Is the wit in media declining?

[MarvinTheParanoidAndroid]

So I just watched some 90's shit with my spare time and I've noticed that just about everything about this show from the dial-up era has better jokes, tighter writing, greater writing efficiency and better everything than anything on TV. Not only that, watching it was actually fun, whereas most shows feel like a chore to sit through. I'll be the first to admit, though I'm sure I'm not, that I don't like Bojack Horseman. It's drab, dour & unfunny. When Bojack Horseman tells a joke, it doesn't have the same punch as something written like a decade ago. Most of the episodes are just Bojack bitterly ranting about how much life sucks, has no meaning, and he's held to unrealistic expectations before chugging down another Jack Daniels with a bottle of pills, and this repetitive shit is considered ground breaking.

It's easy to just blame SJWism and focus-groupism for what's happened to media, but those to me seem symptomatic of something shittier going on. The Simpsons didn't suddenly become shitty just because SJWism came into vogue. I realized pretty quickly that what a lot of these shows lack is simple: wit. None of these shows have wit. Some of them have the makings of a good joke here and there, but they always fumble the delivery. I think this also explains why so many shows are now feature length as well, they lack the wit to meet a 20 minute mark and need an hour to convey what TV shows used to do in a third of that time. So what's the deal? Why are TV shows so unwitty now?

 

[ditto]

Modern media lacks brevity. Irony drenched whedonism writes itself.

 

[Billy "the Bot" Bobson]

It's Jack Daniels, you heathen. It's not that the past was better on average, it's just that the goods were better than the goods of today. Their garbage is about on par with our garbage.

 

[MediocreMilt]

While I don't think you're being fair to Bojack specifically... yeah, writing generally has taken an utter shit.

It's as if the writers hired for most shows and movies these days are a bunch of SNL rejects who can't wait to force-feed the audience "lol we're so awkward millenials" jokes that utterly disrespect the source material they were entrusted with.

 

[MarvinTheParanoidAndroid]

It's Jack Daniels, you heathen.

I fixed it.

While I don't think you're being fair to Bojack specifically... yeah, writing generally has taken an utter shit.

It's as if the writers hired for most shows and movies these days are a bunch of SNL rejects who can't wait to force-feed the audience "lol we're so awkward millenials" jokes that utterly disrespect the source material they were entrusted with.

I almost want to say it's like people who want to be writers because of the noble veneer of being a writer and not because they have anything to actually say, but I can't be certain.

 

[wtfNeedSignUp]

The problem is that, like virtually every thing in media nowdays, it's been optimised to hell and back. Ye olde days had a huge variance of jokes that had changing amount of effort put into their writings and executions. But why go through all the effort when simply referencing other shit, being cringy and being incredibly cynical will make people laugh just enough to feel they had fun, without going through the tough process of writing and handling the jokes?

Not only that, in pure dystopian fashion, the next generation doesn't even know any kind of jokes exist.

 

[Idiotron]

While I'm not very well versed in modern TV shows (just don't feel like spending so many hours watching something that might piss me off 70 episodes in like Game of Thrones did to so many people and then feel like I've wasted entire days of actual time), I think that the current year (to be specific, the last decade) has something that the previous ones didn't - the internet.
Since you've specifically mentioned comedy, these days, you don't really need to have a TV show to be an on screen comedian, you can make sketch comedy on Youtube and get just as much money and fame for it as you would get from a deal with NBC and you have a lot less restrictions, creative people often never go to work for a corporation who then has ownership of every IP you've created for them.
Some of the best sketches I've seen in the last decade are from Youtubers.

Another thing is that there's so much damn content nowadays that you've maybe seen 1% of it and that's if you're watching stuff several hours per day.
The vast majority of things you might enjoy will never even reach you because you're under an avalanche of content all the time.

 

[Sage In All Fields]

I watched The Rainmaker and Beetlejuice (which were both a while before my time) and both those movies just felt so extremely different to anything I'd ever watched, although they aren't written to be especially comical they do have a good portion of the film dedicated to humor and it's like they were so much purer while still managing to retain a certain realistic grit. To enjoy anything from the modern age I need it to be caked in 6 layers of irony and meta references or just complete absurdism or I won't find it remotely funny or interesting.

It's almost like modern film has a certain detachment from reality that wasn't present previously.

 

[DamageJoy]

Multiple explanations are possible.

First of all you have experience with media, you got used to the common tools and tropes used not to mention the attitude of many shows just became cliché on their own.
Second, basically the pursuit of the "broader audience" dumbs down everything. Even the pursuit of "diversity" is somewhat aimed at pulling in the more "diverse" audiences who have better consumption patterns.
Third, nerds have changed. The quality of writers and show runners got worse because nerds are more and more immersed in nerd culture only. You need multiple sources of experience and influence to truly do great things. Now you have people who only reharsh the few things they saw in video games and shows.

Also nowadays everything has to be ironic and cynical, that is straining culture in general.

 

[BScCollateral]

It has always been the case that as you get older, you find the "new stuff kids are into nowadays" banal and generally shit. So while I agree more recent media has taken a nosedive in quality, I also try to remember that's a known side effect of getting older.

I wonder how much home video is causing issues. Nowadays, films are competing with an accessible library of 100 years or more. That's a pretty nice thriller -- is it better than Hitchcock's Suspicion? Fuck, no.

 

[dirtydeanna96]

there hasn't been true wit since Juvenal. RIP.

 

[Jimjamflimflam]

It has always been the case that as you get older, you find the "new stuff kids are into nowadays" banal and generally shit

I used to think this as well, like it's just how things go but the more I compare old to new, the more I see this as a cop-out answer.

Watch a long running series (Simpson's, family guy off the top of my head) amd compare the older episodes to the new and its a world of differences. There has been a huge decline in quality of writing, the jokes are much lazier and have to be spoonfed. The stories are just bad overall.

 

[GhostButt]

Watch a long running series (Simpson's, family guy off the top of my head) amd compare the older episodes to the new and its a world of differences. There has been a huge decline in quality of writing, the jokes are much lazier and have to be spoonfed. The stories are just bad overall.

I think using the same series is a bad control, since the financial stakes are so high the corporate notes also get up there.

Since OP used Bojack as an example, I'll say that the issue there and a lot of other places comes from the shift of importance from pure Make Me Laugh comedy (aka comedy ) towards ""character development"", which is boring and not entertaining, well it is if you actually like the character that's developing, but if you aren't invested its tedious.

It also isn't super re-watchable since that development becomes just plot points, compared to the simpsons or duckman that are infinitely re-watchable, nevermind all the little gags hidden all over like they knew we would be coming back.

Also in duck man vs bojack, which is my closest comparison that I could think of, I don't think the simpsons is as meaningful for that (the protagonists are burnt out middle age doomers, and the simpsons is a family ensemble) both tackle the modern world "theme" but Bojack is more just roll over accept the change as good, where as Duckman fights tooth and nail against every dumb new societal change even if in the end its a "i don't have to like it but it's allowed to exist" solution.

Bojack just doesn't have the spice to be funny, possibly due to modern humor being focused on "how awkward can we make the audience" rather than actual comedy happening (thanks The Office)

TLDR: everything is a Drama now so it becomes disposable, old shit was meant for the ages and some of it is proving to pass the test.

 

[neverendingmidi]

I think the writer's strike in 2008 really fucked things over. That was when "reality" tv shows and "improv" type show s really started to take off as the suits in charge of the studios tried to find ways of getting around needing a large staff of writers.

Then when the dust settled, the writers remaining only hired their friends back, making it even more incestuous than it was, and far more of a hive mind. The Obama period at the time didn't help matters. When the only jokes you are allowed to make are how absolutely wonderful and perfect and cool and dreamy and amazing the people in powerare, all you're going to get are sycophants

 

[Pomniman]

You say it's not woketards or focus-groups, but everything else you can think of stems from those issues because no one in the American entertainment industry nowadays is hired for anything other than having the right politics/skin color/sexual preference/gender identity anymore. There's barely any talent or wit left because they deliberately selected for everything else to tick checkboxes.

 

[OvercookedBacon]

From what little I've seen of modern "comedy" it's either "look, someone did something stupid, awkward silence", being cynical just to be cynical, and/or Orange Man Bad because that NEVER gets old, right? /sneed
Hard pass.

 

[Jones McCann]

It's because of greed. You aren't allowed to take risks anymore outside of independent media. There is still some good stuff out there but it's buried under mountains of the latest nerd culture garbage they shit out every 3 months. Suits and the faggots that work at these media companies love to stick to formulas so they don't have to actually do anything groundbreaking, because that might take some hard work and might waste their precious money. Corporate culture has always been this way but things have become increasingly consolidated in the last 30 years. If you want to blame someone for how shitty media is you need to point the finger at people who actually pay to watch that garbage. You'll probably find him/her smoking weed behind a McDonalds talking about why capitalism sucks, the irony being that it's because of brain dead consumers like them that incentivize this behaviour.

 

[Pokemonquistador2]

I think part of the reason for the dumbing down of media is that 50-100 years ago, writers were:

A. People who experienced things (like wars or adventures) firsthand. The original Star Wars was written by people who had either flown in combat, or people who had watched lots of WW2 movies growing up. You'd be surprised at the number of combat veterans who were on writing staffs for 80s cartoons like He-Man, Transformers, etc. Nowadays, most cartoon writers are people who established themselves on Tumblr/ Deviant Art or who graduated from popular art schools. They've often experienced little of the Real World outside of their regional or fandom bubbles, hence the reason their writing seems janky. They'll often use their own dysfunctional relationships as the basis for their characters' and will push politics above all else.

B. Better educated, and well versed in the Western Literary and Sci Fi / Fantasy Canon. They were also educated about civics and were more savvy about the dangers of utopianism and science run amok. A writer from 50 years ago would write a story based on HG Wells' Time Machine and think that the Eloi race were to be pitied for their weakness and their lack of intellectual curiousity. A modern writer would do the same thing, but portray the Eloi as a happy race, freed from the burden of having to earn their own bread. So what if a few of them got devoured by Morlocks once in a while? It's a small price to pay to live in a post-scarcity society...

C. Living in a more homogenous society. It's easier to write when everyone shares the same media culture. Sure, there were subcultures back then, and genres aimed at minorities of all stripes, but everyone pretty much watched the same shows and movies, and read the same classic books in school. Nowadays, culture fads come and go like lightning, and if you're well versed in things like Youtube Poop or Caustic Critics from the early 2000s, chances are good that most of the young people of "prime internet browsing age" today are not. Anyone remember what the Ice Bucket Challenge or the Harlem Shake were? I rest my case.....

D. Less lazy. Reference Humor is the height of laziness, and thanks to shows Family Guy, all you have to do is point to a cutaway gag showing the thing you're referencing, and people will clap like a seal. Autistic Media ConSOOMERS like being part of the "Cool Group," so when a show gives them something cool that they recognize and like, they'll show their appreciation.

 

[Munchingonfish]

From a practicality standpoint, the era of CONSOOM means talent is spread thin. In the past, you had a handful of networks and cable channels producing scripted shows. There wasn't an unending avalanche of material being made. You had to be good or someone's family member to get a job. There are hundreds of shows being produced now, with the illusion of meritocracy eroded thanks to ideological hiring practices that require you to hit checkmarks. The standards for talent aren't as high and that is being seen in the material made. Self publishing has also been a blow to corporate media. If you're a talented comedian, why slum it in NYC hoping to write for SNL when you could just shoot some videos to share on social media?

 

[Hongourable Madisha]

They've got overly reliant on lazy tricks, like building gravitas or tension in a scene and then defusing it with a lame joke. It makes the audience laugh because it's releasing tension, not because the joke was funny. It's a similar thing with jump-scares in horror films and TV shows, you're not actually scared, you're just startled and it provokes a response from you. You laugh or gasp at the time but it doesn't stick with you the way something genuinely funny or scary does.