The Abortion Debate Containment Thread - Put abortion sperging here.

[Strawberry Mirky Brend]

''Fail safe'' comes to mind. Abortion is the next best thing when you BC or IUD fails to work. What do you care what other people do? especially adults.

I would worry about the people who kill and abuse their living children instead.

These are the usual "whataboutisms" that completely miss the point.

Abortion is willingly killing your living children because you are an irresponsible POS who isn't willing to take on the consequences of their actions.

This is a crime against the most vulnerable members of society and how people can conceptualize it as anything other than that in the case of a voluntary abortion with no underlying circumstances (i.e. rape, incest, retarded/disabled kid/parent, would kill the mother in child birth, etc.) is beyond me. Obviously in these cases, unfortunately killing the child I think should be allowed for obvious reasons.

But to me, asking why I care why healthy people slaughter their own healthy children that they formed via consensual sex is a similar question to asking why I care about if people abuse and murder their children after they are born.

Because it's a fucking terrible thing to willingly kill healthy babies, that's why I care.

Being unwilling to care for children or too irresponsible to step up and be a parent doesn't give you a cop out to murder innocent children.

As for the economic argument, there are gibs for people who are "too poor". Whether you like this or not, this is an undeniable fact.

I have multiple friends who were close to aborting their children because they thought they were "too poor" and said not doing so is the best decision they made in their life. On the other hand, pretty much everyone I know who got an abortion feels guilt/regret later in life. I know someone who turned to hard drugs to cope with the guilt of killing her child 18 weeks after conception.

I'm all for the availability of highly effective free birth control for people of all ages for obvious reasons. Obviously, all forms of birth control can fail. It's unlikely, but it does happen.

However, we voluntarily take on other risks with a very low percentage chance of life changing actions for people we love every day though (e.g. flying on a plane, getting on a train, taking medication, driving a car, seeing relatives in a pandemic, etc.).

These risks come as a part of being alive and participating in everyday life.

I think living in a world where we understand that having sex on properly used birth control comes with a very low risk of unintended children and not allowing people to murder children is clearly and obviously preferable to a society where murdering healthy children is socially acceptable if we use the euphemism "abortion" to describe it.

 

[Muh Vagina]

And for the millionth time, it doesn't even matter if they feel pain or not, ending an innocent human life at any stage of life--irregardless of if they can experience pain or not--is wrong.

It's worse to rob people of their bodily autonomy.

and exist only due to the purposeful actions of the mother (in 99% of cases)".

See, there you go again blaming only the mother.

>tfw you disagree with one side but the people arguing for your side are making way shittier arguments

I am the only person in this thread who is consistently backing my arguments up with facts instead of feels.

As for the economic argument, there are gibs for people who are "too poor". Whether you like this or not, this is an undeniable fact.

But most pro-lifers want to take the "gibs" away. Be honest, how many of you pro-lifers actually support federal programs or welfare?

pretty much everyone I know who got an abortion feels guilt/regret later in life.

lol are we really supposed to believe that all of these alleged women just happened to confide in you?

 

[mario if smoke weed]

It's funny how the average leftie is okay with abortion when it kills little black girls. Many Planned Parenthoods are placed in lower-income neighborhoods inhabited by mostly black households, babies have a near 1 in 2 chance of turning out female. So in a way, the left is supporting the dehumanization and murdering of black and female lives, which is kind of racist and sexist if you think about it.

What these lefties should support instead is having less unprotected sex.

 

[SSj_Ness (Yiffed)]

This is a crime against the most vulnerable members of society and how people can conceptualize it as anything other than that in the case of a voluntary abortion with no underlying circumstances (i.e. rape, incest, retarded/disabled kid/parent, would kill the mother in child birth, etc.) is beyond me. Obviously in these cases, unfortunately killing the child I think should be allowed for obvious reasons.

I agree with you on almost everything in your post, and it was well said, aside from a few things like killing the babies conceived through rape. They're still as innocent as any other. It's understandable that the mother may be distressed by the pregnancy, but the fact is that killing the baby won't unrape them and could quite possibly only add to the trauma and guilt they experience. Allowing a rapist to turn you into a murderer is probably the worst outcome in that situation.

I'm all for the availability of highly effective free birth control for people of all ages for obvious reasons. Obviously, all forms of birth control can fail. It's unlikely, but it does happen.

I don't think it's right to tacitly encourage sexuality in minors, especially the particularly young ones. Celibacy should be promoted in their culture and school for them, instead we have the exact opposite. That's not good for society for a number of reasons.

Of course, adults can do as they please, so preaching celibacy to them is unnecessary though it is obviously the most effective form of birth control across the board.

It's worse to rob people of their bodily autonomy.

No, but you might have some semblance of an argument for rape cases. Bodily autonomy which was consensually forfeited is not a robbery. Don't offer your body as a vessel if you're not willing to temporarily sustain your own child. Your selfishness and lack of accountability is amazing.

See there you go again blaming only the mother.

Unless it was a rape, who else can be blamed for the pregnancy? Obviously the father should be legally required to support his family, but it's still the woman's choice to become pregnant. Men cannot become pregnant, despite the studies you might dig up to the contrary...

I am the only person in this thread who is consistently backing my arguments up with facts instead of feels.

Your entire argument hinges upon feels. "I feel like getting pregnant, and now I feel like getting an abortion, because I don't feel that certain human lives have value, so I feel like shirking my natural, moral, and societal responsibilities. I feel like my bodily autonomy which I have consciously forfeited is more important to regain than my own offspring's life."

You are the feeler. It's just that you only feel for yourself.

Butmost pro-lifers want to take the "gibs" away. Be honest, how many of you pro-lifers actually support federal programs or welfare?

It depends on the program, and the situation. Some people abuse it by pumping out kids on purpose, I don't support that behavior. When you see a gang of kids following their mother to the welfare office, that's a problem, isn't it?

I think every natural born citizen has the right to food, medical care, and some form of shelter. But people have responsibilities as well. Don't shit out a bunch of kids, don't do drugs, don't commit crime, etc. You should be cut off after a couple violations.

I know you hate responsible behavior but we should expect some semblance of it from adults who aren't retarded.

lol are we really supposed to believe that all of these alleged women just happened to confide in you?

You expect everyone to believe you're a woman but then you say shit like that. Makes you sound like the incel you accuse others of being. The notion that men and women can have deep friendships is foreign to you, obviously.

 

[Alessonincrippliningdepre]

https://mobile.twitter.com/Amudo_gemini/status/1469622272881315846

 

[Muh Vagina]

It's understandable that the mother may be distressed by the pregnancy, but the fact is that killing the baby won't unrape them

You're a monster.

Unless it was a rape, who else can be blamed for the pregnancy?

The guy who knocked the woman up! We don't impregnate ourselves.

Your entire argument hinges upon feels.

I post links to back up my arguments. You scream "It's murder! It's murder!" Yeah, okay.

 

[Sanshain]

It's worse to rob people of their bodily autonomy.

Why?

 

[Kermit Jizz]

You're a monster.

>person argues from the perspective fetuses have a right to life
>they reasonably argue murdering another is not justified for the comfort of another person
>"durrrrrrr you're a monster"

It's worse to rob people of their bodily autonomy.

>murder is better than temporary loss of bodily autonomy

You're either retarded or disingenuous, this is precisely why I made my earlier post. You are refusing to engage with the perspective of people you disagree with. They think life begins at conception and everything they argue makes sense in that context. But you just ignore that fact and act like they think the same as you and just want to fuck with women. For someone who believes a fetus has a right to life it makes sense to not let rape-induced pregnancies be aborted, the implications would be fucking insane otherwise.

Literally just argue the fucking core point with them, you'll sound like way less of a psychopath.

The guy who knocked the woman up! We don't impregnate ourselves.

Oh shut the fuck up, you're still 100% responsible for your decisions. The man's responsibility has no impact on your own. Try pulling this shit with literally anything thing else and see how it pans out.

"Durrrr your honor me and my friend conspired to commit murder, so he's also responsible. I should only get a half sentence right?"

 

[SSj_Ness (Yiffed)]

You're a monster.

That's rich coming from a baby killer.

The guy who knocked the woman up!

You mean the guy the woman had knock her up? Stop acting like a passive object if you don't want to be treated like one.

We don't impregnate ourselves.

No, you have guys do it to you. That's still YOUR choice. Your body, your choice, indeed. You chose pregnancy, now accept the responsibility.

And to reiterate, I support using the full power of the law against deadbeat dads. I'll go on the record saying we're not nearly strict enough on men either (though currently far more than women).

I post links to back up my arguments. You scream "It's murder! It's murder!" Yeah, okay.

You seem to think spamming Google's first page results for your specific search constitutes an argument, but it doesn't. You have zero framework for a coherent moral and logical position, links don't constitute those things, they can only reinforce them.

Also, you keep dismissing everyone else's sources as "religious" or "right-wing". You've still yet to prove (or even EXPLAIN) how the scientist I linked to is a "crackpot". And, you won't even engage anyone's points.

You're arguing in bad faith and you know it.

 

[Marley Rathbone]

Before Roe vs. Wade: Fetuses painfully torn apart and killed by iron coathanger in back alley, mother also at risk.

After Roe vs. Wade: Fetuses painfully torn apart and killed by medical instruments in doctor's office, little risk to mother.

My how far we are advancing as a society.

 

[Muh Vagina]

Why?

Because the sentient person who has the ability to think and feel pain should take priority. If you had to choose between rescuing a newborn or a petri dish of embryos from a fire, of course you're going to pick the newborn unless you're a complete psycho.

After Roe vs. Wade: Fetuses painfully torn apart and killed by medical instruments in doctor's office, little risk to mother.

See, how am I supposed to take pro-lifers seriously when they post uninformed shit like this?

People are claiming that I refuse to see the pro-life perspective. But none of you are seeing my perspective. So why is it only okay when pro-lifers shriek like banshees and ignore everything I say?

Every single link I have posted has been cited by multiple reputable organizations. So why do you find those links so objectionable?

The difference between me and you is that I don't want to force anybody to do anything. You do.

 

[Exigent Circumcisions]

Where's all the sluts at?

 

[Exigent Circumcisions]

If you had to choose between rescuing a newborn or a petri dish of embryos from a fire, of course you're going to pick the newborn unless you're a complete psycho.

A petri dish of embryos isn't growing. Hell, the fact that it's not in cryogenic suspension anymore means they're no longer viable in any case.

Still terrible at making analogies, I see.

 

[Sanshain]

Because the sentient person who has the ability to think and feel pain should take priority. If you had to choose between rescuing a newborn or a petri dish of embryos from a fire, of course you're going to pick the newborn unless you're a complete psycho.

That's a rather strange analogy. A petri dish full of embryos isn't developing and never will develop unless implanted inside a human.

Meanwhile a naturally conceived and fertilized embryo is always going to develop into a functional human, no matter what. It's just a matter of time. Are you saying coma patients can be killed without consequence just because they aren't thinking and don't feel pain?

Plus, this isn't an evidence-based argument, it's a moral argument. Why is your decision about who should take priority anymore valid than anybody else's?

 

[SSj_Ness (Yiffed)]

A petri dish of embryos isn't growing. Hell, the fact that it's not in cryogenic suspension anymore means they're no longer viable in any case.

Still terrible at making analogies, I see.

She's an uneducated retard, like most baby killers. You can't expect her to know these things. She will just spam links at you instead of acknowledging she's wrong about this, like everything else.

That's a rather strange analogy. A petri dish full of embryos isn't developing and never will develop unless implanted inside a human.

Meanwhile a naturally conceived and fertilized embryo is always going to develop into a functional human, no matter what. It's just a matter of time. Are you saying coma patients can be killed without consequence just because they aren't thinking and don't feel pain?

Plus, this isn't an evidence-based argument, it's a moral argument. Why is your decision about who should take priority anymore valid than anybody else's?

"bEcAuSe iT'S mY bOdY!!1!"

 

[Exigent Circumcisions]

She's an uneducated retard, like most baby killers. You can't expect her to know these things. She will just spam links at you instead of acknowledging she's wrong about this, like everything else.



"bEcAuSe iT'S mY bOdY!!1!"

"She", lol.

I'm well aware of this guy's stupidity. If you go back through the thread you can watch him get his dictionary out and post examples that support the pro-life position with absolutely no awareness. It's more entertaining to just remind him that he'll never be a real woman and move on.

 

[Solfa12]

Most abortions happen in the first trimester and pain receptors don't develop until 29-30 weeks

It isn't murder by the legal definition

Legal Dictionary - Law.com

ALM's Law.com online Real Life Dictionary of the Law. The easiest-to-read, most user-friendly guide to legal terms. Use it free!

dictionary.law.com

I support abortion not because I would personally have one ( I wouldn't) but because bodily autonomy is very important in general

Also, personal story but I noticed how sick pro-lifers can be last year a Mexican woman who I know was sexually assaulted and forced to carry the rape baby by her bible-thumping family

That incident solidified my opinion on this

 

[Bonesjones]

Did they lock her in her room for 9 months or did they just stigmatize it so she wouldn't do it?

 

[Kermit Jizz]

It isn't murder by the legal definition

That's circular reasoning.

I support abortion not because I would personally have one ( I wouldn't) but because bodily autonomy is very important in general

Bringing up bodily autonomy in abortion arguments is retarded or psychotic. The entire pro life argument is based around the idea fetuses have a right to life. At that point you have to acknowledge their right to their body autonomy too,it's a moot point.

Unless you want to argue that a woman's bodily autonomy trumps other people's right to life, you're fucking crazy.

Also, personal story but I noticed how sick pro-lifers can be last year a Mexican woman who I know was sexually assaulted and forced to carry the rape baby by her bible-thumping family

Once again, what is sick about this? It's not a great situation either way if you believe abortion is murder. Murder or rape baby, that's the call they're making. You can disagree all you want about it being murder, but that's not what they think. Develop a theory of mind.

 

[Zero Day Defense]

It isn't murder by the legal definition

So I guess it's murder depending on the country.