Singular They. - Is it political? It feels political.

[Overly Serious]

So this has been brewing with me for a while. To get it out of the way, Singular They has existed for sometime but formerly it was used exclusively for unknowns. "Someone killed my cat. They just left the body on my doorstep". If you actually knew the sex of the individual you would always use that. This was derived from the fact that you'd also use "they" when it could be plural. "I was robbed. They took everything". Might be one individual but you use "they" because it's an unknown.

What I see now is a rising tide of it used as the default supplanting he/she. And 'their' supplanting 'his/her'.

One factor in this might just be the simplification of language. If you remove gender from language it becomes simpler. It also conveys less information. And it also feels like it has cultural impact as well further promoting the values of those who would erase biological differences from culture.

I just got tipped over into being annoyed enough about the phenomenon to make this post by someone using "them" to refer to someone they know is a single female individual. There is no reason not have used 'her' in the sentence beyond either some ideological wave or just because its become overwhelmingly familiar to the poster.

I'm trying to figure out why I see language shifting this way so much and so raplidly, and equally how it can be pushed back against. I'll probably post more when I've thought about this in depth but wanted to see what other people think. It feels almost like the English language is being dumbed down on so many fronts these days. I can't say exactly why this bothers me so viscerally, but it does and I feel part of that is because I feel intuitively that the drivers of the change are not ones I would like.

 

[sum ting wong]

I have also noticed a similar trend recently in youtube videos, although to me it feels more like people are going out of their way to avoid saying he/him rather than specifically saying they/them.

In my opinion the change is happening because of years of "woke/SJW/whatever you want to label it" programming has had an impact and now the over-socialized people in society are hyper aware that you can't just say "hey guys" and instead need to go "guys, gals, and nonbinary folx" or some shit. Or if they're talking about a hypothetical doctor you can't just assume it's a male doctor because that's sexist so they use they/them or she/her.

I can't say exactly why this bothers me so viscerally, but it does and I feel part of that is because I feel intuitively that the drivers of the change are not ones I would like.

I feel the same way and I think it's because it feels like such an unnatural/forced change.

 

[Larry David's Opera Cape]

I just got tipped over into being annoyed enough about the phenomenon to make this post by someone using "them" to refer to someone they know is a single female individual. There is no reason not have used 'her' in the sentence beyond either some ideological wave or just because its become overwhelmingly familiar to the poster.

I see mostly 20-30 something young women doing this and it sets my teeth on edge every time. They also do it when referring to animals whose sex they know and that also bothers me. I just told you my dog's name is Susan. Stop saying "aww I love themmmmm."

(My dog is not named Susan. My dog's name is Janelle.)

 

[Calvin Gabriel]

For me as a non-native speaker it's extremely annoying.

It confuses me when the speaker uses 'he' or 'she' in one sentence only to change it up with 'they' in the next one or when he speaks of two people, man and woman, and suddenly decides to refer to one or the other as 'they'.

I then have to jump out of my "reading on autopilot" mode and think about the context of the pronoun to derive which person was being addressed.

As to why it's happening, I think it's due to the fairly obvious SJW explanation.

 

["Controlled Demolition"]

I twitch every time I hear someone say "pregnant people" or "pregnant person".
Nigger, it's pregnant woman.

Fortunately, I think this is largely contained to the internet-connected anglosphere. The internet and big cities. The trend may pass entirely before it spreads farther into common parlance.

 

[Overly Serious]

I twitch every time I hear someone say "pregnant people" or "pregnant person".
Nigger, it's pregnant woman.

Fortunately, I think this is largely contained to the internet-connected anglosphere. The internet and big cities. The trend may pass entirely before it spreads farther into common parlance.

Eh, I'm not optimistic of it passing by itself. I think it needs active politicisation and pushback. The comment that tipped me over to making this post was one here on the Farms itself. I see it growing currently.

 

[Chongqing]

I'll say this:

They is a word.
Them is a word.
Themselves is a word.
Themself is not a word.

Case closed.

Make your own language to butcher, trannies.

 

[Miriam Margoyles]

can't just say "hey guys" and instead need to go "guys, gals, and nonbinary folx" or some shit.

Ah, yes, my cue to immediately close the YouTube video.

 

[SSj_Ness (Yiffed)]

It's LGBT propaganda, same reason that video games don't use male/female anymore but rather body type A/B.

 

[Rango Dango]

yeah, standupmaths (great guy btw) does the same thing, in a video about divisibility rules he referred to vsauce as they
jacksfilms does the same thing too
makes me a lil bit MATI ngl

"guys, gals, and nonbinary folx"

i used to like "hello ladies, gentlemen and everything inbetween" because back then it was a silly funny thing, maybe referencing your pets
now it's used unironically and i dont like it

 

[Miriam Margoyles]

Sorry to get off-topic, but this thread has made me think of another subtle Current Year thing about language - particularly written language - now, that I find genuinely insidious and think is almost certainly political in nature. When referring to race, the convention is that Black is now capitalised in standard English, but white is not. There has been no adequately explained reason for this - I have heard people claim that it is to differentiate dark-skinned people of African descent from the colour black, but that seems like something that would be obvious from context anyway, and doesn't explain why you wouldn't also do the same thing for 'white'.

Why is one word capitalised and not the other?

If you ask me, the only time that 'Black' should be capitalised is when the word is either at the beginning of a sentence, or if it is somebody's surname.

i used to like "hello ladies, gentlemen and everything inbetween" because back then it was a silly funny thing, maybe referencing your pets now it's used unironically and i dont like it

Back in 2010, this was just a funny joke for a movie trailer.
Just six years later, this was how people were unironically speaking.

 

[Internet Wizard]

When referring to race, the convention is that Black is now capitalised in standard English, but white is not

I've heard this before, but I've genuinely never seen it used this way in any professional or serious setting. It mostly seems like a BNWO larp to me by black guys on Xitter
I and others ik capitalize any race, but Black usually refers to African-Americans specifically (in a us context duh) White refers to whatever 56% mystery meat White Americans fall under

 

[Miriam Margoyles]

I've heard this before, but I've genuinely never seen it used this way in any professional or serious setting. It mostly seems like a BNWO larp to me by black guys on Xitter

I regret to inform you that it is now standard operating procedure in most mainstream newspapers and news outlets.

 

[regalterry]

The rise of its use is because a tranny will absolutely throw an epic tantrum and make your life a living Hell for daring to not acquiesce to his insanity, while normal people will either frown in confusion or scoff in annoyance.

It's mostly a question of cost vs benefit for most people.

I recently tried playing Outer Worlds and had to give up because the constant use of "they" for every single character gave me a genuine headache. No language on this planet was designed for tranny nonsense.

 

[The Last Stand]

I like to use the singular “they” to indicate unknown entities. For instance, I’d say the plumber said they’ll be here shortly. The contractor, the company. Gender neutrality and all that jazz.

 

[SIMIΔN]

I see mostly 20-30 something young women doing this and it sets my teeth on edge every time. They also do it when referring to animals whose sex they know and that also bothers me. I just told you my dog's name is Susan. Stop saying "aww I love themmmmm."
(My dog is not named Susan. My dog's name is Janelle.)

I used to call my cat her, but when my housemate fed it chocolate, I started refering to the cute bundle of joy as 'it', just so I didn't accidentally give it human food.

Sorry to get off-topic, but this thread has made me think of another subtle Current Year thing about language - particularly written language - now, that I find genuinely insidious and think is almost certainly political in nature. When referring to race, the convention is that Black is now capitalised in standard English, but white is not. There has been no adequately explained reason for this - I have heard people claim that it is to differentiate dark-skinned people of African descent from the colour black, but that seems like something that would be obvious from context anyway, and doesn't explain why you wouldn't also do the same thing for 'white'.

I think either cowardly compliance, bigotry or maybe a font issue.
B is ~60 to 80% the width of W ,
WB WB WB WB WB WB WB WB
Then again, if they really thought page width matters, they'd write 3-letter Nog instead of 5-letter Black.

 

[Slap47]

I twitch every time I hear someone say "pregnant people" or "pregnant person".
Nigger, it's pregnant woman.

Fortunately, I think this is largely contained to the internet-connected anglosphere. The internet and big cities. The trend may pass entirely before it spreads farther into common parlance.

Unfortunately you are wrong. Medical journals and governments do this as a matter of policy. People in hospitals are required to speak like this.

 

[PhoBingas]

As to why it's happening, I think it's due to the fairly obvious SJW explanation.

I think rachet hoodspeak might be a contributing factor too. Shaniquas have been saying stuff like "I gotta get my chillin they dinner." for 100 years or more.

 

[Overly Serious]

I've heard this before, but I've genuinely never seen it used this way in any professional or serious setting. It mostly seems like a BNWO larp to me by black guys on Xitter
I and others ik capitalize any race, but Black usually refers to African-Americans specifically (in a us context duh) White refers to whatever 56% mystery meat White Americans fall under

I think properly speaking both should be capitalised. Same we capitalise Chinese, English, Asian, etc. Not because Black and White are nationalities but just because it's all along the same principles. In any case, they should certainly both be the same grammatically. However, unlike you I have seen it deliberately handled inconsistently in published articles. And the rationale I have heard given is that Black has a cultural identity but White does not. An obviously flawed piece of reasoning and also very biased towards the culture of the people who came up with it. But then propaganda usually is.

 

[Lurkey Turkey]

It's been going on for years. One of their arguments is that "singular they has existed since medieval times!!" Ignoring that anyone over 30 today knows full well this was only used for unknowns until a few years ago. Then, if you say that, out comes "language changes!!" You know, like all throughout history, how a handful of whiny assholes would unilaterally decide English works this way now?

TLDR, it's Orwellian bullshit. Don't use it.