Star Trek - Space: The Final Frontier

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RomanesEuntDomus said:
"You don't want to watch this trite shitty movie without a single fucking decent line, shot or sequence in the entire trailer? What are you? A bigot?!"
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Exceptionally Exceptional said:
If these cunts actually knew ANYTHING about what the fans want it's that we want something far more akin to the old Trek.
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Before Current Year: "The viewers don't like it. How can we change it to make it more appealing?"

During Current Year: "The viewers don't like it. They're bigots, so keep it going until they're not."
 
Sexual Chocolate said:
You're crazy, Superman 3 was good.

Richard Pryor's plan to steal money via computer was way ahead of its time. Superman as a mean drunk causing chaos, trolling Italians, then getting into a fist fight with himself in a junkyard was awesome. The part where the evil lady turns into a cyborg monster was terrifying to kids at the time.
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ToroidalBoat said:
Before Current Year: "The viewers don't like it. How can we change it to make it more appealing?"

During Current Year: "The viewers don't like it. They're bigots, so keep it going until they're not."
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Oh I think its more a case of a single problem existing eternally in any franchise big or small sooner or later...

"fuck! our show sucks and none of us have enough talent or interest in the franchise to try and fix it. What do we do?!"

Before current year: "We need to throw in every cheap and flashy mass marketing gimmick we can think of in order to keep the numbers of viewers up.

Sex, explosions, fcking car chases, fart jokes, whatever it takes to jangle shiny keys in front of the faces of mindless consumers enough for us to make a big enough profit to launch us onto our next project.

Screw what the critics say, they dont pay our fucking bills so we can ignore them as we just want to get paid and nobody in the industry takes critics seriously anyway."
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During current year: "We need to crowbar in every single fashionable media goon gimmick possible in order to make dumbass critics and social media retards spam 5 star reviews and positive twitter coverage at us.

Wokesped shit, buzzwords, trendy media narratives, pop cultural references, whatever it takes to increase our own profile among these mindless clout chasing retards enough for us to gather enough prestige to get a cushier new job when this shit inevitably tanks.

Screw the viewers, these fucking proles and their opinions are of no consequence, and even if literally nobody watches or buys our shit distributers will still pick it up and throw money at us based on all the buzz we have been getting among media goons and twitter."
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I also strongly suspect that the contracting system of writers and such changed during the writers strike of the late 00s along with probably a bunch more shake ups in the pop culture industries which resulted in...
a) writers getting guaranteed chunks of money no matter the quality of work they turned in​
b) far cheaper writers with far less clout becoming far more favoured to ensure said chunk of money would not be particularly big​
c) studios and distributors proactively rewarding positive media coverage in and of itself regardless of financial success hoping this would improve the reputation of their brand​
​
Which in hindsight would have been the perfect set up for the cynical prestige/reputational grift shitty media hacks have been pushing this past decade since it allows them to game the system and get lavish pay and praise and advancement for absolute fucking unprofitable car crashes that lose a tonne of money and are so poor quality they are forgotten within less than a year, all while the industry CEOs try to quietly figure out how in the hell they can unfuck this system without torching their own careers
 
RomanesEuntDomus said:
Admittedly, Patrick Stewart hasn't keeled over yet, so I would not be surprised if that was the impetus to replace normal Picard with some dangerhair muslim troon and claim it's the same character.
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"Engage"
 
Just rewatched Datalore and noticed that after they beam Lore out into space Data uses a contraction, specifically when Picard asks if he's okay he says "Yes sir, I'm fine." right before doing one of Lore's facial tics.

Think that was on purpose? I mean, given that the fact that Lore uses contractions and Data doesn't is actually addressed in the fucking episode you'd think they'd have been on the lookout for that shit more than normal. And you can't argue that the facial tic Lore gave him caused it because it didn't make Data use any contractions until just that moment, and Lore was still using the after correcting the tic in himself.

Just seems like something someone should have noticed.
 
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Exceptionally Exceptional said:
Just rewatched Datalore and noticed that after they beam Lore out into space Data uses a contraction, specifically when Picard asks if he's okay he says "Yes sir, I'm fine." right before doing one of Lore's facial tics.

Think that was on purpose? I mean, given that the fact that Lore uses contractions and Data doesn't is actually addressed in the fucking episode you'd think they'd have been on the lookout for that shit more than normal. And you can't argue that the facial tic Lore gave him caused it because it didn't make Data use any contractions until just until that moment, and Lore was still using the after correcting the tic in himself.

Just seems like something someone should have noticed.
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I always thought it odd that a later generation android (I was about to say "more advanced", but I guess that's technically incorrect, and intentionally stated by the show itself,) wouldn't be able to do something so simple that the previous model could do easily.

Anyway, I just re-watched that scene and yeah... that's an odd oversight.
 
UnKillShredDur said:
I always thought it odd that a later generation android (I was about to say "more advanced", but I guess that's technically incorrect, and intentionally stated by the show itself,) wouldn't be able to do something so simple that the previous model could do easily.

Anyway, I just re-watched that scene and yeah... that's an odd oversight.
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Just googled that and there's a theory that the the reason Data can't use contractions is because Soong thought Lore was far too rude and did multiple things to ensure Data wouldn't be. One was not giving him emotions which kept him from developing an ego, and one was restricting him from using contractions in order to make him sound more formal and polite. Or it could have been a method of intentionally setting him apart from everyone else.

However someone on Trekbbs pointed out that it's never stated in the show that Data can't use contractions. Closest we get was when Lore was impersonating Data and Wesley says that if he'd used a contraction he might have suspected him and "Data"(Lore) says "Yes. I do use language more formally than Lore."

He never explicitly states an inability to use them. I guess it's just a matter of him preferring to use them depending on the situation. Replying to Picard "I'm fine" instead of "I am fine" could have merely been a conscious decision to use a contraction because it sounds more human and reassuring than the alternative.
 
Exceptionally Exceptional said:
If these cunts actually knew ANYTHING about what the fans want it's that we want something far more akin to the old Trek. None of this gritty grim shit that they've been pushing. We want to see mankind at our best, especially after recent years when we've seen ourselves at our worst. We want hope for the future, not despair. And that's all they're giving us.

Now if you let ME make a Trek show? I'd set it 20-30 years after the Dominion war. Try to cover some of the shit that's happened since then like the rehabilitation of the Vorta and Jem'Hadar. I'd completely ignore the idea of Romulus being destroyed because for fucks sake we have the technology to figure out that a star is about to go supernova and I doubt the Romulans aren't monitoring their own fucking sun. I would try to assemble a cast of fairly diverse characters like DS9 had because we really don't see as many aliens on federation starships as we should. TNG had worf. That's basically it for actual aliens. Deanna Troi doesn't fucking count.
I'd try to show a fairly positive view of things. Like in the aftermath of the Dominion War the Romulans have become a staunch ally of the federation, and the Klingons are looking ready to join outright.
I would indeed try to do a few cameos of actors who are still alive, and offer some explanation as to why we never see those who have died. For instance Odo, he can't come back because Rene Auberjonois died. How do we explain that? Well the Changelings, even under Odo's guidance, just don't feel ready to rejoin the galaxy. They believe it would be best to wait until it's been long enough that the Dominion is a distant memory. Doesn't stop us from potentially having a changeling tho since there are still The One Hundred.
Quark can make an appearance. Maybe we find out he sold his bar and now owns his own orbital casino and resort. Rom is Nagus so we can also definitely see him on occasion. Perhaps Garak has managed to gain some sort of high ranking office in the new Cardassian government. We can even have an episode where we see old Ben Sisko, having returned from his time with the Prophets and returned to settle down on Bajor as a sort of spiritual leader. Maybe Cassidy Yates waited for him and he got his happily ever after after all. Maybe we see Jake. Maybe we see Dax and Julian. Maybe we see Worf and Martok. We could see Janeway, Harry Kim, Tom Paris, who the fuck ever.

One of the biggest problems I'm seeing with the new Trek is that it's a lot less episodic. There's this insistence that everything must be part of some overarching plot, like the Romulan-Synth shit. Star Trek is always at it's best when you free yourself up to do whatever the fuck you want, and sticking to a set story for an entire season with no room to breathe is the best way to fuck up Trek.
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I have to disagree heavily by setting an optimistic story after the Dominion War. Pretty much every major power in the Alpha Quadrant was shattered. Earth, Tellar, and Betazed got hit, so the Feds would be more reluctant to provide aid to the rest of their allies when the core worlds were seriously threatened. The Klingon Empire effectively wasted their generation by having two back-to-back wars, and the Romulans took losses significant enough that they can't capitalize on the weaknesses of their neighbors without Shinzon's petrification laser. The Romulan military didn't like Shinzon or the Tal Shiar commissars, but it was clear even in Nemesis that they fought against a common enemy, not to become Federation members. Bajor and Cardassia's roles have effectively reversed, but since Bajor are the Israelis in this story, they'd be more interested in jealously defending their borders and only expand from actual defensive wars. The Dominion has absolutely no reason to open trade relations,* so the Wormhole is effectively a wall, not a trading port, which restricts the growth of the Bajoran economy. Without a large, mostly untouched economy--like America--to rebuild, reconstruction will be slow, which creates an environment for cynical actors, not optimistic ones.

What I would pick assuming CBS was on-board would be a Star Trek series set between 2300 and 2340, preferably the 2320s for unironic current year sync. The Kithomer Accords have been interstellar law for a while, the Romulans have pulled out after the Tomed Incident (which is looking more and more like 9/11 the way the novels are describing it), and the Feds have no major enemies, which will allow them to explore and meet aliens of the week. If those episodes don't work, then a cold war with the Cardassians can be introduced. Star Trek novels of that time frame can be canonized or dismissed based on viewer reaction. Basically take what we learned from Enterprise and apply it to this show.

*Remember that the Dozi and other Dominion client races do business under Dominion approval.
 
Exceptionally Exceptional said:
He never explicitly states an inability to use them. I guess it's just a matter of him preferring to use them depending on the situation. Replying to Picard "I'm fine" instead of "I am fine" could have merely been a conscious decision to use a contraction because it sounds more human and reassuring than the alternative.
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I'm not going to pretend that I offhand knew of any times that Data used contractions. (I've never watched through TNG with the intention of finding instances where he used one, but I guess some people have....) I did however remember him explicitly saying that he couldn't, er... could not use them. Anyway, I looked it up and I found this...
(I started the video 27 seconds in just to skip Lore berating Data for not using contractions, which we already covered. And also to start at the point where Data explicitly says that his program does not allow him to use contractions.) And yeah, the rest of the video is him using them anyway. They were production mistakes.
 
UnKillShredDur said:
I'm not going to pretend that I offhand knew of any times that Data used contractions. (I've never watched through TNG with the intention of finding instances where he used one, but I guess some people have....) I did however remember him explicitly saying that he couldn't, er... could not use them. Anyway, I looked it up and I found this...
https://youtube.com/watch?v=yY1KdQNodN0:27(I started the video 27 seconds in just to skip Lore berating Data for not using contractions, which we already covered. And also to start at the point where Data explicitly says that his program does not allow him to use contractions.) And yeah, the rest of the video is him using them anyway. They were production mistakes.
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To be fair, he does say it's a skill his program has "never mastered" not "is incapable of". But yeah, it probably was just Brent forgetting to not use contractions.
 
Exceptionally Exceptional said:
To be fair, he does say it's a skill his program has "never mastered" not "is incapable of". But yeah, it probably was just Brent forgetting to not use contractions.
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I know you're starting to agree with me, but come on man XD.

If Data (canonically) *could*, but simply didn't often use contractions, then Lal using them once wouldn't have gotten that reaction from Guinan, and especially not from Data when she did it once.
 
Exceptionally Exceptional said:
Just rewatched Datalore and noticed that after they beam Lore out into space Data uses a contraction, specifically when Picard asks if he's okay he says "Yes sir, I'm fine." right before doing one of Lore's facial tics.

Think that was on purpose? I mean, given that the fact that Lore uses contractions and Data doesn't is actually addressed in the fucking episode you'd think they'd have been on the lookout for that shit more than normal. And you can't argue that the facial tic Lore gave him caused it because it didn't make Data use any contractions until just that moment, and Lore was still using the after correcting the tic in himself.

Just seems like something someone should have noticed.
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Knowing early TNG it might have been a sequel hook the writers just abandoned/forgot about.

UnKillShredDur said:
I did however remember him explicitly saying that he couldn't, er... could not use them. Anyway, I looked it up and I found this...
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Its also the first thing that comes up in that old Star Trek Paradox song.
 
Some of them gave some good performances but later turned out to be some shitty, egotistical, condescending wokescolds. Except Will Wheaton. Will Wheaton has ALWAYS sucked, he just sucks even more now. And Marina Sirtis, love her as much as I do, have to admit she gave some terrible performances at times.

At least we will always have that absolute chad Kirk. The best Starfleet Captain who ever claimed the rank.
Shatner's performance was really stand out, and he goddamn knew it. And to this day he remains a chad while lesser men around him have fallen into virgin and even soyjack levels.
william-shatner-87-birthday.jpg

God bless you, Captain Kirk.
 
UnKillShredDur said:
You know, I was about to shit on this... But I think history has proven you correct... God that hurts.
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Castranking goes DS9-TOS- endless space- ENT-VOY-TNG. the last 3 are ranked by hotness because they all have some good performances and alot of real bad ones.


DS9 has the best captain, the hottest woman and a brilliant supporting cast.
 
Exceptionally Exceptional said:
Just rewatched Datalore and noticed that after they beam Lore out into space Data uses a contraction, specifically when Picard asks if he's okay he says "Yes sir, I'm fine." right before doing one of Lore's facial tics.

Think that was on purpose? I mean, given that the fact that Lore uses contractions and Data doesn't is actually addressed in the fucking episode you'd think they'd have been on the lookout for that shit more than normal. And you can't argue that the facial tic Lore gave him caused it because it didn't make Data use any contractions until just that moment, and Lore was still using the after correcting the tic in himself.

Just seems like something someone should have noticed.
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It's been an old joke meme for awhile. SFDebris even made a joke about it back in the day.

Exceptionally Exceptional said:
Just googled that and there's a theory that the the reason Data can't use contractions is because Soong thought Lore was far too rude and did multiple things to ensure Data wouldn't be. One was not giving him emotions which kept him from developing an ego, and one was restricting him from using contractions in order to make him sound more formal and polite. Or it could have been a method of intentionally setting him apart from everyone else.

However someone on Trekbbs pointed out that it's never stated in the show that Data can't use contractions. Closest we get was when Lore was impersonating Data and Wesley says that if he'd used a contraction he might have suspected him and "Data"(Lore) says "Yes. I do use language more formally than Lore."

He never explicitly states an inability to use them. I guess it's just a matter of him preferring to use them depending on the situation. Replying to Picard "I'm fine" instead of "I am fine" could have merely been a conscious decision to use a contraction because it sounds more human and reassuring than the alternative.
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Actually it's also mentioned in the episode with data's daughter.
 
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