The Final Fantasy Thread

[Michael Wade]

Ultima sucks pretty hard for a villain.

He just doesn't emote. There's a brief BRIEF moment where he starts to lose it but by then the fight is practically already done. I get what soulless attitude they were going for but it worked too well.

 

[Psyduck]

I like it when the final boss is just a character by themselves, no transformation into a giant monstruosity or shit like that. Makes it feel more personal, like the final part of the Sephiroth fight in 7 and the Ardyn fight in 15

 

[Gravemind]

He just doesn't emote. There's a brief BRIEF moment where he starts to lose it but by then the fight is practically already done. I get what soulless attitude they were going for but it worked too well.

It's not even the lack of emoting, it's more that his entire presence throughout the game is just

Show up, do bad thing to remind you that he's the big bad, everyone weens about how all-powerful Ultima is, "How can we possibly stop Ultima??", "There must be a way to stop Ultima....", rinse, repeat several times over.

 

[The Fair Lady]

There’s nothing to Ultima that hasn’t been done before or better. He’s just boring and only gains a slight semblance of character when he starts to lose his composure at the end. The most you can say about him is that he has a cool design.

 

[Michael Wade]

It's not even the lack of emoting, it's more that his entire presence throughout the game is just

Show up, do bad thing to remind you that he's the big bad, everyone weens about how all-powerful Ultima is, "How can we possibly stop Ultima??", "There must be a way to stop Ultima....", rinse, repeat several times over.

Oh that's bad too, but anything can be forgivable if the villain has a certain charm or style. This guy just did not have it.

 

[Berrakh]

Ultima sucks pretty hard for a villain.

One of the more amusing ironies of this story-driven series is how often it has flat, weak, or otherwise half-baked villains.

I’d contend there was no stand-out main antagonist until ExDeath in 5. And he was pretty flat (but properly menacing).

 

[The Demon Pimp of Razgriz]

One of the more amusing ironies of this story-driven series is how often it has flat, weak, or otherwise half-baked villains.

I’d contend there was no stand-out main antagonist until ExDeath in 5. And he was pretty flat (but properly menacing).

Pretty sure I made a comment about that earlier in this thread.

Oh wait, I did. Here it is:

This is a problem with Final Fantasy in general. Every game has to end with a generic doomsday villain as the main threat, and saving the world from that generic doomsday villain is basically the plot.

Sometimes this works because the villain is memorable and/or charismatic and has a strong presence felt through out the story (Kefka, Sephiroth, Ardyn, Exdeath). Many times, it just doesn't work. Final Fantasy 13 was a disaster in storytelling, shown by its uninteresting villains who work with convoluted nonsensical plans to frankly stupid ends. Xande was such a non-presence in Final Fantasy III that hardly anyone even remembers him, largely being replaced by Cloud of Darkness, who is even more generic as it isn't even mentioned till the very end of the game and final battle, and is given next to no motivation aside from being pure evil. Nobody remembers that Zemus was the main villain of Final Fantasy IV; everybody probably thinks its Golbez. Ultimecia was as generic as one could get, with no real motivation or character established, no backstory given, and wasn't even seen till the end of her game. Final Fantasy IX barely avoids this by virtue of having Kuja upstage Garland towards the end. Final Fantasy X's villains are so uninspiring, that Dissidia made Jecht the villain representative for the game.

The only mainline Final Fantasy game that attempted to not do the whole generic doomsday villain schtick was Final Fantasy XII.

 

[Gravemind]

One of the more amusing ironies of this story-driven series is how often it has flat, weak, or otherwise half-baked villains.

I’d contend there was no stand-out main antagonist until ExDeath in 5. And he was pretty flat (but properly menacing).

Emperor Mateus and Golbez would beg to differ.

Nobody remembers that Zemus was the main villain of Final Fantasy IV; everybody probably thinks its Golbez.

Golbez is the main villain for most of FF4 until we get the whole bullshit about Zemus being the TRUE evil behind everything. I know this is a highly debatable point to make, but it can still be argued that Golbez doesn't automatically stop having been the villain for most of FF4 just because we have to shoehorn a redemption excuse for Golbez near the end.

 

[The Demon Pimp of Razgriz]

Golbez is the main villain for most of FF4 until we get the whole bullshit about Zemus being the TRUE evil behind everything. I know this is a highly debatable point to make, but it can still be argued that Golbez doesn't automatically stop having been the villain for most of FF4 just because we have to shoehorn a redemption excuse for Golbez near the end.

While Golbez is your main opponent for most of the story, Zemus is the ultimate villain of the story.

 

[Berrakh]

Emperor Mateus and Golbez would beg to differ.

Mateus has drip but he was barely around. And Golbez wasn’t even the main villain + was ExDeath without the ability to murder several named characters.

 

[Gravemind]

Mateus has drip but he was barely around. And Golbez wasn’t even the main villain + was ExDeath without the ability to murder several named characters.

Mateus also had enough scheming swagger to basically become the lord of Hell, and, in a later remake, also the lord of Heaven at the same time after he was defeated. And, in at least one recent interpretation, he was also able to cross dimensions, manipulate an entire race into bending space and time, and basically inadvertently set the stage for Final Fantasy 1 to happen through a convoluted series of events. It can be argued that he's been made more of a standout antagonist over time, and not limited to just his own setting.

 

[Berrakh]

Mateus also had enough scheming swagger to basically become the lord of Hell, and, in a later remake, also the lord of Heaven at the same time after he was defeated. And, in at least one recent interpretation, he was also able to cross dimensions, manipulate an entire race into bending space and time, and basically inadvertently set the stage for Final Fantasy 1 to happen through a convoluted series of events. It can be argued that he's been made more of a standout antagonist over time, and not limited to just his own setting.

That’s just his power level though. All the villains accomplish one crazy stage-dive after another.

 

[Soycast Guy]

AlsoI hear people dislike Ultima. That he feels too much like a standard series staple final boss tacked onto a grittier game. And since he’s so hard maybe he was a better superboss or dlc boss idea!

Yeah Ultima was a mediocre antagonist. I didn’t think he was awful, but he’s extremely generic. It’s especially bad when you go from Ardyn, one of the most compelling antagonists in the series, to this. I just think CBU3 can’t write villains other than Emet-Selch.

One of the more amusing ironies of this story-driven series is how often it has flat, weak, or otherwise half-baked villains.

I’d contend there was no stand-out main antagonist until ExDeath in 5. And he was pretty flat (but properly menacing).

This franchise really struggles with villains. On one hand you have memorable villains like Kefka, Sephiroth, Kuja, Caius, Emet-Selch, and Ardyn. Then on the other hand you have a bunch of shit tier villains, like Ultimecia.

 

[Gravemind]

That’s just his power level though. All the villains accomplish one crazy stage-dive after another.

I mean, it also contributes to his characterization whenever it's been more fleshed out in the remake and other media like Dissidia, Opera Omnia, and Stranger of Paradise.

 

[Berrakh]

I mean, it also contributes to his characterization whenever it's been more fleshed out in the remake and other media like Dissidia, Opera Omnia, and Stranger of Paradise.

Hmmm. Compromise: since I said “until ExDeath” I clearly only envisioned FF2.

 

[Psyduck]

Just finished Type-0 for the first time. Not a great game, but i was surprised by how effective that last chapter was. For as much as i dislike japanese media tropes, they somehow worked in there. That ending got some tears out of me.

Machina and Rem surviving felt like such a cop out, though.

 

[Foltest]

Man, as much as I love this game, It does have some faults.
For one, being only to control one character and not having much of control over your teammaters, makes it pretty boring after a while, as you mash buttons a lot of the times.
Secondly, Some parts of it drags a lot. Out of the Shadows drags on for so fucking long. I just wanted to get over with it.
Otherwise, I still love it.
I have come to the part of the game where:
SPOILERS!
When Annabelle fucking die! Fuck that bitch! You fucking cunt, I hate you.
Dion went out like a boss and about time that Clive and Joshua meet each other.

 

[Gravemind]

>he thinks Dion is dead

 

[ChefKiss]

The kingsglave cg prequel, despite being the best actual part of 15 for example, was originally about noctis and not about his bodyguards.

I was so fucking mad when I played XV and it dodnt have not-ultros and the diamond weapon knockoffs

One of the more amusing ironies of this story-driven series is how often it has flat, weak, or otherwise half-baked villains.

I’d contend there was no stand-out main antagonist until ExDeath in 5. And he was pretty flat (but properly menacing).

The sad thing is 16 HAD good villains and did nothing with them., they could easily have worked Anabella into a more final villain role rather than just largely pointless

 

[Soycast Guy]

I was so fucking mad when I played XV and it dodnt have not-ultros and the diamond weapon knockoffs


The sad thing is 16 HAD good villains and did nothing with them., they could easily have worked Anabella into a more final villain role rather than just largely pointless

Annabella was good, Hugo was a cuck but a good villain, Benedikta was good, Baranabas would’ve been good if he wasn’t a pawn of Ultima.

I really wish Barnabas was the main villain. What a missed opportunity when he was an absolute gigachad in the game. Ultima was so boring.