Pokémon (Not-So) Griefing Thread - Scarlet and Violet Released with 10 Million Copies in First 3 Days in Buggy States

Oh man what the fuck will we ever do without BIDE.
Yeah because all the moves missing are as negligible as Bide. Looking at the list of moves there are a lot moves that are missing are the "complicated" ones like the ones that vary in strength based on friendship, do damage based on the user's level, or otherwise have strange qualifiers like Pursuit. Hell Bide falls into that category as well. This makes it seem like even more laziness on GF's part more so than any sort of balancing or fat trimming that they might pretend it is.
 
Yeah because all the moves missing are as negligible as Bide. Looking at the list of moves there are a lot moves that are missing are the "complicated" ones like the ones that vary in strength based on friendship, do damage based on the user's level, or otherwise have strange qualifiers like Pursuit. Hell Bide falls into that category as well. This makes it seem like even more laziness on GF's part more so than any sort of balancing or fat trimming that they might pretend it is.
Not to mention just plain old regular moves that got axed for no particular reason like Barrier, Signal Beam, ect. And then there's the extra egregious examples of species-exclusive moves that were deleted despite their users being present in Galar like the Woobat line's Heart Stamp and Vespiquen's Heal Order.

Cut corner after cut corner after cut corner, that's all SWSH is...
 
Bug types are literally Chad's Pokemon.
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Unironic Big Chad Energy
 
Also all the Pokemon from previous Gens were still in the code, they just had to be traded in from games that came out later in Gen 3.
This is one of the more 'ehhhhhhhh' counterpoints to me. I mean, on the player end, the difference is minimal - in both cases, the full dex isn't possible until another item or two is released. (In fact, there's Pokemon exclusive to 1 of all 5 gen 3 games, not counting ho-oh exc to coliseum and lugia exc to gale 'cos they're available by events. If you're wondering, Lunatone in Saph, Zangoose in Ruby, a bunch of Johtos in Emerald, Elekid line and others in Leafgreen, Magmar line and others in FireRed.) To make a decent attempt at filling the dex by yourself, you'd need to buy two games at least, if not three.

Having the data not in the game until the patches essentially creates the same result directly. Ruby/Sapphire needed all the data in them from day one, there was no 'dlc' mechanic.

Re: the moves, the big thing for me has always been 'if you can't cut anything, how the hell can you balance the game?' Pokemon's biggest pull to a new game is an ever-expanding roster of mons - inevitably, some are brokefuck. If you can't cut mons, and you can't even cut moves, how the hell can you ever hope to even pretend to balance the game over time?

Yeah because all the moves missing are as negligible as Bide. Looking at the list of moves there are a lot moves that are missing are the "complicated" ones like the ones that vary in strength based on friendship, do damage based on the user's level, or otherwise have strange qualifiers like Pursuit. Hell Bide falls into that category as well. This makes it seem like even more laziness on GF's part more so than any sort of balancing or fat trimming that they might pretend it is.
The moves are a mixed bag, but acting like them focusing on just the mechanically complex moves isn't really accurate - a lot of the cut moves have mechanical equivalents. Sonicboom and Dragon Rage are gone, but Seismic toss is in. Jump Kick's not in, but High Jump Kick is. Ominous Wind is out, by Ancient Power is in.

And I've had people talk to me, being quite happy that the moves were cut, because of things like Hidden Power. After all, hidden power gives special users literally any type attack they want, and the more recent games had made the iv sacrifice easily ignorable. Some even manage to top it off with Technician. Then there's return - a staple, but a staple because it could reach BP 127 - just slightly below moves like Fire Blast, with none of the drawbacks. And any mon could learn it.

There's definitely cases where they targeted mechanics - all of the moves attacking sleepers are gone - but acting like it's out of being too lazy to program mechanics isn't really grounded.
 
Speaking of Bug types, I finally got around to starting a Black 2 mono-Bug run I've been putting off for so long. Only I think I already broke the run for the beginning portion.

I wanted to use a Durant since it's always a mon you can't get until super late so I traded over an egg to serve as the "starter" as soon as I could trade. Except I forgot that level up moves are passed down to offspring so it came out with an endgame moveset on top of its already high stats and early game-retardant typing. So now I'm outspeeding and oneshotting nearly everything in my path while barely taking a scratch in return.

Oops...
 
Yeah because all the moves missing are as negligible as Bide. Looking at the list of moves there are a lot moves that are missing are the "complicated" ones like the ones that vary in strength based on friendship, do damage based on the user's level, or otherwise have strange qualifiers like Pursuit. Hell Bide falls into that category as well. This makes it seem like even more laziness on GF's part more so than any sort of balancing or fat trimming that they might pretend it is.
What you mean the friendship moves that completely negate every other Normal type physical attack that exists

The only 3 of any real note that were removed were Hidden Power, The Friendship moves and Pursuit.

The Friendship moves were sort of unbalanced, they were outright better than every single other normal type physical stab in the game. Do you have a Normal Sweeper? You have Return. Hidden Power was..extremely good in Smogon shit because you could mod your EVs to have the exact Hidden power you want..it was worthless outside of that due to EVs being complete rng.

Pursuit..I am sad to see the gamplay of that go but switching pokemon is already a fairly large price without getting punished for it and it probably should go.
 
I feel like Unown are some of the biggest wasted potential and show the problems with GameFreak's overall lack of imagination (as far as 'Mons go).

They have lore, and side materials show just how creepy they can be (the 3rd Pokemon movie being the best indicator of this), hell, even Super Smash Bros. Melee lets them be somewhat useful. But in the main games? Genuine joke characters. They only learn one move, said move being random as to when you catch it, they go down in one hit, you only get a worthless piece of paper for catching every form, and they don't evolve or change forms, even if you have a large group of them.
The biggest waste of potential will always be Zygarde. Never in the games do we see it actually doing its “job” of defending Kalos.
 
The biggest waste of potential will always be Zygarde. Never in the games do we see it actually doing its “job” of defending Kalos.
There is also Golduck, who had an ability that only a Legendary had, in a format where weather effects were the king of the meta game..and just didn't have the stats to be used.
 
Speaking of Bug types, I finally got around to starting a Black 2 mono-Bug run I've been putting off for so long. Only I think I already broke the run for the beginning portion.

I wanted to use a Durant since it's always a mon you can't get until super late so I traded over an egg to serve as the "starter" as soon as I could trade. Except I forgot that level up moves are passed down to offspring so it came out with an endgame moveset on top of its already high stats and early game-retardant typing. So now I'm outspeeding and oneshotting nearly everything in my path while barely taking a scratch in return.

Oops...
I've been playing a Poison-type monotype in Y for a little while now. 90% of the reason is finding justification in using Dragalge, but poison type is... weirdly a type I like a lot of pokemon from, but don't have strong feelings about itself.

There is also Golduck, who had an ability that only a Legendary had, in a format where weather effects were the king of the meta game..and just didn't have the stats to be used.
That's more competitive viability, I think MSG was talking story potential. I also think it's sad we haven't seen Kyurem Complete.
 
This has been discussed to death already, but I can live with dex cut. As someone who's really affected by it, I can at least understand the logic: they're working within an ever increasing scope that is probably just not worth the effort to mantain at this point. As long as they redirect that time and energy into making something truly great, then I'm fine with it.

Except they didn't. Ever since the very first trailer came out I was like "Huh, it's Pokemon, alright". Unlike Nintendo's other IPs there was no crazy trailer, no crazy reveals, nothing really that new to get invested in. But whatever, maybe I'm just pessimistic. After all, this is a console jump. Then the dex cut happened even though they're clearly still recycling assets and 70% of moves still look lame as hell. That was a huge red flag for me when it came to what the game had to offer if they were cutting corners this blatantly. Then the game comes out and it turns out it's barely above average for a 3DS game at 60 dollars plus more if you want the full experience. That's not even getting into the PR bullshit that created even more drama out of the situation

Seriously, I don't mind the dex cut nor the janky models and animations, but the bottom line is you either make everything else look nicer or you just give me back Typhlosion, goddammit. Also, make a game with actual content while you're at it
 
If you can't cut mons, and you can't even cut moves, how the hell can you ever hope to even pretend to balance the game over time?
Why pretend that's even possible, there's no way to balance Comp in any meaningful way, only make it slightly less busted.
 
Source? Haven't seen anything regarding bringing back megas, Rayquaza or otherwise (or the primals for that matter).
Don't have any proof of mega evolution making a return, but I have a feeling that there's probably going to be a psuedo-mega Rayquaza made through G-Maxing and the right held item.
 
Internet Lumberjack got me yesterday, so this is the Unown post because I really love talking about the Unown and I'm still kinda mad they're not considered Legendary/Mythical Pokémon nor even pseudo-Legendary when they totally deserve the recognition at this point. I mean, thanks to the third movie, I honestly believed they were Legendary Pokémon that were, I dunno, trapped in the Ruins of Alph for reasons unknown (pun unintended but lol). They've always fascinated me, but also were some of the more frustrating Pokémon I've ever had. Because my God they deserve better. I remember thinking something amazing was coming out about the Unown when the "!" and "?" Unown were revealed for FR/LG because of the connection between the Sevii Islands and Johto (especially the Tanoby Chambers which never get talked about), but nah, just gave us more questions. They'd still be around for Gen IV thanks to the Solaceon Ruins and (later) the Sinjoh Ruins, but then they just... disappeared after that.

Not in the sense they were forgotten, but like you couldn't really catch them in-game anywhere else after Gen IV. Still can't. I honestly can't really include the Mirage Caves in with the lore of the Unown because of how late in the series that came out, and they've made it clear OR/AS is like its own separate universe thanks to X/Y splitting the timeline because GameFreak can't do worldbuilding. Hell, lemme put on my tinfoil hat and say that the weapon AZ fired in X/Y that caused that timeline split killed or chased away the Unown in the Mega Evolution universe, which is why the Ultra Beasts exist. The Unown literally hold the Pokémon universe together, and if they disappear, everything collapses in on itself. So the Ultra Beasts stepped in, but are honest-to-Arceus alien to the Pokémon universe, and there's been that struggle to maintain that balance ever since. AZ's fit of rage really and truly nearly destroyed the Pokémon universe and brought about some eldritch horrors that should've never been.

But that's just a theory. That I literally made up just now because I happened to do a quick check-up on Pokémon locations and wondering why it is the Unown just stopped showing up in the wild after Gen IV. They totally could've appeared in Gen V if it hadn't been for the "NEW POKÉMON ONLY" rule for the main game, I'm sure of it. And yet they don't show up anywhere in Unova. (Nor Orre, but it's not really connected to the main series of games, and it's got connections to Celebi through the Relic Forest and it has Shadow Lugia so I'mma let it pass.)

Anyhoo:
Unown is one of my favorite Pokemon when it comes to lore. The fact that the Unown radio signal sound similar to the item used to summon Arceus makes for a neat 🤔 moment.

Oh shit, you're right. But maybe it's just a fun Easter egg since that was Gen IV and the Unown radio signal was Gen II. Although Unown were still involved in the Arceus egg event...

Just wish they could make Unown more viable in battle or have it so that when you catch them all it results in one of them evolving into a sphere of Unowns when put into some sort of ruined pedestal or something.
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Some kid in elementary made up a claim that the Unown are subservient to a giant eyeball Pokémon which (in hindsight) kinda looks like the Eye of the Beholder. But alas, they're nothing more than just the only threads holding the universe together, that's all.

God, I love the Unown. I had to come to love the lore around them over the years, but they're so freaking fascinating, an insight into what ancient Pokémon civilization was like. Johto might actually have the oldest remnants of an ancient people in canon since I don't think an exact dating of the Ruins of Alph has been given (my headcanon, fuck you, Galar), maybe holding the title with Sinnoh because of the Sinjoh Ruins. Like holy shit, I have to give it to GameFreak to manage to link the two generations together like that and make it feel natural.

The Unown are by far some of the creepiest Pokemon in the entire series, and they could've been way creepier. To cut a long story short, it's speculated that they were originally meant to be the victims of some kind of disaster that might've been a reference to the Hiroshima nuclear bombing.

I gotta say I'm highly skeptical it goes that far, but I have to admit, the fact that besides the Unown, Doduo, Ditto, and especially Sunflora are the only Pokemon that spawn in the beta version of the Ruins of Alph does make me think this theory has some merit to it.

Well fuck me, I hadn't heard of this. This is fucking creepypasta shit what the fuck. That's like up there with the theory the ruins in which you find Yamask in are meant to represent the Twin Towers. Except there may be actual merit here.

It's a very weird coincidence, but that's not the case at all; the Unown were originally intended to be aliens. The Hiroshima theory is interesting though, but I don't think GF would ever think of putting a reference to that in their game.

That's even weirder, but the "Pokémon came from space" angle has been around since the beginning so it's just a "Yeah, whatever man" moment for me. But if they were always meant to be serious about that, they should've been serious about that from the start and laid it out there for us, or reserved that notion for the really strange Pokémon instead of something... normal-looking like Clefairy and such (even though they have connections to the moon) to tease us with "Lol do Pogeymans come from space or not?". Honestly, it was probably a good thing the Unown got reworked into being basically the forces that manage to keep the universe in check since they live in a separate dimension and may have actually been Arceus' 1,000 hands.

Althoooooough to go back to the beta, maybe the destruction mural is meant to represent what happened with the relationship between humans and Pokémon. It's possible that the burning of the Brass Tower in Ecruteak wasn't unfounded and that some calamity happened throughout Johto that got humans and Pokémon angry with each other. Hence why the people built the Ruins of Alph as a way to ask for forgiveness for the Pokémon that live (or lived) there and then they abandoned the place. After all, as it says in Crystal:

Our words shall remain here for the ages.
Thus we shall erect a Pokémon statue outside.
They possess great insight and refuse the outside world.
We humans must learn to walk in harmony with them. We depart for their sakes.
(Actually the last two lines appear to be switched around, but as a kid, I solved the Ho-Oh puzzle last, so...)

Really makes you think.

I feel like Unown are some of the biggest wasted potential and show the problems with GameFreak's overall lack of imagination (as far as 'Mons go).

They have lore, and side materials show just how creepy they can be (the 3rd Pokemon movie being the best indicator of this), hell, even Super Smash Bros. Melee lets them be somewhat useful. But in the main games? Genuine joke characters. They only learn one move, said move being random as to when you catch it, they go down in one hit, you only get a worthless piece of paper for catching every form, and they don't evolve or change forms, even if you have a large group of them.

That's why I was so mad the Unown Dex side-thing turned out to be "Your reward? Printing stickers!" instead of something cool like the Unown coming together to be one entity or what.

The third movie I think is the Unown's only saving grace because they kept the mystery and awe-inspiring aspect when it came to Molly's wishes as well as hinting at the immense power they're believed to hold. That's why they're still memorable outside of the "What the hell was the Ruins of Alph???" people like to still talk about. It's one of the Pokémon lore mysteries that I think will never be answered, which I'm totally okay with.

Again, linking them to Arceus I think has done wonders in making them more mysterious as well as more sad that they've gone underutilized.
 
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Well fuck me, I hadn't heard of this. This is fucking creepypasta shit what the fuck. That's like up there with the theory the ruins in which you find Yamask in are meant to represent the Twin Towers. Except there may be actual merit here.
I think the idea that it's specifically referencing Hiroshima is bullshit, but I don't think the idea that it's referencing some kind of in-game nuclear disaster, or some other kind of disaster like that is out of the question. Mostly because the kinds of Pokemon you find there in the beta seem too deliberate to be coincidental-Sunflora itself being the key reason here. That just seems way too obvious and precise to just be a coincidence.
 
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I haven't played mystery dungeon outside of rescue team and explorers so I dunno if it was addressed in the others, but unown lore feels like something they could've used in that series since those games have the opportunity to be more lore focused than the main games. You know, like how they used quirky pokedex entries and incorporated them in these games like the ninetales legend, gardevoir sacrificing itself for its trainer and dusknoir being able to travel to altenate worlds.
 
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