Paradox Studio Thread

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Because it's a pointless anachronism? There was no such thing as "bisexuality" anywhere in that time period. If you slept with men, you were considered a sodomite. It didn't matter if you slept with women too, or even formed romantic relationships with them. A homosexual in CK2 is for all purposes a bisexual because they still sleep with the opposite sex and produce kids like many committed homosexuals throughout history did (and still do). What gameplay mechanics really warrants that? Being able to fall in love with the opposite sex as a bisexual while a homosexual can't?

Same thing with asexuality. It did not exist as a concept separate from celibacy. An asexual still has to fuck and make babies like everyone who isn't clergy in CK2. I guess it could work gameplay-wise by making the asexual more likely to demand to be a monk/nun/priest and decreasing their fertility.

Bruh

Whether a person is attracted to just women or just men or to both is going to have an effect regardless of if you have a separate word or legal concept for it.

Consider a homosexual vs a bisexual with regards to seduction plots. The homosexual could be targeted by seduction plots by women, but they'd all fail because the character wouldn't be interested in any sex that isn't part of his own plot (faking straightness to manipulate someone) or his wife (to make children). But the bisexual character would.

Shit, you basically said it yourself with regards to falling in love. That IS the meaningful distinction.

It's probably like a 20 minute change for them to implement that makes the system work a little smoother.

I also used to think that all the seduction crap in CK2 was really silly and Hollywood-ish, but then I read a book on Roman history. I would think Medieval monarchs wouldn't have carried on as bad as the Romans, but it's shocking how many real-life seduction plots happened around Roman courts involving members of the imperial family. So having the seduction system work somewhat decently is probably worthwhile, though I'm sure they'll go way overboard on it.
 
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:story:

Seriously though, sexuality is an underrated aspect of political life within medieval kingdoms, especially when proximity to the ruler often came with great amounts of personal power. For example, James the VI of Scotland and I of England had multiple homosexual lovers who he doted on and gave rather large estates to. A queen with homosexual lovers was going to be gossip bait behind the scenes, and plenty of nobles were seemingly more obsessed by making war than ever getting down to fuck. Wouldn't surprise me if one or two of them were asexual.
 
:story:

Seriously though, sexuality is an underrated aspect of political life within medieval kingdoms, especially when proximity to the ruler often came with great amounts of personal power. For example, James the VI of Scotland and I of England had multiple homosexual lovers who he doted on and gave rather large estates to. A queen with homosexual lovers was going to be gossip bait behind the scenes, and plenty of nobles were seemingly more obsessed by making war than ever getting down to fuck. Wouldn't surprise me if one or two of them were asexual.
Isn't that already sort of in ck2 though? The seduction focus pretty much escalates to you picking up lovers all over the place, cuckolding as many people as possible, and occasionally seducing the Pope. And as for asexuality, both the chaste and celebrate traits come to mind.
🤔
Now that I think about it, how is what they are doing fundamentally any different than Ck2?
 
Isn't that already sort of in ck2 though? The seduction focus pretty much escalates to you picking up lovers all over the place, cuckolding as many people as possible, and occasionally seducing the Pope. And as for asexuality, both the chaste and celebrate traits come to mind.
🤔
Now that I think about it, how is what they are doing fundamentally any different than Ck2?
Because they used a word that a Tumblrette also used rather than stick with using traits like Chaste and Celibate to model asexuality (the event text upon acquiring the former implies it), so clickbaiters smelled blood in the water. Also this is the company that makes Vampire: The Masquerade and that Women in History DLC for eu4 (in which some French circus fencer becomes a great general the instant you hire her) , so there might be a genuine fear that they'll take a reasonable concept and go full retard.

CK2 dev diaries are so frustrating. I didn't really expect them to include China, but now:

We lose nomads.
Not only is there no naval warfare (which is extremely important for merchant republics), but there's no republics at all.
Most of your army is going to consist of undifferentiated generic "levies."

But whoop-de-doo, we get customizable heresies! Now you can magic your lolmurderincest heresy in instead of being Zoroastrian!

Trash.

It's just flash. Soulless cartoony flashy bullshit graphics, replacing the old charming ones, and no expansion on anything else except for the one or two things the new fanbase (the lolhorsecouncillorgameofthrones fans) likes.
It's like they built up whatever graphical system they're using for Imperator:Rome characters and thought "Let's reskin all of our games with this!". Here's hoping that the men-at-arms system will be viable for people who aren't megablobs with endgame tech, unlike retinues, because it seems that the new tactics system is based on them.
 
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Because they used a word that a Tumblrette also used rather than stick with using traits like Chaste and Celibate to model asexuality (the event text upon acquiring the former implies it), so clickbaiters smelled blood in the water. Also this is the company that makes Vampire: The Masquerade and that Women in History DLC for eu4 (in which some French circus fencer becomes a great general the instant you hire her) , so there might be a genuine fear that they'll take a reasonable concept and go full exceptional individual.


It's like they built up whatever graphical system they're using for Imperator:Rome characters and thought "Let's reskin all of our games with this!". Here's hoping that the men-at-arms system will be viable for people who aren't megablobs with endgame tech, unlike retinues, because it seems that the new tactics system is based on them.

Chaste and Celibate are NOT equivalent to asexual, though. A monk is celibate but he’s not necessarily asexual; most monks probably were heterosexual. Chaste, for its part, seems to be more of a flavorful way of saying “the opposite of lustful,” ie someone who may or may not have sexual attraction but is known for a low libido.

In fact, they really ought to have a hidden trait for virgins that has big effects for female characters.

But to me, that’s the bigger problem: the system doesn’t punish immoral behavior near as hard as it should. If the princess gets caught with a lover, it should be a big debuff to marrying her off, for example.

BTW, to expand on my pissiness about naval warfare, it would be so easy to implement conceptually.

Ships act as basic combat units. You get three phases of combat: Volley, Ramming, and Melee. When you load armies onto ships, it changes the class of the ship, ie from a Transport Ship to an Archer Ship, or a Heavy infantry Ship, etc.

The type of unit changes it. For example, Volley favors ranged infantry, Melee favors melee infantry, and Ramming probably would favor the generic ships. Cavalry is at an inherent disadvantage. Volley mostly kills army units, not ships. Ramming mostly kills ships, not army units (but if a ship goes down, it takes the units with it). Melee kills both, since killing the crew is equivalent to disabling the ship.

There are several kinds of naval province that govern movement, and cultures get special retinues/cultural building levoes. In this time period, ships mostly hugged the coast, so coastal chokepoints and coast-only combat makes sense. The Norse can go up rivers and into deep sea. The Slavs can go up rivers. The Berbers get pirate galleys that can raid coastal provinces without landing. Republics get special marine ships that are really effective at Ramming and special marine units that are effective at Melee and amphibious assaults. Republics also get merchant marines that have some mechanic to boost trade revenue when strategically placed. The Eastern Romans get fire ships that are extremely effective in Ramming (flamethrowers operate at very short distances). In the late game, Galleons are unlocked with extremely high volley and deep sea travel abilities.

I don’t know how river warfare would work.

The advantage of all this?

You don’t have to plan out ANYTHIGN extra. Fighting on sea is a direct continuation of fighting on land: you just load up your troops, and your army composition determines your navy composition, but the effectiveness of it changes in the new environment. Admirals are just generals with special traits suited to naval combat. Naval chokepoints exist. Blockades could be implemented with some expansion to the trade system. Tbe only nations that build special ships are:
- Republics, who are specialized for naval combat
- Greeks, who are basically given the ability to field a very small number of very effective special ships
- Late game empires that begin to experiment with modern-style navies


Edit: Since rivers are so narrow, my thinking there is that any naval battle on a river would be a complete clusterfuck of melee combat with no room for tactics or much of anything. You probably couldn't really maneuver properly to ram, volleys would be limited heavily by the shape of the river and whether or not it enables you to get a good aim. And, while defending land armies may not be able to ram into you with a rival fleet, they can still launch little boarding vessels and harass you from shore.

I'm fine with handwaving it all by just saying that a river battle is resolved as being a land battle, like that the land army/defending navy disembarked their ships, blocked the river somehow, and you resolve it on land before preceding. I'm not aware of any real river battles in the era in the first place, which is a problem.
 
Ships act as basic combat units. You get three phases of combat: Volley, Ramming, and Melee. When you load armies onto ships, it changes the class of the ship, ie from a Transport Ship to an Archer Ship, or a Heavy infantry Ship, etc.
what game I:Rome?




also are we enough for a mp`? i have all dlc for Hoi4, I:Rome and EU4 and i could host
 
ck2 doesnt need a complex sea system. there wasnt much sea warfare in the dark age.
There wasn’t much in ancient times either. There’s a really good book on the topic I read recently on medieval naval warfare called shockingly enough “Medieval Naval Warfare” and it’s a fascinating subject. Control of the seas was very important but most ships like in ancient times were still restricted to coastal operation, both for safety and for supply. The real change in medieval naval warfare was the shift in construction style which made ships far more durable and able to be built bigger.

The Genoese and Venitian merchant and war fleets were vital to the campaigns of the crusades and various Mediterranean conflicts, and there are a decent number of major naval engagements during the time period all over the Mediterranean, the Baltic, and the North Sea coast. The naval forces of the Byzantine empire ended up being the reason for the coronation of at least two emperors IIRC.

A basic naval warfare system should be included IMO because there were decisive naval engagements all over during this period.
 
ck2 doesnt need a complex sea system. there wasnt much sea warfare in the dark age.

There was tons of sea combat in the Middle Ages (CK2 isn't a Dark Age game specifically), especially in the Mediterranean.

What you didn't see much of was national navies, or even admirals. Navies were basically whatever ships you had on hand. Which is why my idea is as simple as just loading troops onto ships, except for the few cultures/governments which were historically notable for having a special interest in the sea.


There wasn’t much in ancient times either. There’s a really good book on the topic I read recently on medieval naval warfare called shockingly enough “Medieval Naval Warfare” and it’s a fascinating subject. Control of the seas was very important but most ships like in ancient times were still restricted to coastal operation, both for safety and for supply. The real change in medieval naval warfare was the shift in construction style which made ships far more durable and able to be built bigger.

The Genoese and Venitian merchant and war fleets were vital to the campaigns of the crusades and various Mediterranean conflicts, and there are a decent number of major naval engagements during the time period all over the Mediterranean, the Baltic, and the North Sea coast. The naval forces of the Byzantine empire ended up being the reason for the coronation of at least two emperors IIRC.

A basic naval warfare system should be included IMO because there were decisive naval engagements all over during this period.

Just by virtue of reading that you'd know way more about it than me, but I have heard that coastal operations was in part because there was absolutely no viable way to coordinate fleets properly out in deep sea. No radio. That's also why in my proposal, no combat occurs in deep sea or even travel, except for the Norse who can travel through deep sea. Honestly I'd be okay with having some parts of the map be surrounded by deep sea, like maybe Iceland and definitely Greenland/Vinland.

I don't know if Age of Sail navies ever had meaningful engagements out in deep sea, well away from land, but I would assume they worked the same way.

It'd also be neat if, there was a deep sea/coastal system, if you could send late-game galleon fleets on expeditions around Africa. But, there wouldn't be all of Africa on the map, necessarily. Instead, you would navigate the fleet to a special sea zone, and then there'd be some interface to send it on a mission. The fleet would disappear for the duration of the mission. The reason I thought of this is because that's how I would have handled invading China.

The Jade Dragon (or whatever they named that shitty DLC) system for invading China is bullshit. You invade China by... having China invade you? What the fuck? Why would you even want to have that in the game? They could have made some system where the army just sort of disappears and has an event-driven campaign system, but instead Paradox went with the laziest possible way to implement it.
 
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The Genoese and Venitian merchant and war fleets were vital to the campaigns of the crusades and various Mediterranean conflicts, and there are a decent number of major naval engagements during the time period all over the Mediterranean, the Baltic, and the North Sea coast. The naval forces of the Byzantine empire ended up being the reason for the coronation of at least two emperors IIRC.
well you have to understand that Paradox just cares about the first 200 years. everything after that is just player dominated anyway.

also nobody wants to play with me?
 
well you have to understand that Paradox just cares about the first 200 years. everything after that is just player dominated anyway.

also nobody wants to play with me?

I'd be interested in that, but I don't know how available I'd be. I spend an awful lot of time rushing around doing math homework. But I'd be interested in Paradox multiplayer.
 
SO they started to make challenges for I:Rome and give away dlc keys. the first challenge took me 2 hours. next challenge will come up next week.
 
I’d be down for a multiplayer game sometime
 
I need help, i don't know why but the game has stopped working correctly: in the sense it refuse to go fast like so bad that too spped is the equivalent of second slowest speed and I'm not sure it's even that fast? I have no idea what the fuck is going on anymore
 
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Does anybody play Millennium Dawn? I hadn't bothered to check it because I had the impression it was a shallow childish memefest, but I finally opened it up (as in, just to check the tech trees and focus trees, I have no time to actually play it), and it seems like my impression could not have been wrong. Complex mechanics (or at least the appearance of it) to simulate internal policy, extremely large elaborate focus trees that are mostly based in reality (but include options for extremism). It looks like a modern day version of what HOI4 should have been to start with.

I need help, i don't know why but the game has stopped working correctly: in the sense it refuse to go fast like so bad that too spped is the equivalent of second slowest speed and I'm not sure it's even that fast? I have no idea what the fuck is going on anymore

Which game?
 
Does anybody play Millennium Dawn? I hadn't bothered to check it because I had the impression it was a shallow childish memefest, but I finally opened it up (as in, just to check the tech trees and focus trees, I have no time to actually play it), and it seems like my impression could not have been wrong. Complex mechanics (or at least the appearance of it) to simulate internal policy, extremely large elaborate focus trees that are mostly based in reality (but include options for extremism). It looks like a modern day version of what HOI4 should have been to start with.



Which game?
CK2
 
I need help, i don't know why but the game has stopped working correctly: in the sense it refuse to go fast like so bad that too spped is the equivalent of second slowest speed and I'm not sure it's even that fast? I have no idea what the fuck is going on anymore

It just suddenly started happening? I did have a computer where CK2 ran like this but it did so from the start. Playing anything above speed 3 was like playing on speed 2. But I was playing on a very basic laptop and after I upgraded I haven't had the problem since.
 
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