Mass Effect General Thread

ME2 was the height of the franchise. The point where Mass Effect and Bioware got all the glaze for revolutionizing gaming narratives and making games art. So it stands to reason that it was all downhill from there, not only for Mass Effect as a franchise, but for Bioware as a whole.

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I still can't fathom how Bioware can look themselves in the face and think people would forget that fuck-up. The wound is still sore, people are still angry, and the fact that they fucked over Revan and the Jedi Exile in SWTOR, as well as the fact that Andromeda was a mediocre game, and now we have Veilguard fucking up bad and they're talking about reviving the Mass Effect franchise with Mass Effect 5. Are they fucking kidding? People are still angry over the ending in ME3 and the mediocrity of Andromeda. Do they really want to revisit their failure? The only people who give a shit about the Mass Effect story and lore hate their fucking guts. How the hell is this going to work?
 
ME2 is when I knew Bioware was dead. It's no surprise that it was followed by DA2 and ME3, since all of the flaws present were already in ME2. The decline might have started the moment they began to chase the console market with KotOR and Jade Empire, but by ME2 it was over. The game completely abandons reasonable writing, consistent worldbuilding and verisimilitude to instead tell a very railroaded story of Shepard dying, coming back to life five minutes later and then completely ignoring the Reapers to go solve his friends' daddy issues (almost every loyalty mission fits). Gone was any attempt to at an interesting building an interesting sci-fi setting; we were now just railroaded along a Rule of Cool(tm)-driven adventure, where the dialogue wheel doesn't offer any choices but obsequiously agreeing with whatever the Illusive Man wants to you do. It's such a drastic and sudden step down and the game makes sure to rub it in your face with the opening.
1. Before he died in 2022, former Escapist writer Shamus Young wrote an entire retrospective of the series in multiple articles. He even had Mr BTounge on his site, who's ME3 vid was the one to explain the ending to me back in the day.
I think this was the single best article in Shamus' retrospective (although the TIM Island one might be the most fun). It perfectly encapsulates a lot of why ME2 feels like it's where it all went wrong.
 
People are still angry over the ending in ME3 and the mediocrity of Andromeda. Do they really want to revisit their failure?
I like the synthesis ending to Mass Effect. Shepard is Jesus (he practically forms a cross as he jumps into the beam), and sacrifices himself to free us from the original sin of the Leviathans. That unironically works for me.

What doesn't work for me is the level design of Mass Effect 2.
 
The legendary edition has been modded to such a degree, you have to wonder if the modding community had access to the original voice cast, they'd just go ahead and make an entire game from the ground up.
You have AI voices for that.
Main problem is the Unreal Engine being outright hostile towards mods.
Making mods for Mass Effect requires a lot of tricking a 20 year old engine into thinking you're using the actual development tools
 
ME2 is when I knew Bioware was dead. It's no surprise that it was followed by DA2 and ME3, since all of the flaws present were already in ME2. The decline might have started the moment they began to chase the console market with KotOR and Jade Empire, but by ME2 it was over. The game completely abandons reasonable writing, consistent worldbuilding and verisimilitude to instead tell a very railroaded story of Shepard dying, coming back to life five minutes later and then completely ignoring the Reapers to go solve his friends' daddy issues (almost every loyalty mission fits). Gone was any attempt to at an interesting building an interesting sci-fi setting; we were now just railroaded along a Rule of Cool(tm)-driven adventure, where the dialogue wheel doesn't offer any choices but obsequiously agreeing with whatever the Illusive Man wants to you do. It's such a drastic and sudden step down and the game makes sure to rub it in your face with the opening.

I think this was the single best article in Shamus' retrospective (although the TIM Island one might be the most fun). It perfectly encapsulates a lot of why ME2 feels like it's where it all went wrong.
ME2's main story was absolutely atrocious, but it is kind of funny how with the character writing you get these glimpses where there were old guard Bioware writers not totally on board with the direction things were going in.
Of course pretty much all of them left the company shortly thereafter.
 
ME2 is when I knew Bioware was dead. It's no surprise that it was followed by DA2 and ME3, since all of the flaws present were already in ME2. The decline might have started the moment they began to chase the console market with KotOR and Jade Empire, but by ME2 it was over.
Actually, KOTOR was the rise of Bioware. Prior to that, it was just seen as a cute little RPG company; making a blockbuster Star Wars game, during the height of SW mania in the early 2000s, put Bioware on the map. KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect, and Dragon Age were the zenith of Bioware's classic game design, before they started whoring out to FPS fans with ME2 and action game fans with DA2.

The game completely abandons reasonable writing, consistent worldbuilding and verisimilitude to instead tell a very railroaded story of Shepard dying, coming back to life five minutes later and then completely ignoring the Reapers to go solve his friends' daddy issues (almost every loyalty mission fits). Gone was any attempt to at an interesting building an interesting sci-fi setting; we were now just railroaded along a Rule of Cool(tm)-driven adventure, where the dialogue wheel doesn't offer any choices but obsequiously agreeing with whatever the Illusive Man wants to you do. It's such a drastic and sudden step down and the game makes sure to rub it in your face with the opening.
ME2's main story was absolutely atrocious, but it is kind of funny how with the character writing you get these glimpses where there were old guard Bioware writers not totally on board with the direction things were going in.
Of course pretty much all of them left the company shortly thereafter.
Well, that's because they were trying to copy movies and graphic novels. They wanted to ape the cinematic feel, and movies tend to have such plots where it's mostly suspense over logic. Hence why Shepard was killed off then brought back, when it would've just been more appropriate if Shepard was incapacitated and Cerberus offered to help heal and rebuild the wounded Spectre.

But if ME2 did one thing right, it was the party member backstories; the main story had all the depth of the Arnold Schwarzenegger Commando film, with you just going over there and gunning down a large number of bad guys to get your people back. But it was getting to know your party members and their stories which made ME2 great. Hence why it got all the glaze and the love from the fans.

And like with Fallout New Vegas, it was all downhill from there. Especially when ME3 felt like they were rushing things, when ME3 was the perfect opportunity to create a longer game split between multiple chapters to handle the galactic-scale conflict with the Reapers. What Blizzard did to Starcraft II, Bioware should've done with ME3. EA could've made multiple parts of ME3, each sold as full-price games, and made more money while giving the writers enough time and room to expand upon the characters and the conflict, to give the franchise a satisfying and cathartic ending that recognizes your choices throughout the series.

I think this was the single best article in Shamus' retrospective (although the TIM Island one might be the most fun). It perfectly encapsulates a lot of why ME2 feels like it's where it all went wrong.
You wouldn't know that from the fans' perspective. Hell, if ME3 had a decent ending, we wouldn't care, since the series would still be going strong. Or at the very least, treading water enough to the point where it still exists as a relevant franchise.

It's come to my attention that you only need the illusion of a well-written story to string people on; not an actual well-written story. So long as you have enough suspense and stakes to keep people hooked, they'll accept it. Even if at times, the logic doesn't make sense.

What doesn't work for me is the level design of Mass Effect 2.
That's due to the fact that you had a lot of goobers coming in from the CoD fanbase that Bioware wanted to attract. And they weren't in the mood for exploring maps or mazes. CoD maps are even more straightforward than Halo's; it's practically a hallway shooting gallery, and ME2, which is a game made to attract those kinds of players, fit right into that.

I still think it's a crime that the Legendary edition didn't come with the multiplayer gamemode.
I'll wait with buying it until some modder manage to use it for something so all those maps and classes don't go to waste
Ironically, the ME3 multiplayer mode is what stood the test of time. Not only is it fun to keep playing, especially with all the races and classes, but you can make up your own stories as to why your character is gunning down Geth/Cerberus/Reapers/Collectors, which does wonders for the role-playing aspect of a role-playing game.
 
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I'm begging the forces of destiny to ensure EA shut down BioWare before they release Mass Effect Will Continue. Andromeda was abysmal dogshit, but at least it had the good grace to not interfere with a beloved setting and characters. What we've seen of the new ME suggests they're using it as their "break glass in case of emergency" project: a return to the Milky Way after the failed attempt to hide from the ME3 ending in Andromeda, re-using OT characters, heavily leaning on the Shep legacy... real chance they retroactively do terrible damage to the originals (which already took a big hit in the back half of ME3)

It's appallingly cynical that BioWare announced this shit after Anthem flopped, just to buy themselves a reprieve from EA's scythe (with Dreadwolf still in dev hell at the time, too). The excessive nostlagiabaiting baked into the very premise of the game -- and all the marketing -- rankles the feathers immensely, too. No doubt it'll be a piece of shit, but because Liara is in it bashing her eyelids at the camera the consoomer types will pretend it's the second coming of Project SFX.
 
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I'm begging the forces of destiny to ensure EA shut down BioWare before they release Mass Effect Will Continue. Andromeda was abysmal dogshit, but at least it had the good grace to not interfere with a beloved setting and characters. What we've seen of the new ME suggests they're using it as their "break glass in case of emergency" project: a return to the Milky Way after the failed attempt to hide from the ME3 ending in Andromeda, re-using OT characters, heavily leaning on the Shep legacy... real chance they retroactively do terrible damage to the originals (which already took a big hit in the back half of ME3)

It's appallingly cynical that BioWare announced this shit after Anthem flopped, just to buy themselves a reprieve from EA's scythe (with Dreadwolf still in dev hell at the time, too). The excessive nostlagiabaiting baked into the very premise of the game -- and all the marketing -- rankles the feathers immensely, too. No doubt it'll be a piece of shit, but because Liara is in it bashing her eyelids at the camera the consoomer types will pretend it's the second coming of Project SFX.
People think they can't ruin best girl, but they'll try.
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Building a chosen family of niggers and queers. There might also be a B-plot of having to take down a bad guy, who simultaneously is a galaxy destroying threat and isn't taken as seriously as the Reapers.
Sounds like a larger-scale plot of Rent. The characters already fit the companion aesthetics of Nu-BioWare.

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. What we've seen of the new ME suggests they're using it as their "break glass in case of emergency" project: a return to the Milky Way after the failed attempt to hide from the ME3 ending in Andromeda, re-using OT characters, heavily leaning on the Shep legacy... real chance they retroactively do terrible damage to the originals (which already took a big hit in the back half of ME3)
There's so much they could do with the setting as well so it's so lame they're going back to the old stuff. Show us the first contact war or the war between the Gith and the Quarians or even just something simple like a new spectre doing specter stuff and let us be a race that's not just human. There's so much I really wish they would do instead of more Shepard.
 
There's so much they could do with the setting as well so it's so lame they're going back to the old stuff. Show us the first contact war or the war between the Gith and the Quarians or even just something simple like a new spectre doing specter stuff and let us be a race that's not just human. There's so much I really wish they would do instead of more Shepard.
Playing as an Asari or Salarian specter during/immediately after the first contact war could be such a good story point. Given that the human merc groups weren't started too long after the first contact war right? Blue suns IIRC. Could give a counterviewpoint to humanity butting out the batarians from pretty much every aspect.
 
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There's so much they could do with the setting as well so it's so lame they're going back to the old stuff. Show us the first contact war or the war between the Gith and the Quarians or even just something simple like a new spectre doing specter stuff
I like the spectre idea more than threading over old story. Turian contact war: there was a big war, and then it ended and humans and turians came to an agreement, done.
Geth and quarian conflict, inspired by the multiple slave uprisings in history, ends with the exile of the quarians and, nearly three centuries later, a (possible) truce brokered by shepard, Legion, tali and admiral zal'koris.

Playing as an Asari or Salarian specter during/immediately after the first contact war could be such a good story point. Given that the human merc groups weren't started too long after the first contact war right? Blue suns IIRC. Could give a counterviewpoint to humanity butting out the batarians from pretty much every aspect.
I like these more, Asari are ill-suited by their own admission to ground meaty war. They excel as black ops operatives, same with Salarians. You can adjust the whole game's mechanics to suit the infiltration-stealth style better.
 
Playing as an Asari or Salarian specter during/immediately after the first contact war could be such a good story point. Given that the human merc groups weren't started too long after the first contact war right? Blue suns IIRC. Could give a counterviewpoint to humanity butting out the batarians from pretty much every aspect.
Only if we get the mandatory Asari commando "armor".
 
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Does it have an excuse of them being indoctrinated or messed up by the Illusive Man because I can't see them filling that role of their own accord. Maybe an angry Miranda if you don't win her loyalty but Jacob? Never.

Of course when it comes to Miranda, it bothered me on my first playthrough of 2 when I didn't have her loyalty (thanks to siding with Jack after her loyalty mission and not having enough renegade or paragon points to make up with Miranda) that she still sided with me on the Collector Base and betrayed Cerberus. It doesn't feel earned or right for her character that she does that after I lost her loyalty.
It's true. Neither Miranda or Jacob are entirely loyal to Cerberus.
The mod gives a nice idea but it can't be.
 
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