Mega Rad Gun Thread

SHIGGSHOGG said:
I'd reload SHTF ammo like 77gn 5.56 or 9mm HPs but I wouldn't carry reloaded normal defense ammo as I think that'd look REALLY bad in court. I'd already be careful what ammo you pick such as maybe not the Phillips screwdriver looking ones, the 65gn really fast 9mm, RIP rounds, or vintage collectible Black Talons. Better off with something boring sounding that won't stand out and draw attention. 50 bucks every other year to cycle through your carry ammo is better than lots more lawyer debt or jail time.
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Has defensive ammo actually come up in a court case where the prosecution has used it as evidence against the defendant?
 
ellroy said:
Has defensive ammo actually come up in a court case where the prosecution has used it as evidence against the defendant?
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Idk but I'm personally not gonna chance it. Iirc there was a cop that got fucked because he had some cringe dust cover on his AR after he shot somebody or smth. Not gonna take the chance myself especially when lots of the possibly bad choices are either not very good to begin with or impractical to get
 
ellroy said:
Has defensive ammo actually come up in a court case where the prosecution has used it as evidence against the defendant?
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I can’t find any cases but imagine if some yokel actually blasted a Somali with the Jihawg ammo.

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SHIGGSHOGG said:
Idk but I'm personally not gonna chance it. Iirc there was a cop that got fucked because he had some cringe dust cover on his AR after he shot somebody or smth. Not gonna take the chance myself especially when lots of the possibly bad choices are either not very good to begin with or impractical to get
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If you’re referring to the Daniel Shaver shooting that cop was eventually reinstated and medical retired. The dust cover was ruled inadmissible. It’s still retarded to put edgy shit on your gun and it’s asking for trouble.
 
SHIGGSHOGG said:
Idk but I'm personally not gonna chance it. Iirc there was a cop that got fucked because he had some cringe dust cover on his AR after he shot somebody or smth. Not gonna take the chance myself especially when lots of the possibly bad choices are either not very good to begin with or impractical to get
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I'll counter fuddlore with a fudd saying: "I rather be judged by twelve than carried by six."

Don't limit your defensive ammo just because you're worried about trial optics. As long the ammo can be legally bought in the US, I personally think it will be fine. It's the homemade armor piercing bullets type of round will get you trouble ( a PDF on how do so has been posted in this thread, see "AP Anon Version 1.0.pdf"). That said, I'm a cheap bastard and I just use Federal 124 gr JHP but if you want hyper/gucci ammo including the 65gr fluted, then go for it if you can afford it.
 
ellroy said:
Don't limit your defensive ammo just because you're worried about trial optics. As long the ammo can be legally bought in the US, I personally think it will be fine.
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Use what works - pretty much every agency in North America runs Gold Dot or HST and the rounds have the bodies to prove their reputations.
Ballistics gel tests on YouTube don’t prove much because humans aren’t made of 16” long chunks of goo.
 
ellroy said:
Has defensive ammo actually come up in a court case where the prosecution has used it as evidence against the defendant?
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Rumors and anecdotes swirl indicating that something excessively tacticool/mallninja might hurt you if your case makes it to court, and it can't hurt to have something nondescript and common like HST and the canned answer "it's what cop/gun store employee recommended for defense" if challenged on it. Generally, being a known well practiced shooter or gun hobbyist isn't going to look great if you wind up standing trial for a defensive action, but if you aren't a yapper or putting it all on social media why would it even come up aside from maybe character witnesses?
 
ellroy said:
Has defensive ammo actually come up in a court case where the prosecution has used it as evidence against the defendant?
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no. the only things similar i can thing of is the Harold Fish case where he was charged for using a 10mm and spent some years in prison before being exonerated. there was also a guy who was charged for using full auto in self defense. He was an industry guy and was the victim of robbery/road rage while traveling with dealer samples. IIRC he used a Ruger AC-556.

it should be mentioned that both above cases were decades ago in a time where the opinions around guns were much more strict and unforgiving.
God's drunkest driver said:
Rumors and anecdotes swirl indicating that something excessively tacticool/mallninja might hurt you if your case makes it to court, and it can't hurt to have something nondescript and common like HST and the canned answer "it's what cop/gun store employee recommended for defense" if challenged on it. Generally, being a known well practiced shooter or gun hobbyist isn't going to look great if you wind up standing trial for a defensive action, but if you aren't a yapper or putting it all on social media why would it even come up aside from maybe character witnesses?
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there have been studies about this using mock juries. Tactical shit usually biased the jury against the shooter while traditional/hunting style guns with wood stocks were received more favorably.
 
ellroy said:
I'll counter fuddlore with a fudd saying: "I rather be judged by twelve than carried by six."

Don't limit your defensive ammo just because you're worried about trial optics. As long the ammo can be legally bought in the US, I personally think it will be fine. It's the homemade armor piercing bullets type of round will get you trouble ( a PDF on how do so has been posted in this thread, see "AP Anon Version 1.0.pdf"). That said, I'm a cheap bastard and I just use Federal 124 gr JHP but if you want hyper/gucci ammo including the 65gr fluted, then go for it if you can afford it.
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It depends on the time of year and which pistol I'm carrying. If it is the colder months where people are wearing heavy clothing, then I'm loaded with those Lehigh Xtreme Defenders, the ones that look like a Phillips head screwdriver since they can't get gunked up with leather or jacket insulation. If it's warm weather I'm loaded with hollow points, Hornaday Critical Duty 135gr for 9mm or Federal HST 230gr for .45 ACP.
 

James Reeves has done a couple videos about this subject so I won't be posting all of them. Tldw: Yes, everything from hollow points, to attachments, to Punisher decals etc can affect the case in a negative way to you if you are using them. Though in most cases mentioned, they are just a part of the bigger picture and not the smoking gun with the prosecutor and judges knowing jackshit about firearms so they can work against you.
 
I can't say I've seen a brand/specific named round come up but prosecutors argue about bullet types all the time. If you're using ball then you're reckless because you don't care about what happens behind the target, if you're using hollow points then obviously you wanted to kill someone.

I carry Critical Defense for a couple of reasons. First, it has defense in the name and if it ever comes down to it I want the prosecution to have to say defense as many times as possible. Second, it basically never overpenetrates, it's on the low end of efficacious without being underpowered in any test I've seen. Third, it's less likely to get caught up in clothing than standard hollow points. Finally, it's not advertised as either ball or hollow point. They call it Flex-Tip


If I wasn't going to carry that I'd call one of my cop/alphabet buddies and see what they carry and call that good (as long as it's not something unobtanium)
 

200, 300, 400, and 500 on D zone sized steel with 55 grain ammo. The group size becomes larger than the target past 400. Also I was figuring out my holds from the POI shift caused by the suppressor.
 
I don't know if any of you have been following, but Beretta is making moves to do a hostile takeover of Sturm Ruger & company. Beretta is now the majority stockholder and is nominating 4 members to the board this year. I expect them to take the company private once they can. Beretta is the largest firearms manufacturer world wide and Ruger is the largest domestic manufacturer.

Off the top of my head Beretta already owns: Tikka, SAKO, Uberti, Benelli, Chapius, GECO, Holland & Holland, NORMA, Burris, RWS, Stiener, Stoeger and SwissP.


This isn't necessarily a bad thing.
 
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Romulus augustulus said:
Tikka, SAKO,
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Small detail, Tikka is a brand of firearms made and sold by Sako. Firearms originally made by Tikkakoski of Suomi KP/-31 manufacturing fame carried that name, the company got bought by Sako in 1983 and since then that brand of rifles have been under the Sako banner. Tikka T3x is basically the only firearm in the Tikka brand right now as the "budget option" of all Sako made stuff.
 
Laminated Flooring Panel said:
Small detail, Tikka is a brand of firearms made and sold by Sako. Firearms originally made by Tikkakoski of Suomi KP/-31 manufacturing fame carried that name, the company got bought by Sako in 1983 and since then that brand of rifles have been under the Sako banner. Tikka T3x is basically the only firearm in the Tikka brand right now as the "budget option" of all Sako made stuff.
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Fair enough, they are generally listed as separate entities though. even by Sako/Beretta.

I don't think Beretta owning Ruger would be a bad thing on the face of it. Most of their owned brands have done very well. They generally let them service their own markets with minimal interference.
 
Romulus augustulus said:
I don't know if any of you have been following, but Beretta is making moves to do a hostile takeover of Sturm Ruger & company. Beretta is now the majority stockholder and is nominating 4 members to the board this year. I expect them to take the company private once they can. Beretta is the largest firearms manufacturer world wide and Ruger is the largest domestic manufacturer.

Off the top of my head Beretta already owns: Tikka, SAKO, Uberti, Benelli, Chapius, GECO, Holland & Holland, NORMA, Burris, RWS, Stiener, Stoeger and SwissP.


This isn't necessarily a bad thing.
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Pasta nigger global supremacy.
 
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