Star Trek - Space: The Final Frontier

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L50LasPak said:
TAS isn't worth dismissing outright like that. For one thing Yesteryear is one of the best episodes of Star Trek ever written, and there's a fair amount of of decent episodes in there.

As for the bad episodes, you haven't lived until you've seen Kirk and Spock accidentally summon Satan, and then travel to the center of the galaxy where Kirk has an honest to god fucking wizard battle with the guy in charge of the Salem Witch Trials.
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I guess you're right. I didn't think I'd care much for Abrams' Star Trek movies, but I ended up liking them quite a lot, so maybe it's not fair of me to dismiss things like that. Although I gave DSC and Picard a fair chance and I thought both were awful.

I had seen a few episodes of TAS though, and it honestly felt like some kind of weird drug trip. Not sure if in a good way. It's been a while, though, so maybe it's worth trying again.
 
ditto said:
It's also the one where Gul Dukat has to give Sisko a fireworks display. The plain weirdest moment in the whole of DS9.
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It also shows just how much the character of Dukat changed in later seasons. Early seasons, he was Tomalok; adversarial at times, but generally was there to explain his nation's interest. It's when he gets exiled in season 4 does he become what people think of him as.
 
Emo Crow Fumikage said:
I had seen a few episodes of TAS though, and it honestly felt like some kind of weird drug trip. Not sure if in a good way. It's been a while, though, so maybe it's worth trying again.
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I wouldn't even disagree with that impression, but I think that's a strength of TAS. It gives it a distinctive style, and it also keeps the boring episodes from being completely unattractive. Its not a show that lends itself to the modern habit binge watching though as any two or three episodes of TAS can be radically different and kind of disorenting, but I still reccomend that people watch it.
 
+1 to TAS being worthwhile.

Yes, it has a few really boring and terrible episodes, but the good episodes are on the same level as the best from seasons 1 & 2 from the original live action show. The Infiinite Vulcan and the Robert April episode are both quality Trek.
 
Drag-on Knight 91873 said:
IMO, he got his natural stride in Explorers, the one with the solar sailboat. It's also the episode where he grew the beard.
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Yeah, he really came alive there.

He had a strong outing in the pilot, too. (Love his introduction to Quark.)
ditto said:
Unpopular opinion, but I enjoyed pre-Seven Voyager more than the latter seasons.
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It needed more time in the oven.

Braga/Taylor. What a pair of mental midgets. Taylor's as responsible for the ratings slump as anyone. Remember "Alliances"? Even she admitted it was a mistake.

I like Seven a lot, but why did she have to dwarf so many characters?

Tuvok went from Janeway's trusted advisor and the canny detective to a humorless, one-note joke whom everyone has a kick at eventually.

Torres took a back-seat, too; almost as if the writers don't trust the audience to follow along with two female characters. Torres was supposed to be the daughter Janeway never had. Remember that?(:_(
 
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UnKillShredDur said:
As she was written, Janeway completely changed her entire worldview from episode to episode depending on who was writing her at the time. And Seven had nothing to do with any of that. (Although if anything, Janeway got even more inconsistent after Seven joined the crew.)
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Janeway: I want to give you the freedom of choice
Seven: Then I choose to go back to the collective
Janeway: No, lol
 
White Devil said:
The only part of Captain Archer I really liked was when he lost his shit and decided to go full war crimes.
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Only once did I feel any affinity with Archer. T'Pol talks about how everyone is misinterpreting Surak to suit their political agenda. She turns to Archer, who has this wry look on his face. They needed more moments like that.

Archer has no rapport with his staff, apart from Florida Man.
 
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Florida Man was my favorite crew member. He seemed to have the most personality and the most conflict as a character.
 
Quintex96 said:
Janeway: I want to give you the freedom of choice
Seven: Then I choose to go back to the collective
Janeway: No, lol
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Janeway is positively psychotic in her pusuit of Ransom.

Didn't she commit far worse crimes just to get this far? Sacrificing planets to the Borg, awakening a genocidal species in "Dragon's Teeth", and more?:geek:
White Devil said:
Florida Man was my favorite crew member. He seemed to have the most personality and the most conflict as a character.
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Naturally Braga killed him off.

I've heard it said that Trip was distinctly "Enterprise". He's to ENT what Data, Quark and Seven were to their respective shows.
 
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To be fair, they killed him at like the second to last episode. It was a stupid death but I don't think they'd have done it if the series wasn't getting cancelled. Way smarter to keep him and T'Pol as a tense couple.
 
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Drag-on Knight 91873 said:
It also shows just how much the character of Dukat changed in later seasons. Early seasons, he was Tomalok; adversarial at times, but generally was there to explain his nation's interest. It's when he gets exiled in season 4 does he become what people think of him as.
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If you scan the trivia sections of each Dukat episode on the wiki, you'll see there was a lot of outside pressure to make Dukat a regular.

Actors are needy by nature and Alaimo is an extreme case. To the bitter end, he wanted to be the 'white hat' of DS9. So he leaned into the more charming qualities of Dukat. Ira got fed up with him and the Dukat stans who wrote letters saying Bajor was better off under the occupation.

At first, Ira tried to reposition him as "the Richard Nixon of Deep Space Nine", someone who will sink to any depths to win political office. I was onboard with it until "Covenant". That's when the character started getting stupid.

Didn't care for him porking Kira's mom, either. Not sure what the point of that episode was.
 
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The most fascinating part about Star Trek is that the episodes that work within the established sci-fi parameters and are more drama oriented tend to be the better ones. To me the most immersion breaking episodes are just about every anomaly and time travel bullshit episodes. Now that I have watched most of the good old shit I have to say that DS9 has by far most consistent quality throughout the series, but even that can't avoid having dumb stuff like ghosts in it.
 
WeWuzFinns said:
To me the most immersion breaking episodes are just about every anomaly and time travel bullshit episodes.
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Leave that stuff to the holodeck.

For every "City on the Edge of Forever", you have "Time's Arrow", "Wrongs Darker Than Day or Night", "Future's End", the one where amnesiac Archer and T'Pol are fucking (and no one cared).

Then again, people point to "Timeless" as one of VOY's best. Seems the batting average was skewed by having too much time travel.
 
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jennifermist said:
Archer had no rapport with his senior staff, apart from Florida Man.
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Once again, Ya Boi Zack had something to say about Star Trek.

jennifermist said:
Janeway is positively psychotic in her pusuit of the Equinox. Didn't she commit way worse crimes just to get this far? Sacrificing planets to the Borg, awakening a kill-crazy species in "Dragon's Teeth", etc.
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Which is why I wanted to watch the Equinox crew instead... and I got that monkey's paw wish with Star Trek: Discovery. A research science ship enslaves a creature that can make the ship go super fast and everyone is a scumbag constantly arguing the ends justifies the means.
 
jennifermist said:
Leave that stuff to the holodeck.

For every "City on the Edge of Forever", you have "Time's Arrow", "Wrongs Darker Than Day or Night", "Future's End", the one where amnesiac Archer and T'Pol were fucking (and no one cared).

Then again, fans point to "Timeless" as one of VOY's best. Looks like the batting average was skewed by having too many time travel stories.
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Timeless was only good because writers were sensible enough to use time travel elements sparingly. The episode was mostly drama based and suffered from the last second save cliché.
 
jennifermist said:
Finally, Ira Behr got fed up with him and the Dukat fans who wrote letters saying Bajor was better off under the occupation. At first, Ira tried to reposition him as "the Richard Nixon of Deep Space Nine", someone who will sink to any depths to win political office, then he resorted to turning Alaimo into a demon when viewers didn't get the hint.
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Considering the shit FDR, JFK and LBJ pulled to "win" their elections and what they done in office Nixon was a saint compared to them.
 
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