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In a meta-sense, Hank Pym is a better character. His suicide attempt was leagues above any of Banner’s and you can actually make the mental breakdown a lot better. He fulfills the same tortured genius who wants help, but is constant attacked over something he really can’t ever apologize more enough with the domestic and genocidal robot son.
You can actually do a few angles on the slap because he was literally tripping balls when it happened and Janet was a whore.

My issue with the Hulk lies in that he’d be a better character if Banner accidentally triggered episodes and killed people indirectly.
yeah but they keep torturing Hank and won't let him just rebuild his life properly.

Bruce Banner kinda should just merge his personalities again and live as the Professor hulk, Doc Green. Hell, we should bring back the Pantheon and let it be revealed that they're actually part of Orchis. It'd be fun.
 
To be serious, "For the man who has everything" is among the best Alan Moore stories he have written and Superman stories in general.
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It is so damn well written and show that Alan Moore is a good writer when he is not a delusional faggot.
Agreed on everything, peak of Mongul’s career too, one of the few times the yellow bastard was a menace without the Warworld.

Moore was talented once, I feel that gets lost in the modern contempt for him.
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Bruce Banner kinda should just merge his personalities again and live as the Professor hulk, Doc Green. Hell, we should bring back the Pantheon and let it be revealed that they're actually part of Orchis. It'd be fun.
Doc Green was fun, I liked the rockstar, sociopath science man who freaked everyone out and eventually got rid of all his friends. One of the better tools to reset the status quo, shame once he succeeded in his good work they wrote him off (well I might add) to shill the chink.

His arc was also one of best uses of Maestro since Future Imperfect, as a looming nightmare reality
 
Hulk can be fun, but I think we have too many weird instances of shit like starship hulk and not enough of the decent stuff like planet hulk or even the ewing hulk.

Well, we can disagree on Ewing hulk. I actually thought it was well drawn and little else. Planet hulk is okay. It's...an idea done before. Hulk 140 forward by Roy Thomas. Hulk gets transplanted to a foreign world, becomes a hero to the locals, falls in love (Jarella), and it all ends poorly.

Agreed on everything, peak of Mongul’s career too, one of the few times the yellow bastard was a menace without the Warworld.

Moore was talented once, I feel that gets lost in the modern contempt for him.
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I never denied he had a way with words. But he's the anti-journeyman.

Doc Green was fun, I liked the rockstar, sociopath science man who freaked everyone out and eventually got rid of all his friends. One of the better tools to reset the status quo, shame once he succeeded in his good work they wrote him off (well I might add) to shill the chink.

His arc was also one of best uses of Maestro since Future Imperfect, as a looming nightmare reality

It's the difference with PAD. The one saving grace of him as a creative, Peter...back in a saner time, could actually ask 'am I really. the bad guy?'

He'll always be imminently more interesting that shitty Ewings Morrison fanfic style.
 
Been on a Hulk kick for the past year, started with Immortal then went back and read most of the PAD run and then Planet Hulk, Indestructible Hulk and the “Omega Hulk” stuff, I topped it off with rereading Immortal, now getting the references and deeper cuts.

My takeaway is other than those gay mutants being crybabys when compared to Doctor Banner’s torment and persecution, Joe Fixit is the man.

Savage Hulk takes over and it’s a twenty minute rampage followed by a nationwide manhunt, Joe takes over? He fucking steals a year of Bruce’s life, gets his own supporting cast, gets involved with a Vegas callgirl and generally lives out every Las Vegas movie/trope. Motherfucker in a year lived out Casino, Fear and Loathing, Leaving Las Vegas and The Hangover.

To top it off, he ends by being the MVP/main character of the final arc of Immortal, this guy is the best Hulk, followed closely by dad of the year, the Devil HulkView attachment 5755706
“Sunshine Joe, what a concept.”
Ewing's Joe Fixit was a piece of shit asshole (see him calling Thing a monster for daring to defend himself against the violent Green Hulk, who has repeatedly fucked over Thing multiple times including fucking up his honeymoon with Alicia as the most recent shit he's done to Thing) while prancing around like his shit doesn't stink and how he's the best alter ego in Bruce's head who runs everything. Even though Ewing's Fixit itself bore ZERO resemblance to the actual Mr Fixit personality, who was an obnoxious piece of shit who often had to be gangpressed into doing good and who was forever shitting on Banner and the Green Hulk persona and who wanted nothing more than to get rid of them if only he could and took glee whenever he could make his seizing control over their shared body, as traumatic as possible for Bruce due to Fixit being the type of asshole who drank Bruce's tears.

His Fixit was so OOC and so Marty Stu-ish that it's inevitable that like the PAD Smart Hulk, some later writer is probably going to retcon it "Trickster Hulk" or some other thing, and have the real Joe Fixit personality show up to kick his imposture ass.

Also; X-Men and Spider-Man update


Spider-Man: Gang War ended with a huge turd with Tombstone beating Madam Masque, who beat Peter nearly to death until MJ and Spider-Boy saved the day. Robbie wakes up, the super-hero ban in NYC is removed off-panel, Iron Fist and Shang-Chi bitched that no one cared what they did in their tie-in books, and Tombstone impotently vows to kill Spider-Man to White Rabbit when he finds out that his control over the city's crime family is fragile as fuck as everyone now realizes that Tombstone is in a pseudo-alliance with Spider-Man.

X-Men: Dead X-Men are the team going back in time to make sure they confirm Moira's story about her powers manifesting on her 13th birthday (since Xavier doesn't trust her anymore and is planning on killing her). Enigma has Phalanx Spiders waiting in the timestream to kill anyone who tries to eliminate/depower Moira and Xavier did something to Cypher to put Mr Sinister inside his body ala Malice and Sinister states the SoS Sinister included a "secret" inside of Rasputin she doesn't know about that is his and Xavier's secret weapon, much to the horror of Rasputin when she finds out what it is.

BUT the Dead X-Men (traveling within Moira's past timelines and the timelines of the Save Scum clones of Moira) take their mission a bit too far when Progidy (powers now suped up to being a living lie detector) decides the Dead X-Men are going to go further down the Moira rabbit hole and try and stop her while one of Moira's past lives (from the timeline where she massacres the Trask family only for someone else, this case Hank Pym, to create Ultron Sentinels) is chasing after them to game the system to gain more life since this version of Moira is a cyborg with a Xorn helmet ax.

Oh and a solicitation leaked that Marvel's finally doing an Xtinction Agenda/Days of Future Present omnibus. Sadly it omits UXM #273 (which is the epilogue to Xtinction Agenda) but they are also, in a collect the remaining shit department, including the Kings of Pain 1991 Annual X-Over and a good chunk of orphaned Australia era X-Men stuff such as the Colossus and Havok solo stories from MCP and the Sentinel/Abomination story from Marvel Super-Heroes, but not the Warlock solo story from MCP that ran after his death or the Ghost Rider/X-Factor team-up that furthered the Morlock storyline that culminated in UXM #291-293.

Tom Defalco is one of those frustrating people; FF, Thor, clone crap. Spider-girl only excuses so many sins.
You are in the minority faggot.

DeFalco's Spider-Man work is universally loved, his Thor run got 100% reappraised once Marvel started collecting it and people started to realize that Wizard was blood libeling him (and to a greater extent Doug Moench) by screeching that their runs were horrible to suck off Walt Simonson (and the fact that Aaron's Whor run was the real worst Thor run ever), his Fantastic Four run resurrected the Fantastic Four after the direness of the Simonson run and Byrne's character assassination by having Human Torch cuck Thing and making Alicia a worthless whore, and the fact that Scott Lang and Cassie Lang would be a forgotten D-Listers if not for DeFalco having Scott replace Reed on the FF team and writing Cassie as something other than hostage fodder.
 
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I actually tried reading that abomination last night, nice art I guess but Cates’s template (Venom, Thor, Thanos) is so obvious. That car crash was god mercy-killing the run.

Planet Hulk’s only downside is that it isn’t longer and he didn’t stay in the cosmic side of things longer, would’ve been fun if when Nova chewed out Stark after Annihilation and Civil War he casually dropped.

“You know Tony, last I counted it was seventy worlds that call the Hulk, king, god or warlord, the titles are interchangeable at this point. I don’t know why you shot him into space but thank you, he’s been busy killing tyrants and breaking chains.”
Cates had drug problems before the car crash though. I think thats what really killed his career
 
I've only read DeFalco's Spider-Man/Girl stuff and enjoyed it a lot. He does great at characterization, utilizing the supporting cast, and building & weaving together subplots, but his main plots are usually very standard and not particularly memorable. He reminds me a lot of Chuck Dixon.
 
You are in the minority faggot.

Only one of us is sucking Tom's cock man. :biggrin:

Besides, I'm pretty sure Defalco got a shit ton of hate mail.

DeFalco's Spider-Man work is universally loved,

All of it? Every bit? The clone saga is universally beloved?

his Thor run got 100% reappraised once Marvel started collecting it and people started to realize that Wizard was blood libeling him (and to a greater extent Doug Moench) by screeching that their runs were horrible to suck off Walt Simonson (and the fact that Aaron's Whor run was the real worst Thor run ever),

You keep using that defense. Reappraised? After the bulk of people who read comics left a few fan boys seized on the lack of people who even READ a certain run to try to make it better by...comparison? I'm Aaron's shit is worse. But...that doesn't make Defalco's work BETTER.

It was bad and they had to reboot Thor to fix the damage and that you'd diminish Simonson speaks volumes.

his Fantastic Four run resurrected the Fantastic Four after the direness of the Simonson run and Byrne's character assassination by having Human Torch cuck Thing and making Alicia a worthless whore, and the fact that Scott Lang and Cassie Lang would be a forgotten D-Listers if not for DeFalco having Scott replace Reed on the FF team and writing Cassie as something other than hostage fodder.

And now you defend the Defalco FF while slandering Simonson and Byrne? Go on. Defend the shit he did with Sue storm in that run. Or Sharon Ventura. I'm gonna go there.

No true FF fan defends Defalco. There. I said it.
 
All of it? Every bit? The clone saga is universally beloved?
To be fair, his writing was consistently strong throughout the Clone Saga, at least relative to most other writers. As the original editor (he eventually just went back to being a writer midway through) during the era, he claimed his original plan was: act 1, introduce Ben Reilly and stir up drama over who the real Peter was > act 2, 'confirm' that Ben was the real one, leading to Peter's retirement > act 3, reveal that Ben actually was the clone and bring back Peter as the one, true Spider-Man, with Ben getting his own spin-off. I do think this is revisionist history on his end because he claims he just happened to keep the plan a secret (why would you do that?) and nobody else who worked on it ever heard of such an outline.

The problem with the Clone Saga was less the concept, I feel, and more the constant shake ups of editorial due to Marvel's financial woes, which also led to them constantly extending the event due to it being the only thing that was selling well.
 
To be fair, his writing was consistently strong throughout the Clone Saga, at least relative to most other writers. As the original editor (he eventually just went back to being a writer midway through) during the era, he claimed his original plan was: act 1, introduce Ben Reilly and stir up drama over who the real Peter was > act 2, 'confirm' that Ben was the real one, leading to Peter's retirement > act 3, reveal that Ben actually was the clone and bring back Peter as the one, true Spider-Man, with Ben getting his own spin-off. I do think this is revisionist history on his end because he claims he just happened to keep the plan a secret (why would you do that?) and nobody else who worked on it ever heard of such an outline.

I mean, I feel like my head hurts just processing what you wrote. So...yeah, not so beloved.

The problem with the Clone Saga was less the concept, I feel, and more the constant shake ups of editorial due to Marvel's financial woes, which also led to them constantly extending the event due to it being the only thing that was selling well.

I mean. I use the Clone saga as an example. I never thought I'd hear people DEFEND Defalco's post 90s Marvel stuff like that.

Do I like Spidergirl, yeah. It's nice, even if I feel like his dialogue is dated, to the point of every page soaked in descriptive text and he's a bit to Stan but not Stan. I associate him with that 90s era when Spidey was...not great.

by in the 90s from the point of I want to say from the year after Todd left to Just before heroes Reborn where things started to get less bad honestly you could have done better in the Spidey department by just following the formulaic stuff.
 
I've only read DeFalco's Spider-Man/Girl stuff and enjoyed it a lot. He does great at characterization, utilizing the supporting cast, and building & weaving together subplots, but his main plots are usually very standard and not particularly memorable. He reminds me a lot of Chuck Dixon.
Spider-Girl is very, very good but it sort of peters out when it gets to the Sci-Fi bullshit. I absolutely loved how he basically took every concept from Spidey and twisted it. So you have essentially a Peter Parker as a supporting character, which you think theyre gonna make him an incel but then they flip it on you AGAIN and make him talk it out with May. very clever, because it's thematic mirroring and subversion not to look smart, but to actually be smart and create a realistic nuance to characters. rather than him just being a subversion of Peter and a villain in order to sell the metaphor that "May aint like Peter yo" they create a realistic nerdy kid with rough edges and approach him like a real person

Tom's great at that but one of his two main problems is like you said his main plots are kind of stock. like i think what he did with Osborn III was great overall but the plots that got there could be a bit mediocre. his other problem is kind of wooden dialogue, every character tends to say what he means

there's also the problem with spider-girl being dated to marvel in the 90s. the use of hereos and villains is limited to who was big in the 90s and that's kind of the problem. if you are a new reader youre not going to be attached to speedball or arya corazon. i feel if tom brought it back we'd probably see him do his own interpretation of someone like miles in place of 90s holdovers
I mean, I feel like my head hurts just processing what you wrote. So...yeah, not so beloved.



I mean. I use the Clone saga as an example. I never thought I'd hear people DEFEND Defalco's post 90s Marvel stuff like that.

Do I like Spidergirl, yeah. It's nice, even if I feel like his dialogue is dated, to the point of every page soaked in descriptive text and he's a bit to Stan but not Stan. I associate him with that 90s era when Spidey was...not great.

by in the 90s from the point of I want to say from the year after Todd left to Just before heroes Reborn where things started to get less bad honestly you could have done better in the Spidey department by just following the formulaic stuff.
tbf no one was hitting their heaviest swings during the clone saga. Even JM Dematties
 
• Daken made a better Wolverine successor than X-23.

• Polaris is the coolest of Magneto's kids.

• I don't like that Miles Morales Spidey doesn't have even a slightly different alter ego name, in order to further differentiate himself from Peter Parker Spidey. I can't think what his alternative name would be, though.

• Spider-Man 2099 and Spider-Man Noir don't get enough love. Well, maybe 2099 does in comparison. And then there's 2211, that's been swept further under the carpet.

• Speaking of not getting enough love, here are two Spidey villains whom (I realise sometimes it's who, but it's fun to chop and change) I really like: The Sin-Eater, and Chance.

• Has there ever been a Judge Dredd-Punisher crossover? 'Cos if not, I reckon it'd do well.

• Speaking of The Punisher, there should be a medieval version of him. Just imagine the savage, yet, depending on the situation/the pain/damage he'd want to inflict, advanced weapons he'd have.

• The Immortal Hulk is the best Hulk comic series ever.

• I remember coming across a fucked up Batman villain who murdered his parents, and wore his mum's head as a mask, or some shit. I'm 99.9% sure I didn't fever/binge drink dream it. I've been trying to think of the story for a long while, and I can't remember what it was called.

• I find it a tad disappointing that Jason Voorhees has so many comics about him. What about Freddy Krueger? Or Chucky? Or Pinhead? Or Mick Taylor? If there are, though, it'd be nice to be informed.
 
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• Daken made a better Wolverine successor than X-23.

• Speaking of not getting enough love, here are two Spidey villains whom (I realise sometimes it's who, but it's fun to chop and change) I really like: The Sin-Eater, and Chance.

• The Immortal Hulk is the best Hulk comic series ever.

• I remember coming across a fucked up Batman villain who murdered his parents, and wore his mum's head as a mask, or some shit. I'm 99.9% sure I didn't fever/binge drink dream it. I've been trying to think of the story for a long while, and I can't remember what it was called.
I like Daken better as well especially in Dark Avengers.

Spiderman has quite a few underrated villains. For example I unironically like The Hypno-Hustler and Jack o Lantern.

I loved Immortal Hulk to. In particular what they did with characters like The Leader and The U-Foes. I especially enjoyed issue 2 for being the first horror comic I ever read that made me feel scared in a good way. It's a shame the guy who illustrated the series is no longer at Marvel. Joe Bennett I believe his name was.

I'm pretty sure there's a similar female villian to what you described who turned her victims into skin suits she'd wear. That or your describing Edd Gein or Norman Bates.
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• I don't like that Miles Morales Spidey doesn't have even a slightly different alter ego name, in order to further differentiate himself from Peter Parker Spidey. I can't think what his alternative name would be, though.
They've given him his own names in non-standard spin-offs and merchandise. Kid Arachnid and Spin are two (both, I think, from Spider-Man shows for children, Spidey and his friends or something).
 
They've given him his own names in non-standard spin-offs and merchandise. Kid Arachnid and Spin are two (both, I think, from Spider-Man shows for children, Spidey and his friends or something).
I had no idea. Spin is probably his best name.
 
I like Daken better as well especially in Dark Avengers.

Spiderman has quite a few underrated villains. For example I unironically like The Hypno-Hustler and Jack o Lantern.

I loved Immortal Hulk to. In particular what they did with characters like The Leader and The U-Foes. I especially enjoyed issue 2 for being the first horror comic I ever read that made me feel scared in a good way. It's a shame the guy who illustrated the series is no longer at Marvel. Joe Bennett I believe his name was.

I'm pretty sure there's a similar female villian to what you described who turned her victims into skin suits she'd wear. That or your describing Edd Gein or Norman Bates.View attachment 5791598
Yeah, Jack O'Lantern rings a bell. Hobgoblin is an overlooked one. There's even a Hobgoblin 2099, but I think that might be for the 2099 section of Spider-Man: Shattered Dimensions on the PS3. The Dark Avengers were cool. One of 'em was Venom/Dark Spider-Man, which may have been Mac Gargan (Scorpion), as the Venom Symbiote hopped around other hosts after Eddie Brock gave it up (sold it, I think). And yeah, it's a shame Jim Bennett left Marvel Comics. And, I'm not finding anything on that scary fucker who I thought was a one off Batman villain, though. Maybe he was from another comic series, but I can't think of anything but Batman. Oh, well.
 
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