wtfNeedSignUp
kiwifarms.net
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- Dec 17, 2019
One thing that always annoyed me with abortion is attaching feminism to the topic, despite there aren't any male equivalents that can justify a claim of discrimination.
The Abortion Debate Containment Thread - Put abortion sperging here.
- Thread starter Sweetpeaa
- Start date
ChikN10der
kiwifarms.net
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- Aug 12, 2020
Lemme try to summarize a few things:
If it's wrong to have an abortion, aren't you literally forcing women to have a baby?
No, because I didn't force the woman to get pregnant.
Thinking murder is wrong doesn't mean I must support your social programs or be a hypocrite. That's a non sequiter.
The medical definition of a fetus doesn't make it not murder, just like the Nazi scientists believing jews were subhuman didn't make the Nazis not murderers.
Targeted genocide might lead to better economic conditions. This does not excuse genocide. Most families would be more financially secure if they murdered all their children. This doesn't excuse murder.
This isn't 1980 and the fundies aren't in charge. You guys need to update some of your arguments. "Men say women shouldn't get abortions, but they won't even ask for directions! What's the deal?"
If it's wrong to have an abortion, aren't you literally forcing women to have a baby?
No, because I didn't force the woman to get pregnant.
Thinking murder is wrong doesn't mean I must support your social programs or be a hypocrite. That's a non sequiter.
The medical definition of a fetus doesn't make it not murder, just like the Nazi scientists believing jews were subhuman didn't make the Nazis not murderers.
Targeted genocide might lead to better economic conditions. This does not excuse genocide. Most families would be more financially secure if they murdered all their children. This doesn't excuse murder.
This isn't 1980 and the fundies aren't in charge. You guys need to update some of your arguments. "Men say women shouldn't get abortions, but they won't even ask for directions! What's the deal?"
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- Feb 3, 2013
You still aren't answering it.
I know you are autistic so this is hard to understand, but by taking away people's choices, you are still forcing them to do something. That's how the world works
ChikN10der
kiwifarms.net
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- Aug 12, 2020
He's being unnecessarily obtuse, but if I may:
Telling a person they cannot kill their fetus isn't the same as forcing them to do anything, because outlawing abortion doesn't make people pregnant.
I don't"force" people to work for their entire lives to feed themselves simply because I don't offer to pay their way through life, nor do I force them to work because I say they cannot just rob a bank. Yes, bank robbery would result in that person having to work less, but taking that option away isn't forcing anything on them.
A pregnancy results in a birth, life leads to hunger, thirst, and needs. That's how it is. Saying "no murder allowed" doesn't mean I'm forcing you to eat or drink, that's life doing that to you.
Now, if you want to sue nature for putting an unfair burden on women, I could get behind that, but I don't think you'll win.
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- Feb 3, 2013
I was referring to in the case of rape... If a woman is raped, she can get pregnant through no fault of her own. Thus, without abortion, she is being unfairly forced to bear her child and all costs associated with it
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- Feb 2, 2019
Men are also forced to unfairly pay for children that aren't even theirs.
Sometimes things aren't fair, because we think to care for the vulnerable supercedes rights to "fairness".
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- Feb 3, 2013
Well, as long as you're willing to help those women pay for their baby that you're forcing them to carry, I don't see a problem. However, something tells me that you won't do that.
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- Feb 2, 2019
Why? Why would you then be okay with it? Isn't it still horrible for women to carry their rape baby? Isn't it her body her choice?
And yes I am willing in the sense that it is the law and I don't break the law. And if it wasn't the law, I'd donate. I've spent considerable time doing volunteer work with kids like that when I was younger. I prefer such support to be voluntary rather than forced, though.
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- Feb 3, 2013
It is horrible to force her to carry it to term, but it's even worse when she's left with the medical bills and the cost of raising the child. An 18 year old woman who gets raped isn't going to be able to afford that shit very easily
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- Feb 2, 2019
You said you didn't see a problem with it and now you say it's horrible regardless. Are you just not very precise with your words (hopefully) or completely irresponsible with them?
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- May 5, 2020
Well why would a man pay for a child that is not even his?
The contract between male and female has always been : I take care of you and our child and you can assure me he's mine and that he will grow succesfully.
How big of a cuck do you have to be to accept this?
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- Feb 3, 2013
I should've said I see less of a problem with it
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- Feb 2, 2019
On average over a lifetime, men pay into the state. On average over a lifetime women receive benefits. The study has been done in a number of western countries.
The state gets its money from the productivity of men and gives in the form of welfare to the mom&kids.
I don't think the study has been done in the US so that part is a mystery, but if we assume, for argument's sake, it holds true then most men end up paying for kids that aren't theirs. Because they pay taxes.
Practically every man is cucked by their state, like it or not.
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- May 5, 2020
Well you can't really compare taxes to child support.
-You give one to the state to support the country/community and reciprocate the opportinities and favour the state gives you.
-You pay child support because you have a moral and penal debt towards the child
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- Feb 2, 2019
They aren't the same thing. That's why I made a seperation between the two in my first post about them.
And because they aren't the same thing, you can compare them.
One thing that they have in common is that it's money. Money going to a mother and kid that need it.
The difference is the source of the money. For one the source is the biological father. For the other it's from men in general. In the former the state only steps in if he does not fulfill the responsibility. In the latter the state organizes the collection and distribution of money.
The results of men not cooperating is similar; the state will force them to cooperate.
Ps. Note that when I say biological father I mean it precisely like that. Even if he was raped statutory or otherwise, or the condom was fished out of a trashcan to impregnate. And of course for some 1-2% it isn't even the biological father paying but the one that thinks he is.
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- Jun 12, 2020
ITT @Lemmingwise gives you recycled MGTOW talking points from 2011
"Some anti abortion people don't want to give out welfare, why?"
"BUT WHAT ABOUT THE MEN WHO PAY CHILD SUPPORT" even rich celebrities get out of paying child support
"Some anti abortion people don't want to give out welfare, why?"
"BUT WHAT ABOUT THE MEN WHO PAY CHILD SUPPORT" even rich celebrities get out of paying child support
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- Feb 2, 2019
Imagine getting angry because someone asked you to explain what you mean.
If there was anything incorrect about the argument you would have been able to point it out. You had 9 years for it apparently.
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- Jun 12, 2020
lol what are you even talking about? are you on the spectrum or something?
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- Feb 2, 2019
Do you have amnesia? Part of that discussion was literally on the top of the page between you and me.
Also, did you feel so caught that you quickly had to edit and add links as if you somehow had made a substantative post originally rather than just the part I quoted, a failed attempt at adhom?
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