HBO's The Wire - You come at the king, you best not miss.

DumbDude43 said:
meanwhile marlo never wanted out, but got forced out by the plea deal. he got everything stringer dreamed of, without having to try at all, but it's worthless to him because all he ever cared about was the game and the street cred, and that is now lost to him.
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Based on the dirt from the Stanfield case, if he tries to be a player again, he'll potentially get life and everybody involved (the cops, his lawyer, Levy, and the DA lady) will get prison time as well. No way he'll just leave. I would think that Levy would get Marlo killed to protect himself.
 
Gravityqueen4life said:
Whats your thoughts on season 2?
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when i first watched it i disliked it because it was such a radical break from season 1, almost felt like i accidentally watched a different show entirely
but after watching the rest of the show i like it. seeing how the greek and his trafficking organisation (and the union guys who are in his pocket) run the smuggling and fencing side of the criminal underworld kind of completes the big picture the show tries to paint.
 
Season 2 is the best season be cause it's about white people problems, season 5 is borderline unwatchable because David (((Simon))) is airing out all of his journalist dirty laundry. All in all because of how incomplete season 4 feels without season 5 and just how bad season 5 is, I honestly can't recommend it above Oz.

Making this thread the day before I finished watching it was way too unsubtle, gangstalker child.
 
You know it would never be made today because most of the explicit racism is experienced by the white characters, or weaponized by grifters like Clay Davis to their own ends. Prez gets in trouble twice while the black cop in Season 4 just effortlessly enjoys his unimpeded police brutality. Carcetti can only win by splitting the black vote between two candidates because he is a white guy in a black town, and Rawls can't become Commissioner while there is a white mayor due to racial politics.

Gravityqueen4life said:
Whats your thoughts on season 2?
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Probably the one that a lot of people consider either the best or worst season. I personally liked it, especially given that one of its overarching themes of deindustrialization has just become far more pertinent over the past two decades.
 
for all of seasons 5's many faults the serial killer analysis that just describes mcnulty was pretty great
 
Gravityqueen4life said:
Whats your thoughts on season 2?
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I like the big tittied whore who was riding McNulty. It’s the most realistic season in terms of how shit actually works but unsurprisingly that’s the time when HBO told David Simon that he needed for focus more on the niggers or else they were going to yank his show. White working class issues give (((media executives))) the ick unless they’re cartoonish losers like Justified.

The Wire is a pretty good show. I found it annoying how they had some niggers talk like philosophers but in the end it didn’t do them any good. No way could it be made today.
 
The Hardest R said:
I found it annoying how they had some niggers talk like philosophers but in the end it didn’t do them any good.
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The Wire is the ultimate problematic show for liberals. The white characters, and cops, are alcoholics and general messes but are usually on the right side of the political and social issues. Like gang violence or open air drug dealing. So they would placate liberals by having the cops filled with major character flaws or immoral behaviors. Then the black characters are almost always on the wrong side of the law, committing murders and spreading drug addiction misery, so to compensate the writers have them sound like Shakespearean stage characters. Then end up overcompensating in both directions.

It's the reason that they had McNulty become such a huge loser in the last season. To show that they didn't want to promote the 'white savior' trope. And why they had McNulty act like a moron and rage over Bodie getting killed like he would care. When he knew that Bodie had killed multiple people including the teenager Wallace which crushed a major case against top drug dealers.

The HBO series We Own This City is clearly an apology attempt for some stories on The Wire.
The Hardest R said:
No way could it be made today.
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Pretty much all of the good shows from the 90s or 2000s could not be remade without making them politically correct. And lots of those shows have received a politically correct remake or spinoff or movie to apologize to the public for wrongthink. Like the awful Sopranos movie, Justified's horrible sequel series, the new Dexter series, Mayans MC for Son of Anarchy.
 
The Hardest R said:
I found it annoying how they had some niggers talk like philosophers but in the end it didn’t do them any good.
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The Jew lawyer spells it out in season 5 that Stringer was his house nigger and later he comes as close to owning Marlo, who's essentially castrated, as he possibly can. Granted they did retroactively make Stringer dumber and dumber, and his actual failings are more interesting than how they try to frame it later in the show, but it is saying something about niggas that be talkin like Sephiroth.
 
Most based show of all time, especially the way it portrayed the insane double standards of black politician's blatant anti-white bigotry and entitlement for simply being black in a black-majority city and the resulting rampant corruption.

Whites eating constant shit from the black majority, etc.
 
Ziggy killed himself. Could have something to do with being raped, a history of drug use (he got sober), and the Baltimore prosecutors not taking his case.

James Ransone, who played Ziggy Sobotka in “The Wire” and a host of other HBO roles has died. He was 46.

Ransone died by suicide in LA on Friday, according to the Los Angeles County Medical Examiner.

He was a married father of two, and wife Jamie McPhee posted a fundraiser for the National Alliance on Mental Illness (NAMI) in her social media profile.

Ransone’s cause of death was listed as “hanging,” while his place of death was listed as “shed.” His body is ready for release, the LA County Medical Examiner’s records stated.
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In 2021, Ransone came forward as a sexual abuse survivor.

The actor said that his former tutor, Timothy Rualo, sexually abused him numerous times at his childhood home in Phoenix, Maryland, over the course of six months in 1992.

Ransone made the accusation public by posting a lengthy note on Instagram that he sent his alleged sexual abuser.
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The IG post has been deleted, but here's a copy of it from the Post:

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TheHarbinger said:
It's the reason that they had McNulty become such a huge loser in the last season. To show that they didn't want to promote the 'white savior' trope. And why they had McNulty act like a moron and rage over Bodie getting killed like he would care. When he knew that Bodie had killed multiple people including the teenager Wallace which crushed a major case against top drug dealers.
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Herc gets the shit end of the stick, too. At the close of season 1 he's obviously learned something and is striving to be a better cop, while Carver ratted his way to an unearned promotion. Come season 2, Herc is back to his old self. I am dead certain Herc and Carver swapped arcs for racial purposes.

But! That being said, this is such an unflinchingly honest depiction of urban blight and instituional corruption that it's led to some truly hilarious interpretations that drive David Simon up a wall ... no doubt because these interpretations are completely defensible.

Twitter gadfly Zodiac Motherfucker posted what's probably the pithiest example of this several years ago:

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Mola Ram said:
Herc gets the shit end of the stick, too. At the close of season 1 he's obviously learned something and is striving to be a better cop, while Carver ratted his way to an unearned promotion. Come season 2, Herc is back to his old self. I am dead certain Herc and Carver swapped arcs for racial purposes.
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The show does the same with Daniels. He's a drug dealer cop before the show starts. The FBI has him dealing close to $500K in stolen drugs. He then uses the money to buy a fancy home, expensive fundraiser tickets, and his wife a political career. By the end of the show he's a politically connected attorney dating a judge and it's played like a happy romance story.
Mola Ram said:
But! That being said, this is such an unflinchingly honest depiction of urban blight and instituional corruption that it's led to some truly hilarious interpretations that drive David Simon up a wall ... no doubt because these interpretations are completely defensible.
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Ed Burns made the first four seasons. David Simon made the last one. The second season is probably the most anti-union movie or show ever made. As they literally have the local unions running drugs and sex slaves. And even one of the characters, the father of Nick, says that it would be better for the ports to shut down than to get involved in heroin.
 
Waifu Denier said:
Probably the one that a lot of people consider either the best or worst season. I personally liked it, especially given that one of its overarching themes of deindustrialization has just become far more pertinent over the past two decades.
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You know the part where they are walking down to the parts of the dock that are no longer in use, the rats scurrying around, weeds growing out the cracked tarmac and concrete. Fucking real man, painfully real.
 
TheHarbinger said:
The show does the same with Daniels. He's a drug dealer cop before the show starts. The FBI has him dealing close to $500K in stolen drugs. He then uses the money to buy a fancy home, expensive fundraiser tickets, and his wife a political career. By the end of the show he's a politically connected attorney dating a judge and it's played like a happy romance story.
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To be fair, Daniels' redemption arc comes in the first season, from ambitious company man to good po-leece. And he's suitably punished for daring to do a good job. As for his happy romance ending, well, guy kinda deserved it after the huge ration of shit he had to eat from his awful, awful wife. Seriously, Marla Daniels ranks as one of the most obnoxious characters, right up there with Scott Templeton.

I do think they softballed whatever his corruption issue was. It only comes back in the final season just to keep him from becoming Commissioner. I don't know that this was a racial thing, because Christ knows the show was never shy about showing corrupt black officials. Sheeeeeee-it! Maybe Daniels was just one of those popular characters they cleaned up a bit, sort of a precursor (and significantly less egregious) Tyrion Lannister.

TheHarbinger said:
Ed Burns made the first four seasons. David Simon made the last one. The second season is probably the most anti-union movie or show ever made. As they literally have the local unions running drugs and sex slaves. And even one of the characters, the father of Nick, says that it would be better for the ports to shut down than to get involved in heroin.
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I've always wondered how much Burns was responsible for as opposed to Simon. That Simon was the creative force behind season 5 explains why it royally shit the bed on the Baltimore Sun storyline. I've always kind of suspected that, though, because that's where all the nuanced characters the show is famous for completely vanish. Everyone at the Sun is a 2D cutout, one of Noble Veteran Journalist, Bright-Eyed Journeyman Journalist, Company Man Sellout, or Evil Fabulist. Gus is an unapologetic Mary Sue, obviously Simon's self-insert ... and black, which says so much about Simon you gotta laugh.
 
TheHarbinger said:
Ed Burns made the first four seasons. David Simon made the last one.
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This is the truth of it. I'm not gonna completely shit in Simon, the best bits of The Wire and The Corner directly come from his books that he wrote based on real life things he saw while a journalist in Baltimore. But it's also obvious that, in the realm of tv, he's not the strongest link. This is also true for Homicide Life on the Street, which is also, at least in the first season, based on some of his work. But that season was done by Tom Fontana, who later went on to do Oz, another show that fell way off. Fontana stayed on for other seasons, but it seems like his influence began to lessen with time. By the end, it was more David Simon and Eric Overmeyers' show, and you could tell.

The cracks really began to show with David Simon with Treme. Now, I didn't hate Treme, I even enjoyed parts of it. But it definitely had a more shitlibby bent than The Wire. The Wire worked because you could watch it, regardless of political leaning, and get something out of it. It criticized cops, drug dealers, politicians, the whole system in general.
 
StimulatedOrb said:
You know the part where they are walking down to the parts of the dock that are no longer in use, the rats scurrying around, weeds growing out the cracked tarmac and concrete. Fucking real man, painfully real.
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I will say, as someone watching the show for the first time, while I think season 1 is better overall, the last montage of the pier honestly got me pretty good. I'm also kind of taken aback at how much of a "bottle season" 2 is feeling like as I watch 3, very little of it feels connected, which honestly is disappointing. I knew that season 2 wasn't as well received due to going in a completely different direction but man this is very much a U-turn story wise if I've ever seen one, even if the end of season 2 was building up to going back to the Barksdale storyline. It's just disappointing not seeing characters like Beadie return, even if most them did sort of wrap up their arc by the end of 2.

Also obligatory McNulty image:
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fake farts said:
The cracks really began to show with David Simon with Treme.
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Generation Kill was another Ed Burns project that still holds up well because he could veto anything from David Simon.
fake farts said:
The Wire worked because you could watch it, regardless of political leaning, and get something out of it. It criticized cops, drug dealers, politicians, the whole system in general.
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There is an HBO series called We Own This City that is almost written like a parody of The Wire. It's written on behalf of the system. Where you have characters openly praising the politicians and social justice workers. And tons of scenes where characters turn to the camera to preach to the audience.
 
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