MMA & UFC General - Featuring Bellator MMA & Rizin Fighting Federation

[Sheriff of CWCville]

He's his own worst enemy. His only loss was because he had a massive murderboner and couldn't stop himself doing 12-6 elbow strikes on a guy he was mounting and who was 10 seconds away from having the ref jump in to stop him. His one loss sums him up best, complete lack of self control. Can't stay out of prison, can't not do PEDs after USADA upped their game, can't stop doing eye pokes when he's getting his shit pushed in.

He looked gassed after that first round with Khabib. Combination of dropping a bomb with every swing he took (like he did with Ferguson in the 1st round) and Khabib's relentless pace. Khabib is a machine, He keeps an an upped pace throughout his fights. Still kinda miffed that we never got the Ferguson/Khabib fight, though whether it happens in the future, who knows (unlikely).

I don’t think people that haven’t trained really get how draining it can be when you’re in with a guy who you know (or believe) is better than you. Even moving around becomes labored, you’re tense and on edge burning yourself out every second. It’s a terrible feeling that negates however good your cardio might be. It’s crazy to watch khabib walk Justin down like that, but it was also probably the safest way to approach the stand up as counterintuitive as that sounds. Toughness and a willingness to be hit can be an amazing asset that isn’t often recognized as an actual game plan.

 

[Magic Sun Daddy]

Toughness and a willingness to be hit can be an amazing asset that isn’t often recognized as an actual game plan.

I think people tend to confuse that with just relying on the toughness of your chin, ala Chuck Liddell.

 

[Slimy Time]

I don’t think people that haven’t trained really get how draining it can be when you’re in with a guy who you know (or believe) is better than you. Even moving around becomes labored, you’re tense and on edge burning yourself out every second. It’s a terrible feeling that negates however good your cardio might be. It’s crazy to watch khabib walk Justin down like that, but it was also probably the safest way to approach the stand up as counterintuitive as that sounds. Toughness and a willingness to be hit can be an amazing asset that isn’t often recognized as an actual game plan.

He mentally and physically breaks people. McGregor would do it with taunting and jeering and acting like an ass, Khabib does it by being just that good and with that great of a reputation. His wrestling /ground style as well is designed to physically tire his opponent out. He positions his head above his opponent on the ground, so they have to carry his weight, he uses trips while grappling to send them tumbling down, he uses painful neck cranks (which don't win matches/knock someone out) to physically make you uncomfortable and miserable. He's like a wet towel during a waterboarding session, just smothers his opponent, tiring them out mentally and physically.

He shows no fear either. We all saw Gaethje and McGregor either KO people or beat them up easily, he doesn't care (mental toughness and willingness to take hits), he's going to keep up the pace, take hits (rolled with) if need be, and walk his opponent down. That last trade before he got Justin on the ground, doesn't matter if he take those chopping leg kicks, he knows he can bait it out with a jab and that he could get the single as Justin retracted the kick.

I think he's the GOAT, if not definitely one of the top 3.

 

[Violent Ken Apologist]

My hot take: if Silva never broke his leg he'd still be absurd imho.

 

[trent]

Silva didn't embarrass himself in that fight but i still think he needs to retire.

He did ok in the first round because Hall was a bit starstruck but once Uriah settled down he handily had the measure of Silva, he didn't bite on any of the feints/showboating and he was the much more accurate fighter. He basically frustrated Anderson into coming forward and Silva doesn't have anything like the kind of abiltity he used to have so he left himself wide open during that final flurry.

Hall is an inconsistent fighter so pretty much anyone else in the division could probably also beat Anderson. There's not much point in him fighting any more.

 

[Sheriff of CWCville]

I sad, trust me I sad

 

[Violent Ken Apologist]

Yoel Romero is how you're meant to fight, imho, I think that's closer to the honest fighting style that an old person should take with them and commit to long term. Stand up to conserve energy, crazy wrestling skills to control the pace. Lots of muscles that don't sap your power due to the conservation and let you counter hit like a truck.

Silva's style doesn't work in the long term. Maybe if you're like 29.

 

[King's Gambit Accepted]

Bones Jones and fans et al are really assmad that White and DC are proclaiming that Khabib is the P4P greatest. As somewhat of a Bones fan, I agree with both of them. I would arguably say that Bones could have lost his last two fights. No one has ever really come close to getting the win over Khabib. He’s been wobbled plenty but no one put him down. Dude is a beast.

Khabib isn’t the most interesting dude to watch work, but he does put on masterclasses on how to absolutely drown people with unrelenting pressure.

Jones is far more accomplished than Khabib but I don’t think anyone as dominated their opponents as impressively as Khabib has. If he’s in trouble for a few seconds of a round during a fight, everyone gets excited cause of how rare it is.

His chin is pretty incredible too — never getting knocked down or bleeding in a sport that allows elbows, knees and kicks is genuinely incredible.

 

[Sheriff of CWCville]

Jones is far more accomplished than Khabib but I don’t think anyone as dominated their opponents as impressively as Khabib has. If he’s in trouble for a few seconds of a round during a fight, everyone gets excited cause of how rare it is.

His chin is pretty incredible too — never getting knocked down or bleeding in a sport that allows elbows, knees and kicks is genuinely incredible.

P4P debates are fun but even I have a hard time playing by my own rules. I have GSP at 1 and JBJ at 2, my logic being that Jones failed drug tests can’t make me justify the 1 spot especially with Jon’s last couple fights where I had them going to the challenger, reminded me of the tail end of GSP’s reigns with the close one with condit and arguable loss to big pig. Really it does just come down to those drug tests tainting the most important wins in Jones career against DC.

And as dominant as khabib has been, I have a hard time justifying putting him above Silva, even tho khabib hasn’t lost or failed a drug test. Idk I just feel with khabib that he hasn’t stayed on too long enough, but I’m also a Silva and Conor fanboy. but damn regardless it’s undeniable that he’s one of the scariest dudes to ever do it.

 

[King's Gambit Accepted]

P4P debates are fun but even I have a hard time playing by my own rules. I have GSP at 1 and JBJ at 2, my logic being that Jones failed drug tests can’t make me justify the 1 spot especially with Jon’s last couple fights where I had them going to the challenger, reminded me of the tail end of GSP’s reigns with the close one with condit and arguable loss to big pig. Really it does just come down to those drug tests tainting the most important wins in Jones career against DC.

And as dominant as khabib has been, I have a hard time justifying putting him above Silva, even tho khabib hasn’t lost or failed a drug test. Idk I just feel with khabib that he hasn’t stayed on too long enough, but I’m also a Silva and Conor fanboy. but damn regardless it’s undeniable that he’s one of the scariest dudes to ever do it.

Id probably put GSP, Jones and Silva above Khabib too in an all-time list. I think it’s fair to put Khabib above Jones on the current p4p list since its based on recent performance and Khabib’s last few fights have been better than Jones last few fights. I think if dominates at heavyweight as well, he should go back up to #1.

Too bad Khabib’s retiring — he’s young enough that he could dominate for another 3-4 years at least. And he’s only gotten better his past few fights.

Conor would probably be Khabib’s toughest opponent but I don’t see anyone at 155 beating him. I think he could probably beat most 170 pounders as well.

 

[Violent Ken Apologist]

P4P debates are fun but even I have a hard time playing by my own rules. I have GSP at 1 and JBJ at 2, my logic being that Jones failed drug tests can’t make me justify the 1 spot especially with Jon’s last couple fights where I had them going to the challenger, reminded me of the tail end of GSP’s reigns with the close one with condit and arguable loss to big pig. Really it does just come down to those drug tests tainting the most important wins in Jones career against DC.

And as dominant as khabib has been, I have a hard time justifying putting him above Silva, even tho khabib hasn’t lost or failed a drug test. Idk I just feel with khabib that he hasn’t stayed on too long enough, but I’m also a Silva and Conor fanboy. but damn regardless it’s undeniable that he’s one of the scariest dudes to ever do it.

What if Silva didn't break his leg and was allowed to juice? Would that offset his age and mileage enough that he'd be able to keep competing? Asking for a friend.

 

[Looney Troons]

I can remember exactly where I was, what I was drinking, and who I spat said drink on when Silva’s leg wrapped around Weidman’s. God damn. Even that isn’t as gruesome as that dude’s ear nearly falling off this past Saturday.

 

[Looney Troons]

Sorry for the double post. Anyone watching BKFC tonight?

 

[naffatune]

I don't watch BKFC regularly, but I imagine that most guys there are killers since the stakes are naturally higher due to the no ounce gloves

Speaking of killers, the bantamweight division is super stacked. I'd watch someone like O'Malley, Garbrandt, or Sandhagen over any heavyweight any day of the week.

Let's not forget all the Contender Series dudes who managed to make it into the big show. Kyler Philips, Dan Ige, Sodiq Yusuff, and Phil Hawes are noteworthy examples

Oh, and one final thing: who do you think Chandler should fight first? I'm going with Hooker; it will be interesting to see how someone like Chandler will deal with someone with many ranged weapons in their arsenal. Him vs. Poirier is good as well, but it's too early for him to get that right now

 

[Sheriff of CWCville]

Yoel Romero is how you're meant to fight, imho, I think that's closer to the honest fighting style that an old person should take with them and commit to long term. Stand up to conserve energy, crazy wrestling skills to control the pace. Lots of muscles that don't sap your power due to the conservation and let you counter hit like a truck.

Silva's style doesn't work in the long term. Maybe if you're like 29.

sorry I somehow missed this comment a while back but I find it interesting, because I both agree and disagree. Yes, as far as career longevity goes you could be doing much worse than Yoel, as he’s almost an ode to the old school black boxers who defined what it meant to preserve your body for a longer career. And although this is true, you have to ask yourself “is it worth it?” and “is that style meant for me?”

You brought up A Silva specifically and would be correct to say that his style is much more that of the young man’s. It is also the style that seems to fit Anderson’s body type and personality. Could more wrestling and cardio have helped Andy stick around longer? Maybe. Would he still have been the spider if he didn’t commit the majority of his time to the striking arts with the fallback of defensive BJJ? It’s hard to say.

This is also to assume that the goal of prizefighting is to stick around the longest. P4P and GOAT debates and a persons legacy are just something that people project onto. Your bank account, however, is an objective thing, and historically high risk comes with much higher rewards. Flashy strikers and those who are offensively driven will always be easier to promote which will always lead to higher purses. I would argue that fighters should listen to what Izzy said and what Cejudo did and get in, get rich, and go out before your prime ends and someone else’s begins. The only things that await you are cumulative head trauma and declining purses and reputation.

Again, this all depends on why a fighter is fighting, but I think the claim that all fighters should strive to fight like Yoel is far less linear than it seems, although I could still take it as generally applicable advice for young fighters, as although it takes high risk moves to be a star, you are statistically unlikely to become one.

 

[Looney Troons]

I don't watch BKFC regularly, but I imagine that most guys there are killers since the stakes are naturally higher due to the no ounce gloves

Speaking of killers, the bantamweight division is super stacked. I'd watch someone like O'Malley, Garbrandt, or Sandhagen over any heavyweight any day of the week.

Let's not forget all the Contender Series dudes who managed to make it into the big show. Kyler Philips, Dan Ige, Sodiq Yusuff, and Phil Hawes are noteworthy examples

Oh, and one final thing: who do you think Chandler should fight first? I'm going with Hooker; it will be interesting to see how someone like Chandler will deal with someone with many ranged weapons in their arsenal. Him vs. Poirier is good as well, but it's too early for him to get that right now

Call me casual, but I’d actually love to see Chandler v Ferguson. Tony is one of my favorites, and he made a huge mistake by taking on Justin after training for a grappler. I’m also a huge Chandler fan and, I don’t know, dude, that just seems like an exciting fight to me, and one that Tony has trained for. Dan Hooker would also be good to put him through the paces.

The BKFC card was exciting, but aside from the nearly guaranteed bloodshed, it’s only a baby step above Rough ‘n Rowdy, imo. Not to discredit the athletes, but it was a bunch of clinch striking and overhand rights. Uly Diaz scored a contested two second knockout which was absolute insanity. Go check that clip out.

 

[naffatune]

Your wish has just been granted. Just hope that the boogeyboy doesn't injure himself in camp

 

[Sheriff of CWCville]

Your wish has just been granted. Just hope that the boogeyboy doesn't injure himself in camp

My buddy at work is a diehard T-Ferg fan and I’m a Conor nut hugger so we’re both really hoping the stars align and we get that fight eventually, which I could see actually as I’m pretty confident that both Conrad beats Dustin and Tony embarrasses Chandler

 

[naffatune]

what a familiar feeling

 

[biophonic]

Silva didn't embarrass himself in that fight but i still think he needs to retire.

He did ok in the first round because Hall was a bit starstruck but once Uriah settled down he handily had the measure of Silva, he didn't bite on any of the feints/showboating and he was the much more accurate fighter. He basically frustrated Anderson into coming forward and Silva doesn't have anything like the kind of abiltity he used to have so he left himself wide open during that final flurry.

Hall is an inconsistent fighter so pretty much anyone else in the division could probably also beat Anderson. There's not much point in him fighting any more.

Anderson became so complacent because he's used to people being the aggressor in his fights, when you break down his performances against people like Diaz/Bisping/Weidman/Brunson. that he always was on the retreat with counter attacks and would only remain active on the last minute of each round to try to win the judges favour. When anderson started losing, it wasn't because of a lack of skill but when you think about it, all his opponents studied him and he never changed his game plan which was why he started losing more frequently. Add that with slower reaction time because age and you got a deadly combination for a fighter who relies on a defensive tactic being unable to defend himself.