He doesn't understand and doesn't realize this

[TheRetroReplay]

I'm not overestimating him, I think that Chris understands what reality is, but that doesn't mean he won't try and change it. We all understand how reality works although we do have wishful thinking, things that we think about that would change reality in our favor once in awhile. We know that wishful thinking will only work if we act upon and work to make the wishful thinking a reality as long as we stay grounded in reality and know that its something that is possible to do.

Chris is the same way, he knows how reality works and also has wishful thinking, but he takes it to a very far extreme. He tries to change reality into his favor with his wishful thinking, that's where all his, as you put it, crazy voodoo spells, come from. It's Chris understanding reality, but rejecting it because it doesn't favor him and trying to substitute his own, regardless of how outlandish it is.

A preindustrial society is somewhat similar to how Chris thinks the world works but it's more trial and error and snake oil salesmen. Remember in those days where you'd have the traveling salesman that would sell a cures all what ails you wonder tonic? It didn't work and would probably kill you but that didn't stop people from trying. I think Chris's thinking understanding is more like faith healing, you know it doesn't work but you pray that it does.

But the whole idea of trying to change reality on the (relatively) huge levels that Chris tries to is contrary to the idea of reality. Some people have lucky charms or attend church and things like that, but in their normal, everyday lives, they still know they have to stick to trusting people like mechanics with their cars and doctors with their bodies and cooks with their food. Essentially, people don't bet the farm on shamanistic beliefs unless they're about to die from cancer or something like that.

Chris constantly relies on his crazy voodoo and believes he has an impact on the world around him. And I wouldn't call that understanding reality.

But you're completely missing the point I'm making, I'm saying that Chris rejects reality and substitutes what he wants for something that favors him. For example, Chris knows that his life sucks, that's understanding reality. Chris refuses to accept that his life sucks, that's rejecting reality. Chris makes up things to make himself feel better like his voodoo curses because it gives him a sense of control, that's substituting the actual reality with his own. Everytime something bad happens to him, he rejects what happened and replaces it with something that favors him.

You're point is that Chris doesn't understand reality and thinks that his voodoo works because he relies on it all the time, when in actuality, he doesn't, he only relies on the voodoo, when something doesn't go his way. Yes he relies on the voodoo and believes that it has an impact, because he's already rejected what happened to him. For him to replace reality with his own self serving one, he has to understand that something reality did not go his way.

You're looking at the end result, you're looking at it as if, Chris uses the voodoo because he thinks it works, therefore he doesn't understand reality, I think that's what you're getting at. But ask yourself this question, why does he use the voodoo? He uses the voodoo because something bad happened to him, he understands that something bad happened to him. He doesn't like that something bad happened to him and he wants that to change. For him to have a reason to use the voodoo, he has to go through the process of rejecting and replacing reality with his own, there has to be a level of understanding, even if its a remedial understanding.

 

[Marvin]

He doesn't replace reality. He thinks he has control over it. It's... fighting bad things. He's not holding his hands to his ears and going "lalala nothing bad's happening," he's acting like he's the hero and fighting for his goals. To Chris, the hero should always win, when in fact, that doesn't always happen.

I'm questioning this belief of his, not his ability to understand the basic facts. He understands the basic facts. He tries to fight the bad things that happen in his life, really, like any other person could. But any other person knows that you can't cast spells or torture people via lego totems. And if they do believe in things like that, they live in cult communes out in the desert.

 

[Tubular Monkey]

He doesn't replace reality. He thinks he has control over it. It's... fighting bad things. He's not holding his MANOS to his ears and going "lalala nothing bad's happening," he's acting like he's the hero and fighting for his goals. To Chris, the hero should always win, when in fact, that doesn't always happen.

I'm questioning this belief of his, not his ability to understand the basic facts. He understands the basic facts. He tries to fight the bad things that happen in his life, really, like any other person could. But any other person knows that you can't cast spells or torture people via lego totems. And if they do believe in things like that, they live in cult communes out in the desert.

Sounds like somebody's just afraid there might be a Lego Marvin totem...

 

[CatParty]

chris chan doesn't understand nor realize any thing.

 

[Kosher Dill]

But is he honestly surprised when his curses and spells don't work? Probably not. I think what he gets out of it is just mental soothing, and reinforcement of his worldview. To Chris, the only way his problems can be solved is by outside forces (magic, gods, FBI raids) coming in and punishing everyone that makes him feel bad. By casting his spells, he's done the utmost that he needs to - if the outside forces don't finish the job, it's their fault not his.
The net result is that Chris perpetuates his internal drama where he's the persecuted hero, while having no need to take any action on his own beyond calling for help. This fantasy has obvious attractions to him, and on top of that his autism keeps him stuck in that frame of mind. That's my guess.

 

[Marvin]

He doesn't replace reality. He thinks he has control over it. It's... fighting bad things. He's not holding his MANOS to his ears and going "lalala nothing bad's happening," he's acting like he's the hero and fighting for his goals. To Chris, the hero should always win, when in fact, that doesn't always happen.

I'm questioning this belief of his, not his ability to understand the basic facts. He understands the basic facts. He tries to fight the bad things that happen in his life, really, like any other person could. But any other person knows that you can't cast spells or torture people via lego totems. And if they do believe in things like that, they live in cult communes out in the desert.

Sounds like somebody's just afraid there might be a Lego Marvin totem...

I was for awhile, but then I got a lego tomgirl magic shield , so I'm protected.

But is he honestly surprised when his curses and spells don't work? Probably not. I think what he gets out of it is just mental soothing, and reinforcement of his worldview. To Chris, the only way his problems can be solved is by outside forces (magic, gods, FBI raids) coming in and punishing everyone that makes him feel bad. By casting his spells, he's done the utmost that he needs to - if the outside forces don't finish the job, it's their fault not his.
The net result is that Chris perpetuates his internal drama where he's the persecuted hero, while having no need to take any action on his own beyond calling for help. This fantasy has obvious attractions to him, and on top of that his autism keeps him stuck in that frame of mind. That's my guess.

Uhh, they do work as far as Chris is concerned. Heh. Really, Chris didn't question any of this magic shit until it failed when Bob died and Chris and Barb lost their case. That's why I keep on emphasizing those two events. He was extremely fucked up by those two events specifically because his magic shit didn't work. That's why he's questioning a bunch of things now.

I mean, he's not exercising and getting a job, but his worldview was definitely shaken.

 

[Kosher Dill]

What, so he never noticed in the past that Mary Lee Walsh, the jerkops, the trolls, Snyder, etc failed to suffer divine retribution? Did he think the Sonichu Sub-Episodes were real?

And: Bob dying was an example of magic failing? God, it's depressing as hell to imagine how Bob must have felt lying there in the hospital, while Chris said "Don't worry, I can fix this".

 

[Marvin]

What, so he never noticed in the past that Mary Lee Walsh, the jerkops, the trolls, Snyder, etc failed to suffer divine retribution?

He heard rumors that supported his magic beliefs. Like, that their careers weren't going so well or some bullshit. So he just thought it worked.
http://sonichu.com/cwcki/Curse_ye_ha_me ... this_works

And: Bob dying was an example of magic failing? God, it's depressing as hell to imagine how Bob must have felt lying there in the hospital, while Chris said "Don't worry, I can fix this".

It wasn't necessarily magic, but more of Chris' precognitive dreams that he believes are actual promises from godbear.

 

[Tubular Monkey]

Chris's belief in his own magic powers is essentially this:

[youtube]KNYo69XiDfA[/youtube]

If Chris is stupid enough to think he has magic powers, he's stupid enough to see evidence of it when it isn't there.

 

[Jimmy Jazz]

Chris isn't mentally a child. He's emotionally stunted but mentally is pretty standard. He lacks experience in dealing with anything and has almost no education and has faces very little legitimate hardship.

These things combine to make Chris a particular way: Chris has a primitive mentality. He thinks language has ontological power and that to will something also has an effect on the world around him. It's a sort of shamanism that you would find an a tribal community. However, unlike tribal communities, which have a very good frame of reference for hardship and when they deign to commune with the world they do so for rain after a drought or for shelter from a storm. Chris doesn't have that frame of reference and so when he projects his will onto the world in hopes of a return it's asking Santa for a girlfriend or speaking curses on a troll. In either case, he has a ritualized behavior and speaks language which mediates his desires. Chris is a one-man tribe of autismal crazy person. His mainstreaming got him an education that was happy to ignore him in favor of easier students to teach, his untreated social inhibitions kept him from having any substantive friendships. He lives in a culture unique to him, cobbled together by Bob and Barb's upbringing, TV, and Video Games, naturally there is a place in it for magic.

Not to mention that all of the media that shaped his world view taught him to associate himself with the protagonist, naturally he should be winning life by destiny alone.

 

[Anchuent Christory]

I think what we're essentially touching on here is the reason why Chris has a massive cwcki dedicated to him and fairly active forum discussing him. There are plenty of retards, idiots, closed minded people, delusional people, egotistical people and repulsive people on the internet.
But nobody else seems to even come close to Chris' spectacular level of...... whatever you want to call it. Words like "fail" simply don't convey the magnitude of the world Chris has built around himself.

It's an over-simplification, but I see Chris' world as one built entirely on wishful thinking. He seems to believe that existence is only about getting everything you want, without fail. He just refuses (or can't) accept that the world doesn't work like that, and the more failures he encounters, the deeper down the rabbit hole he falls.

 

[Trombonista]

But you're completely missing the point I'm making, I'm saying that Chris rejects reality and substitutes what he wants for something that favors him. For example, Chris knows that his life sucks, that's understanding reality. Chris refuses to accept that his life sucks, that's rejecting reality.

Of course Chris refuses to his accept his life sucks. Who would accept that? The real problem is that while he knows his life sucks, he doesn't fully understand why it sucks.

 

[calicojack]

But you're completely missing the point I'm making, I'm saying that Chris rejects reality and substitutes what he wants for something that favors him. For example, Chris knows that his life sucks, that's understanding reality. Chris refuses to accept that his life sucks, that's rejecting reality.

Of course Chris refuses to his accept his life sucks. Who would accept that? The real problem is that while he knows his life sucks, he doesn't fully understand why it sucks.

That's why he blames the trolls.

 

[bigshot]

Chris really isn't all that different from everyone else. We all sometimes want something to be true so bad, we convince ourselves it is true. The problem with Chris is that the people he trusts pat him on the head and aren't honest with him. That makes him believe his fantasies.

Encouragement is not the best way of handling delusion.

 

[Marvin]

Chris really isn't all that different from everyone else. We all sometimes want something to be true so bad, we convince ourselves it is true. The problem with Chris is that the people he trusts pat him on the head and aren't honest with him. That makes him believe his fantasies.

Encouragement is not the best way of handling delusion.

Eh, but people don't literally believe those things are true. Honestly, I don't believe in pop culture ideas of the "subconscious." I think you either know something or you don't.

The difference between normal people and Chris when it comes to shit like this is that Chris genuinely believes this stuff. And I know that might be hard to believe based on the level of insanity you've seen Chris express, but really, I've seen Chris admit hard truths to himself and others. He'll do it. Really, this just boils down to Chris actually believing crazy shit.

 

[DJAndyMD]

But you're completely missing the point I'm making, I'm saying that Chris rejects reality and substitutes what he wants for something that favors him. For example, Chris knows that his life sucks, that's understanding reality. Chris refuses to accept that his life sucks, that's rejecting reality.

Of course Chris refuses to his accept his life sucks. Who would accept that? The real problem is that while he knows his life sucks, he doesn't fully understand why it sucks.

Not only does he not fully understand why his life sucks but it all comes back to him not doing anything to fix himself. He obviously thinks that he is entitled to everything because he grew up being pitied but like any other person with a disability, physical, mental or otherwise, he has to go beyond it and do something. Unfortunately, it will never happen.

 

[Bugaboo]

It seems Chris never learned that the world does not revolve around him as most children eventually do. But this child took up faux voodoo to make shit work his way
But the real question is when did he start to beleive he had magical powers? Where in his world of ancient and 90's pop culture did this happen? Did his parents tell him he was magical or some shit or is it a incredibly warped view of the Christian prayer he was taught

 

[Marvin]

It seems Chris never learned that the world does not revolve around him as most children eventually do. But this child took up faux voodoo to make shit work his way
But the real question is when did he start to beleive he had magical powers? Where in his world of ancient and 90's pop culture did this happen? Did his parents tell him he was magical or some shit or is it a incredibly warped view of the Christian prayer he was taught

Uhh, well, he kinda gradually developed and didn't have anyone telling him that he might lose. This, combined with a bunch of media involving infallible heroes like Sonic and Mario, Chris gradually learned that he was the hero in life and that, while he might have downtimes sometimes, he'll ultimately win. And I think that once he got that into his head, nothing would permanently bother him, because when he overcomes something, he'll be closer to his galpal paradise.

 

[CatParty]

It seems Chris never learned that the world does not revolve around him as most children eventually do. But this child took up faux voodoo to make shit work his way
But the real question is when did he start to beleive he had magical powers? Where in his world of ancient and 90's pop culture did this happen? Did his parents tell him he was magical or some shit or is it a incredibly warped view of the Christian prayer he was taught

his belief in magical powers reminds me of a game my friends and i used to play waiting at stoplights. you sit there saying "green light now. green light now" and whoever said it last pretended to either be psychic or have telepathic powers. however, it's like he played that game in his head and it happened once or twice he was right on. From there on, he believed he was magical.

 

[Alec Benson Leary]

But the real question is when did he start to beleive he had magical powers? Where in his world of ancient and 90's pop culture did this happen?

I think all little kids inherently assume they alone are gifted with magical powers. When I was like 6, I thought I was psychic, for no reason other than I thought I was special and psychic powers would be cool so why shouldn't I have them? Unlike normal children, who are repeatedly faced with the fact that they are ordinary as they age, Chris was never taught that he had to earn being better if he wanted it. He has just always assumed he is better.

Uhh, well, he kinda gradually developed and didn't have anyone telling him that he might lose. This, combined with a bunch of media involving infallible heroes like Sonic and Mario, Chris gradually learned that he was the hero in life and that, while he might have downtimes sometimes, he'll ultimately win. And I think that once he got that into his head, nothing would permanently bother him, because when he overcomes something, he'll be closer to his galpal paradise.

It's the ultimate culmination of his fantasy. Every saga, every trial, every hardship is just another level in Green Hill Zone.