💊 Manosphere IceCat - the defender of loveshies

[4Macie]

Debatable. Icecat already mentioned how his parents fucked him up, I know my parents fucked me up and I know of several other loveshy's whose family fucked them up.

Spoiler: Spoilered for not being about icecat

My mom doesn't tell you what she's irritated about, she just blows up at random stuff if she's irritated. You then try to adjust your behaviour so she won't blow up, because that shit is scary as a kid yo, but you find yourself unable to because she wasn't mad about the thing you were doing, she was mad about something she didn't tell you and if you don't do thing A anymore she would blow up about thing B.

Example: I was at a friends house, getting a bottle of lemonade from his fridge. He looked up, said "Oh, that bottle is still closed" and looked down again. In his case he simply meant to warn me that the bottle was still closed and I should open it.
In my mother's case, that would mean that there was another bottle of lemonade in the fridge and you should've taken that one, and she would have been so mad at you for misunderstanding her it wouldn't be funny.

Since every insignificant thing had huge consequences at my home, I never dared to ask girls out either.

But whether nature or nurture is to blame is kinda irrelevant IMHO. Since you can't change your upbringing, it's kinda pointless to lament it, you should just keep trying to move past it.

If this is literally all loveshy's have to worry about and if THIS is what made their lives terrible... Jesus Fucking Christ. There is no hope for the world.

What you precious little snowflakes needs to realize is that EVERYONE'S life sucks (to them). No one's life is perfect and putting that responsibility (to make your life perfect) on a spouse is so fucking stupid. Would you want the responsibility....nay, the job, to make someone ELSE'S life perfect? No? Then why put that on someone else.

LordAzazel, what you just described is literally how my own mother AND her mother (my grandmother) acted. My mother and grandmother would come home pissed as all hell; wouldn't tell you why, and you'd just assume it was something you did. I'd get yelled at for literally no reason. Got grounded once because my mother had a bad day at work and I spilt my spaghetti Os a little when I took them out of the microwaves. Grounded for a whole week for that.

My parents never came to an orchestra concert or a school play. Ever. They never let me go to a school dance either. I also wasn't allowed to have any boyfriend (or girlfriend) at all until after highschool. This means I left highschool a virgin who had NO experience at all with men (or women).

But you don't see me bitching and whining about being loveshy or whatever because I realize that if I don't have someone in my life, it's probably because no one wants to be with me. Or I haven't met them yet. Or fuck all, maybe it's because I'm myself enough to be by myself and not be miserable.

Loveshy/incels all say how "woe is me" because they don't have a woman. No one cares. There are 7 billion people on this world; at least half of them will have a worse off life than you. Get over yourself. It's not someone else's job to make you happy; that's your own job. Get to it.

@IceCat
Did you know Sir Isaac Newton never had sex? He believed in having to be married before sex and because he was so busy being fucking Newton, he never got married and thus, never had sex.

Mother Teresa was also a virgin (big surprise)

Andy Warhol died a virgin. He was what some would consider a "loveshy".

Nikola Tesla abstained from sex for his entire life. He believed that sex would distract him from his work. (Kinda like Newton but not really)

Some say Queen Elizabeth 1 (aka: Virgin Queen) died a virgin but some aren't so sure.

The guy that wrote Alice in Wonderland is reported to have died a virgin... but that may be because he was a closet pedophile and was ashamed of it... apparently he had more than a few pictures of naked children in his house when he died.

Joan of Arc (big surprise here again) although some people think that maybe she was sexually assaulted as a "female warrior" so maybe Virgin isn't the right word, but she certainly didn't have consensual sex.

Joseph Merrick died a virgin. (Elephant Man). He was too shy (because of his condition) to ever approach a woman.

For current virgins you might know:
Tim Tebow claims he's a virgin
Tim Gunn is technically not a virgin but he hasn't had sex in like 30 years. And he claims he's super happy and doesn't need sex to establish his happiness.
The Pope (of course)
Pretty much any nun and most priests.


As you can see, successful and happy incel/virgins/loveshy exist.
Of course THESE talented people don't call themselves "incel" or "loveshy". They are just themselves.

 

[SU 390]

WanderingWagabond - just keep not raping while everybody else does it. This will make you successful.

Chetniks

 

[DrChristianTroy]

Debatable. Icecat already mentioned how his parents fucked him up, I know my parents fucked me up and I know of several other loveshy's whose family fucked them up.

Spoiler: Spoilered for not being about icecat

My mom doesn't tell you what she's irritated about, she just blows up at random stuff if she's irritated. You then try to adjust your behaviour so she won't blow up, because that shit is scary as a kid yo, but you find yourself unable to because she wasn't mad about the thing you were doing, she was mad about something she didn't tell you and if you don't do thing A anymore she would blow up about thing B.

Example: I was at a friends house, getting a bottle of lemonade from his fridge. He looked up, said "Oh, that bottle is still closed" and looked down again. In his case he simply meant to warn me that the bottle was still closed and I should open it.
In my mother's case, that would mean that there was another bottle of lemonade in the fridge and you should've taken that one, and she would have been so mad at you for misunderstanding her it wouldn't be funny.

Since every insignificant thing had huge consequences at my home, I never dared to ask girls out either.

But whether nature or nurture is to blame is kinda irrelevant IMHO. Since you can't change your upbringing, it's kinda pointless to lament it, you should just keep trying to move past it.

No offense but that example is the mildest thing I've ever heard. Maybe you wrote it poorly but that doesn't sound like the kind of shit that will "fuck you up." That sounds like having a shitty day. Anger management issues at worst. But enough to fuck someone up? Sounds like you need thicker skin.

If this is literally all loveshy's have to worry about and if THIS is what made their lives terrible... Jesus Fucking Christ. There is no hope for the world.

What you precious little snowflakes needs to realize is that EVERYONE'S life sucks (to them). No one's life is perfect and putting that responsibility (to make your life perfect) on a spouse is so fucking stupid. Would you want the responsibility....nay, the job, to make someone ELSE'S life perfect? No? Then why put that on someone else.

LordAzazel, what you just described is literally how my own mother AND her mother (my grandmother) acted. My mother and grandmother would come home pissed as all hell; wouldn't tell you why, and you'd just assume it was something you did. I'd get yelled at for literally no reason. Got grounded once because my mother had a bad day at work and I spilt my spaghetti Os a little when I took them out of the microwaves. Grounded for a whole week for that.

My parents never came to an orchestra concert or a school play. Ever. They never let me go to a school dance either. I also wasn't allowed to have any boyfriend (or girlfriend) at all until after highschool. This means I left highschool a virgin who had NO experience at all with men (or women).

But you don't see me bitching and whining about being loveshy or whatever because I realize that if I don't have someone in my life, it's probably because no one wants to be with me. Or I haven't met them yet. Or fuck all, maybe it's because I'm myself enough to be by myself and not be miserable.

Loveshy/incels all say how "woe is me" because they don't have a woman. No one cares. There are 7 billion people on this world; at least half of them will have a worse off life than you. Get over yourself. It's not someone else's job to make you happy; that's your own job. Get to it.

@IceCat
Did you know Sir Isaac Newton never had sex? He believed in having to be married before sex and because he was so busy being fucking Newton, he never got married and thus, never had sex.

Mother Teresa was also a virgin (big surprise)

Andy Warhol died a virgin. He was what some would consider a "loveshy".

Nikola Tesla abstained from sex for his entire life. He believed that sex would distract him from his work. (Kinda like Newton but not really)

Some say Queen Elizabeth 1 (aka: Virgin Queen) died a virgin but some aren't so sure.

The guy that wrote Alice in Wonderland is reported to have died a virgin... but that may be because he was a closet pedophile and was ashamed of it... apparently he had more than a few pictures of naked children in his house when he died.

Joan of Arc (big surprise here again) although some people think that maybe she was sexually assaulted as a "female warrior" so maybe Virgin isn't the right word, but she certainly didn't have consensual sex.

Joseph Merrick died a virgin. (Elephant Man). He was too shy (because of his condition) to ever approach a woman.

For current virgins you might know:
Tim Tebow claims he's a virgin
Tim Gunn is technically not a virgin but he hasn't had sex in like 30 years. And he claims he's super happy and doesn't need sex to establish his happiness.
The Pope (of course)
Pretty much any nun and most priests.


As you can see, successful and happy incel/virgins/loveshy exist.
Of course THESE talented people don't call themselves "incel" or "loveshy". They are just themselves.

EDIT- So @IceCat says his parents abused him. Abuse is nothing really to take too lightly but did he say what actually happened? Because at this point, given his track record, I can't help but think he's overreacting. Did I miss something?

 

[LordAzazel]

@4Macie, I'm not sure I understand the hostility I read in your post?

[bad thing] happened to me, so people who [bad thing] happened to shouldn't complain isn't much of an argument, IMHO.
I thought we could both agree that how we were raised sucked ass. Some people simply shouldn't have children.

I thought we could also agree that loveshys who expect spouses to "fix" them are entitled little bitches.

I'm still unsure how admitting I struggle with dating because of how I'm raised makes me a special little snowflake.

No offense but that example is the mildest thing I've ever heard. Maybe you wrote it poorly but that doesn't sound like the kind of shit that will "fuck you up." That sounds like having a shitty day. Anger management issues at worst. But enough to fuck someone up? Sounds like you need thicker skin.

Then the example worked, because it shows how insignificant things were made into anxiety inducing fuckfests where every observer not having lived my life would claim I just need thicker skin. I'd count that as fucking up my life. No offense, but you have no idea how mad my mother could become.

 

[DrChristianTroy]

So that's an excuse to be a loveshy? Unless there's more to the story for you to take this as some sort of traumatizing event makes you sound kind of like a bitch.

EDIT- Also privileged as fuck. Again if the worst your life got was your mother yelling at you, things have worked out pretty damn well.

 

[SU 390]

Stop pretending you know what you're talking about. Family and a degree are in no shape or form a requirement to gain entry into the US.

Well let's keep him far the fuck away from the U.S.

Unless it's a prison, then yeah, bring him. Other than that, hell fucking no!

 

[DrChristianTroy]

Well let's keep him far the fuck away from the U.S.

Unless it's a prison, then yeah, bring him. Other than that, hell fucking no!

We can bring @IceCat or @Holden to the US. Just drop him off in Watts, CA in all red or all blue. Just have him see shit can be worse than "Oh I have no girlfriend"

 

[4Macie]

@4Macie, I'm not sure I understand the hostility I read in your post?

[bad thing] happened to me, so people who [bad thing] happened to shouldn't complain isn't much of an argument, IMHO.
I thought we could both agree that how we were raised sucked ass. Some people simply shouldn't have children.

I thought we could also agree that loveshys who expect spouses to "fix" them are entitled little bitches.

I'm still unsure how admitting I struggle with dating because of how I'm raised makes me a special little snowflake.



Then the example worked, because it shows how insignificant things were made into anxiety inducing fuckfests where every observer not having lived my life would claim I just need thicker skin. I'd count that as fucking up my life. No offense, but you have no idea how mad my mother could become.

You're saying your mom getting pissed and not telling you why she got pissed fucked you up.
I'm saying this shit happened to EVERYONE growing up.
Your mom getting mad randomly really shouldn't have fucked up you. Simple as that. If it did; if your mom getting mad about every little thing fucked you up so you can't get a girlfriend/boyfriend/partner/spouse... that's your fault, not your upbringing. Obviously there is something wrong with your self-confidence if this is the case. So once again, not your upbrining's fault; it's the fault of your own personal growth.

I will reiterate. Every. Single. Person. has problems. They all had difficult childhoods one way or another. But out of everyone, you see 0.5% of the population bitching about not being able to find a mate... why do you think that is? (Hint: it's not their upbringing or their parents' fault)

 

[XH 502]

Then the example worked, because it shows how insignificant things were made into anxiety inducing fuckfests where every observer not having lived my life would claim I just need thicker skin. I'd count that as fucking up my life. No offense, but you have no idea how mad my mother could become.

So was she passive-aggressive mad (like what you outlined in your example) or full-blown "I just threw my child into the wall during my violent rage" mad?

 

[DrChristianTroy]

So was she passive-aggressive mad (like what you outlined in your example) or full-blown "I just threw my child into the wall during my violent rage" mad?

This is the big issue here. If it's the former, you're a bitch and need to learn how to man up. If it's the latter, seek help.

 

[LordAzazel]

So that's an excuse to be a loveshy? Unless there's more to the story for you to take this as some sort of traumatizing event makes you sound kind of like a bitch.

EDIT- Also privileged as fuck. Again if the worst your life got was your mother yelling at you, things have worked out pretty damn well.

Traumatizing event? Hardly, it was more of a continuation of a trend. And quite frankly, why should I care if you think I sound like a bitch?

Privileged as fuck does describe me by the way, my parents are rich, white and well-educated. I myself am tall, moderately intelligent with average looks and socially competent enough. I'm still not seeing how saying that the way my mother handled her various mental problems was unproductive makes me entitled. Do you compare your problems with children born in poverty in Africa before decided whether or not to complain about them?

You're saying your mom getting pissed and not telling you why she got pissed fucked you up.
I'm saying this shit happened to EVERYONE growing up.
Your mom getting mad randomly really shouldn't have fucked up you. Simple as that. If it did; if your mom getting mad about every little thing fucked you up so you can't get a girlfriend/boyfriend/partner/spouse... that's your fault, not your upbringing. Obviously there is something wrong with your self-confidence if this is the case. So once again, not your upbrining's fault; it's the fault of your own personal growth.

I will reiterate. Every. Single. Person. has problems. They all had difficult childhoods one way or another. But out of everyone, you see 0.5% of the population bitching about not being able to find a mate... why do you think that is? (Hint: it's not their upbringing or their parents' fault)

I'm glad you are so understanding how there are obvious degrees how pissed people are and with what frequency. You're forcing this into a black and white issue, but the world don't work that way son. Would my mother break everyone she could've had as a child? Possibly no. Are all three of her children fucked up? Yes.

Why is it so hard to accept that my mother at least played a role in shaping who I am today? Especially if I don't take that acknowledgement as a pass to stop improving myself. Even if it's her fault she fucked me up, I don't win anything by not trying to undo her damage.

 

[ON 190]

Do you compare your problems with children born in poverty in Africa before decided whether or not to complain about them?

No, but you just did right there.

By the way, I have mental issues, fairly serious ones, and yet I've had girlfriends, I've been engaged, and I'm currently dating someone. It's because, while not my fault I have them, I took a hold of my issues, am undergoing therapy and on medication, and realized that I can't blame everything on it. Some things, yes, because there's stuff beyond my control. Most things? No. I'm dealing with them as an adult does.

 

[DrChristianTroy]

Traumatizing event? Hardly, it was more of a continuation of a trend. And quite frankly, why should I care if you think I sound like a bitch?

Did I say you have to care? You don't have to listen to me at all. I'm just stating my opinion and that opinion is that your problems aren't problems at all.

Privileged as fuck does describe me by the way, my parents are rich, white and well-educated. I myself am tall, moderately intelligent with average looks and socially competent enough. I'm still not seeing how saying that the way my mother handled her various mental problems was unproductive makes me entitled.

It just goes with your coming off as a bitch. You grew up well and your problems were getting yelled at. As I said until we get clarification that it was "Mom grabbed me and slammed me into the wall" shouting shit doesn't sound bad. Letting it fuck you up just sounds like a lack of perspective more than anything else. If it was physical abuse that's a whole different can of worms.

Do you compare your problems with children born in poverty in Africa before decided whether or not to complain about them?

No I don't. I also let the spectre of my rich mother haunt me.

Would my mother break everyone she could've had as a child? Possibly no. Are all three of her children fucked up? Yes.

Again unless your mother was physical or it was more than just passive aggressive bitchiness I think all the kids need thicker skin.

Why is it so hard to accept that my mother at least played a role in shaping who I am today? Especially if I don't take that acknowledgement as a pass to stop improving myself. Even if it's her fault she fucked me up, I don't win anything by not trying to undo her damage.

Absolutely agree. You should try improving yourself. At least we agree on that.

 

[4Macie]

Why is it so hard to accept that my mother at least played a role in shaping who I am today?

I'm not NOT accepting that parents play a role in shaping someone. I'm saying that loveshies who say "My parents are the reason I'm loveshy" are complete morons and need to put their big boy panties on and grow the fuck up.

Parents are not the reason you have a partner unless it's a planned marriage. So, with that logic, they are also not the reason you DON'T have a partner.

If you have such traumatizing issues because of mommy-dearest... you need to go get therapy. As it is, if you have these mommy-issues now, it's no wonder you don't have a partner. But, again, having mommy-issues isn't your mom's issue, it's yours.

Literally every loveshy we've come across on these forums have bitched about how it's everyone else's fault but not their own fault. It's so fucking pathetic that it physically pains me. They blame girls for not loving them, as if you can choose who you love. They blame their parents for doing things that everyone's parents do. They bitch and whine about how their life is so fucking terrible and how their childhood was so fucking terrible when there are millions upon millions of people who have had it worse. And while I'm seriously sorry you feel your childhood was a wasted mess, this doesn't mean you should blame others for your lack of a love life. Love life droughts happen. And some last for YEARS and years. It's the way the world works. But what these people need to realize is that you are your own happiness and that having a partner just gives you someone to share that happiness with. And if you aren't happy to be yourself, by yourself, then you can never be happy with someone else. Not truly anyway.

 

[DrChristianTroy]

Yo so is this @LordAzazel guy one of the loveshy goofs or just some dude that can actually get better?

 

[ON 190]

Yo so is this @LordAzazel guy one of the loveshy goofs or just some dude that can actually get better?

I'm thinking (hoping) the latter.

 

[JU 199]

Why is it so hard to accept that my mother at least played a role in shaping who I am today? Especially if I don't take that acknowledgement as a pass to stop improving myself. Even if it's her fault she fucked me up, I don't win anything by not trying to undo her damage.

Power level?

 

[deductionotaku]

No offense, but you have no idea how mad my mother could become.

Would she beat you for individualizing?
Would she dig her fingernails into your cheeks when you questioned her words?
Did you ever need to call the police to restrain her and have yourself removed from the house?
Would she strangle you with the phone cord when you called the police on her?
Did you ever think if you didn't kill her, she would kill you?

No down the board? Newsflash: My mother was immensely worse than yours; bear in mind, I skipped the emotional abuse that she doled out to everybody.

And you know something? That still hasn't stopped me from growing beyond it. Between her and the female teachers who ignored all the signs of abuse - like me telling them my mother beats me and pointing out all my fresh bruises - I had a massive distrust of women, romance, and marriage for a long time, and the abuse even left me catatonic for a while, but it's my past. I dig this up in therapy and when special little snowflakes like you think your mothers were abusive for being disciplinarians or not being involved enough, but otherwise it's just shit that used to happen and doesn't anymore. I'm still a work in progress, but I'm allowed in an out-patient program now and can interact with the world again. I'm still no social butterfly and I refuse to speak to my mother, but there's interaction between me and the world that doesn't involve me shooting nasty looks and being apathetic about the world.

Your mother yelled a lot. Compared to a narcissist with a middle child complex, I'd trade mothers with you in a heartbeat.

 

[HickoryDickory]

Eh... I feel it would be best to step back a bit. I get that a lot of loveshies one incels blame their parents for not hooking them up (and it is messed up), but telling someone that they are a whiny bitch and comparing different forms of childhood abuse is comes off as one-up manship and getting into personal grivences that aren't appropriate for this thread. (Re: Power levels)

 

[4Macie]

This has gone WAAAAAY beyond the Icecat thread.
Now we got whiny people (loveshy) complaining about how they were bullied and their mother yelled at them when they were a kid.
Jesus fucking christ. @IceCat you really support and defend these people? Why?

Eh... I feel it would be best to step back a bit. I get that a lot of loveshies one incels blame their parents for not hooking them up (and it is messed up), but telling someone that they are a whiny bitch and comparing different forms of childhood abuse is comes off as one-up manship and getting into personal grivences that aren't appropriate for this thread. (Re: Power levels)

That's not at all what I originally hoped would happen when I posed my question. I apologize if my question has derailed the thread.

The point of my question was this:
Loveshy go through no more turmoil than anyone else in the world. There is nothing about their childhoods or current life that is any more special or any more "awful" than anyone else's. They got bullied, so does everyone else. They pissed their parents off, so did everyone else. They got yelled at for something they didn't do, so did everyone else. There is literally nothing that has happened to the loveshy we've encountered that hasn't happened to someone else who was able to pull through with it. So for them to blame other people for why they can't get a partner is life is, frankly, stupid as fuck.

To me, someone who has been through some shit and come out pretty clean (IMO), what the loveshy are doing is no more moronic and immature than a child complaining that some other kid has a newer toy when they themself have a perfectly good toy in their hands.

So, again, my end result was this: @IceCat why do you support whiny people like this? Why do you enable their useless antics? Don't you know that you're suppose to ignore a child's tantrum else you reinforce this behavior?