IT: chapter II - Pennywise the clown is so #cancelled

[Sure Thing Idiot]

Spoiler: Is it even a spoiler if the story's 33 years old?

Its not a perfect movie but I thought it was a really great adaptation of the book by having it's own vision, but staying close, to the source material. I've said it already and I'll say it again. I think any talented director or screen writer could make a successful movie of the first half of IT. The latter half ventures into territory that is not easy to visually translate to screen at all, let alone for a diverse worldwide audience to view and happily digest in under 3 hours. The turtle and the depth of the concepts of the macroverse and giant birds and rituals of will and the deconstruction of the feeling of fear just aren't going to make sense to the greater part of a general audience sitting in the theatre after work for 3 hours on a Friday night. People would get confused and dislike it for being (at least seemingly) nonsensical. People are already somewhat confused. My friend asked me after the movie why the adults didnt just kill pennywise or why pennywise just didnt kill them when he had so many chances. All of those questions are answered in reading and understanding gradually what it IT is, which is this entity that subsists almost solely on its ability to provoke fear and the vividness of ones imagination, so that when you remove that power, even gradually, IT becomes weaker and weaker to the point it really is no threat at all. Kind of like why adults aren't afraid of monsters under the bed. Because they dont believe it's actually possible anymore. Just that idea itself is really fucking hard to visually translate to screen without outright saying it in the dialogue. I had four requirements going into this
1- I wanna see stan's suicide 2 - I wanna see shit popping out of fortune cookies 3- I wanna see a giant spider 4- they have to kill eddie

The thing is, every fan of the book wants to see certain things. I wish they'd shown stan's wife knocking on the door and her like emotional transition from concern to straight up fear when he doesnt answer. Pennywise actually communicating to Henry Bowers instead of just the implication. But its almost 3 hours long already, and as a fan of the book those 4 things are what I wanted and I got them. Its not an original idea it's a movie based on a book so I have to rate it on how well it was adapted to film. Humor in situations where it's not totally neccessary is a minor criticism. I think the only way IT could be shown totally and accurately is in a 2 or 3 season 8-10 episode series on Netflix or something. Andy Muschietti and the actors did a fantastic job. Unafraid to come from its wild book-based nonsense, silly, intense, creepy and fun as hell. Solid 8 out of 10.

 

[Next Task]

I liked it well enough, though it was more grotesque then scary. The fact the scares pretty much all followed the same pattern and were pretty clearly telegraphed meant I was left with just the gross parts, and there were some of those but I just didn't really get any of the terror the film should have had.

Spoiler: Spoilers

The gay criticism is, of course, utter bullshit. The opening scene is straight from the novel, just contemporised, and based on a real event to boot. The same people complaining about it are the same ones who whine about how oppressed minorities are and then whine more when a piece of media actually shows that oppression.
What the scene didn't do, what neither film did really, was show how much It had poisoned the town, how being careless with their kids and acts of violence were much more commonplace when Pennywise was active. The film didn't need to cover how every 27 years these child murders ended in acts of horrific violence that the town as a whole essentially decided to cover up, but it definitely provides context to the opening scene and just how there's so much violence that the town seems to gloss over.

I thought they did better than the first film in explaining why these characters and not others were able to survive. In the first film the kids pretty much just had the plot armour of central characters, but in this one, with their totems, there was more of a focus on the power of belief that Mike was trying to harness. The new scares for the kids had a little bit of that, but it's certainly more than the first film had.

They didn't explore the characters' lives outside of Derry other than their introduction, but I thought it made sense that Stan married his mother and Beverly her father. It also left a couple of threads dangling here and there, but the film was long enough without bringing those characters back. As for Richie being gay - it's pretty clear he is by the end, but it's not at all a big deal, and considering he's repressed such an important part of his childhood then it doesn't seem that out of character. I hate knowing that it might be a nod to shippers, though, because fans who think tween boys should be lovers rather than friends are terrible, terrible people. But yes, of course, even though Richie is gay, it's very unlikely Eddie is, so again, anyone claiming 'bury your gays' is reaching for bullshit.

I also very much enjoyed the adult cast. I thought the kids were all excellent in the first film, especially Bill, Beverly, Richie and Eddie - and the same applied here. Richie and Eddie falling into their old patterns of banter only didn't work for me right at the end with Eddie's last 'I fucked your mom', but other than that their interactions were some of the best parts of the movie. And yes, Mike - as an adult played by the Old Spice guy - gets short-changed in this film as well. It's nice of them to flesh out Stan's character so he feels more important than just 'guy who kills himself at the start', but it does feel a bit at the expense of the black guy. At least he gets to stick around until the end, though, which I forgot he didn't get to do at all in the book.

At the end of the day, it's a bit too long while still feeling a little truncated, and more of an adventure film than horror, but I at least enjoyed it. Didn't love it, but it was pretty solid. Though, yes, I do wish it had been scarier.

As for Georgie and the sewers - firstly, when I was a kid sewers were awesome places to play, we thought. Secondly, he's four or five, so not very bright. And most importantly, he doesn't actually play in the sewers at all - he just sticks his arm into one to get his boat back from the friendly clown. If there was one moment of horror I particularly missed in the first film that came from the book, it was his arm being ripped off and him being left to die in the street, rather than just being disappeared with a puddle of blood. That was such a horrific image to me when I read it.

 

[Takayuki Yagami]

I saw the movie about a week ago. Did the book have this much filler? They could have cut a lot of the shit about them gathering tokens or whatever.

 

[DiceindaMirror]

It was decent, but I might prefer the 90's miniseries. I'll have to think on it.

The Mortal Kombat 1 and 2 arcade machines being in 1989 really bugged me, but then I remembered it's just a movie and I should really just relax.

 

[Carnavoyeur]

I saw the movie about a week ago. Did the book have this much filler? They could have cut a lot of the shit about them gathering tokens or whatever.

All of Stephen King's novels are mostly filler. The tokens were added to the movie. In the book they do go around town but it's just to regain their memories. It pretty much plays out the same, though.

 

[TrippinKahlua]

I'm gonna go see it in a few hours with my left-wing pro SJW sister.

She'd better tolerate the ironic laughter I know I'm gonna do watching Pennywise kill the gay person.

 

[The Fair Lady]

Just saw it.

Spoiler

I agree with the consensus that they could’ve trimmed the fat and cut out a lot of the flashback scenes. Most of the scares being jumpscares was a little annoying and the CGI old woman just looked silly, but it didn’t bother me too much. The death of the kid in the hall of mirrors was a shock, honestly, and I’m glad they didn’t go with the expected outcome of Bill saving him.

The actors cast for adult Richie and Eddie were perfect, though Richie being gay felt extremely shoehorned, plus like someone else mentioned it didn’t affect the plot at all. The love triangle between Bill, Bev and Ben was super eyeroll-worthy and one of the weakest parts of both movies IMO. I loved the call-backs to the first one though, especially the “scary”, “very scary” and “not scary at all” doors.

All in all, I enjoyed it. Chapter 1 was a teensy bit better but it was still pretty damn good and had a satisfying conclusion.

 

[BobsSpergers]

The cinema wouldn't shut the fuck up where i saw it, laughing through every scene, Including when Pennywise died.

My friend wouldn’t shut up through it. I heard “RIP” and “bruh moment” all throughout the three hours. I wanted to murder-suicide.

Edit: I replied to the wrong post.

There must be something about this movie that attracts autists who can't abide theater etiquette. I went to a morning showing so I could avoid a larger crowd but I still ended up with people beside me talking through the whole thing. Like there's a shot in the film that shows a movie marquee that says "A Nightmare on Elm Street Five" and she loudly reads it out like she's shocked or something.

 

[Ughubughughughughughghlug]

There must be something about this movie that attracts autists who can't abide theater etiquette. I went to a morning showing so I could avoid a larger crowd but I still ended up with people beside me talking through the whole thing. Like there's a shot in the film that shows a movie marquee that says "A Nightmare on Elm Street Five" and she loudly reads it out like she's shocked or something.

Mass appeal? Off-beat, chaotic story attracting people with off-beat personalities?

I just know that in the case of my dude, he's a really nice guy but he's also a huge boor in public (it embarrasses me).

 

[TrippinKahlua]

They cut the ending scene, which means Bill purchased the Silver Bike for no reason.

 

[W00K #17]

Just finally got around to seeing the new movies. I didnt think they were great, but also not terrible. Just some ok horrow movies.


I dont have any particular criticism for what they did wrong as I think i think the source material is hard to make a good film with.

It's one of SKs best and darkest works, but it's not really something that adapts well to screen (like alot of his books).

The only way I think you could really effectively flesh that whole story out and be able to do it graphically enough to really capture the vibe of the book is if you did a 12 episode miniseries on a premium network like HBO. Like so many things had to be cut that just made it hard depict just how disturbing the novel really was. The patrick hockstetter arc and chapter is probably the darkest thing I've ever read by King, but you'd need an hour of run time just to properly depict that part on film.

 

[Trombonista]

Here's an interesting collaboration:

 

[XYZpdq]

Here's an interesting collaboration:

should have been the Doraemon gang

 

[Mad Asshatter]

I saw the movie when it was still in theaters, I liked some of it but a lot of it could have been much better.

With the gay stuff, I really think they would have bitched just as hard if the Adrian stuff was left out just as much as they did when it was left in. To me though, the Adrian stuff felt like it fit the horror of the movie and how It was influencing the town, plus I felt for the character because he really did seem to have a heart.

However, I felt that Ritchie being gay for Eddie honestly did feel like it was shoehorned in hard for the Reddie shippers. The way the whole thing came off was somewhat heavy handed and syrupy, when all I could think of was 'Dude, Eddie is straight and married. Just move the fuck on already.' The fact that yes, these types seem to be hellbent on shipping underaged boys as gay lovers (and I have seem some of their fics and art depicting this ship) is as someone else put it nicely, quite disturbing and really does makes me wonder.


As for the rest, my other criticisms is that they could have made Bowers and Bev's husband much more to greater effect. Besides Bowers being nuts, the husband is an abusive possessive fuck, and showing how Pennywise could influence people and drive them to unspeakable acts would be much more fitting to showcase as adult fears then some ineffective jump scares that fall flat. Influencing people to do bad things could have been the whole overarching theme of the second chapter insteady of trying (and largely failing) for overt scary, so ultimately missed opportunities I guess.

Lastly, they shortchanged Mike. His adult segments were really lacking and barebones, and they could have cut some of the other stuff if they were worried about running over time. Besides the Native American stuff, they could have shown how he got through his parents dying in the fire and how he got his token. Instead, the one character that had some hardcore stuff hinted at in the trailer and is the backbone of the group gets squat.

This movie could have been much better, and I really was looking forward to it being the rare movie that I want to have a physical copy of. Unfortunately it just was 'Eh' and more then likely I just won't bother.

5/10.

 

[A Grey Cat]

So really history ended up repeating itself with it? The original version was praised for the actor playing pennywise and all the segments with the kid actors. But the adult actors and segments are considered the dull bland parts nobody cares about