Star Trek - Space: The Final Frontier

[BR55]

Holy shit guys I don't want to backseat moderate but this isn't the Alien thread.
Back on topic...
So Picard has the plot of Mass Effect 3, the clothing style of the BSG reboot, painfully generic ship interior design, edgy violence out of WH40K and ridiculously moronic allegories and current events metaphors,
Honestly between Joss Whedon snark and quip fest's and J.J Abrams/Kurtzman normiefied focus grouped melodramatic corporate slop I can't decide which writing style I loath more.
Whedon's dialogue is complete trash but the Bad Robot stuff is just so spectacularly retarded and ill thought out.
They've both helped to ruin Hollywood writing though.

 

[Cyril Sneer]

Now that you mentioned that, you're right. Hell, the Pakled suit had more character.
View attachment 1194781
And the sheer variety in Ferengi outfits was astonishing. Made me think the costumers had a lot of fun with them.

Indeed.

And not just the designers. Basically everyone in this screencap looks like they're having a better time than just about anyone who's appeared onscreen in either STD or STP:

 

[acmeurquhart]

They're Generic Mostly CGI Ship #1513. Except, as I was shocked to learn, Discovery doesn't use CGI sets, they're real. Which is so, so sad, because they feel like CGI. Bad CGI. Cheap, SyFy Original Movie-level CGI.

Canadian. The word you are looking is “Canadian.”

 

[AnOminous]

It may not have been anything political but the movie was a pretty big flip off to the audience, the comparison is valid I think.

Other than just not being particularly great, how exactly?

 

[Oaat]

It's a theory for explaining why humans haven't encountered alien life yet, based on guesses, assumptions and speculation about how a spacefaring species would develop and behave.

Really, what is it's explanation then?

 

[Overly Serious]

What's this y'all keep going on about the feet? Did Tarantino make an Alien film?

In the original movie the Alien is a tall, thin man in a suit and therefore the legs are human legs and human feet, albeit in black rubber outfit. But in the phenomenally good game Alien: Isolation (and I like how everyone's just marking Cyril's posts as "Disagree" and getting on with life) that was a bit lackluster. Ridley Scott and James Cameron could just not have the camera show the xenomorph's feet much but in the game you're hiding under tables, crawling through ducts... a pair of ordinary human feet walking past lacked impact, verging on feeling a little silly. So they made the xenomorph's feet digitigrade. It was deliberate design decision and frankly a good call - both creepier and makes the xenomorph look like it can run down the humans easily. Game is scary as Hell playing in the dark with headphones.

It's a dark, bleak nihilistic game. (Though obviously not as dark, bleak or nihilistic as Kurtzman's Star Trek)

EDIT: Just saw this and feel obliged to reply because it's so egregious -

It's in the same star system as LV-426, and compared to Earth

Wrong! Sevastopol is never said to be in the same star system as LV-426. We are told at the start of the game that Amanda is "working in the same region where her mother went missing". It never defines region even and she also travels via hypersleep to Sevastopol from whereever she currently is working in the opening. And the reason the second ship went to LV-426 was specifically because they were homing in on the Nostromo's beacon. It's not because Sevastopol which they went to later was "within spitting distance" of LV-426 or whatever other crap you're making up today.

Now, back to Star Trek?

EDIT EDIT: Just reached these:

Holy shit guys I don't want to backseat moderate but this isn't the Alien thread.
Back on topic...

Yeah, fair enough. I'm done with this now. I'll just reply to a couple more things on Alien because I know they're coming and then I'm done, too.

But if LV-426 was really that remote it never would have been discovered in the first place, why would the Nostromo even be in the area in the first place? Again, outer space is pretty big, it makes sense for LV-426 to be in just an obscure enough locations it would take a while to discover, but still not remote enough so that it could feasibly be discovered in the first place.

The crew of the Nostromo ended up there because of a beacon from the Space Jockey's ship - they were way off-course from where they were supposed to be.

And because I suspect Cyril is going to say this and I'm done after this, I'll just anticipate the last defense of his made-up claims that LV-426 and Sevastopol are in the same star system which is when he tries to argue they must be for the crew of the Anisodora to get there with the face-hugger still attached. We never see what happens immediately afterwards but the reasonable assumption is that they froze her with it still on. It's what Burke wanted to do in Aliens. It's what even Parker kept shouting at Ash through the window of the medical bay "Hey, why don't you just freeze him?" repeatedly. The only reason they didn't then was because Ash was a saboteur who deliberately arranged for the xenomorph to get free from the outset. The only reason in Alien 3 it wasn't happening was because the face huggers broke open the sleeping pod to get in and wrecked them. Freezing is so obvious that it's been independently suggested twice in two separate movies. We don't see it but the Anisodora has plenty of time to get to Sevastopol. Nothing in the game says that they're in the same star system except to Cyril's magic ears which hear whatever he wants to hear.

Okay, I'm genuinely sorry. I am a sperg. But now I am done. Play the game - it's great and they went all out to make it fit the first movie's feel.

 

[Lithos]

So... about that Species 8472... can they be terrifying? Discuss.

 

[Cyril Sneer]

Really, what is it's explanation then?

*ahem*

• There are billions of stars in the Milky Way similar to the Sun.
• With high probability, some of these stars have Earth-like planets, and if the Earth is typical, some may have already developed intelligent life.
• Some of these civilizations may have developed interstellar travel, a step the Earth is investigating now.
• Even at the slow pace of currently envisioned interstellar travel, the Milky Way galaxy could be completely traversed in a few million years.
• And since many of the stars similar to the Sun are billions of years older, this would seem to provide plenty of time.

TL;DR: It's just wanking to unprovable speculation over unknowable unknowns.

In the original movie the Alien is a tall, thin man in a suit and therefore the legs are human legs and human feet, albeit in black rubber outfit. But in the phenomenally good game Alien: Isolation (and I like how everyone's just marking Cyril's posts as "Disagree" and getting on with life) that was a bit lackluster.

"Everyone" = three people, including you.

Ridley Scott and James Cameron could just not have the camera show the xenomorph's feet much but in the game you're hiding under tables, crawling through ducts... a pair of ordinary human feet walking past lacked impact, verging on feeling a little silly.

"Ordinary human feet"

So they made the xenomorph's feet digitigrade. It was deliberate design decision and frankly a good call - both creepier and makes the xenomorph look like it can run down the humans easily.

It unbalances the design, IMO.

It's a dark, bleak nihilistic game. (Though obviously not as dark, bleak or nihilistic as Kurtzman's Star Trek)

Ridiculously so, since we all know that Amanda Ripley is going to live to a ripe old age regardless.

Wrong! Sevastopol is never said to be in the same star system as LV-426.

No, you're wrong. The comic, the novel and (I think) the in-game logs state that the station orbits the gas giant KG348 in the Zeta Reticuli system, i.e. LV-426's neighborhood.

And the reason the second ship went to LV-426 was specifically because they were homing in on the Nostromo's beacon. It's not because Sevastopol which they went to later was "within spitting distance" of LV-426 or whatever other crap you're making up today.

As I've already pointed out, it's something of a major plot point in the game that Sevastopol Station is located close-by to LV-426. It's the nearest human outpost, which is why the crew of the Anesidora heads there following the facehugger attack, which creates a plot-hole in Alien.

So... about that Species 8472... can they be terrifying? Discuss.

I think the design has a very definite "alien" quality to it, but in a way that's more subtly unsettling than frightening, though that may be in part a side-effect of the "uncanny valley" look of the relatively primitive CG animation.

 

[Oaat]

So... about that Species 8472... can they be terrifying? Discuss.

I can't claim credit for this idea, but what if fluidic space is Species 8472? The creatures you see are like cells or scouting ants of it's body, this is why they think of other life as impure. The laws of physics might be different to allow for such an organism, however in a TOS episode the Enterprise encountered a giant cell in space, and Kirk speculated that it could grow into a huge body, making humans viruses to it.

*ahem*


TL;DR: It's just wanking to unprovable speculation over unknowable unknowns.

Nice job copying wikipedia retard, you left out the actual paradox. You said it's a theory explaining why humans haven't encountered alien life yet, so what is it's explanation then?

 

[AnOminous]

Same thing with the costumes, I've noticed. NuTrek dresses everyone in generic post-NuBSG street clothes...

...whereas TNG-era Trek had a very unique (if also very odd) style for human civilian clothing, often featuring wrapped tunics, odd patterning and some pretty eccentric fabrics.

I'm not sure TNG Trek's civilian fashion choices made any actual sense, although they were less ridiculous than Starfleet uniforms have always been, but they seemed like something a future culture might have worn, rather than just something from a current issue of GQ minus any actual fashion sense. TNG wins again.

 

[Absolutego]

I still can't get over how monumentally stupid it is to lift, of all things, the main story from Mass Effect 3. The story that almost single-handedly killed an IP. Andromeda couldn't cultivate an audience, even after the QA issues were fixed, even though they set it in a different GALAXY to get away from ME3's ending, because of how bad the ending killed fan confidence in the studio. They're even repeating Bioware's mistake of making the story all about synths vs. humanoids being unable to coexist peacefully despite metric tons of counterexamples to that in preceding entries in the series.

There's even a better Mass Effect 3 story line they could crib from - if they wanted to needlessly make Star Trek about #CurrentYear politics to soothe their myopic obsession, just copy the Tuchanka quest line. It'd still be retarded because Alex Kurtzman is in charge, but having your refugees suffering from a species-wide plague that's destroyed their previously stable society would sure as hell be nabbing CBS more "this is the series we NEED right now" op-eds these past few weeks than this nonsense has been.

 

[Dom Cruise]

I can't believe that I have to point this out again, but it's in the same star system as LV-426. Even if the Zeta Reticuli system has a larger diameter than our own, the distances between objects within it, however overwhelmingly long they might be on a human scale, are still going to be completely dwarfed by the 39-light-year distance back to Earth.

It's not that remote, though. It's located in the same star system as a very large commercial space station which, in it's better days, used to handle a massive amount of traffic, which makes it utterly ridiculous that some Wey-Yu dork way out on Thedus or wherever would be the first and only person to detect the beacon.

They are glaringly obvious unless you've completely turned your brain off, which really calls into question the intelligence (or at least, the honesty) all these people calling Isolation the only good Aliens-universe game.

This is the bargaining stage of loss.

And really, how would you take it if I said it was perfectly fine that Hadley's Hope is shown to be mostly intact in Colonial Marines, rather than flattened by an expanding "cloud of vapor the size of Nebraska," simply because the developers wanted the players to be able to explore the iconic environments from the film, and had to "bend things slightly in order for the game to happen?"

No argument there. That was incredibly stupid.



Goalpost shifting.

It's a theory for explaining why humans haven't encountered alien life yet, based on guesses, assumptions and speculation about how a spacefaring species would develop and behave.

Or even if the material in question doesn't really provide all that much support for such a take, as in your case.

Same thing with the costumes, I've noticed. NuTrek dresses everyone in generic post-NuBSG street clothes...

...whereas TNG-era Trek had a very unique (if also very odd) style for human civilian clothing, often featuring wrapped tunics, odd patterning and some pretty eccentric fabrics.

"Bargaining stage of loss"? Alien: Isolation is one of the best games I've ever played, no other movie based game made you truly feel like you've stepped into the world of a movie like it does, there is no loss here, not once did I ever think the existence of Sevastopol station was in any way a "plot hole"

The Hadley's Hope thing in Colonial Marines was obviously ridiculous and Colonial Marines in general was a terrible game whereas Isolation was a great one, there is no comparison between Hadley's Hope's survival and the existence of Sevastopol station.

I'm frankly genuinely disturbed you would latch onto a nonexistent plot hole to negatively color your opinion of a fantastic game (not to mention your obsession over the alien's feet), your takes on the game are genuinely bizarre and I can't even begin to comprehend why you feel this way but clearly you're not going to change your mind so whatever.

But I'll just say it again for the last time, space is a really big place, something being within the same "star system" as something else does not mean it's just a hop, skip and a jump away, it's kind of insane that you seem to think that's the case.

Other than just not being particularly great, how exactly?

By killing off the character who's rescue was the entire point of the previous movie before the opening credits are even done.

Not even The Last Jedi had a fuck you quite that bad.

 

[Flexo]

Well I've lost track of all the talk so I'll just sum up a lot of points at once. (Thank you @Overly Serious btw)

1) I am a huge AvP fan - I always liked the two species crossing over, especially in video games (movies... look I'll agree they weren't perfect). The aliens are literally just multicelluar viruses. If I taught baby meatbags, I'd probably use Alien as a demonstration film for when we got to cellular biology and viruses because it's pretty darn good at demonstrating a lot of concepts there. The idea of these things ever evolving is... a fairly large leap in disbelief suspension. That's why I always assumed they were a bio weapon that got out of control. I mean on paper they are almost perfect - drop them in an area, with their breeding pattern there will be a natural cap on their growth, so you just wait for them to wipe everything out then die off and move in. (what probably went wrong is that the xenos would never die...)

2) From there, it still cracks me up that of all the treks, it was Voyager that ripped off BOTH of these properties, giving us the Alien (Species 8472) and the Predator (Hirogen). I mean the alien outright nearly kills Harry Kim with tentacle hentai (and would have if it wasn't for People magazine). Hell they outright gave us an AvP episode.

Star Trek (Voy): Prey

Star Trek Reviews

sfdebris.com

It still always bugs me that - as usual - Voyager has to waste the potential of their stories and made both of their knock offs to be too human.

3) And just to top it off, the original Alien 3 was written up in one of the first alien comic books put out by Dark Horse. After the movie came out and screwed everything up (the bastards) Dark Horse changed all subsequent printings of those stories to be "faithful" to canon. (In the original, the protagonists were Hicks & Newt - their names had to be changed.) BUT in a special anniversary hard cover release, the original story has been restored to those interested and if you hit up your local amazon or barnes & noble, you can get a faithful reprint of the Alien 3 we should have had.

4) I seriously keep wondering how bad everyone is at these things. Aliens & Predator both - as franchises - always work best keeping things very simple, streamlined, and primal. What killed AvP and the last few films of both properties is that they tried to do way too much with both. Meanwhile Star Trek, which has always worked best stretching our minds & imagination, they have to go and make them overly simple and then try and compensate by making them complicated. It keeps frustrating me because First Contact was the best TNG film and DS9 the best post-TOS series, and yet modern trek keeps learning all the wrong lessons from them. They were beloved because like all good stories, they gave real, difficult challenges to our heroes that pushed them physically, mentally, and morally. (See the episode: Darmok) But no, the mary sues can never be seriously challenged - that sends the wrong message.

Geez I hate modern storytelling so damn much.

 

[trekkor]

I do not understand what the show is trying to make me feel concerning Agnes. One scene she's being mopey and crying (again), then she's having a romantic moment with a guy she had casual sex with (once!), then everyone is saying how horrible she is because she murdered a man (and would've gotten away with it even after trying to kill herself because the EMH is retarded) and then she's considered the "mother" of the androids (even though she just showed up and murdered the man who actually created two of their own). It's one thing being a complex character who can be viewed differently based on their actions and the morals of others, but it's another to be all over the place. I'll say this, at least all this mess makes her more interesting than Raffi, who is either bland or bitchy, depending on the scene, and Rios, who doesn't really do much other than sprout the occassional Spanish phrase. And there's no point in mentioning Elrond, he's a complete non-character.

• why did Picard tell everyone he was ill? It served no purpose. He could've just asked Agnes to keep it to herself and tell the others it was a personal matter but they had a job to do so nevermind.
• I'm glad the show at least misses Hugh as much as I do, fuck you Kurtzman.
• you know what, sure, there's another Soong out there. Whatever. As long as Spiner doesn't have to put on make-up that makes it look like his face is melting, it's prefectly fine by me. They basically copied Arik Soong, but again - whatever.
• Is there a reason Soongs can only make Data-like androids? Like, how hard is it really to make them look like regular humans? There was never any real need to have them be golden-eyed and skinned, it just looked interesting (and it made Data stand out), but what is the explanation now?
• so the big revelation basically boils down to >yo we're higher beings and fuck biological beings, just summon us and we'll genocide them np. And honestly, that's really boring. Picard and all the captains really have met so many OP god-like beings that this honestly shouldn't even be that dramatic to them. Like, when all this was going on, I was wondering if Q would pop up in the last episode and just yeet the bio-haters out of the galaxy because they wanted to hurt his husbando Picard.
• REMEMBER SPOT????
• It felt weird hearing Picard say he loved someone so casually. I get him saying that romantically to Beverly or so, but not just throw it out there for his "bro", Raffi.
• That ending with nuShoji (I don't even know how I'm going to remember these people) went by so fast. Everyone just gathered around to have a lighting round of PICARD SPEECH>NO FUCK BIOLOGICALS WE'RE SUMMONING THESE HIGHER BEINGS>YOU CAN STAY, AGNES, WE LIKE YOU FOR SOME REASON and I felt like so much was cut out.
• Side note, but why did Soong make so many bald androids? I get making like one, just for some variety, but there were so many of them, it was a bit odd.

Personally, I can't wait to see the huge beam of light in the final episode. Cool of Kurtzman to channel the tired EPIC moment his good buttbuddy JJ made so popular.

 

[Flexo]

I do not understand what the show is trying to make me feel concerning Agnes. One scene she's being mopey and crying (again), then she's having a romantic moment with a guy she had casual sex with (once!), then everyone is saying how horrible she is because she murdered a man (and would've gotten away with it even after trying to kill herself because the EMH is exceptional) and then she's considered the "mother" of the androids (even though she just showed up and murdered the man who actually created two of their own). It's one thing being a complex character who can be viewed differently based on their actions and the morals of others, but it's another to be all over the place. I'll say this, at least all this mess makes her more interesting than Raffi, who is either bland or bitchy, depending on the scene, and Rios, who doesn't really do much other than sprout the occassional Spanish phrase. And there's no point in mentioning Elrond, he's a complete non-character.

• why did Picard tell everyone he was ill? It served no purpose. He could've just asked Agnes to keep it to herself and tell the others it was a personal matter but they had a job to do so nevermind.
• I'm glad the show at least misses Hugh as much as I do, fuck you Kurtzman.
• you know what, sure, there's another Soong out there. Whatever. As long as Spiner doesn't have to put on make-up that makes it look like his face is melting, it's prefectly fine by me. They basically copied Arik Soong, but again - whatever.
• Is there a reason Soongs can only make Data-like androids? Like, how hard is it really to make them look like regular humans? There was never any real need to have them be golden-eyed and skinned, it just looked interesting (and it made Data stand out), but what is the explanation now?
• so the big revelation basically boils down to >yo we're higher beings and fuck biological beings, just summon us and we'll genocide them np. And honestly, that's really boring. Picard and all the captains really have met so many OP god-like beings that this honestly shouldn't even be that dramatic to them. Like, when all this was going on, I was wondering if Q would pop up in the last episode and just yeet the bio-haters out of the galaxy because they wanted to hurt his husbando Picard.
• REMEMBER SPOT????
• It felt weird hearing Picard say he loved someone so casually. I get him saying that romantically to Beverly or so, but not just throw it out there for his "bro", Raffi.
• That ending with nuShoji (I don't even know how I'm going to remember these people) went by so fast. Everyone just gathered around to have a lighting round of PICARD SPEECH>NO FUCK BIOLOGICALS WE'RE SUMMONING THESE HIGHER BEINGS>YOU CAN STAY, AGNES, WE LIKE YOU FOR SOME REASON and I felt like so much was cut out.
• Side note, but why did Soong make so many bald androids? I get making like one, just for some variety, but there were so many of them, it was a bit odd.

Personally, I can't wait to see the huge beam of light in the final episode. Cool of Kurtzman to channel the tired EPIC moment his good buttbuddy JJ made so popular.

Whoa whoa whoa. What's this about higher beings again?

 

[trekkor]

Whoa whoa whoa. What's this about higher beings again?

Something something ancient ones who are low-key seething over biological beings being able to breed and age so they wait 'til the day significantly advanced androids will appear to summon them so they can genocide all living life from the galaxy/universe. It's not that interesting, really. What's more fucked up is an Android (not even a Shoji-tier one, but a Soong droid) being able to mind meld to even get to said information.

 

[Miller]

some pretty eccentric fabrics.

I member the public bus fabric of 90s Trek.

why did Picard tell everyone he was ill? It served no purpose.

Goldsman is planting the seeds for the inevitable scene with JL uploading himself into the golem.

you know what, sure, there's another Soong out there. Whatever.

Is it possible though? I always thought that Soong (the one who designed Data and the others) couldn't have kids.

It felt weird hearing Picard say he loved someone so casually.

I agree, it took him 7 seasons (and 20+ years in-universe probably) to admit that he loved Beverly since the first day they met. Him, saying "I love you" to Raffi was really strange. TNG Picard was a very private person who made sure to never show his feelings to his crew.
Sutra (the 3rd Dahj/Soji model) can somehow do the vulcan mind-meld because she enjoys the vulcan culture so much... Really?! At least it made sense when Archer used the mind-meld on ENT because he carried Surak's katra.
Also why did the Borg cube follow the not-Rocinante and the Romulan scout ship to that planet? Why would Seven get involved in this shit show when she is already too busy being a vigilante for the something Rangers?

Whoa whoa whoa. What's this about higher beings again?

Member Mass Effect? Member the Reapers?

 

[Flexo]

Something something ancient ones who are low-key seething over biological beings being able to breed and age so they wait 'til the day significantly advanced androids will appear to summon them so they can genocide all living life from the galaxy/universe. It's not that interesting, really. What's more fucked up is an Android (not even a Shoji-tier one, but a Soong droid) being able to mind meld to even get to said information.

Member Mass Effect? Member the Reapers?

I was just thinking that. They are LITERALLY doing the reapers now?

I mean don't get me wrong, I love the thought of ancient robots just waiting to be awakened to kill all humans - but that's also not Star Trek.

But now it is? None of you are pulling my legs? They seriously revealed that ancient robots are going to be woken up by Data or Lore to kill all life?

Seems like the Borg and Dominion alone would have something to say about that...

 

[The Gagh Whisperer]

Same thing with the costumes, I've noticed. NuTrek dresses everyone in generic post-NuBSG street clothes...

...

...whereas TNG-era Trek had a very unique (if also very odd) style for human civilian clothing, often featuring wrapped tunics, odd patterning and some pretty eccentric fabrics.

The guy in charge of most costumes in 90s Trek, Robert Blackman, was very good at his job and had a specific look he was going for. A kind of timeless futuristic neutrality that's near-impossible with fasion, but he did it better than anyone else.

Now, we can judge that with thirty years of hindsight and exponential budgets, but I can't fault his attempts. Considering this was done in the late 80s/early 90s, as awkward as some of the costumes look, they look far less dated than any other sci-fi series made at the time, or even stuff made years later.

It was part of the palette that made up TNG/DS9/VOY, including set, props, lighting, and even filming style which made it a consistent believable world we could escape to.

 

[AverageAnimeWatcher]

I still can't get over how monumentally stupid it is to lift, of all things, the main story from Mass Effect 3. The

Not just Mass effect, there is an even more obvious place he took this idea.

More directly, this is also a ripoff of the Orville. Remember the Kylons and how they killed their creators due to mistreatment? Yeah, the same thing is happening here. Except the Orville did it better.

so the big revelation basically boils down to >yo we're higher beings and fuck biological beings, just summon us and we'll genocide them np. And honestly, that's really boring. Picard and all the captains really have met so many OP god-like beings that this honestly shouldn't even be that dramatic to them. Like, when all this was going on, I was wondering if Q would pop up in the last episode and just yeet the bio-haters out of the galaxy because they wanted to hurt his husbando Picard.

Not gonna lie, I don't know if Kurtzman made this intentionally in a failed attempt to be morally ambiguous, but I see no reason we shouldn't be rooting for the Romulans instead of the "synths" here.

I mean, sabotage on mars and good androids like Data aside, turns out they are 100% right in their fears. that sufficiently advanced androids will eventually be the end of all organic life as we know it.

You can't even say it was the fault of the ban on androids because we already got some evil androids like lore and the other Soji there. And they already said they do want to do it.

I guess it's in character for Picard to find a middle ground peaceful solution so no complaints there. But even he should know what's at stake here. Remember what happened in the Orville? The crew had no problem befriending an android in Isaac, and even tried diplomacy, but once the Kylons went in genocide mode, it was time for the good guys to defend themselves with violence.

I do not understand what the show is trying to make me feel concerning Agnes.

That's an issue that's been bothering me since Nephente (aka Memberberries Riker And Troi episode). The show assumes people in-universe are all aware they are supposed to be "the new crew" so it's just rushing to that conclusion as if the characters had already seen the scripts and already knew they were supposed to be friends.

In reality, they shouldn't be close together at all. The captain is a mercenary giving them a ride for money and the others literally just met a few days ago and are just, supposedly, temporarily together, but, for some reason, Picard already considers them "his crew".

Also, the show already knows Agnes is a protagonist so it assumes we will forgive Agnes as just a poor victim when she killed Bruce Madox, so the characters don't question her beyond some mild slaps on the wrists and then move on to accept her in.

As for Soji's Romulan boyfriend, who was trying to save every living being in the whole galaxy by killing her? Well, he is a monster deserving of the disdain of everyone. No one even tries to understand his motives. It's as if the characters had already read the script that he is a bad guy.