Microsoft is fucking butthurt no one wants Windows 11 so they're stopping the sale of Windows 10 licenses this month

[Slav Power]

the actual Windows peak, dont @ me retards

Fuck you, imma @ you anyways.
2K was the peak, I agree 100%.

The fact you need to do this is the valid reason for rejecting Windows 11 in favor of 10 LTSC which saves you time you would spend coomstomizing base 10 22H2.

Windows 11 also has an LTSC version that also saves you the time of debloating. Still doesn't change the fact that the constant kvetching about 11 is retarded since so many of it's issues were already present in 10, yet people seem to glaze 10 just because the cycle must continue. I'm sure as hell not gonna say Windows 11 is good though, the new taskbar, explorer and context menu are a travesty, but it did make some improvements, like the new Settings panel and the new actions menu that's actually suitable for current day mobile computing instead of whatever the fuck Windows 10 was doing with the WiFi menu being separate from the quick actions menu that opened up as a side panel or whatever the fuck.

But it's all one step forward and five steps back, for every good change in 11, the jeets made five bad ones. Though so far in my experience all the issues are in the UI, the backend shit is still the same. It's sad that this enshittification is this superficial, Microsoft trying to haphazardly slap on a fresh coat of paint on 10 (which was needed tbh), but as ususal fucking it up in the process.

 

[Susanna]

Yeah, I can just run the GOG installer and it'll work. Oh, you mean the original release? In that case, please install it on Linux from scratch without using Lutris or any of the prepackaged patches, see how well that compares to Windows when you have to do it the hard way.

It is actually much easier to setup on Linux than on Windows, because Lutris just works and has several profiles for it. Of course I can’t do it without wine/proton, nobody but you ever claimed so.
If SimCity4 ruffles your feathers so badly, let’s do something even more mainstream. How about one of the best-selling games of all time, The Sims (1 or 2, I’ll let you choose your favourite). I can find profiles for both on Lutris, my install will be limited only by how slow my disk drive is.

Sorry, I forgot that with you, everything is dead serious. I get all sorts of snarky remarks for what I post so don't get all bitchy when someone makes a snarky remark at you and your love for Apple products.

I get shit for liking Apple all the time, I couldn’t care less about that. I just don’t see why you insist on dragging me into your stupid argument, you know I find you terribly uninteresting.

Whoever at Microsoft thought S0 sleep (which doesn't actually sleep since networking is kept running) was a good idea needs to be shot immediately. Nothing but problems for me.
Thankfully, my old work laptop supported S3 "Linux" sleep as well, so I could fix it being terrible in Windows.

Don’t MacBooks also use S0 sleep? I know they wake intermittently to check your mail. I think the issue here is Microsoft, not the sleep state. Macs manage to check your mail in the background without draining the battery or panicking the kernel on a wake.

 

[Merton J. Dingle]

Honestly, is there much of a point in putting a laptop, regardless of model or OS, into sleep mode for long periods of time? I always use hibernate whenever I put my laptop into my bag because it would still be draining power on sleep mode, would possibly overheat, and it doesn't even take that much time to get it up and going from hibernation anyway.

 

[Susanna]

Honestly, is there much of a point in putting a laptop, regardless of model or OS, into sleep mode for long periods of time? I always use hibernate whenever I put my laptop into my bag because it would still be draining power on sleep mode, would possibly overheat, and it doesn't even take that much time to get it up and going from hibernation anyway.

Maybe not, but the simple matter is I can just fold my macbook up and stuff it into my bag, go away for a week, come back, unfold it, and it'll just instantly pop back, and have enough battery for a full day of work (if not more). With my Windows work laptop, this would be impossible. It'll either have completely drained itself (this seems to take much less than a week, I've had it with as little as closing it on Friday and opening it on Monday), or it will wake up but be so unstable I can't even get the start menu open to reboot it properly.
Hibernate may work better, but it's not the default, and even then I'll have to unfold it and wait half a minute before I can get started. And even then my Windows laptop won't have enough battery for a full day of work, even fully charged it only lasts at most half a day.

Even Linux handles sleep better than Windows, and Linux is notorious for not really supporting sleep (most of the skilled kernel devs focus on server stuff because that's what their employers do, desktop Linux is an afterthought and mobile Linux even more so). Setting it up can be tedious, but once it is set up it's actually pretty reliable. Closing the lid puts the laptop to sleep, and it doesn't drain very much battery in that mode. Then opening the lid gives me the lock screen within a few seconds, and the system will run stable. It works just fine, it's just a surprising amount of effort to set up for something so basic.

 

[Merton J. Dingle]

I'm not for a second going to doubt that Windows' sleep has problems or that Mac and Linux handle it better, but just how hard is it for you to set the laptop to hibernate when you close the lid? And is waiting 30 seconds really that big of a compromise? And the Macbook battery thing sounds to be more about it using ARM vs. your Windows laptop's x86.

 

[Susanna]

I'm not for a second going to doubt that Windows' sleep has problems or that Mac and Linux handle it better, but just how hard is it for you to set the laptop to hibernate when you close the lid? And is waiting 30 seconds really that big of a compromise?

Oh, I don't dispute that changing the default sleep state to hibernate is difficult, nor that waiting 30 seconds is that big a deal. But it is an extra step you don't need to take on a Mac.

And the Macbook battery thing sounds to be more about it using ARM vs. your Windows laptop's x86.

I've got an x86 laptop with Linux, configured to sleep with the lid closed, and the battery in that will last a week. It still drains itself completely in a few hours of use, that's definitely caused by x86, but x86 can sleep without draining battery, it's just that doesn't happen if your OS is Windows.

 

[Merton J. Dingle]

I've got an x86 laptop with Linux, configured to sleep with the lid closed, and the battery in that will last a week. It still drains itself completely in a few hours of use, that's definitely caused by x86, but x86 can sleep without draining battery, it's just that doesn't happen if your OS is Windows.

Guess Windows sleep really is that much of a piece of shit. I was pretty impressed by how seamless that Bazzite's sleep was when done in the middle of a game on a handheld gaming PC. On Windows on that same handheld, it seemed to drain the battery at a rate of about 6% per hour, and it was inconsistent on a game-by-game basis as to whether it would come up quickly and bug free after coming out of sleep or not. Pretty much hammered home that you really have to rely on a combination of hibernation and sleep on portable Windows devices and that sleep is not even viable for medium-term amounts of inactivity.

 

[Xarpho's Return]

OH MY FAUCI WINCOCKS EXS PEE WAS THE BEST OS EVER!!!11 - average zoomoid faggot. I'm sick of hearing this shit over and over.

Before SP2, Windows XP was easily the least secure bundle of software in existence. This was the true golden age of malware/PUPs, you could buckbreak XP by simply using it like an average normalfaggot computer user of early 2000s. Hence SP2 and SP3 which did harden XP ever so slightly,

B-BUT MUH AESTHETICCS - Luna, default XP theme was criticised in its times for looking like a cheap toy. Looking at both Windows 2000 (the actual Windows peak, dont @ me retards) or Mac OS X 10.0, I can see their reasons for thinking so.
Vista has obviously undercooked, no amount of sperging will convince me otherwise, but after SP1 its only valid criticism was the high system requirements, which has lost it's significance anyway the moment people started going dual-core en masse around 2008-2009.

As for Win 11, it is shit, accept it. Hurr you can fix your Arch Troonix Wincucks 11 install with one amhole.rc registry tweak... spare me of that shit as well. The fact you need to do this is the valid reason for rejecting Windows 11 in favor of 10 LTSC which saves you time you would spend coomstomizing base 10 22H2. And this customizing is already getting progressively harder each major Windows update.

Windows XP looked like a cheap knockoff of Mac OS X, down to the use of "X", when it was introduced in the early 2000s. Then again, Windows has always been a cheaper, uglier version of the Mac OS, which has been disaster as Apple took the OS increasingly in the direction of the iPhone, with rumors at one time that the OSs would merge.

 

[COME ON OUT YOU RAPIST]

For anyone unaware, Windows 10 IoT Enterprise LTSC 2021 will receive security updates until 2032 on clean installs. You can avoid ze bugs of W11 for almost a full decade without depriving yourself of whatever features Microsoft quietly strangleholds. The only thing I can think of that demands Windows off the top of my head is Fortnite, but still.

I'm really hoping SteamOS isn't as worthless as the Steam PC or Steam Controller but is instead more like the Steam Deck and Steam Steam. When I take out a mortgage to upgrade my PC in another year or two I'd like to become a Linuxfat full-time.

 

[Betonhaus]

For anyone unaware, Windows 10 IoT Enterprise LTSC 2021 will receive security updates until 2032 on clean installs. You can avoid ze bugs of W11 for almost a full decade without depriving yourself of whatever features Microsoft quietly strangleholds. The only thing I can think of that demands Windows off the top of my head is Fortnite, but still.

I'm really hoping SteamOS isn't as worthless as the Steam PC or Steam Controller but is instead more like the Steam Deck and Steam Steam. When I take out a mortgage to upgrade my PC in another year or two I'd like to become a Linuxfat full-time.

I wasn't aware that IoT 11 has 2 RDP session support. That makes it perfect for the Windows VM on my home server.

 

[Slav Power]

The Sims (1 or 2, I’ll let you choose your favourite)

Oops, recently got re-released on Steam, easy peasy. Besides, this hyperfixation over gaming on Linux is funny, as if that's the only thing people use Windows PC's for. But I get it, Linux users couldn't live ti down that Valve is using Linux to their advantage to stay independent from Microsoft so right now it's the only thing they can repeat ad nauseam to convince people to switch to Linux.

If we're speaking of edge-case scenarios as gotchas, there will be very niche old specialized software that doesn't have a modern equivalent for shit like ROM flashing, BIOS editing, SSTV transmissions and whatnot that you will have to manually set up in Wine if you want to run it under Linux. You'll still have a better time dealing with 11 than with Linux.

If SimCity4 ruffles your feathers so badly

Sorry that you had to bring up a game that has a GOG release that works even better than some Lutris package and now you're upset you've lost the argument so you have to move the goalpost. Lutris, by the way, does nothing more than what an NSIS installer on Windows would do. Replace some files, add some files, maybe registry keys and suddenly the thing works. Big whoop.

The difference is that with Windows, people can follow PC Gaming Wiki since those tricks are easy to do, copy one .dll file into the game folder and it works again. With Linux, Lutris is a necessity because accomplishing the same with Wine will make you rip your hair out as Wine devs refuse to mimic this simple behavior of .exe files and require you to manually define .dll overwrites. So yeah, awesome win for the Linux Master Race. Making solutions for problems created by yourself.

I just don’t see why you insist on dragging me into your stupid argument, you know I find you terribly uninteresting.

Uninteresting? Not everyone @ ing you is trying to date you, but I guess it's hard for a psychopath to understand that. I @ you for bantz and you spaz out as if I was trying to hit on you or something, the fuck is wrong with you? If anything I find you intriguing, you're like an alien trying to mimic human behavior with how you write.

Also, funny how right after you spazzing out over that one banter @ you go back to your religious mention of Apple products this Apple products that, but acting like that @ suddenly changes the entire meaning of my post. Seek a therapist and learn some basic human emotions such as comedy, sarcasm and irony.

 

[seri0us]

@Susanna Can you talk more about your favorite Apple devices and bad experiences with Windows (this is a Microsoft hate thread)

 

[Slav Power]

Guess Windows sleep really is that much of a piece of shit.

I actually tried to get S3 working on my laptop after reading this thread. Win11 Pro. Said it's unsupported and that the hypervisor doesn't support it. So I went out of my way to remove Hyper-V, then disable every possible security option there was, including Secure Boot. And since it's a modern ThinkPad there was a whole bunch of them. It was still on. Turns out Windows Hello relies on the hypervisor, so I disabled that too. Success, no more hypervisor.

powercfg /a just told me S3 isn't available on this system, period.

I don't know if it's actually hardware related or if it's just hard disabled in Win11. Maybe it's the former given the amount of business tech shit ThinkPads have, idk. Ended up only reenabling Secure Boot and Windows Hello since I like the fingerprint and face login. It's probably better that way too since all the super duper virtualization security options slow the OS down.

 

[grocerygoblin]

24h2 just works! Upgrade upgrade upgrade ( - :

https://cookieplmonster.github.io/2025/04/23/gta-san-andreas-win11-24h2-bug/

 

[Slav Power]

24h2 just works! Upgrade upgrade upgrade ( - :

https://cookieplmonster.github.io/2025/04/23/gta-san-andreas-win11-24h2-bug/

That was an interesting read. R* fucked up a single line, causing garbage data to be spewed in the game, but the circumstances that didn't cause it to go catastrophically bad were maintained for over two decades until Microsoft changed something that apparently hasn't caused any issues with any programs, besides this specific game, due to it having this specific bug relying on this specific component to behave in this specific way to actually manifest.

Reminds me of Linus Torvalds getting angry that someone wanted to "fix" something, but it would break the user space due to Linux relying on such mishaps as being the standard. Windows is basically an entire amalgamation of those, for it to work as intended, it has to stay broken. No one could ever foresee that this change in 24H2 would suddenly cause this one plane in GTA:SA to glitch the fuck out.

 

[Susanna]

Oops, recently got re-released on Steam, easy peasy.

has a GOG release

Okay. I'm not saying these things don't exist, but why would you buy a game again when you already have the CDs? I can install my old CD of The Sims on Linux pretty easily (I just need to plug in a DVD drive), but it's my understanding getting these games to run on Windows is in no way easy. Your insistence on buying rereleases kind of supports that.

The difference is that with Windows, people can follow PC Gaming Wiki since those tricks are easy to do, copy one .dll file into the game folder and it works again. With Linux, Lutris is a necessity because accomplishing the same with Wine will make you rip your hair out as Wine devs refuse to mimic this simple behavior of .exe files and require you to manually define .dll overwrites. So yeah, awesome win for the Linux Master Race. Making solutions for problems created by yourself.

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make here. Reading a wiki to find step-by-step instructions to make your game work seems like a lot more work than just launching Lutris, searching for SimCity 4, and picking an installer script. Most of the time you don't even need to hit Next in the installer, it'll just extract the game for you. Yeah Wine itself doesn't necessarily make this convenient, but that's why I mentioned Lutris (which has scripts to configure Wine for you) or Proton (which has a more accurate Windows runtime environment so that many of these scripts are not necessary).

If we're speaking of edge-case scenarios as gotchas, there will be very niche old specialized software that doesn't have a modern equivalent for shit like ROM flashing, BIOS editing, SSTV transmissions and whatnot that you will have to manually set up in Wine if you want to run it under Linux.

I don't need wine for these. Flashrom and DD are very reliable and easy to use for low-level tasks, and software like qsstv runs natively on Linux.

@Susanna Can you talk more about your favorite Apple devices and bad experiences with Windows (this is a Microsoft hate thread)

I could, but I won't. I'm not actually at all bitter about Windows 11, I'm mostly able to not use any Windows at work, and since I never really used it back when it was "good" (2000 through 7 I guess?) I don't have the emotional baggage of watching something I used to like worsen. I've posted some rants about my Windows work laptop in the past, you're welcome to read those. I don't really have a team when it comes to operating systems. I grew up on MacOS, so that's familiar to me. I like Linux because it's powerful and easy to customise (in normal usage, my system closely resembles MacOS). I don't like Windows because it's given me nothing but trouble. If Microsoft were to release a Windows 12 that offered a UI similar to MacOS, and tools comparable to Linux, without any or at least most of the annoyances I have with other Windows, I probably would switch fairly quickly.

 

[C4ndyCorn]

The only thing I can think of that demands Windows off the top of my head is Fortnite, but still.

Compatibility with anti-cheats have made more progress than I ever would have thought. Devs almost have to take an anti-linux stance for there to be issues (see bungie).

 

[Merton J. Dingle]

Uninteresting? Not everyone @ ing you is trying to date you, but I guess it's hard for a psychopath to understand that. I @ you for bantz and you spaz out as if I was trying to hit on you or something, the fuck is wrong with you? If anything I find you intriguing, you're like an alien trying to mimic human behavior with how you write.

I... take it that this isn't the first time that you guys have had a spat?

 

[A16]

I actually tried to get S3 working on my laptop after reading this thread. Win11 Pro. Said it's unsupported and that the hypervisor doesn't support it. So I went out of my way to remove Hyper-V, then disable every possible security option there was, including Secure Boot. And since it's a modern ThinkPad there was a whole bunch of them. It was still on. Turns out Windows Hello relies on the hypervisor, so I disabled that too. Success, no more hypervisor.

powercfg /a just told me S3 isn't available on this system, period.

I don't know if it's actually hardware related or if it's just hard disabled in Win11. Maybe it's the former given the amount of business tech shit ThinkPads have, idk. Ended up only reenabling Secure Boot and Windows Hello since I like the fingerprint and face login. It's probably better that way too since all the super duper virtualization security options slow the OS down.

You had to nerf the security of your system to own the libs to get something that is standard on Linux and macOS, and probably still doesn't work.

All that insanity you described is why people are installing Windows LTM and switching to Linux.

 

[YoRHa No. 2 Type B]

I don't know if it's actually hardware related

Ever since Microsoft came up with S0, the older S3 sleep (that actually sleeps) is typically not included on laptops.
The only time I've ever seen it configurable is some laptops having an option in the BIOS between "Windows" and "Linux" sleep, all it does is enable/disable S0 since Linux took a long time to get S0 support. But S3 works better in Windows anyways so no reason not to have it to set to "Linux" (S3) sleep if your device supports it.