The Abortion Debate Containment Thread - Put abortion sperging here.

[PhoBingas]

I think he is saying to end welfare checks and the welfare queen culture with it.

More getting at the fact that if we wholesale ban abortion like some people are suggesting, there are going to be thousands of "unwanted" children, growing up in abusive households, hundreds maybe thousands of more severely disabled children draining their parents and or the state's resources. I can poke around to see if I can find the blog but this husband and wife who had one or two very mentally and physically disabled children... Husband dies in a workplace "accident" (read suicide) to ensure his wife has enough money via life insurance to care for their potato children.

Also no abortions means more welfare queens like you said. I'm not sure if welfare / social assistance pays more to families with more children, but imagine if every poor, uneducated family now has 7 or 8 kids instead of 2 or 3.

There might not be much sympathy for the people getting back alley abortions, but illegal shit tends to breed other illegal shit. What's stopping the guy with the horse tranquilizers, shop vac and coathanger from just putting the woman getting an abortion under and selling them off to human trafficking? At least abortion clinics have to pay tax.

 

[Eris!]

More getting at the fact that if we wholesale ban abortion like some people are suggesting, there are going to be thousands of "unwanted" children, growing up in abusive households, hundreds maybe thousands of more severely disabled children draining their parents and or the state's resources. I can poke around to see if I can find the blog but this husband and wife who had one or two very mentally and physically disabled children... Husband dies in a workplace "accident" (read suicide) to ensure his wife has enough money via life insurance to care for their potato children.

I don't see any reason to care.

Also no abortions means more welfare queens like you said.

Not if we abolish welfare along with abortion.

imagine if every poor, uneducated family now has 7 or 8 kids instead of 2 or 3.

"Imagine this silly hypothetical that would be bad."

There might not be much sympathy for the people getting back alley abortions, but illegal shit tends to breed other illegal shit. What's stopping the guy with the horse tranquilizers, shop vac and coathanger from just putting the woman getting an abortion under and selling them off to human trafficking?

Being a criminal murderer who hires a hitman to kill your baby isn't safe? I have no problem with this.

 

[Hollywood Hulk Hogan]

If you really want to make abortions go down, provide access to birth control. Just like doing drugs, people are gonna fuck. Just because you're mad that no woman will let you into her vag doesn't mean everyone should suffer

 

[Eris!]

If you really want to make abortions go down, provide access to birth control. Just like doing drugs, people are gonna fuck. Just because you're mad that no woman will let you into her vag doesn't mean everyone should suffer

I see you're still incapable of arguing.

 

[Samson Pumpkin Jr.]

If you really want to make abortions go down, provide access to birth control. Just like doing drugs, people are gonna fuck. Just because you're mad that no woman will let you into her vag doesn't mean everyone should suffer

everyone shouldn't suffer. But why is that? We live in a society where killing people around 9 months before they're born is ok. But why isn't it human in the first place? If I burn money that's against the law. Assuming that the mother wants the kid does that make it a human? we know that if you kill a pregnant woman it is counted as a triple homicide. We assume that if the mother wants the baby it should become human.

 

[Hollywood Hulk Hogan]

I see you're still incapable of arguing.

It's true, though. You can sperg on and on about how fucking has consequences, but people are still gonna fuck. You can hate it all you want, but it's gonna happen. It's similar to drugs.

 

[Samson Pumpkin Jr.]

It's true, though. You can sperg on and on about how fucking has consequences, but people are still gonna fuck. You can hate it all you want, but it's gonna happen. It's similar to drugs.

if you stop people from fucking they don't fuck. It's as simple as that. If you outlaw fuck a lot less people are gonna be having fuck.

 

[Hollywood Hulk Hogan]

everyone shouldn't suffer. But why is that? We live in a society where killing people around 9 months before they're born is ok. But why isn't it human in the first place? If I burn money that's against the law. Assuming that the mother wants the kid does that make it a human? we know that if you kill a pregnant woman it is counted as a triple homicide. We assume that if the mother wants the baby it should become human.

I agree, that's stupid, too. It shouldn't be considered double murder either.

if you stop people from fucking they don't fuck. It's as simple as that. If you outlaw fuck a lot less people are gonna be having fuck.

Unfortunately, that has been shown not to be the case. People still fucked before abortion was legal, they just did back alley abortions when needed. Fucking is human nature. It's a biological urge that we have. It's pretty much the whole reason we exist. You can't get rid of it short of some really drastic stuff.

It's similar to drugs... drugs are illegal, but people still do them plenty.

 

[Eris!]

everyone shouldn't suffer.

I don't agree.

It's true, though. You can sperg on and on about how fucking has consequences, but people are still gonna fuck. You can hate it all you want, but it's gonna happen. It's similar to drugs.

If you choose not to have sex or do drugs you won't have sex or do drugs. Your argument is stupid and barely worth responding to.

It shouldn't be considered double murder either.

Yes it should.

It's similar to drugs... drugs are illegal, but people still do them plenty.

Yes, because the point of making things illegal is not to control people's behavior. Lefties like you seem to not understand this. We don't make things illegal as some elaborate attempt to manipulate their behavior until they stop doing things, or so people at a statistical level are disincliuned to do it. We make things illegal because those things are immoral and people who do them deserve to be punished for it.

I do not want to control people. I want to give people what they deserve.

 

[Samson Pumpkin Jr.]

I agree, that's stupid, too. It shouldn't be considered double murder either.

I agree too, it shouldn't even be considered homicide.

Unfortunately, that has been shown not to be the case. People still fucked before abortion was legal, they just did back alley abortions when needed. Fucking is human nature. It's a biological urge that we have. It's pretty much the whole reason we exist. You can't get rid of it short of some really drastic stuff.

It's similar to drugs... drugs are illegal, but people still do them plenty.

I watched Dan Carlin's hardcore history on Japan and he told me that people are as malleable as bonsai trees. We can just brainwash people from birth not to fuck. I'm in favour of doing drastic stuff to stop abortion. I'm a baby saving machine

I don't agree.

funny thing because I agree too. I was just joking there. People need to suffer to build character

 

[Eris!]

People need to suffer to build character

I think that's dumb too. I think suffering has inert value. It is neither bad nor good. Suffering can be good if it builds character, or evil if it is caused by unjust actions. In and of itself, however, it is irrelevant. Suffering is not itself an impetus to change things, nor is it bad for a person to never suffer. All amounts of suffering are equally relevant: not at all.

 

[Hollywood Hulk Hogan]

I don't agree.

If you choose not to have sex or do drugs you won't have sex or do drugs. Your argument is stupid and barely worth responding to.

Yes it should.

Yes, because the point of making things illegal is not to control people's behavior. Lefties like you seem to not understand this. We don't make things illegal as some elaborate attempt to manipulate their behavior until they stop doing things, or so people at a statistical level are disincliuned to do it. We make things illegal because those things are immoral and people who do them deserve to be punished for it.

I do not want to control people. I want to give people what they deserve.

I know being autistic and all you can't understand others view points, but people are still gonna fuck. It doesn't matter if you make abortion illegal, people are still gonna have them. They'll just be back-alley abortions. History has shown this to be the case.

And it isn't immoral to have an abortion. It's not your body, it isn't your choice. Just because you think a fetus is a person doesn't mean everyone does. I know that being unable to think from others perspective is a sign of autism, but try to do so please.

Stop being a jerk to people who can get laid. Some day you might be one of them.

 

[Samson Pumpkin Jr.]

I know being autistic and all you can't understand others view points, but people are still gonna fuck. It doesn't matter if you make abortion illegal, people are still gonna have them. They'll just be back-alley abortions. History has shown this to be the case.

If you're so sure of this show me the literature. I think asking for "muh facts" in debates is gay most of the time, but we're at in impasse where we can go back and forth like this forever

Stop being a jerk to people who can get laid. Some day you might be one of them.

insulting people based on sex is very feminine behaviour. very disappointing from someone with a hulk hogan uber masculine avatar

 

[Eris!]

I know being autistic and all you can't understand others view points, but people are still gonna fuck. It doesn't matter if you make abortion illegal, people are still gonna have them. They'll just be back-alley abortions. History has shown this to be the case.

Duh. No one said otherwise.

And it isn't immoral to have an abortion.

Murder is immoral.

It's not your body, it isn't your choice.

I agree, the fetus' body is not yours and you have no right to murder it.

Just because you think a fetus is a person doesn't mean everyone does. I know that being unable to think from others perspective is a sign of autism, but try to do so please.

I know you're autistic but if you want people to see things from your point of view that actually requires effort on your part. You need to explain your point of view, explain your reasoning for it, and actually convince the other person that it's a reasonable way to see things. You have done none of this.
Abortion is obviously murder. A fetus is obviously a person. You have made literally zero arguments explaining a contrary position to this or trying to convince anyone of it.

If you can't provide any reasoning for why it's not murder i'm not going to entertain your empty vapid opinion that it isn't. I'm just going to say you're factually incorrect and proceed with the argument.

Stop being a jerk to people who can get laid.

No one is jealous of your lack of self control.

 

[Hollywood Hulk Hogan]

If you're so sure of this show me the literature. I think asking for "muh facts" in debates is gay most of the time, but we're at in impasse where we can go back and forth like this forever

The whole reason for Roe vs Wade was that back alley abortions were so popular and women were dying.

insulting people based on sex is very feminine behaviour. very disappointing from someone with a hulk hogan uber masculine avatar

Sorry you can't get laid brah. Women generally don't like pro-lifers.

Duh.

Murder is immoral.

I agree, the fetus' body is not yours and you have no right to murder it.

It's not murder. Just because your autistic mind thinks it is doesn't mean it is.

I know you're autistic but if you want people to see things from your point of view that actually requires effort on your part. You need to explain your point of view, explain your reasoning for it, and actually convince the other person that it's a reasonable way to see things. You have done none of this.
Abortion is obviously murder. A fetus is obviously a person. You have made literally zero arguments explaining a contrary position to this or trying to convince anyone of it.


No one is jealous of your lack of self control.

Did you read that from your "Talking to people as an Aspie" handbook? If so, here's a tip: Don't quote it back to people who aren't autistic like you. You still haven't explained how a fetus is a person. A fetus is not a person yet. A brick is not a house yet. Just because in your aspie mind you think it's murder because mommy and daddy told you that it is doesn't make it murder. Life doesn't begin at conception. Life begins at birth. That is my opinion on it and it's no more or less valid than your opinion on it, the difference is that I am not trying to take away people's rights by forcing my opinion on them. You are. You don't actually give a shit about the baby once it's born. You don't care if it would be forced to live a life of suffering due to a shitty mother or a terrible disease. You just want to force your aspie "all or nothing" viewpoints on us normies.

 

[Eris!]

The whole reason for Roe vs Wade was that back alley abortions were so popular and women were dying.

This is a myth people made up after the fact.

Sorry you can't get laid brah. Women generally don't like pro-lifers.

It's actually sad that you keep trying this angle despite everyone laughing in your face every time you try it. Do you think it will work the 300th time?

It's not murder. Just because your autistic mind thinks it is doesn't mean it is.

Right back at you lol. You have provided no reasoning for why it's not murder. Your empty statement is empty and has no argumentative value.

You still haven't explained how a fetus is a person.

Actually I have. Many times.

A brick is not a house yet.

It is a house in construction.

Just because in your aspie mind you think it's murder because mommy and daddy told you that it is doesn't make it murder.

It's murder. If you want me to think otherwise you need to do this thing called arguing and changing my mind.

Life begins at birth.

Why? By what magical process is humanity endowed by passing through a vagina? Why is that the deciding factor?

That is my opinion on it and it's no more or less valid than your opinion on it

Actually your opinion is significantly less valid.

the difference is that I am not trying to take away people's rights by forcing my opinion on them.

Yeah you are. You are trying to take away the fetus' right to life. I, conversely, am not taking any rights from anyone. Murder is not a right.

You don't actually give a shit about the baby once it's born.

Correct. I've been very clear about this.

You just want to force your aspie "all or nothing" viewpoints on us normies.

Yeah, it's called morality.

 

[Samson Pumpkin Jr.]

I'm right forever. Prohibition worked: The thing is, if people were consuming alcohol under guise of medication then you would expect the consumption to be virtually unchanged between the time it started and ended. But what you see is a very sharp increase in consumption after it ended proving it worked. The same thing with abortion. Back alley abortions weren't a major problems

 

[Eris!]

I'm right forever. Prohibition worked: View attachment 1665335The thing is, if people were consuming alcohol under guise of medication then you would expect the consumption to be virtually unchanged between the time it started and ended. But what you see is a very sharp increase in consumption after it ended proving it worked. The same thing with abortion. Back alley abortions weren't a major problems

Back alley abortions aren't any more of a problem than other back alley murders.

 

[haurchefant]

That's like chopping off your arm because you got a small cut. The solution to the black population is forced deportation, not keeping them here but perpetually murdering their babies as population control.

I would prefer that, but we have to work inside reality and with the tools we have. Deportation is not an option at this moment, though I'd take that over abortions any day.

I'm right forever. Prohibition worked: View attachment 1665335The thing is, if people were consuming alcohol under guise of medication then you would expect the consumption to be virtually unchanged between the time it started and ended. But what you see is a very sharp increase in consumption after it ended proving it worked. The same thing with abortion. Back alley abortions weren't a major problems

Prohibition was also a legal nightmare to enforce, lol especially with so many cops and such on the take with regards to hiding it. Due to the incentives to lie to the people who recorded this information I'd also caution you against believing this chart uncritically.

The Kennedys made their fortune off bootlegging, and it only took a few years for the ban to be reversed. I bet that if we banned abortion then there would be similar robber barons who made buku bucks off providing illegal abortions. Same thing as weed, there are people who have made ridiculous amounts of money off weed despite it still being illegal in many places. In fact the problems with controlling weed usage drove it being legalized in many places.

I don't think there would be thousands of back alley abortions or thousands of unwanted children if we banned abortion but I do think that black market forces would fill the gap, as they did with Prohibition and weed and other drugs. That's important to keep in mind even if the threat is overblown.

I can see it now, headlines 50 years in the future: FAMOUS POLITICIAN'S FAMILY MADE FORTUNE OFF PROVIDING ILLEGAL ABORTIONS.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to be all "HURR DURR JOGGERS BAD!", but getting rid of legal abortion will not get rid of the demand for legal abortion. If the ban goes through you'll see hundreds if not thousands of back alley abortion clinics popping up, and people doing crazy home "remedies" to try and skirt the ban.

Bad for everybody.

To some extent, yeah. If nothing else you'd have a lot of pregnant women "accidentally falling" down the stairs. And there will be unscrupulous people who will provide these procedures unregulated. The upside of having legal abortion is that you can tax it out the ass and you can send regulators to crawl up the asshole of every abortion clinic in the country to give them a hard time and make sure they're up to code. (To a certain extent anyway, government being what it is.)

 

[Hollywood Hulk Hogan]

This is a myth people made up after the fact.

Wrong.

It's actually sad that you keep trying this angle despite everyone laughing in your face every time you try it. Do you think it will work the 300th time?

Right back at you lol. You have provided no reasoning for why it's not murder. Your empty statement is empty and has no argumentative value.

Actually I have. Many times.

It is a house in construction.

It's murder. If you want me to think otherwise you need to do this thing called arguing and changing my mind.

Why? By what magical process is humanity endowed by passing through a vagina? Why is that the deciding factor?

Actually your opinion is significantly less valid.

Yeah you are. You are trying to take away the fetus' right to life. I, conversely, am not taking any rights from anyone. Murder is not a right.

Correct. I've been very clear about this.

Yeah, it's called morality.

It is only murder to a small number of people, you included. You can't legislate something just because you think it's something when the majority of people disagree. I would say it's immoral to force women to bear a child that they aren't ready for. What makes your opinion on morals more correct than that of the majority? You can't just say "because I said so", because again, I know due to your autism you can't think from others perspectives, but you gotta try here.

And I've told you many times why a fetus is not a person. It can't survive on its own outside of its mothers body. It isn't human yet.