Push to Require Clergy to Report Child Rape Stalls in Mormon Utah

A push to mandate members of religious clergy report child sexual abuse when it's brought to their attention is facing pushback from churches throughout the United States

By Associated Press

March 1, 2023, at 1:01 a.m.

SALT LAKE CITY (AP) — Lindsey Lundholm looked out over hundreds of people at the Utah State Capitol last year and felt a deep sense of healing. Abuse survivors, religious leaders and major party politicians were all gathered to rally for an end to a legal loophole that exempts religious clergy from being required to report child sexual abuse once it comes to their attention.

Lundholm, one of the rally's organizers, recalled telling the crowd how, growing up as a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in Idaho, she told her bishop about her painful abuse only to see it go unreported.

Unearthing the trauma wasn't easy, but back in August she hoped reforms could be forthcoming so others would not face what she did.

“There was really a lot of momentum," said Lundholm, now a teacher in northern Utah. “Everyone we were talking to was like, ‘This is a no brainer. This is something that needs to be changed.’”

It hasn't.

Proposals to reform laws that exempt clergy from child sex abuse reporting requirements went nowhere in Utah’s statehouse this year, failing to receive even a hearing as lawmakers prepare to adjourn for the year. Efforts were stymied by a coalition of powerful religious groups, continuing a yearslong pattern in which Catholics, Latter-day Saints and Jehovah’s Witnesses have defended the exemptions as survivors like Lundholm fight for reform.

In Utah, where the majority of lawmakers are members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, state law requires most professionals — therapists, doctors and teachers among them — report abuse, yet clergy are exempt from alerting authorities about abuse they learn of through confessions.

Republicans and Democrats announced plans last year to reform laws that exempt religious clergy from reporting child sexual abuse cases revealed in conversations with parishioners.

Behind-the-scenes conversations between legislative leaders in Utah and what Senate President Stuart Adams said was “a broad base of religious groups” helped thwart four separate proposals to add clergy to the list of professionals required to report child sexual abuse.

“I think they have First Amendment rights and religious protections,” Adams, a Latter-day Saint himself, said, noting fears among religious leaders that clergy could be punished for breaking vows of confidentiality.

Each proposal was introduced or announced after an Associated Press investigation found that the Utah-based Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints' sexual abuse reporting hotline can be misused by its leaders to divert abuse accusations away from law enforcement and instead to church attorneys who may bury the problem, leaving victims in harm’s way.

In lawsuits detailed in the investigation, attorneys from the faith widely known as the Mormon church have argued clergy-penitent privilege allows them to refuse to answer questions and turn over documents about alleged sexual abuse.

Church officials declined to comment about the stalled legislative efforts. The Catholic Diocese of Salt Lake City did not respond to requests for comment but campaigned against them, saying in January that priests and clergy were different from other professionals mandated to report sexual abuse.

“Legislation that would require a priest to (report sexual abuse) violates our right to practice our religion,” Bishop Oscar Solis, of the Salt Lake City Diocese, wrote in a Jan. 25 letter to parishioners.

Utah Gov. Spencer Cox last month said he “had no problem with the bills moving forward” and receiving consideration in the statehouse.

“I think it’s an important conversation to have. We’ve encouraged the Legislature to look at this and make sure that our model is the right model,” he told reporters.

Marci Hamilton, chief executive of the abuse prevention nonprofit Child USA, said churches have maintained the same playbook for decades in opposing more disclosure.

Routinely it involves a two-pronged approach, defending clergy-penitent privilege in statehouses and using it to avoid damaging disclosures in court cases, said Hamilton, also a University of Pennsylvania law professor.

"They have not veered from it. Both institutions are hoping that time will simply let everybody start trusting them again," Hamilton said, referring to Catholics and Latter-day Saints.

But, she added, "by preventing the public — and especially the sincere believers — from getting the full story you don’t create the accountability that these organizations should be held to and the secrets continue.”

“The problem in the United States — and this is particularly acute in state like Utah — is that the lobbying power of these religious organizations is so extraordinary,” Hamilton said.

Laws in 33 states exempt clergy — regardless of religion — from laws requiring people report child sexual abuse allegations to authorities. Religious leaders have systematically fought efforts to expand the list of states. They currently oppose efforts from Vermont to Washington, where a proposal advanced through the state Senate Tuesday.

Kansas lawmakers introduced multiple proposals on penalties for not reporting suspected child sexual abuse, including one in the state Senate that would have added clergy to a list of mandatory reporters. It faced especially fierce public rebukes from Catholic leaders because it didn’t exempt confessions. No proposal received even a hearing before an initial deadline this year.

In the wake of the AP's investigation last year, Republican state Rep. Phil Lyman and Democratic Rep. Angela Romero announced plans to reform Utah's clergy-penitent privilege loophole. Lyman, who served six years as a Latter-day Saints' bishop, said at the time lawmakers should want to reexamine the loophole “regardless of religious or political affiliation.”

“People should be able to go and confess their sins to their bishop without fear of being prosecuted up until when they are confessing something that has affected someone’s else life significantly,” he told the AP in August.

Lyman ultimately released a proposal that broadly affirmed clergy's exemption from mandatory reporting. It didn't advance or receive any hearing as lawmakers prepare to adjourn Friday. He did not respond to repeated requests for comment.

Proposals from Democratic Reps. Romero and Brian King, and Sen. Stephanie Pitcher to close or narrow the loophole have also not moved forward amid opposition from religious groups.

Both Pitcher and Romero, who is Catholic, said they planned to reintroduce their proposals next year.

“With AP uncovering what they uncovered, you'd think this would be a matter of urgency for this Legislature and for Legislatures across the country. But again we are allowing these institutions to dictate what we mandate,” Romero said, referring to the Catholic Church.

Several Utah lawmakers told AP that opponents of limiting clergy-penitent privilege regarding child sexual abuse had circulated research that they claimed suggests mandatory reporting reform doesn't result in more confirmed reports of sexual abuse and may deter perpetrators from speaking to clergy.

“What most of the research shows is that if people aren’t able to come to them for fear of being reported on, they’re not able to provide the help and support they need,” Sen. Ann Milner said.

However, conclusions drawn from the study, which the Catholic Diocese also circulated in opposition to a similar bill from Romero in three years ago, have been challenged by its authors.

University of Michigan law professor Frank Vandervort and his co-author, Vincent Palusci, a pediatrics professor at New York University, told the AP last year the study was limited, partly because churches often wouldn’t give them access to relevant data.
“A single article should not be the basis for making policy decisions,” Vandervort said. “It may be entirely the case that there’s no connection between the changing of the laws and the number of reports.”

Lundholm said Utah lawmakers adjourning without having a “true public discussion” on any clergy-penitent privilege reform proposal provoked eerily familiar feelings for survivors. Though she never expected political change to happen overnight, she said survivors like her who had abuse go unreported — once again — feel unheard.

“Maybe the worst part is that this is something that survivors experience often, and unfortunately, it’s rare when their stories are heard,” she said.
___
The story has been updated to correct the spelling of the first name of Lindsey Lundholm.
___
Associated Press writers Joey Cappelletti in Lansing, Michigan, and John Hanna in Topeka, Kansas, contributed to this report.
Copyright 2023 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
 
They do, but this is besides the point. We're not talking about absolution-- we're talking about the confessional seal wherein they have to hear that the penitent committed a crime in the first place before they do anything else.
I thought confession and absolution happened in the same sitting? The priest hears the confession, then he assigns you a penance to be completed on your own time, and then the priest delivers sacramental forgiveness. So essentially you're forgiven on the spot, as long as you do your penance.

I'm only vaguely familiar with the catholic confession though, I guess the process is different for mormons?

I guess my point is.... priests/church leaders need to be ruthless towards self-confessed rapists. These are not the people you should want to protect, or keep around in your parish. Don't forgive people who don't have any remorse for their crimes. Banish them.

Priests have the power to hold rapists accountable. There's so much they could be doing to protect the most vulnerable of their congregation (children) from the most heinous of crimes (rape). Why aren't they doing these things?
 
I thought confession and absolution happened in the same sitting? The priest hears the confession, then he assigns you a penance to be completed on your own time, and then the priest delivers sacramental forgiveness.
I think you're confused about the thread topic.

This is about priests being compelled to speak about what's told to them in a confession session to others (specifically, legal authorities). The matter of whether they administer the sacrament of absolution for someone who confesses crimes to them has no bearing on this matter.
 
Pretneding liket his is the only or likley scenairo is dumb. Here are some other ones;

1) Pedo feels guilty and confessed to priest.
2) Preist forgives him.
3) Pedo gets urge to molest again and more children are victimized.
I never said it was the only scenario, but it is one you brought up.

Here's another one:

1) Child who looks up to priest as someone that can help them tells priest about the sexual abuse.
2) Priest does nothing.
3) Child ends up dead or continues to be abused after feeling helpless.
This is literally my scenario, just with a possible dead child.

Like I said the fact, you need a law to make this happen is patheitc.
Except your law doesn't make priests do anything. It's solely dependent on proving the priest had information of the acts , did nothing about them and having a willing prosecutor ignore other cases for what? A fine in all likelihood.

My assumption is that priest are bad people just trying to play a role then and are more concerned with avoiding controversy to protect a hierarchy than helping people.
And that's simply because you have a problem with Christians and seek to give others a cudgel by which to beat them over the head with.
 
  • Mad at the Internet
Reactions: Mothra1988
Oh no, someone's dog died, their feeling down, quick, get the feds, pump him full of meds!
>let's change the subject from protecting child rapists to something else, I'm totally winning this argument

Seven pages of spergs defending kiddy diddlin' confidentiality and internet sticker slap fights :story:
Sad ain't it? I thought the baseline of acceptable human behavior was raping children not being acceptable, but apparently not for these spergs claiming to be religious.
 
You know what, instead of making things up about whole groups of people, why don't we do a bit of digging. I grew up in the church, I just suck as a person and haven't been in a long time (years), I've met good and not-so-good people inside and outside, and I really hate lies and deceit, especially when it comes to protecting children. There are policies for it, let's look it up.

Their official church website, quick search
General Handbook is one of the manuals that they have leaders follow
Let's check what it says about abuse
38.6.2

Abuse​

Abuse is the mistreatment or neglect of others in a way that causes physical, sexual, emotional, or financial harm. The Church’s position is that abuse cannot be tolerated in any form. Those who abuse their spouses, children, other family members, or anyone else violate the laws of God and man.

All members, especially parents and leaders, are encouraged to be alert and diligent and do all they can to protect children and others against abuse. If members become aware of instances of abuse, they report it to civil authorities and counsel with the bishop. Church leaders should take reports of abuse seriously and never disregard them.

All adults who work with children or youth are to complete children and youth protection training within one month of being sustained (see ProtectingChildren.ChurchofJesusChrist.org). They are to repeat the training every three years.

When abuse occurs, the first and immediate responsibility of Church leaders is to help those who have been abused and to protect vulnerable persons from future abuse. Leaders should not encourage a person to remain in a home or situation that is abusive or unsafe.
That hyperlink has more info about what anyone in charge of taking care of youth and children are supposed to do

When inappropriate behavior or abuse happens, you should act promptly to protect the child or youth.​

U.S. and Canada

If you learn of abuse, you should immediately contact legal authorities. You should also counsel with your bishop or stake president, who will call the abuse help line for guidance in helping victims and meeting reporting requirements.

Countries outside of the U.S. and Canada

Learn how and when you should report abuse. In most countries, you will immediately need to contact legal authorities. Counsel with your bishop or stake president for direction. If the abuse help line is not available in your country, the bishop will counsel with the stake president and area office to learn the proper process for reporting abuse and protecting the person that was abused.

Children and youth who have been abused need kind, caring attention from inspired Church leaders, family members, and others, including trained professionals, who can help them overcome the destructive effects of abuse. The healing power of the Savior Jesus Christ will ease burdens and provide strength to overcome adversity.

Please view the Frequently Asked Questions below for more information about this online training module and about how to prevent and respond to abuse in your calling.

My opinion: pedophiles should be removed from society, if death is the most appropriate way, so be it. People who abuse their authority and exercise unrighteous dominion are some of the biggest sinners. If someone was negligent in their handling of information provided by a victim, woe unto them, especially if it enabled further abuse.

It's almost like people who hate Mormons for whatever reason like to make up narratives about them. Who'd have thought.
 
I can't think of anyone who would type this setence other than a pedophile. Stay way from kids please. Also I'm pretty sure covering for a child rapist who will likely continue victimizing that child is a bigger sin than a priest breaking some technical rule regarding a Catholic sacrament. You people are absolute lunatics.

You do understand that the argument isn't that priests shouldn't say anything anywhere to anyone? If a priest has a reason to suspect abuse is ongoing then he has ways of reporting it anonymously and the police can then investigate the matter on their own.

The argument is that priests cannot be forced to go to the police with every crime they hear about, because that will turn the priests into a de-facto wing of the police, and people will simply stop trusting the priests to keep anything they say a secret, which is the point of confessional to begin with - a safe place to admit to your sins and transgressions and receive absolution.

Yeah it sucks when kids get molested. I'm not in favor of tearing down centuries old traditions over the possibility that maybe it will put a few more molestors in jail, the same way I'm not in favor of banning guns because maybe it will keep a few kids a year from getting shot by a school shooter. Because:

1. That's not a solution addressing the root problem, it's a solution addressing a symptom
2. The "solution" takes away something from the 99% of people who don't commit crimes in order to address the 1% that do.
 
Seven pages of spergs defending kiddy diddlin' confidentiality and internet sticker slap fights :story:
The trouble is more with mandatory reporting, which as I mentioned previously, has considerable evidence pointing to said policy causing more harm than good. A shock to some people here, but nobody's advocating for child rape, but debating which policy helps the best.

Well, I say debating, but Mothra is just mad over stickers and calling everyone a pedophile.
 
Why are you so mad about stickers? I literally explained my position in the post you took said quote from. I presume you being a woman (or, more likely, a "woman") doesn't prevent you from reading.
No but she's a retard, so that does prevent her from reading.

She's going to bitch about pedophiles but then when you ask if she's a pedophile she'll deflect 24/7. It's pretty funny to watch.
Oh wait she's mad about stickers?
 
Why are you so mad about stickers? I literally explained my position in the post you took said quote from. I presume you being a woman (or, more likely, a "woman") doesn't prevent you from reading.
How about you stop saying child molestation should not be reported, faggot? I'm not reading the files from your the pedo-defense folder on your hard drive next to the others ones. Child molestation should always be reported. Simple as that. If you are against that, I question your motives. You're not even using the religious freedom of scumbag priests as cover as the other people are. You're just chimping out at the idea it should be reported, and no I'm not taking the bait by clicking on your pedo-defense links.

No but she's a retard, so that does prevent her from reading.

She's going to bitch about pedophiles but then when you ask if she's a pedophile she'll deflect 24/7. It's pretty funny to watch.
Oh wait she's mad about stickers?
>thread is full of grown men mad at me saying child molestation should be reported in all cases for fucking 7 pages like a NAMBLA convention (this could have been simple and stopped at page 1 if some people here didn't want to defend child molesters so bad)
>no u
Yeah, that's not going to work. Stay mad, you sperg.

No but she's a retard, so that does prevent her from reading.

She's going to bitch about pedophiles but then when you ask if she's a pedophile she'll deflect 24/7. It's pretty funny to watch.
Oh wait she's mad about stickers?
BTW, if you don't think this guy is MATI about this thread saying child molesters should be reported to the police, check this out. He literally did this all in one setting after I noticed I had a bazillion new alerts:

mati.png

Imagine being this mad about a law being introduced to stop children from being molested.
 
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BTW, if you don't think this guy is MATI about this thread saying child molesters should be reported to the police, check this out. He literally did this all in one setting after I noticed I had a bazillion new alerts:

View attachment 4700245

Imagine being this mad about a law being introduced to stop children from being molested.
>Still mad about puzzle pieces
>Still pushing a policy that promotes child rape

1677975128886.png
 
>Still mad about puzzle pieces
>Still pushing a policy that promotes child rape

View attachment 4700458
>reporting child rape to the police promotes child rape
Sure thing, pedo.

wow she really is mad at negrates.
Double posted AND bitched at my profile.
While ignoring that some retard did the same exact thing. Lmao.

woman moment.
>literally spends hours giving a wall of negrates
mati.png
>durr you're mad at negrates I'm not mati
I understand that it's hard to get a job after being convicted for child abuse, but don't you have something better to do then obsess over me saying child sexual abuse should be reported? lol
 
>literally spends hours giving a wall of negrates
View attachment 4700503
>durr you're mad at negrates I'm not mati
I understand that its' hard to get a job after being convicted for child abuse, but don't you have something better to do then obsess over me saying child sexual abuse should be reported? lol
Hours?
Holy shit you didn't even notice it took two minutes. Imagine being so butthurt you didn't even pay attention to the source of the butthurt. lmao.
You are a fucking retard. No wonder you think blaming other retards for kiddie diddling totally doesn't look like projection.

Is this another vaunted femcel overly worrying about other people's sex life? Good lord you people are numerous.

Also imagine thinking you can continue debating about kiddie didddling after being ousted as an autist, and being surprised no one wants to 'debate' with you. Is this why you haven't gotten laid?
 
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