Millet System

[Jan_Hus]

I make no secret of the fact that I really love the Ottoman Empire. During their height, the Ottomans ruled over a large state with many conflicting cultures, religions and ethnicities. In addition, the Islamic Ottomans managed to become protectors of the Greek Orthodox Church. How did they manage this without imploding?

Their answer to this was the Millet System. Under this system, individuals would pay taxes to the Ottoman government to manage the affairs of the empire. They would be subject to the laws of the empire as any other citizen. However, in order to keep their Jewish and Christian population comfortable with Islamic rule, the Padishahs established a system of Millets in order to guarantee religious minority rights of their population. Each "people of the book" had their own Millet. These Millets would make their own laws for their religious group and the religious heads for each Millet had access to the court of the Padishah in order to advise him on matters concerning their respective populations. My question is this: Would there be a way to modernize the Millet system for things such as political beliefs? Could we learn anything from this system?

 

[Gym Leader Elesa]

I make no secret of the fact that I really love the Ottoman Empire.

Good God, why?

 

[Jan_Hus]

Good God, why?

I find the Ottoman Empire to be fascinating. They're fascinating to research and examine.

 

[Gym Leader Elesa]

I find the Ottoman Empire to be fascinating. They're fascinating to research and examine.

Oh. Oh, good.

However, in order to keep their Jewish and Christian population comfortable with Islamic rule, the Padishahs established a system of Millets in order to guarantee religious minority rights of their population. Each "people of the book" had their own Millet. These Millets would make their own laws for their religious group and the religious heads for each Millet had access to the court of the Padishah in order to advise him on matters concerning their respective populations. My question is this: Would there be a way to modernize the Millet system for things such as political beliefs? Could we learn anything from this system?

Does not Israel have a very similar system? How do you feel about its?

 

[Jan_Hus]

Oh. Oh, good.



Does not Israel have a very similar system? How do you feel about its?

I think it's a good thing. Millets are effective at pacifying potentially dissident parts of a population.

 

[Alec Benson Leary]

How would we go about determining which group was entitled to such representation and which wasn't? That would immediately become a hornet's nest.

Maybe I need a little more clarification. Did each millet make laws to govern its own people, so long as said laws did not conflict with the overarching laws of the empire? I don't really like the idea of different populations being subject to different legal standards. It's too collectivist and seems to me like it would naturally lend itself to rights violations. Say you're registered as a democrat, so you follow the rules as given by the DNC millet. Now, if you think the DNC is full of shit about how they conduct their rules and society don't know when anyone would ever think that but go with me here, could you just say you don't want to play with them anymore and switch to the republicans? People can't just jump between different court systems just because they don't like the outcome one hands them and want a re-roll. Conversely, what if your desire to switch parties is genuine, based on true conviction? How many hoops should you be forced to jump through in order to "prove" your honesty?

A real world example is people who want to allow alternate sharia courts for muslims in secular societies. How do we trust those sharia courts to be just and fair? If a woman is raped and her attacker walks free because she doesn't have at least 4 male witnesses, and she comes to the government pleading for help and asylum, do we just tell her "no sorry lady, you are muslim, sharia is what you believe!" and wash our hands? When I say this sounds collectivist, I mean it sounds like an excuse to pre-judge people by different standards based on unfair characteristics. This to me is the opposite of a free and fair society.

 

[Jan_Hus]

How would we go about determining which group was entitled to such representation and which wasn't? That would immediately become a hornet's nest.

Maybe I need a little more clarification. Did each millet make laws to govern its own people, so long as said laws did not conflict with the overarching laws of the empire? I don't really like the idea of different populations being subject to different legal standards. It's too collectivist and seems to me like it would naturally lend itself to rights violations. Say you're registered as a democrat, so you follow the rules as given by the DNC millet. Now, if you think the DNC is full of shit about how they conduct their rules and society don't know when anyone would ever think that but go with me here, could you just say you don't want to play with them anymore and switch to the republicans? People can't just jump between different court systems just because they don't like the outcome one hands them and want a re-roll. Conversely, what if your desire to switch parties is genuine, based on true conviction? How many hoops should you be forced to jump through in order to "prove" your honesty?

A real world example is people who want to allow alternate sharia courts for muslims in secular societies. How do we trust those sharia courts to be just and fair? If a woman is raped and her attacker walks free because she doesn't have at least 4 male witnesses, and she comes to the government pleading for help and asylum, do we just tell her "no sorry lady, you are muslim, sharia is what you believe!" and wash our hands? When I say this sounds collectivist, I mean it sounds like an excuse to pre-judge people by different standards based on unfair characteristics. This to me is the opposite of a free and fair society.

I actually don't think you could implement a modern Millet system. Just wanted to try and provoke some thought and discussion