Tesla Hate Thread - oh and come seethe about EVs in general with me

Is Tesla Gay?


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Ignores at a minimum the giant elephant in the room which is battery replacement, like you could even do it yourself now that these companies have started gluing them down.

You got battery replacement costs, service and man hour costs, also software which only certain companies like Tesla can only work on so the costs just pile on.

But of course it's 22 percent less maintence then those evil polluting gas cars that only evil, right wing Trumpler racists nazis drive while I drive a leaf because I care about the planet and mother gaia and bow at the feet of Greta Thunberg.
 
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A VFD and brushless speed controller aren't that different, but they definitely aren't the same thing.
What type of motor is used in large multi-copters? I always assumed those were AC, but am I wrong?
 
What type of motor is used in large multi-copters? I always assumed those were AC, but am I wrong?
DC Brushless. These motors use Pulse Width Modulation of DC voltage instead of varying AC frequency to control the speed.
2. 20:1 compression in overboosted, undersized ICE engines.
Thank you for more proof you know nothing about cars. Super high compression and forced induction are not compatible in any way, shape, or form. Even us knuckle-dragging diesel guys use lower compression pistons and more boost to make number get bigger.
Also no car enthusiest who turns their own wrenches need high performance or off road fuels to make big numbers. You can easily get big numbers on 87 out of a LS V8 or a Honda K motor.
No one is making 400+ hp out of a K24 on 87. Pump gas? Sure, but it's 91 or 93. Lots of turbski guys run E85 to push more boost without going broke driving. AvGas was the redneck E85 of yesteryear. My uncle and his friends used to buy from the crop dusting outfit's bulk tank.
 
What type of motor is used in large multi-copters? I always assumed those were AC, but am I wrong?
The stuff in RC copters and airplanes are indeed BLDC that are driven by a DC current from the battery and the ESC. I think the confusion lies with the fact 3 wires are used on BLDC motors, which is an AC current but chopped essentially making it like PWM. You can swap any of the 2 motor wires around to reverse direction. The ESC takes the DC from the battery and makes it a 3 phase AC to power the motor. Unlike VFD for induction motors, the ESC doesn't bother with any frequencies as the permanent magnet BLDC motor already produces its own, which the ESC then reads via back emf every off phase (the voltage generated by the motor as it spins) and can adjust speed of the motor by controlling the output voltage. The ESC also essentially acts as the commutator for BLDC motors so it does a pretty big job in timing the motor to attain a balance between efficiency and power.

Because these RC brushless motors are mass produced from China, there is expected to be a variance in how they're tuned mechanically. Good ESC software like BL heli was and is still such a big deal cause it does a good job of keeping multiple motors in sync for extreme quadcopter flying.
 
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Outside of that it’s an apples and oranges comparison.
I literally compared like to like. Same manufacturer, same model year, same trim options. The only difference is the drivetrain, and for that difference, you pay an extra 15k and end up with reduced performance and versatility, and more weight (meaning more more road wear, increasing maintenance costs, and faster tyre wear, which means more expense for the owner).

Also, the referenced 60 mile (really 87 mile) test was pretty much optimized to maximize battery consumption.
It was a trailer with a reasonably aerodynamic front, quite typical of the sort of thing a truck would be expected to haul. Both trailers were empty. If you think that's optimised for maximum consumption, then I don't know what to say to you, other than it's clear you also don't understand aerodynamics or towing on top of everything else. They compared it to a 6 litre V8, which ended the test at the same point as the electric with nearly 130 miles of range left in the tank.

Electric trucks are even more stupid than electric cars, and you're stupid for trying to defend them.
 
Substantially less frequent brake service, no trannies to dialate, engine cooling system has almost no service and is a lot simpler, no fuel system, no emissions , climate control is ridiculously simple, no starting system or ignition system…. The cars are just mechanically simpler. Elon demands innovation by eliminating things that are complex. There is a lot of beautiful engineering in making things simple that I appreciate.

Oil changes right now are something like $60 to $100, three to six times a year, depending on how much you drive. Flushing a transmission costs a little more (it was around $175 a few years ago) and really shouldn't need to be done more than once or twice, ever. Pads and rotors are also an "every few years" type job and "maybe a couple hundred bucks."

By the time you are in the price range where you are considering a $60,000 car, routine maintenance is a rounding error. Saving on oil changes and brake pads would arguably matter if we were talking about $10K shitboxes, but we're not. Meanwhile, the electric motor itself is a $15K premium, and that's with several K government subsidies. The maintenance savings will never pay for themselves. "Muh maintenance" is a penny-wise, pound-foolish argument.

We've had this exact discussion earlier in this thread, but you apparently can't learn math.
 
Oil changes right now are something like $60 to $100, three to six times a year, depending on how much you drive. Flushing a transmission costs a little more (it was around $175 a few years ago) and really shouldn't need to be done more than once or twice, ever. Pads and rotors are also an "every few years" type job and "maybe a couple hundred bucks."

By the time you are in the price range where you are considering a $60,000 car, routine maintenance is a rounding error. Saving on oil changes and brake pads would arguably matter if we were talking about $10K shitboxes, but we're not. Meanwhile, the electric motor itself is a $15K premium, and that's with several K government subsidies. The maintenance savings will never pay for themselves. "Muh maintenance" is a penny-wise, pound-foolish argument.

We've had this exact discussion earlier in this thread, but you apparently can't learn math.

I think you missed his other nonsensical points.

1. Brakes and rotors (and suspension) are equivalent for ICE and EV. No points there.
2. Cooling system as no service? You still have a service interval for the battery coolant FLUID (lol) change. Verdict is out on this one.
3. No fuel system or emissions - well duh. But the "fuel" system is exchanged out with a heavy duty electrical system. No points!
4. Staring or ignition - same as above. No, but let's be real. Starter, alternator, spark plugs have been replaced with an arguably more complex electrical distribution system. You know what one of the worst things to debug in any car EV or ICE? The god damn electrical system. - No points!


Mechanically simpler than ICE? Sure.
Electrically simpler? LOL, are you on crack?

I am sure over time we will have far more data on what is easier for people to maintain and operate with an EV and what is not. I am, nor should anyway, be under any delusion that EVs are zero cost and maintenance free relative to ICE.

If you do, then I have a bag-of-dicks ready to give you for consumption.
 
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I am sure over time we will have far more data on what is easier for people to maintain and operate with an EV and what is not. I am, nor should anyway, be under any delusion that EVs are zero cost and maintenance free relative to ICE.
It's perfect marketing for the type of people who would buy an EV, the people who don't actually work on their own car. All they know is once in a while they take their car to the shop and spend money. Then comes along the EV marketing of "You won't be doing that anymore! See? Saved money!" without saying "Well, you'll still go. Maybe less often but when you do it will be substantially more expensive".

Then they go "But I trade my car in anyways before anything happens" aka they never actually own the car. Then they wonder why everything is built like shit nowadays.
 
I think you missed his other nonsensical points.

1. Brakes and rotors (and suspension) are equivalent for ICE and EV. No points there.
2. Cooling system as no service? You still have a service interval for the battery coolant FLUID (lol) change. Verdict is out on this one.
3. No fuel system or emissions - well duh. But the "fuel" system is exchanged out with a heavy duty electrical system. No points!
4. Staring or ignition - same as above. No, but let's be real. Starter, alternator, spark plugs have been replaced with an arguably more complex electrical distribution system. You know what one of the worst things to debug in any car EV or ICE? The god damn electrical system. - No points!


Mechanically simpler than ICE? Sure.
Electrically simpler? LOL, are you on crack?

I am sure over time we will have far more data on what is easier for people to maintain and operate with an EV and what is not. I am, nor should anyway, be under any delusion that EVs are zero cost and maintenance free relative to ICE.

If you do, then I have a bag-of-dicks ready to give you for consumption.
You bring up some good points on longevity of certain components in EVs. My daily driver right now is a couple decade old German car with nearly 200k miles. Obviously with routine care the engine has proven itself to last, but I have had to get the instrument cluster rebuilt due to some failed electrical components. I also had to replace some old relays for my doors. I am very curious to see what EVs we will see on the road that are 20 years old. The first model year Model S are nearing 10 years and we know that the battery on that is a big expense right now. I don't know how many of those are on the road though. As for the other electrical components? It will be very curious indeed.
 
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based electric motorcycle that's relatively affordable
I'd happily get an electric 2 wheeler if it had either extended range and definitely faster charge time. With the states putting in their own charging networks (let's see them be maintained/updated lmao) I'd be happy with a 2 wheeler that has a 200 mile battery with a 1 hour charge time.
 
I'd happily get an electric 2 wheeler if it had either extended range and definitely faster charge time. With the states putting in their own charging networks (let's see them be maintained/updated lmao) I'd be happy with a 2 wheeler that has a 200 mile battery with a 1 hour charge time.
thats gonna be a long while away considering the current level of technology in batteries, sulfur lithium batteries being a number of years away from mass production, the cost of said motorcycle, and the fact most people arent interested in one because of similar reasons as to ebikes or bikes in general
 
The Fast Lane Truck had their brand-new Hummer EV freeze while driving:
That's funny because it's another EV utility vehicle fail that TFL group has tested/reviewed. First it was that Ford F150 Lightning towing test and now this Hummer. Oddly enough, Hoovie is now stirring up drama because his towing "test" with the Ford Lightning is the video that caught the attention of Infowars. It really makes no sense because both Hoovie and Alex Jones are saying the same thing about EV pickups and their lack of towing utility. Hoovie just seems to be kvetching over the fact he was mentioned by controversial figure Alex Jones despite it bringing more publicity and revenue for his channel. Maybe it's all an act and Hoovie is just faking it for the drama. Can never tell these days with these youtubers.

 
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