Livestock Thread

[InspectorJappOfficial]

How small did you start with your rabbits? Is a couple hutches in a backyard a reasonable way to raise the things? I live in the suburbs with a pretty small yard, but it sounds like your setup doesn't take much space.

Butting in to say that yes, you do not need a lot of space to raise rabbits. They can be healthy even in pretty small spaces, as long as they have enough room to get up and turn around and sprawl out. They do love being given the chance to run around - we tried to give each rabbit a few hours of exercise in a decent size run in the yard whenever we could - but they can be content to not do that for a while, and most people who raise meat rabbits don't do even that much. And as far as total space taken up goes, I've known people who've kept their rabbit cages inside a one car garage.

The wire floors are perfectly fine for rabbits, too. Like, there's certainly things that happen to livestock that apologists are too quick to excuse, but this is not one of them. Rabbits have very thick pads on their feet and the wire floors cause no difficulty. What would cause difficulty is a build-up of chemicals from their urine, which can cause very serious rashes if not given a way to drain out, e.g. a wire floor. So too much hay, which, yeah, they will pee on, can actually be genuinely bad for them in a way that the harsher seeming metal wires are not.

 

[${Sandy}]

Does anybody have any recommendations for equipment I should buy to harvest chickens?

I have harvested a few roosters and usually its a pretty clean and easy kill.

But the last time I harvested a rooster, I cut the throat and the blood was draining. Everything seemed fine, and after a few minutes the damn thing started flopping around like crazy when it should have been dead.

I know that things like this can happen because of nerves and what not. But part of me still has that doubt in my mind that I had somehow fucked up and the chicken suffered an unnecessary amount of pain. I don't have any moral issues about killing an animal and eating it. In fact, part of me has been considering only eating meat when I harvest the animal myself.

But I love my birds, even the ones I cull and I don't want them to suffer.

I just use what I have on hand, I had a knife and some bungie cord and I just tied the chicken up, snapped its neck, and cut the throat. That method seems to work just fine but after yesterday I feel genuinely fucking awful. So I want to know, is there anything I get to make harvesting chickens as quick and painless for the chicken as possible, that won't leave any doubt in my mind that the chicken suffered too much?

I don't think I can harvest one again unless I'm confident I won't cause an undue amount of pain to the animal.

 

[Obstacle]

Could one manufacture nitrate fertilizer by farming pigeons and harvesting their shit?
Compost the loft sweepings like?
My granda raised pigeons, and it occurred to me that they breed like rats, and essentially turn trash into nitrate rich pigeon shit, and these two facts might just solve that fertilizer crisis people are always yamping about.
'S just a matter of ratios.
How efficient a nitrate factory is a pigeon?
Can they be made better?

 

[Dagoth AMOGUS]

My cow @Judas Connor Moon keeps playing too much Marvel Rivals

 

[${Sandy}]

Could one manufacture nitrate fertilizer by farming pigeons and harvesting their shit?
Compost the loft sweepings like?
My granda raised pigeons, and it occurred to me that they breed like rats, and essentially turn trash into nitrate rich pigeon shit, and these two facts might just solve that fertilizer crisis people are always yamping about.
'S just a matter of ratios.
How efficient a nitrate factory is a pigeon?
Can they be made better?

If you do plan on collecting the poo for fertilizer one thing I reccomend is using sand instead of bedding for their coop. I do that because its easier to manage than bedding and its easy to clean. Just use a litter box scooper and a rake, takes like 10 minutes max.

I heard you can compost the chicken shit and sell it to people as fertilizer so I was planning on doing that.

My cow @Judas Connor Moon keeps playing too much Marvel Rivals

Cull him

 

[LowlyPheasent]

I heard you can compost the chicken shit and sell it to people as fertilizer so I was planning on doing that.

One fella I know who raises broiler chickens on the side has some of those coops on wheels. Moves them along the field letting the chickens progressively fertilize a field now and then.

 

[The handsome tard]

Why don't more people own chickens then? I know Mexicans do, but if eggs cost as much as bullets in the US, what's stopping more people from raising chickens? They seem to have less space requirements than dogs.

Perhaps a mixture of lack of space outside of rural areas, culture that doesnt motivate self reliance and, lets face it, dear ol' government trying to stick their unnaturally long nose where they dont belong.

 

[Yugica]

Could one manufacture nitrate fertilizer by farming pigeons and harvesting their shit?
Compost the loft sweepings like?
My granda raised pigeons, and it occurred to me that they breed like rats, and essentially turn trash into nitrate rich pigeon shit, and these two facts might just solve that fertilizer crisis people are always yamping about.
'S just a matter of ratios.
How efficient a nitrate factory is a pigeon?
Can they be made better?

You can, yes. If you want to speed up the process of turning the urea and ammonia(a byproduct of the breakdown of urea) into nitrate then you can take an approach like what is done for aquariums. High surface area media for bacteria(nitrifying bacteria and others, see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nitrification .) with a highly oxygenated and stirred tank. The bacteria will consume oxygen to make the ammonia into less toxic nitrite and then finally nitrate. You need to keep the oxygen levels high however otherwise you will get a denitrifying environment(see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denitrification ) as nitrates are powerful oxidizers and those denitrifying bacteria will utilize them in place of O2.

You don't have to do that though, just wetting and stirring and mixing up the pigeon droppings will do well. Especially if you mix it with something like grass clippings as that'll help keep the pH from being ungodly and allow for the mixture to be more porous(gives the microbes more food to eat too).

The thing with the nitrogen from pigeons is that it seems pretty likely that they just get it from their food, if you want more nitrogen then you want nitrogen sequestering bacteria. Some algae do this, legumes famously do this( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legume#Nitrogen_fixation ) but also Azolla ferns(a kind of floating plant) utilize cyanobacteria to fixate nitrogen. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azolla . Azolla is also edible for livestock.

In the same vein, duckweed can also be used for making feed from that bioreactor concept I mentioned before with highly oxygenated water. Duckweed is pretty rich in protein and is very good at pulling nitrates and phosphates out of water and is also a potential food source for chickens, ducks(the name gives that away) and such. Duckweed very rapidly multiplies too and is considered a kind of pest plant in the aquarium hobby for how prone it is to completely overtaking the surface of the water. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lemnoideae

 

[chimpSculpture]

Does anyone here have experience with quail? I've never kept birds before but I've been planning on raising quails because I like their small eggs. Maybe later I'll replace them with chickens.


I'm tearing down my old shed, and building a new brick one. I'd like to build their coop against the brick shed so I can build an entrance that goes into a raised (few inches off the ground) sectioned off part of the shed that'll be there's (later if I replace them with chickens I'll convert this in to a hen house with nest boxes, I believe quails don't like nest boxes and prefer to lay eggs straight on the ground). I want to do it like this so they can have both a semi-indoors and outdoors space (I don't think they'll suffer or not lay eggs if this indoors space isn't there, but I like the idea and project). I live in Europe and it can get cold here so I think this'll be more suitable. It'll look something like this:

Spoiler: Noob questions

I don't know what's a fair bird to coop-space ratio. I've been told I can keep as many as five or six quail in something that's the size of a fucking rabbit hutch, that seems too small to me. To my understanding they will injure themselves if the roof of their coop is too tall so I want to have as much horizontal space as possible.

What species should I get? I think Coturnix (Japanese quail) are a good idea.

What's the best way to feed them? Compared to something like chickens I believe they immediately dig around and scatter there feed around as much as possible when they're fed, making there enclosure very messy. What's the best way to avoid this or is it a non issue?

How can I keep rats from getting in? If I want it to be something Bossmanjack would be proud of and have it highly rat proof, it looks like I'd need to bury a mesh under the coop so they can't dig under the walls and up into the enclosure. Is this overkill?

 

[Sperg_rancher]

I've seen people drive cattle with fucking pibbles

I've seen people herd cattle with RC cars. not in person. the cows will both chase the thing, and get spooked when it approaches their rear. the people aren't running into the cows with them, but they do give them a spook every so often it seems. what are your thoughts there?

 

[${Sandy}]

To be fair, my pitbull is really protective of my chickens. Never shows aggression to them, and I've observed her patrolling the backyard and following the chickens around.

I didnt even train her to do that.

 

[RollingRock2]

Hello I have a question from the Jack Scalfani thread. Is it possible these are unwashed local farm eggs in a reused Kirkland egg carton? Or is Jack, who is very stupid, very lazy, and a liar, lying? They look too clean and consistent in shell colour to me but I only had unwashed eggs once.

 

[${Sandy}]

I wouldn't be surprised if he is full of shit.

But if all of those eggs are from the same chicken then it is certainly possible for them all to have the same color and shape. I've been preserving the eggs my bantam hens lay. All of them are the same shade of white.

 

[Sperg_rancher]

Kurzgesagt released a highly Zionist video yesterday on livestock:

Looks like Bill and Melinda Gates are paying them to try to justify permanent cost increases in meat...

That aside, I'm sympathetic to the animals, and I've noticed that buying farm/butcher direct will usually offset the costs of happier animals.
Anyone else wanna weigh in here? What happens if the entire industry is regulated to remove factory farms?

 

[LowlyPheasent]

What happens if the entire industry is regulated to remove factory farms?

As just kind of a general overview:

Factory Farms:

• Lower cost, high production
• Unsanitary and cramped, disease easier to spread
• Animals have to be pumped full of antibiotics/other shit more as a result of the prior
• Uses less land

Conventional Farm:

• Higher cost, lower production
• More humane and can be more clean though some are neglectful
• Reduced need for treatment as a result of the prior
• Requires more land

I think weening off factory farming slowly is good but with urban/suburban sprawl, the warehouse/conumer industrial sprawl, population growth, and present cost of living it's hard to shut down factory farming. At the end of the day though anti-humanists/animal advacates are going to continue to push it further if it just gets to an ethical conventional farming standard because there is no enough for people like that. It's shitty but it provides poorer people easier access to food which is critical, without solving the issue of the prior mentioned sprawl to accomodate land for agriculture I don't think it's doable. I also instantly distrust anything pushed by Kurzegates though.

Edit: And this is coming from a guy who refuses to buy shit that's factory farmed because I think it's both shitty to the animals but also just shit quality food.

 

[Fastest Hand In The East]

Everything seemed fine, and after a few minutes the damn thing started flopping around like crazy when it should have been dead.

Unfortunately that's normal- post mortem agony of the body. Same happens rarely with humans, but nobody likes to talk about it. I think you shouldn't feel that bad- the brain is detached and dead so it doesn't feel that, as far as I understand it.

I just use what I have on hand, I had a knife and some bungie cord and I just tied the chicken up, snapped its neck, and cut the throat. That method seems to work just fine but after yesterday I feel genuinely fucking awful. So I want to know, is there anything I get to make harvesting chickens as quick and painless for the chicken as possible, that won't leave any doubt in my mind that the chicken suffered too much?

I know people are using these things:

It looks nasty, but it has to be done.
I've also read about people using mechanical guillotines, but can't find any good picture of it. In my opinion it's better to trust the mechanics instead of your hand in killing, no matter how steady.

 

[${Sandy}]

Unfortunately that's normal- post mortem agony of the body. Same happens rarely with humans, but nobody likes to talk about it. I think you shouldn't feel that bad- the brain is detached and dead so it doesn't feel that, as far as I understand it.

That helps ease my concious. I have no problem with killing an animal to eat but I feel like a monster if I think I caused an undue amount of pain.

I was planning on getting that cone next time I harvest a chicken.

 

[Blue Gem Kosher Queen]

Time to embrace the quailpill kiwis.

Does anyone here have experience with quail? I've never kept birds before but I've been planning on raising quails because I like their small eggs.

I'm going to start by giving you some fine resources on all things quail.
Coturnix Corner & Slightly Rednecked. You are going to encounter these two a lot on all things quail related on the Internet, specially on YouTube and Facebook.
Myshire Farm. Product reviews, recipes and a 25 video long playlist on how to raise quail for profit.
Double Trouble Homestead. What got me into the quailpill.

Full disclosure: I'm linking these channels before answering for two reasons.
1. I believe it is more effective to give visual examples.
2. These people have years of experience in animal husbandry and I'm basically going armchair here.

I've experience with birbs but since my mum entered her hunt for plot of land to retire arc, I'm looking into self-sufficiency because the one she wants is in the middle of nowhere. I'll be echoing stuff I've learned online and irl for research.

Maybe later I'll replace them with chickens.

Just don't put them together. They have different dietary needs and chicken can and will bully quails. If you want to get quails a roomate, go for rabbits.

I've been told I can keep as many as five or six quail in something that's the size of a fucking rabbit hutch, that seems too small to me.

There are people raising quails in drawers.
Giving them space is a better idea for their well being and happiness but don't give them too much because they will become more territorial. About 1 square foot per bird.

To my understanding they will injure themselves if the roof of their coop is too tall so I want to have as much horizontal space as possible.

I saw a video of a guy that made what looked like a mobile station with this same philosophy. With quails, you either give them something under 60 cms or over 2 meters in height because otherwise they might kill themselves, something quails are experts at. Horizontal space is your friend.

What species should I get? I think Coturnix (Japanese quail) are a good idea.

Technically a trick question. All other quails merely exist for the pet market. So, the coturnix is your choice. However, there are kinds of coturnix.

Regular coturnix: 100-120 grams. Master egg layers. Come in a variety of pretty colours.
Jumbo coturnix: Can weigh 300 grams. Still lay plenty of eggs and give you meat.

If possible, always go for the generalist just in case you need it.

What's the best way to feed them? Compared to something like chickens I believe they immediately dig around and scatter there feed around as much as possible when they're fed, making there enclosure very messy. What's the best way to avoid this or is it a non issue?

The little bastards basically swim on it and will hurt each other if they think they don't have enough food.
If you want to save money in feed, soak or ferment it. Here's a short out of 3 on all you need to know if you want to ferment it. If you do ferment it, use a chick feeder.

How can I keep rats from getting in? If I want it to be something Bossmanjack would be proud of and have it highly rat proof, it looks like I'd need to bury a mesh under the coop so they can't dig under the walls and up into the enclosure. Is this overkill?

Mate, nothing is overkill when it comes to securing your quails. You think of keeping the predators out but you'll struggle more to keep the damn birds in. People in this thread have described goats as escape artists at best and agents of chaos at worst. At least a goat will give a fight if it escapes and a predator wants to eat it. The quail will escape for no other reason than it could and then find its way into an early grave one way or the other.

These guys will stare at the sky when it rains. You'll need to get a shallow water bowl or a pecking waterer because otherwise it will die of exposure. No, really.

You'll need to bury the mesh, yes. But don't use chicken wire, they will find a way to hurt themselves with it. 1/2 hardware cloth is what you will need to keep them from being able to use it to harm themselves. Then there's the issue that you have to actually quailproof it by ensuring there isn't a single space they can sneak into to get outside or hurt themselves. Again, goats but smaller and with wings.

But if you know what you are getting into, you got yourself one fantastic source of food and fertilizer.

 

[Happy Little War Painter]

I recently acquired for the upcoming season breeding pairs of rabbits and hutches (In need of repair).

Welcome to the farm family, Josh, Amber, and Chantal.

 

[${Sandy}]

Josh, Amber, and Chantal all fucking like rabbits.