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What are your expectations for the EU5 release?


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I'm good at all Paradox games, I can blob in 50 years in CK2, I know that I need to rush gas attack in Vic2, I know that I eed to make 21/24 width inf divisions, but I can never understand how to make money in EU4. All my games bar one have resulted in mw quitting my 1500ish when I can't effectively conquer everyone around me and make money at the same time. the one game in where I made it to 1590 was one as England where united the isles before 1500 and managed to colonize but the Portugese resulted in border gore and they were allied to France who were allied to Aragon (Spain never formed) and I think Venice who would backsiege my mainland holdings, and whenever I went to war with France to try and finally put them down they got a huge 80something-k deathstack (For reference my armies were split up sieging down forts, 2 armies within one province distance of each other, always 30k men) and wiped out 30k men from two armies, my army templates were alright and I was up to date with my mil tech too plus I had quality ideas. On the topic of ducats, I made sure to steer trade to the Channel from the New World and North Sea and build manufactories and trade power buildings, but I only had a profit of 3-8 ducats at a time because I needed to construct armies and ships to keep up with France, and barely in money in reserve because I built buildings to raise my force limit.
You will need to post your map and economy tab for more help. How much % of the node you have? Maybe you can't afford advisors? Too many forts? Over the force limit?
If you can't win against someone usually the answer is ally their enemies and conquer somewhere else until you are stronger.
 
If you haven't yet, I would recommend an already big nation that doesn't focus on colonizing like the Ottomans, Muscovy, or France. My general rule for income is building churches and workhouses when they generate +.2, trade ports at +2, and factories at +.4.
I do this, but I do churches when they're +.1

What I've done with trade is you want merchants directing trade as long of a snake as you can back to your home trade node. I don't know if that's optimal but I get pretty good trade income.
Colonizing is generally fucked because colonies are semi-independent, so they can declare war on be declared on without you being drawn in, and I don't think anybody can decipher how trade actually works.
Many times I've gone to check in on my colonies and they're basically gone because the Iroquois or whatever declared war on them and I didn't pay attention to the notification.

You also need to subsidize new colonies ~5 ducats/month to help them stay out of debt and grow which is dumb. That should be baked in.
 
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What I've done with trade is you want merchants directing trade as long of a snake as you can back to your home trade node. I don't know if that's optimal but I get pretty good trade income.

I get that and it's generally what I do too, but what I don't understand is how the hell in my current England->Angevin game I have ~35% trade power in Cheasapeake Bay without a merchant, no transfer of trade power, no subjects colonizing there, and my furthest west province being Iceland.
 
Colonizing is generally fucked because colonies are semi-independent, so they can declare war on be declared on without you being drawn in
While you're not automatically drawn in you can still do something about it. If your colony is the one declaring you should be able to use the same CB to get involved. If your colony is being attacked you should be able to use enforce peace to either end it, or join in.

Many times I've gone to check in on my colonies and they're basically gone because the Iroquois or whatever declared war on them and I didn't pay attention to the notification.
I mean not paying attention to notifications kinda sounds like a skill issue tbh

I get that and it's generally what I do too, but what I don't understand is how the hell in my current England->Angevin game I have ~35% trade power in Cheasapeake Bay without a merchant, no transfer of trade power, no subjects colonizing there, and my furthest west province being Iceland.
Trade power automatically propagates upstream. Since you're Angevin I assume you're completely dominating the Channel, and 20% of your provincial trade power propagates to nodes upstream, which includes Chesapeake. If you go to the Chesapeake node and hover over your total trade power, the tooltip should show something about "transfer from traders downstream"
 
If you haven't yet, I would recommend an already big nation that doesn't focus on colonizing like the Ottomans, Muscovy, or France. My general rule for income is building churches and workhouses when they generate +.2, trade ports at +2, and factories at +.4. Colonizing is generally fucked because colonies are semi-independent, so they can declare war on be declared on without you being drawn in, and I don't think anybody can decipher how trade actually works.
Churches are generally not a good use of a building slot, generally I only recommend them for provinces that have seven or more tax. Otherwise it's better to just build a manufactory and production efficiency line. Production is king for income since it double dips; first from the value of the good itself, and then from the increase to trade value in the node that you can collect.

Trade is decently easy once you figure out how steering works. Make your home port one of the end nodes (or at least a chokepoint node like Constantinople or Malacca), build trade buildings only in provinces with already high trade value, use your merchants to steer trade towards that node. Once you start consolidating an empire you want to reassign your merchants further out; e.g. if your end node is constantinople, don't use merchants to pull from both the black sea and alexandria when you could steer trade from the gulf of aden into alexandria and then direct the increased trade from alexandria into constantinople. Trade nodes also have a natural flow into a certain node so putting merchants in that to steer trade in a direction it's going to is unnecessary. Depending on where you are and your playstyle anywhere from two-fifths to three-fourths of your naval forcelimit should go into light ships to improve your trade power in nodes that are either hotly contested or that you're steering in but don't have a lot of provinces. Only assign provinces to trade companies when they're disconnected and you want to commit a whole area to it - e.g. Indian/Indonesia coastal provinces if you're the Ottomans/Byzzies, but not Egypt.
 
Probably because despite its problems EU4 is still a sandbox whereas HoI4 and Vicky 3 are overglorified visual novels with clear railroads.

The early modern period also just lends itself better to this without being silly. The playing field was alot more even and the big players were big simply through sheer manpower and land fertility.
 
All right, guys! CK3 is getting a new map! This will totally make it good! Right...?
It does look much better, I'll give them that much. The EU5 map also improved a lot recently, so I assume it was a company wide push. Wonder if HoI4 and V3 will get a similar face-lift.
 
Too bad the game is still shit
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It does look much better, I'll give them that much. The EU5 map also improved a lot recently, so I assume it was a company wide push. Wonder if HoI4 and V3 will get a similar face-lift.
Where have they posted the improvements? I remember seeing a heightmap added after the youtuber previews but the 3D showcase was shit.
 
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It does look much better, I'll give them that much. The EU5 map also improved a lot recently, so I assume it was a company wide push. Wonder if HoI4 and V3 will get a similar face-lift.
I agree, it does look much better. But, as Imperator at launch taught us, the map can be beautiful, but it doesnt matter if the game is mid.
 
Where have they posted the improvements? I remember seeing a heightmap added after the youtuber previews but the 3D showcase was shit.
Compare the recent TT map screenshots to the older ones. The textures they are using are much improved.
I agree, it does look much better. But, as Imperator at launch taught us, the map can be beautiful, but it doesnt matter if the game is mid.
Ahem, nowhere did I say the game will be better. Adding China to make it even more bloated is certainly going to make the game worse, but I will call a spade a spade and say the textures and heightmap look better, so I will give props to the art department alone.
 
It does look much better, I'll give them that much. The EU5 map also improved a lot recently, so I assume it was a company wide push. Wonder if HoI4 and V3 will get a similar face-lift.
HOI4 never will, updating the map would eat into too much time for creating new focus trees.
 
Does anyone here still play vanilla/vanilla+ HOI4? I had a blast playing as Germany playing until 1950 with a suite of small improvement mods like Better Mechanics and a few major ones like RK+ & Festung Europa. Barbarossa was especially fun since it looked like I'd lose in Ukraine because of some frontline fuckery (Map mod added a few lakes along the Dneiper that broke up the frontline) but I lucked out and got the scripted peace deal by March of '42.
 
@Knud Lavard Saw a really old post of yours in here about pilgrimages (for CK2). The topic of conversation was cathedrals not really being represented properly in the game despite being one of the most notable features of the era, wonders of the world that were each and every one of them a story in itself.

Could be cool if a CK2-like (i'm going to say -like from now on since Paradox themselves are hopeless) had a sort of "build your own holy site" thing. Or think of it like Civilization tourism. You get cathedrals and monasteries, they work like Great Works but balanced to be viable and gradual projects. Then there's some kind of pool of Pilgrims in your religion/region. The state/church can actively cultivate a holy site, a cult to a saint, a collection of relics to boost the attractiveness of its holy sites. It's competitive. It draws Prestige, Piety and commerce/cultural exchange/technological diffusion from the movement of peoples. It can become a source of event chains and intrigues and such (Medieval monasteries would straight up steal relics from each other, Orthodox would fake up "uncorrupted" saints that were stuffed with straw, ancient Pharaohs would hire tomb raiders to loot the treasures of old pyramids for their own and disavow them if they got caught, etc.). It's both competitive and cooperative in that active investment in, cultivation of religious fervor drives Moral Authority (though it could perhaps due the opposite if it gets derailed into social reform, like many of those heresies really were) but you get more of the goodies, the rewards, for doing more of the work yourself.

Make a whole DLC. Call it The Pilgrim's Progress or some dumb shit.

I truly hate, from the bottom of my heart, the Game of Thrones crowd because I think they more than anybody were responsible for Paradox playing into lolmurderincest and roleplaying instead of enriching their Medieval world.
I had this old post (what I've replied to above) from a million years ago that I remembered (yes, I know it's extremely autistic, but I have recall like that, only for useless faffery though) and I thought of this book, some of you may have read it:

This dude is essentially writing Catholic economic history apologia against my favored position, I'd argue badly, but it richly details the ways the "magisteria" was different from both philosophy and heathenry (science is a Christian endeavor) and the way that Medieval Europe was really starting to flourish through the development of monastic capitalism, Italian capitalism, trade fairs in France, the rise in living standards, the inventiveness of Medieval man, the flourishing of art that tends to get ignored by modern people. (The guy basically sticks his head in the sand about Protestantism's role in accelerating this stuff, arguing with this outdated strawman, but that's irrelevant to CK2.)
 
Johan posted this yesterday:

Our approach to missions is a deliberate and evolving one, designed to enhance player experience without compromising freedom or immersion. While the current underlying code is an adapted version of the mission tree mechanics from Imperator, it's crucial to understand that this is merely a foundational element. Our primary focus right now is on building a truly deep and immersive game world, rich with flavour content, without relying on a set of guiding missions for key countries. This is not your late-era EU4-style Mission Trees.

To clarify a common misconception, I've previously stated that this game would not feature Europa Universalis IV-style mission trees. This distinction is vital. My statement was not a blanket rejection of all mission trees, but rather a commitment to avoid the highly prescriptive, often linear, and sometimes excessively ahistorical nature that EU4's system can impose. We are aiming for something far more organic and adaptable.

It's important to recognize that missions are just one part of providing engaging and flavorful content. Our game will feature a multitude of other types of compelling content, many of which are entirely unique to this title, including Situations, Dynamic Historical Events, International Organizations, and all the content that we’ve been showing to you in Tinto Talks and Tinto Flavour during these past months.

These elements, alongside our refined mission system, will contribute to a rich and replayable experience that goes far beyond simply ticking off objectives.

Ultimately, the role of missions in our game when we release it will be primarily pedagogical and introductory. We envision missions serving as invaluable learning tools and a core part of the onboarding process for new players. They will gently guide players through the game's mechanics, introduce key concepts, and provide initial direction.

However, they are not intended to force players onto predefined "rails" or dictate their strategic decisions throughout the entire game. Once players have grasped the fundamentals, they will be free to chart their own course, engage with the world on their own terms, and create their unique stories within our deeply simulated environment. This philosophy ensures that while missions provide a helpful starting point, they do not hinder the player's agency or the emergent narrative possibilities that define our game.


When it comes to flavor, as mentioned above, we have so many tools, with which we will be telling a country or region chronicles. As we expand on the story lines, situations as an example solves the old problems of “mission tree X for Country A is making mission tree Y for Country B feel silly”, by making content that involves multiple countries at the same time.

As you have all seen in Tinto Talks during the year, the unique country specific flavor in EU5 comes in many different shapes..

  • International Organisations, like Catholic Church, High Kingship of Ireland, Tatar Yoke, etc
  • Disasters like Rise of the Szlachta, Hook and Cod Wars, Ambrosian Republic, etc
  • Characters like John Wycliffe, Mikael Agricola, Leonardo da Vinci, etc
  • Advances like Wagenburg, Kungliga Postverket, Farari Corps, etc
  • Unique Mechanics like Promote Mamluk, Appease the Gods, Raise a Bey Fortress, etc
  • Cabinet Actions
  • Buildings
  • Diplomatic Actions
  • Laws and Policies
  • Estate Privileges
  • Inheritance Rules
  • Government Reforms
  • Religious Mechanics
  • Historical Events
  • Units
  • Parliament Mechanics
  • Peace Treaties
  • And much more…
 
Johan posted this yesterday:

Our approach to missions is a deliberate and evolving one, designed to enhance player experience without compromising freedom or immersion. While the current underlying code is an adapted version of the mission tree
Good. Mission trees are OP in EU4. They make the first 100 years of a save exciting but after that the game is a slog.
 
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