell. One of his friends who died had asked him to look after his mother if he was killed, and Lewis took this request so seriously that he went to live with her and spent the rest of her life taking care of her. He rejected his Christian faith as a teenager and spent a long time, as he put it, being "very angry with God for not existing" and "equally angry with him for creating a world." He ultimately returned to Christianity after years of atheism thanks to the influence of his friends Tolkien and Hugo Dyson and wound up becoming one of the foremost lay theologians the Church of England ever produced. All throughout his academic career, he worked with and taught many very smart people, and his friends in the Inklings, including Tolkien, Owen Barfield, and Charles Williams, helped him refine the Space Trilogy and the Narnia series. They also occasionally did competitions where they read aloud from the books of legendarily shitty author Amanda McKittrick Ros to see who could read her drivel the longest without laughing, so sitting around and mocking no-talent lolcows over a beer is a grand and honorable tradition that we should all be proud of.

Vivzie has not lived anything like this kind of life. She's gone from Christian to atheist and her parents are divorced, but those things happen all the time and don't seem to have had a major impact on her. She has had no great tragedies, no struggles, no friends to challenge her beliefs or help her refine her work. She can't take criticism, she doesn't seem to want to do any kind of research beyond the most basic background stuff, and she is incapable of stepping outside her own perspective to look at the world through someone else's eyes. She's certainly not alone in this among current-day creatives, but she's a good example of the problem with them. William Faulkner once said that "A writer needs three things, experience, observation, and imagination, any two of which, at times any one of which, can supply the lack of the others." Vivzie clearly has an imagination, damaged as it is by a steady diet of Tumblr bullshit and low-denominator pop culture, but she has no experiences or observational skills worth a damn and all of her creative output demonstrates that fact. She has the skeletons of interesting and provocative stories in HH and HB, but she's buried them under a sloppy, rancid pile of Tumblrina-level drama, pointless edginess, and yaoi-fangirl shipping, because that's all she knows how to write and she's never going to be able to evolve beyond that without some major changes to her perspective and patterns of thought.
 
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(Though he could have just also continue to give out the book without the sex contract attached to it no more, but whatever.)
Stolas wanted to be in a relationship with Blitzo, though. If he was still loaning out the book there would always be doubt (even if just in his mind) that Blitzo was only sleeping with him for access to it.

Of course he goes about it in the most pants-shittingly retarded way a) demanding the Grimoire back with no explanation and b) "freeing" Blitzo and giving him the choice to stay or go, only to get pissy when Blitz doesn't react the way he wants.
 
Stolas wanted to be in a relationship with Blitzo, though. If he was still loaning out the book there would always be doubt (even if just in his mind) that Blitzo was only sleeping with him for access to it.

Of course he goes about it in the most pants-shittingly retarded way a) demanding the Grimoire back with no explanation and b) "freeing" Blitzo and giving him the choice to stay or go, only to get pissy when Blitz doesn't react the way he wants.
I felt a lot was left out from that scene when watching it for the first time. It's like watching a horror movie where the characters end up making the worst choice possible and you're left yelling at the screen.
 
ok boys
She's a 10/10 but when you get to her place she breaks this out
What do you do?
"Babe this boardgame is fun and all but can you explain me why we stopped doing hitman jobs midway through and are now recollecting 'romantic tokens' to go out on a date with a giant bird?"

Amanda McKittrick Ros
You guys need to check out the history of this woman, she was basically 20th century Vivziepop:
She named characters as fruits (Lord Raspberry, Cherry Raspberry, Sir Peter Plum, Christopher Currant, the Earl of Grape, Madame Pear), used thinly veiled insults to publish her displeasure at critics calling them amongst other things ‘talent tarnishers’ and ‘critising crowdrops’ and had a hatred for lawyers in particular after a failed court case, vilifying them with elaborate and hatefilled eulogies.
Ros wrote that her critics lacked sufficient intellect to appreciate her talent, and that they conspired against her for revealing the corruption of society's ruling classes, thereby disturbing "the bowels of millions".
A reader sent a copy of Irene to humorist Barry Pain, who in an 1898 review called it "a thing that happens once in a million years", and sarcastically termed it "the book of the century". He reported that he was initially entertained, but soon "shrank before it in tears and terror". Ros retorted by branding Pain a "clay crab of corruption" and wrote a twenty-page preface to her second novel, Delina Delaney, in which she disparaged Pain at length and suggested that he was so hostile only because he was secretly in love with her.But Ros claimed to have made enough money from Delina Delaney to build a house, which she named Iddesleigh.
 
It's not. Unless the new episode is going to be a redo of said pilot. Which would make the new episode canon.

If that's the case, I can't wait for that episode to ruin more of the lore and continuity of the show.
I think this is worse than Disney Star Wars continuity
 
Stolas wanted to be in a relationship with Blitzo, though. If he was still loaning out the book there would always be doubt (even if just in his mind) that Blitzo was only sleeping with him for access to it.

Of course he goes about it in the most pants-shittingly retarded way a) demanding the Grimoire back with no explanation and b) "freeing" Blitzo and giving him the choice to stay or go, only to get pissy when Blitz doesn't react the way he wants.
I feel like that could have still worked the same with him just lending the grimoire with no strings attached. It would definitely even the playing field between them and give Blitzø the choice whether he wanted a more personal relationship with Stolas or not. It's better then "let me take a book and not offer you an explanation for the next ten seconds so you can worry about your livelihood for that amount of time before I give you a crystal that basically means you're owned by Asmodeus now, but it's fine because he doesn't care how his crystals are used and we're just friends now...until the trial where he basically does shit for either of us though it would be really easy to make a counterargument for the accusations that are being spouted out."

Anyway, the infamous Full Moon scene doesn't work because they're speed-running through the drama because the episode decided to waste it's time on a plot that didn't add up to anything for the ending. Kind of like Sinsmas did.
 
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