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Okay serious hat time. I need a chat software the Kiwi Farms mods can use.

I've never done this before. Contrary to popular belief I don't even have the majority of staff on any kind of app like Signal. Basically all mod discussion takes place on the forum itself.

This is a problem now because I'm implementing emergency reports, and I need to make sure that mods see the emergency reports. I could send emails but I figure notifications would work better.

Normally people would just use Discord but I absolutely despise Discord. My wishlist for this is like:

  • Bot API
  • E2EE
  • Group chats
  • Multiple rooms with permissions
  • Nice app that people will actually use and pay attention to.
  • Resilient (i.e. if my shit goes down we can still talk)

Looked at: Wire (poor bot APIJ)
Considering: XMPP, Matrix, Rocket Chat

XMPP is something I use to talk to the few people from the forum I do talk to, but individually 1-on-1. They're all privacy nuts. The one group chat I am a part of on XMPP sucks and I pay no attention to.
MATRIX and Rocket Chat both have to be self-hosted. Matrix's group chat E2EE had problems IIRC. Matrix had other issues IIRC. Their foundation also hates us.

IIRC there's Session but I don't remember that having group chats with permissions, I don't see how that could work.

There's also SimpleX which the dev reached out to me about but I think it's a very new project.

Edit: There's also Threema Work. I'm willing to pay for something that's bulletproof and that my mods want to actually use. We have income now for good stuff.

Do you have other suggestions? Discuss.
 
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Null said:
Do you have other suggestions? Discuss.
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I recommend against rocket chat on account of having tried it and not liked it. Same for matrix. Just very poor quality experiences that dont work well.

I was thinking about ejabberd (xmpp based) based on the feature list and so forth but haven't tried it yet as it needs a lot of RAM and the box I was going to put it on isnt racked yet
 
Null said:
Okay serious hat time. I need a chat software the Kiwi Farms mods can use.

I've never done this before. Contrary to popular belief I don't even have the majority of staff on any kind of app like Signal. Basically all mod discussion takes place on the forum itself.

This is a problem now because I'm implementing emergency reports, and I need to make sure that mods see the emergency reports. I could send emails but I figure notifications would work better.

Normally people would just use Discord but I absolutely despise Discord. My wishlist for this is like:

  • Bot API
  • E2EE
  • Group chats
  • Multiple rooms with permissions
  • Nice app that people will actually use and pay attention to.
  • Resilient (i.e. if my shit goes down we can still talk)

Looked at: Wire (poor bot APIJ)
Considering: XMPP, Matrix, Rocket Chat

XMPP is something I use to talk to the few people from the forum I do talk to, but individually 1-on-1. They're all privacy nuts. The one group chat I am a part of on XMPP sucks and I pay no attention to.
MATRIX and Rocket Chat both have to be self-hosted. Matrix's group chat E2EE had problems IIRC. Matrix had other issues IIRC. Their foundation also hates us.

IIRC there's Session but I don't remember that having group chats with permissions, I don't see how that could work.

There's also SimpleX which the dev reached out to me about but I think it's a very new project.

Edit: There's also Threema Work. I'm willing to pay for something that's bulletproof and that my mods want to actually use. We have income now for good stuff.

Do you have other suggestions? Discuss.
Click to expand...
matrix is pretty good from when I used it back when you recommended it on mati that one time, just make a mod thread on how to use it and join the mod group chat to retard proof it
otherwise idk use smoke signals or some shit heard it worked for donga
 
Null said:
Okay serious hat time. I need a chat software the Kiwi Farms mods can use.

I've never done this before. Contrary to popular belief I don't even have the majority of staff on any kind of app like Signal. Basically all mod discussion takes place on the forum itself.

This is a problem now because I'm implementing emergency reports, and I need to make sure that mods see the emergency reports. I could send emails but I figure notifications would work better.

Normally people would just use Discord but I absolutely despise Discord. My wishlist for this is like:

  • Bot API
  • E2EE
  • Group chats
  • Multiple rooms with permissions
  • Nice app that people will actually use and pay attention to.
  • Resilient (i.e. if my shit goes down we can still talk)

Looked at: Wire (poor bot APIJ)
Considering: XMPP, Matrix, Rocket Chat

XMPP is something I use to talk to the few people from the forum I do talk to, but individually 1-on-1. They're all privacy nuts. The one group chat I am a part of on XMPP sucks and I pay no attention to.
MATRIX and Rocket Chat both have to be self-hosted. Matrix's group chat E2EE had problems IIRC. Matrix had other issues IIRC. Their foundation also hates us.

IIRC there's Session but I don't remember that having group chats with permissions, I don't see how that could work.

There's also SimpleX which the dev reached out to me about but I think it's a very new project.

Edit: There's also Threema Work. I'm willing to pay for something that's bulletproof and that my mods want to actually use. We have income now for good stuff.

Do you have other suggestions? Discuss.
Click to expand...
Have you heard about GNU jami?

It has all the features you requested and is P2P by nature (but you can deploy a cetralized identity server called JAMS)
 
Maybe a combination of email and a pager system over SMS.
Perhaps for privacy you could give mods actual 3G/GSM pagers that play a 1 second long theme bitcrunched song clip on a tiny shitty speaker.
 
Null said:
Looked at: Wire (poor bot APIJ)
Considering: XMPP, Matrix, Rocket Chat
Click to expand...
You do not have the time or energy to expend setting up matrix to be usable to your standards. With the right effort and getting everyone really on board agreeing to put work in and accept certain concessions it can be great but I think you know how that herd of cats goes. You can use it for barebones text communication easily enough if you’re satisfied with that but I think you more than anyone appreciate the capriciousness of end users wanting a cushy familiar easy to use and install solution. Your active mod staff is going to naturally be more willing to move through friction by virtue of being jannies on this place but like a lot of free-er systems there definitely is friction that you don’t get on pozzed platforms like discord that are going to frustrate your intended users. And with everything they already have to deal with the little extra annoyances do stack up and make for a less effective workforce.

If you can find some trusted autist to set it up and manage it for you I’d go ahead but please do not try yourself, you’ve got too much already.
 
Null said:
Okay serious hat time. I need a chat software the Kiwi Farms mods can use.

I've never done this before. Contrary to popular belief I don't even have the majority of staff on any kind of app like Signal. Basically all mod discussion takes place on the forum itself.

This is a problem now because I'm implementing emergency reports, and I need to make sure that mods see the emergency reports. I could send emails but I figure notifications would work better.

Normally people would just use Discord but I absolutely despise Discord. My wishlist for this is like:

  • Bot API
  • E2EE
  • Group chats
  • Multiple rooms with permissions
  • Nice app that people will actually use and pay attention to.
  • Resilient (i.e. if my shit goes down we can still talk)

Looked at: Wire (poor bot APIJ)
Considering: XMPP, Matrix, Rocket Chat

XMPP is something I use to talk to the few people from the forum I do talk to, but individually 1-on-1. They're all privacy nuts. The one group chat I am a part of on XMPP sucks and I pay no attention to.
MATRIX and Rocket Chat both have to be self-hosted. Matrix's group chat E2EE had problems IIRC. Matrix had other issues IIRC. Their foundation also hates us.

IIRC there's Session but I don't remember that having group chats with permissions, I don't see how that could work.

There's also SimpleX which the dev reached out to me about but I think it's a very new project.

Edit: There's also Threema Work. I'm willing to pay for something that's bulletproof and that my mods want to actually use. We have income now for good stuff.

Do you have other suggestions? Discuss.
Click to expand...
Would you consider Teamspeak 6? The group chats are apparently literally just Matrix group chats, and the UI is basically a Discord clone these days.

No idea if it has bot support, it was bare bones last time I used it
 
Sirius said:
I installed a LineageOS-based GSI (generic system image) on a cheap Motorola I bought and am very impressed with it so far. Currently on my way to getting 20 hours of active use/screen-on time out of a single charge, while the stock firmware only gave me 12-14. What's weird is that this particular phone has a MediaTek chipset, which are supposed to be bad on ROMs.
View attachment 8181032
View attachment 8181033


Do note though that GSIs vary from device to device, my phone doesn't have any tailored ROMs for it so I'm forced to use one. Also I really like microG; it provides Google services without the associated battery drain and datamining.
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I'm wondering if i can use this on my tablet. I don't have a reason to do it just yet but maybe
 
Null said:
Okay serious hat time. I need a chat software the Kiwi Farms mods can use.

I've never done this before. Contrary to popular belief I don't even have the majority of staff on any kind of app like Signal. Basically all mod discussion takes place on the forum itself.

This is a problem now because I'm implementing emergency reports, and I need to make sure that mods see the emergency reports. I could send emails but I figure notifications would work better.

Normally people would just use Discord but I absolutely despise Discord. My wishlist for this is like:

  • Bot API
  • E2EE
  • Group chats
  • Multiple rooms with permissions
  • Nice app that people will actually use and pay attention to.
  • Resilient (i.e. if my shit goes down we can still talk)

Looked at: Wire (poor bot APIJ)
Considering: XMPP, Matrix, Rocket Chat

XMPP is something I use to talk to the few people from the forum I do talk to, but individually 1-on-1. They're all privacy nuts. The one group chat I am a part of on XMPP sucks and I pay no attention to.
MATRIX and Rocket Chat both have to be self-hosted. Matrix's group chat E2EE had problems IIRC. Matrix had other issues IIRC. Their foundation also hates us.

IIRC there's Session but I don't remember that having group chats with permissions, I don't see how that could work.

There's also SimpleX which the dev reached out to me about but I think it's a very new project.

Edit: There's also Threema Work. I'm willing to pay for something that's bulletproof and that my mods want to actually use. We have income now for good stuff.

Do you have other suggestions? Discuss.
Click to expand...
Are you opposed to Telegram for this? Their bot api is really well documented and easy to use even with multi-room groups. Probably some mods already have it on their phone and could just turn notis on.
 
Null said:
Do you have other suggestions? Discuss.
Click to expand...
You can implement XMPP or several other chat programs and use a software bridge/bot to forward messages back and forth from Discord or many other chat programs.

This essentially means you can use XMPP or whatever program as the root layer where your bots put reports/links and discussion happens but people can elect to access the messages and engage from other platforms that they think are more suitable without it even mattering or people realizing.

Example: https://matrix.org/ecosystem/bridges/discord/

You can also do this with IRC but its more annoying since you have to host an IRC server.

This is a very penultimate idea since some people have a preferred chat program that they already have on their phone/device that they use for notifications and instead of them having to fuck around with the hellhole that is XMPP they can just stay on Discord or whatever they use.

edit: Telegram and some of the other suggestions are annoying because you require a mobile number and its tied to that - you can't just register with an OTP, you actually have to have your phone number connected and you can only have one account. For that reason some people will not like to use Telegram.

Null said:
MATRIX and Rocket Chat both have to be self-hosted. Matrix's group chat E2EE had problems IIRC. Matrix had other issues IIRC. Their foundation also hates us.
Click to expand...
Matrix does not have to be self-hosted: https://servers.joinmatrix.org/
Just join a large public server, create a channel, make it private and don't tell anyone what it is.

Read DMs off-site, I sent you a solid idea that will solve everything and is very penultimate style if I do say so myself.
 
Mergers and Acquisitions said:
Are you opposed to Telegram for this? Their bot api is really well documented and easy to use even with multi-room groups. Probably some mods already have it on their phone and could just turn notis on.
Click to expand...
Yes. Telegram is absolutely fucking awful. I despise literally everything about it.
 
Null said:
IIRC there's Session but I don't remember that having group chats with permissions, I don't see how that could work.
Click to expand...
Session is nice for short 1 on 1 conversations but I would not recommend session for longer term communication. Due to everything being routed trough TOR group chats come with race conditions out of the box, this makes any real time chatting a nightmare lol.
 
Null said:
Considering: XMPP, Matrix, Rocket Chat
Click to expand...
XMPP is cool and there's a decent selection of clients to choose from. For phonefags the XEP for push notifications is still experimental but some clients support it.

Prosody is what I'd recommend for an XMPP server since it's very simple to setup, lightweight and would have no problem supporting a few dozen clients connected 24x7. They've just implemented support for push notifications in the latest major release.

Here's the list of modules

Caveat is that your ability to communicate is dependent on you keeping Prosody running, but the benefit is having total control over who can access it, no personal data needs to be shared, and there's no risk of getting banned thanks to some faggot tranny.
Null said:
  • Bot API
  • E2EE
  • Group chats
  • Multiple rooms with permissions
  • Nice app that people will actually use and pay attention to.
  • Resilient (i.e. if my shit goes down we can still talk)
Click to expand...
Bot API - Use an XMPP SDK
E2EE - OMEMO
Group Chats / Multiple Rooms - Called MUCs, https://prosody.im/doc/modules/mod_muc
Nice App - Official client list https://xmpp.org/software/?category=clients
Resilient - Just don't host it on the Kiwi Farms shit and you'll probably be fine
 
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Null said:
This site is very thorough and has many suggestions.

Best Privacy Tools & Software Guide in in 2023

The most reliable website for privacy tools since 2015. Software, services, apps and privacy guides to fight surveillance with encryption for better internet privacy.
www.privacytools.io www.privacytools.io
Click to expand...
Do not use Privacy-Tools. It use to be good before the site owner starting selling out, all the previous staff and members moved to a new site called Privacy Guides. Privacy guides is an non-profit organization made to spread knowledge about privacy, while Privacy-Tools is a website being used to sell VPN and software.

Also realistically, matrix is pretty good. Its not amazing but in terms of security and privacy its probably the best platform to be having important staff shit on. There's a reason why all the lolicons and pediverse people use it.
 
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