Magic The Gathering

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Doorkeeper Thrull is honestly a good answer to Thasa's Oracle.

It even has flash.
Honestly it is probably the best one currently existing.

Cheap, Flash and has flying so it can carry equipment and hit Monarch/Initiative/Coveted Jewel holders
 
EDH being a sanctioned and very actively supported format has been the death of any charm it might've had before, not only because of specially tailored cards and decks, but because it has brought in every single type of player ever thanks to it oppressing any other paper format when it comes to product and events.
That's the issue - it isn't sanctioned in the sense of sixty-card constructed, for the reasons you pointed out. Stores that give out prize support, and tournaments with prize support, are doing so on their own dime and revenue, because Wizards isn't retarded enough to be blind to the fact that you'd just have people who show up, triple-team the odd-man-out in the game, and then throw the game to whoever was designated the winner and split the pot.

Rule 0 was always a cop-out from their end because they're too lazy to do anything. It works in friend groups, which already don't need it, because it translates to "don't be an antisocial autistic retard."
No, put paying 6 Mana to Anticipate at sorcery speed is fucking trash and none of the Disguises are great if you are casting them as just vanillas, and "White is the best color already" just means the best color has access to a hoser for a major mechanic of the set at uncommon.
Lol dimir is the worst color pair this format by a country mile, don't play the shit faerie and things might improve. The ones that flip on two mana except for the 2/1 lifelink are all really solid, with the one that dies into a 2/2 being middling. The dryad that fetches a land and the x/x for forests are some of the better commons and uncommons in green, which is probably the second-best individual color even if boros is top tog.

And the dog itself really isn't that good. On The Job is the far better card and is far more common when you're above diamond.
Rares are way more egregious in this set, it's very very prince
Also things that are annoying me about the set..the fucking "Utility lands" are all fucking shit. Bring back Crystal Grotto.
Think of this set like Brother's War: you have to be doing something every turn. The taplands are unplayable unless you have a ton of artifact sac synergy
That is retarded because there is no actual way to define what is Cedh power level, and anyone who isn't a faggot should be wanting to tune their deck as much as they can without breaking the Thematics of the deck.
It's hard to get random people at a store to agree on what's Cedh. It'd be easy to get a committee that supposedly makes the rules to do so. Do casuals want MLD? Do they want fast mana? Do they want infinite combos that require extreme, extreme brain power to use like "zirda makes monoliths untap for one less than they make"? No? Shove it into cEDH. What do you care? If you're tuning your deck to be the best possible, why do you care if it's now got "competitive" as a tag to it?

I'd personally be a fan of three divisions. Broadly, this third pod would ban fast mana, reserved list et all, but allow everything else: stax, mld, turn-2 infinites, etc. etc. It would take an afternoon to draft it up at most, and they could even keep the whole "rule zero" cop-out after having shit it out.

There's also literally no amount of money you can spend on your deck to force anyone to play against it in a casual format, dude.
Hulk isn't a problem, it was Flash Hulk automatically making it sac itself and instantly winning at next upkeep with Lab Man (it would use oracle now lol). If you have to set up the Hulk beforehand it's fine.
The problem was that Flash and Hulk are both extremely easy to tutor to hand, which made for an oppressive interaction that was only able to be dealt with by counters, stifle, or Shadow of Doubt to stop the tutors. Now, there's also Ashiok and Opposition Agent to stop the tutoring, Tishana's Tidebinder as a very playable stifle to blank the death trigger (simic also has one of these as a split card), and people have started teching Angel's Grace even if they lack it all.

So to say, there's more than enough tools in the modern day to deal with it. Most of the shit on the banlist could come off for competitive, like Balance. Biorhythm is another one that's got no use on there, same as Coalition Victory or Braids or so-on.
Cedh Decks are Glass Canons
Maybe if they're made by idiots, but very few of them go all-in without shittons of protection and backups.
It's like losing to turn 2 Blightsteel in Vintage Cube.
Except that you know Blightsteel is in that cube, and there's one of each card in the pool that everyone drafts from. Next draft, who knows what you'll get?

Meanwhile, Krark-Sakashima involves copying an EDH decklist. Wow, who knew copy spells could chain together infinitely with each other and there's several cards that turn that into infinite damage and infinite mana? Really galaxy-brain stuff there. Hey, did you know that a deck with four Sheoldreds in standard shits all over one with just one?
Doorkeeper Thrull is honestly a good answer to Thasa's Oracle.
Not really. So if they don't have a counter for the thrull, or removal for it, Thoracle hits the board and they don't Consultation. The way that the combo plays is that it gets Thoracle's ability on the stack, holds priority, and then casts consultation; if you blank thoracle, they haven't yet consultation'd, so they have the rest of their deck (and all of the backups) still in play.

This is why Thoracle's being equal-to zero sucks so much balls; even if you let consultation wipe their deck and then kill thoracle, they still win unless the trigger itself gets squelched.
 
Lol dimir is the worst color pair this format by a country mile, don't play the shit faerie and things might improve
I was actually base black..using the fact that many of the morphs are dual colors to..not have to run off color lands and basically running "Creatures and Removal" which works in many formats.

Think of this set like Brother's War:
Another really boring ZZZ format.

I'd personally be a fan of three divisions.
That will be great, nothing like having no idea what decks to Bring to a Magic Con because I have no idea what people are actually going to be playing there. That will be super healthy.

Do casuals want MLD?
MLD isn't even good.

why do you care if it's now got "competitive" as a tag to it?
Because I don't want to play the game of "I have to tune my deck even more downwards to play at all" even more than I already do. I like taking a deck concept as far as I can with it, but I kind of have Cedh because most of it is just..a lot of the samey shit every game. I actually have a sideboard and change my commander on my favorite deck because the main commander is too Linear in comparison to the alt commander.

And even taking out the turn 3 win, I still get people on MODO who bitch when they list "Power level 8" When..I use Defense of the Heart to do the thing that Defense of the Heart does.

Maybe if they're made by idiots, but very few of them go all-in without shittons of protection and backups.
Yes..and that takes up resources so you can cheese a Cedh game by letting the actual power decks fight shit out and slipping in something that the "Cedh" staples can't really handle.

Except that you know Blightsteel is in that cube, and there's one of each card in the pool that everyone drafts from. Next draft, who knows what you'll get?
yeah and I know that if I am rolling a Cedh game chances are I am gonna deal with some nonsense that probably shouldn't be in EDH at all because the Rules committee are dickless faggots who are afraid to ban cards that shouldn't be in the format, like Sol Ring..and Mana Crypt..and Thassa's Oracle and Arcane Signet and Dockside, and Rhystic Study, and Smothering Tithe.

Power really isn't an issue in the format but holy fucking shit there are a ton of cards that need to be gotten rid of because the play pattern is god damn stuid.

Meanwhile, Krark-Sakashima involves copying an EDH decklist. Wow, who knew copy spells could chain together infinitely with each other and there's several cards that turn that into infinite damage and infinite mana? Really galaxy-brain stuff there. Hey, did you know that a deck with four Sheoldreds in standard shits all over one with just one?
Oh no, the internet provided people resources to improve their decks so decks are stronger than ever..the thing that everyone knows has happened and kind of just accepted because unless you are gonna set fire to EDHrec's servers then people are gonna use it.

God you are so fucking butthurt that your Precon isn't powerful, yeah the game can be expensive..if you absolutely have to have the strongest shit possible..quite frankly the answer I have been saying for over a year now is that since WOTC decided that they wanted to whale people with proxies then Proxies are completely acceptable and if a card costs something stupid then you should be allowed to proxy it.

If that means we see a power spike that is fine, the RC needs to start doing their fucking job, but why do that when you can just screech on twitter about toxic fandom and point out Rule Zero exists.
 
I was actually base black
So, the worst, most shallow color in the format? Like even if you pull Izoni p1p1, you're better off doing GU/GW splash black.
Traditional black "staples," like murder, are dogshit in this format. Extract a Confession is their premier common, and that's in part because their commons are not good.
Another really boring ZZZ format.
Brother's War at high levels of play was a great time. If you were playing against retards, sure, you draft the RB deck and quickly come in first, but at a competent pod you couldn't get enough pieces to go anywhere with it. ONE was a truly shit format with zero interplay.
That will be great, nothing like having no idea what decks to Bring to a Magic Con because I have no idea what people are actually going to be playing there.
So, under the current system, you know what to bring to a Magic Con? The numbers system and Rule 0 works well?
MLD isn't even good.
Do you... think casuals dislike it because it's "too strong?" They dislike it because it often makes games drag on for hours. If it were used like it is in vintage cube, there wouldn't be as much bitching, but it isn't.

A casual banlist would make de jure what is already de facto, given that MLD, Stax, etc etc are already non-grata in casual pods.
Because I don't want to play the game of "I have to tune my deck even more downwards to play at all" even more than I already do. I like taking a deck concept as far as I can with it, but I kind of have Cedh because most of it is just..a lot of the samey shit every game.
Hold on, hold on - you don't see tuning your deck to be as strong as possible, to be as effective as possible, to not be... competitive? You're basically saying you want to play above casual, but not quite at cEDH. Whoah, weird, it's like you'd fall into a third category, wherein anyone bitching about, say:
And even taking out the turn 3 win, I still get people on MODO who bitch when they list "Power level 8" When..I use Defense of the Heart to do the thing that Defense of the Heart does.
...would be called a retard, because DotH isn't on the "tuned" banlist. Maybe that's a card that could go on a "casual" banlist, because of course you're getting combo pieces with it - and casuals don't like combo. More enfranchised players are fine with combo, and Heart anyways is easy to remove and play around.

You see the issue here, right? 8 means nothing. 10 means nothing, nor do any of the "scale" numbers. The system has never worked and always been retarded: everything is a 7. With a dedicated casual banlist that's actually spelled out, you defang people from bitching anywhere else when you do basic game interactions, like entwining tooth and nail: "If you don't like it, why not just play casual?"
Yes..and that takes up resources so you can cheese a Cedh game by letting the actual power decks fight shit out and slipping in something that the "Cedh" staples can't really handle.
I'm just skeptical of whoever your opponents were in those cases. Yes, they'll expend resources keeping each other from going off, but I don't see how Winota stax or Orvar combo or even Edric turns slip on banana peels that hard.
ban cards that shouldn't be in the format, like Sol Ring..and Mana Crypt..and Thassa's Oracle and Arcane Signet and Dockside, and Rhystic Study, and Smothering Tithe.

Power really isn't an issue in the format but holy fucking shit there are a ton of cards that need to be gotten rid of because the play pattern is god damn stuid.
We're fundamentally in agreement that the RC should have a meaningful banlist, but I don't see the point in banning those all outright. Let cEDH have every single one. Let casual ban everything but signet. Let the in-between keep Rhystic and Tithe as well, and maybe Oracle if you ban Consultation outside of cEDH.
Proxies are completely acceptable and if a card costs something stupid then you should be allowed to proxy it.
If you don't like the boring play pattern and find cEDH samey, arguing that everyone should just proxy power sure isn't a way to make the entire format not devolve into samey, boring shit. This is fundamentally why I want these divisions - let competitive players have their space and have a ruleset that caters to them, and casuals have the same. The competitive scene can get as repetitive and boring as its meta dictates - the whole point of the casual scene is to avoid that shit and just have fun.
God you are so fucking butthurt that your Precon isn't powerful
This entire time, man, I have not once argued that other people should power themselves down to "play with me," lol. You have to be severely autistic to not know if you're pubstomping, and severely pathetic to pubstomp knowingly. If everyone else at a pod is playing durdly turtle-tribal decks, and that isn't your speed? Literally just don't play with them, lol. If that's the only crew around, and you really don't want to make a handicapped deck, maybe try out one of the other eight billion hobbies that exist on the planet.

Like, let's look at two retards and ask why they're any different.

Take your guy bitching about Heart. He goes over to a cEDH pod and throws a shitfit when someone plays t1 vault into basalt and knows Kinnan will go infinite next turn. He demands everyone play less powerful decks, because he can't compete. No-one should be able to win before turn seven, because that's how the game is supposed to be played! Nevermind that everyone else at the table wanted powerful, fast games: they all have to play by this retard's standards. Or, they don't, and they tell him to go play at a different pod and he throws his deck and gets asked to leave.

Now, the alternative. Some fat whale, recently thrown into a tiff because he has an emotional response to internet stickers, squeezes his ass just barely into a seat where a guy (who is not Richard) is playing birds tribal, another a zombie precon, and the third guy is borrowing a friend's lathril elves. The newcomer pulls out Kambal turbostax, and has the game completely on lock by turn three. The other three players scoop and ask the odious, odorous guy to play something else. He begins yelling about how he's so much better at the game than any of them are, how his deck is so much better designed and requires so much more thought, and how they should all upgrade their decks to play on his level because that's how the game is supposed to be played! Or, wait, no, they tell him they aren't going to play with him, so he kicks a chair, injuring himself, and gets asked to leave.

What, exactly, is so hard about laughing at both of these people?
 
I don't even figure trying to split the format would mean much, you have to find enough people that want to manage, that are qualified to manage it, and more than likely you'll need WotC to sigh off on it (they won't, because in-person and webcam cEDH play is full of playtest cards and other fakes.) We're in too deep for there to be an easy solution, if you ask me.
Actually they do have an easy solution: brawl.

Let the "standard" EDH be the cEDH that official WOTC events happen for and let everything else be handled on rule 0. If it's a store event, then let the store have their own posted banlist.
 
Damn, I forgot that we have two threads. @I'mma real anime gurl is right, by the way
Gentlemen, I regret to inform you that the West has fallen. Again. From this moment we are on the path to a crossover with animal control.
View attachment 5749754

Also, some Assasins Creed got spoiled. It will be secret lair or something. Edit: It actually seems to be a whole set.
 
Let the "standard" EDH be the cEDH that official WOTC events happen for and let everything else be handled on rule 0. If it's a store event, then let the store have their own posted banlist.
WOTC can never officially support EDH competitive events in any way unless there's basically zero prize support, or it goes hands off: last year it gave stores some surplus Strixhaven precons, told them to host an event, and do whatever they wanted with the event. That's the best they can do, because there's absolutely hilariously rampant cheating in cEDH that's impossible to really resolve because it's multiplayer.

So in 1v1 draft, they had to actually implement a rule about players actually having to play games out, because it was so often the case that angle-shooters would go to an event and force draws with each other to boost their prize pool share. That is currently happening in unofficial cEDH tournies, where multiple players will actively choose not to win the game but rather to go infinite in a way that kills everyone simultaneously... or all four players just scoop. That's in addition to the more mundane cheating - just this last week, some guy in a big tourney palmed the top 15 of his deck so he could infinite on turn 2 or something and win.

This is probably why they haven't lit a fire under the RC's ass, honestly: they're never hosting tournaments for the shit in either case. The point of splitting banlists would be purely to not hold competitive players back to casual preferences, and to reduce the occurrence of whining from pubstompers and casuals alike.
In Bloombarrow planeswalkers become furry.
Are they still doing that? I swear that half of the time they don't direct the artists to make the characters look any different based on the plane they're on, but that always struck me as a neat detail. They'll probably just make Ajani a focus there anyways.
 
Yeah makes sense battlebond shrunk planeswalkers to the proper size
Not entirely. Because there's no humans in Lorwyn but it was implied planeswalkers still maintained their form while there.

Heck in the origin story, Nissan sparking to Lorwyn almost became Taylor Swift with how captivated the elves there were with her alien but "beautiful" form.

I can sort of allow size adjustment (whatever size "means" with planes) but species hopping? This is some trans propaganda / furry bullshit.
 
This is some trans propaganda / furry bullshit.
Oh it's 100% propaganda, but at least we have seen planes that do absolutely fucktarded shit before in regards to affecting Planeswalkers.

captivated the elves there were with her alien but "beautiful" form.
Well that was retarded as shit because Lorwyn elves are self loving faggots who hate anything not a Lorwyn elf, Nissa is different enough from them (she got no Hooves or Horns) they would instantly call her an Eyeblight.

It gets worse. Judging from the spoilers it looks like Kellen is finally meeting Oko.
Does anybody actually care about Kellen?
 
As someone who likes to look at a bunch of card games on a surface level because I like to just see what is going on. Whenever I look at "high level" commander being played, it always just looks like really poor yugioh.
 
Does anyone want to take bets on how long before Magic becomes an obscure IP again?
As soon as they can get away with printing only universes beyond, so within a year or two. The game will become like a western Weiss/Schwarz and be entirely based on playing cards based on other IPs. So, I think magic won't become obscure, but The game won't have an identity and won't have an actual IP of it's own.
 
As soon as they can get away with printing only universes beyond, so within a year or two. The game will become like a western Weiss/Schwarz and be entirely based on playing cards based on other IPs. So, I think magic won't become obscure, but The game won't have an identity and won't have an actual IP of it's own.
as the memes foreshadowed...

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Are they still doing that?
Well, to be honest, so far we've seen only Jace do it, and it's most likely something like this
FZHx2ZtWAAEv0cW.jpg
but with illusion magic. So, he isn't really an animal, so far. Just putting a holographic fursuit to see what's going on at Rainfurrest.

Edit: oh shit, Ral is also a furry now
skdsiq46zdkc1.png
He too has blue and my theory still stands, but now I am concerned.
 
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Well, to be honest, so far we've seen only Jace do it, and it's most likely something like this
It wasn't a race swap or anything, but during amonkhet Gideon instantly had Egyptian styled armor before they'd seen amonkhet.
 
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