Diseased Open Source Software Community - it's about ethics in Code of Conducts

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King n Yellow said:
Can't someone just make backups, call them on their bluff, watch as they delete shit, then post the backups and laugh at them?
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No, because under the license it is their code and they can remove it if they want to. Even if you literally owned the project you do not own the code contributed by other people. It's why all of the development hubs meticulously track every individual fork and contribution from every individual user.

Even if they were to now update the license to say "cannot remove previously submitted code" it wasn't the license that the original code was submitted to so it doesn't matter to anyone looking to remove code and would be less attractive to anyone who isn't aware of the level of shit show this is to contribute code.

You might think it wouldn't be legally pursued, but that's where you'd be dead wrong. Lots of businesses and applications operate on Linux, having the development hindered by CoC nonsense will get these corporations out in force. Diversity is great, until it hurts the bottom line.

Outside of the legal issues, but long term removing key contributors is going to severely hurt the long-term growth of the OS. More vulnerabilities will exist, more issues will pop up. Patches and updates will be slower or non-existent. And the worse it gets the less viable the software is to anyone.

EDIT - It will be like the Lerna bitchslap but substantially harder (https://github.com/lerna/lerna/pull/1633). (TL;DR they added "this software cannot be used by ICE Collaborators" into the new license and got threatened and reverted within a day by said ICE Collaborators (Microsoft, Google, Amazon).
 
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Tanner Glass said:
You might think it wouldn't be legally pursued, but that's where you'd be dead wrong. Lots of businesses and applications operate on Linux, having the development hindered by CoC nonsense will get these corporations out in force. Diversity is great, until it hurts the bottom line.

Outside of the legal issues, but long term removing key contributors is going to severely hurt the long-term growth of the OS. More vulnerabilities will exist, more issues will pop up. Patches and updates will be slower or non-existent. And the worse it gets the less viable the software is to anyone.
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fact that these niggas keep forgetting shit like this only proves further that these people can't think properly before opening their fat mouths and screeching "diversity" for the sake of wedging themselves into public focus

all it does is fuck shit up for everyone else and i eagerly await the day when everyone gets fed up at last
 
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I'm not 100% familiar with the Linux license, but is there anything preventing the talented contributors from forking out from here and maintaining their own version?
 
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Marvin said:
I suppose I can't really demand anything from them. But ultimately my point is that the potential to kill a good desktop OS exists both in sperglords like the kernel developers driven by money, as well as much as SJWs driven by ideological bullshit.
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I'll still prefer people who are good enough at what they do to get paid to do it. They might be paid by people with interests that don't coincide with mine. I have no use at all for people who even if they were well intentioned are too stupid to contribute anything useful at all who will just torpedo the entire project out of pure spite.
 
The Linux kernel is a much more important project than people realize. I don't think the people who shoe-horned in their disingenuous CoC realized the possibility of former, banned contributes burning the whole thing down leaving them to pick up the pieces.

Ada himself once said that they got a job without understanding the significance of Big-O notation. It'd be really amusing trying to watch someone like them attempt to write C code trying to fix something they don't fully understand.
 
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Arkangel said:
The Linux kernel is a much more important project than people realize. I don't think the people who shoe-horned in their disingenuous CoC realized the possibility of former, banned contributes burning the whole thing down leaving them to pick up the pieces.

Ada himself once said that they got a job without understanding the significance of Big-O notation. It'd be really amusing trying to watch someone like them attempt to write C code trying to fix something they don't fully understand.
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From what i gather on his website, he struggles with Ruby webapps, i doubt he'll do better on lower-level C.
 
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You don't want the FWMs? Then you don't want their contribution or legacy either. It's just like those "day without an X" they do for women/blacks/whatever. Fair is fair.

I feel sorry this is happening to the linux community but after watching what happened in games and comics and on internet forums and so forth, I think detonating the emergency nuclear device is the cleanest way to end the infestation they can try.
 
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AnOminous said:
I'll still prefer people who are good enough at what they do to get paid to do it. They might be paid by people with interests that don't coincide with mine. I have no use at all for people who even if they were well intentioned are too stupid to contribute anything useful at all who will just torpedo the entire project out of pure spite.
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I think there's a way to wrangle those people while encouraging people like Con to still contribute.

I've worked with people who are unnecessarily abrasive and they don't have the talent to back it up. For every Linus out there, there's a bunch of people who talk and act like him, just with substantially less talent.
 
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So... in terms for someone who hasn't been following ANY of this (like me)...

Troons and SJW's have forced the Linux community to ban wrongthink in whatever context anyone feels is offensive, and the main community is going to essentially DFE their specific contributions through legal means?

Is that what I'm reading here?
 
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I'm going to repost what I said in the FOSS thread about this:
CIA Nigger said:
Licensing stuff can be a total mess with contributors, especially if the license is changed. The original MAME license said that commercial use was prohibited, but after said license caused issues some of which were pointed out by some devs when the relicensing effort started leading to flamewars between devs, the MAME people decided to relicense MAME under a mix of the GPL, 3 clause BSD, and LGPL. The effort involved contacting just about every single MAME contributor and asking them to relicense it under their choice of license. Surprisingly, this effort went well. In 2016 with only around 2-3 drivers being removed and some being rewritten by other devs, MAME 0.172 was released as GPL licensed.

That's really the closest thing I can think of to this situation. If developers go through with this it will get messy all around, as both sides weaponize this. It's not just going to be some guy who got kicked for saying something on Twitter doing this, you're going to be seeing more of this from the "I'm not fixing this because Intel isn't woke" type crowds.
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If it happened it would be devastating. They'd have to go back and redo a lot of missing code because of some drama causing devs to throw a wrench in the project, and Stallman's FSF/GPL team would take a big fat L as corporations + users jump ship to something like FreeBSD (which Sony has done with the PS4 thanks to the BSD license).
 
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Tanner Glass said:
I'm not 100% familiar with the Linux license, but is there anything preventing the talented contributors from forking out from here and maintaining their own version?
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They can, but most distros use the base version of the kernel and its time consuming to switch out software to another version of the kernel. Possibly, yes, but a lot of downtime required. Most online shit require it to be online almost 24/7. So if business can avoid this, they will.
 
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Graffiti canvas said:
So... in terms for someone who hasn't been following ANY of this (like me)...

Troons and SJW's have forced the Linux community to ban wrongthink in whatever context anyone feels is offensive, and the main community is going to essentially DFE their specific contributions through legal means?

Is that what I'm reading here?
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When I was in grade school there was an unpopular asshole who we wouldn't let play with us. Teachers said we had to. So he asked to join our game of tag and we couldn't say no.

Know what we did? We quit the game immediately. And moved 20 feet away and started a "new" game of tag.

And here we have the people with all the talent and experience being told to let nobodies into the game, so they quit the game.
 
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Yes, and they can really poison the atmosphere. A few of the top people on the mailing list have been there for a long time. If these were the ones complaining and pushing for a CoC, they had probably merit in doing so. Besides weird conspiracy theories, I don't think the big corps that contribute want the kernel to go to shit for some nefarious purpose. There is a lot of good coming out of this work for them. Alphabet government setups might want (and have tried) to weaken certain specifics of the kernel or get backdoors in, but they still would want the thing to be used by everyone and not fractured in a bunch of different projects. Nobody wants to go back to that. It's no question though that it's not the same wild west atmosphere it once was when Linux was still a thing for nerds and weirdos and old-school wizard-beard computer scientists.

The pushback is pretty big, I haven't seen anybody who is happy about that except dangerhairs on twitter who might also overvalue their influence even though the CoC is made by one of them. I find it very unlikely that linux goes to a point of "post-merit" were dangerhairs are filtering dangerous words out of the sourcecode and pajeets write it to shit. There's just too much money riding on it not to be shit.

In other news, I actually looked into OpenBSD and it's surprisingly different in some ways and feels a bit old-school, but not bad at all. I will at least keep looking at it. Always good to have alternatives.
 
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