The Linux Thread - The Autist's OS of Choice

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But my whole point is that Linux will not win over the desktop anytime soon strictly because it fails as a gaming OS for most people. Nothing else matters from that perspective.
Vidya is just the tip of the iceberg of Linux's "plans for market dominance" woes. Aside from the obvious "Windows is preinstalled so it dominates the market" ordeal, everything that Torvalds mentioned about desktop Linux still holds true to this day.
No one is going to develop for your OS if the way you have to compile and package your software is different across every single distro that you'd wish to target, that every distro will have their own ways of dealing with dependencies and having their own potential issues that'll break your software, and that for Windows/Mac you only care to compile for these architectures, choose this form of distribution (installer/portable) and you're good to go, just covered every single instance. There is also no backwards compatibility on Linux. Windows tries it's best to allow you to run Windows 95 software from the get-go, meanwhile if you tried doing the same with Linux, guess what, doesn't work, and it's your problem for wanting to run this outdated software on modern distros.

The so-called "friendly and open Linux community" has this strange internal conflict with what it is that they want and how they want to accomplish it. To me it seems that all they care about is that people who use Windows should use Linux no matter what as long as the StatCounter and Steam Survey numbers shift towards a higher Linux percentage as ultimately those are the only two counters that are anywhere close to showing how popular desktop Linux is, and they are always extremely small, so they feel insecure and whenever they have any significant bump they will run around celebrating them. Don't act like it never happened either, happened when Steam Survey showed more Linux users due to Steam Deck and it happened when StatCounter hit the mythical 5% and everyone celebrated that as a huge win.

Thing is that no, no one will be willing to ditch absolutely everything just to move to Linux like many Linux users wish the world to work, because most people aren't tied to an ideology of using one OS over the other, and if they were to make the change, then this OS has to meet their practical requirements of what the OS is capable of and if it meets their needs. Coincidentally, the Linux community seems to refuse this reality, so whenever people try to convince other people to switch to Linux, they never mention any issues that are unique to Linux, but instead only point to Windows issues that don't exist on Linux. Lying by omission, because if they were brutally honest about all the drawbacks of desktop Linux that still exist then they would validate the truth behind those userbase numbers, which is something they want to reject. All that matters is more people using Linux, period.

And whenever you point out that this mentality is fundamentally flawed, you will be faced with denial and attacks, a defense mechanism to avoid accepting that yes, there are fundamental flaws with desktop Linux that stem from Linux users being too focused on the ideological part of it rather than the practical, pragmatic part of it, and that ultimately it's the Linux community that's dragging desktop Linux down. It's the Linux community that develops desktop Linux, and they are the ones that refuse to bring Wine up to a standard where you don't have to mess around with it's configuration to get your Windows software running. They're the ones that can't decide whether to use X11, Wayland, or develop XLibre and use it in their distros. They're the ones that can't decide whether or not to use systemd, and if they don't use systemd, which subset of tools to use, where differences between them can cause issues that will draw away software developers even further leading to the Linux desktop software ecosystem to be a barren desert that no one would be willing to switch to. They're the ones acting like the vegans of the Internet, inserting themselves into discussions that don't mention Linux to praise how amazing and woe-free Linux is and how everyone should switch to it. They're the ones that say that "the entire Linux community isn't like that" even though no matter where you go online this is exactly what you're faced with, and that's what ultimately forms the opinion about Linux in the masses. They're the ones that refuse to accept this and try and change their image due to their "community friendliness", leading to them getting irritated when reminded of what it looks like to most people. They're the ones that constantly compare desktop Linux to Windows as their main competitor then turn around and say that "Linux isn't Windows" and that you're irrational if you're expecting Linux to be like Windows even though that's always how it's presented to you: Windows but better.

It's an endless cycle of the exact same shit, and if the Linux community was actually smart, they'd go "fuck off we're full", they'd end with their evangelization and constant war with Windows, actually be concise with the "Linux is not Windows" statement and stay in their little 5% userbase niche, not trying to achieve something they'll never will without radically changing the way they approach this war and without radically changing desktop Linux. But as you already know, this will never happen. I'll get the exact same stickers from the exact same users, be told the exact same statements of how I'm wrong, and no one will ever learn anything.
 
No one is going to develop for your OS if the way you have to compile and package your software is different across every single distro that you'd wish to target, that every distro will have their own ways of dealing with dependencies and having their own potential issues that'll break your software

where differences between them can cause issues that will draw away software developers even further leading to the Linux desktop software ecosystem to be a barren desert that no one would be willing to switch to
yeah. that's the problem. there is no software for linux! barely anything to install. I mean, there are 100s of choices for every kind of program you can think of. We are begging for more linux programs if you really think about it. If we get gorillion jeets making more linux webapps then we can truly have a proper operating system.


t's an endless cycle of the exact same shit, and if the Linux community was actually smart, they'd go "fuck off we're full"
crazy. like 6 months ago or something. when I was saying this shit. people didn't seem to like it.
 
yeah. that's the problem. there is no software for linux! barely anything to install. I mean, there are 100s of choices for every kind of program you can think of. We are begging for more linux programs if you really think about it. If we get gorillion jeets making more linux webapps then we can truly have a proper operating system.
Quantity = quality, fantastic thinking that. Seems to be a common defense reaction of the Linux community. "We have the freedom to choose any package you want so it's a good OS!"
xkcd 927 standards.png
While in reality it's just eternal xkcd 927.
 
It doesn't matter because Mint was never specifically recommended for gaming and isn't even set up for that purpose. Slav Power just described it very well. If you want to run your games, you need to fiddle around with Wine configurations, Proton configurations, and what not.
It's been like that for a quarter century now, and I just cannot see how it's supposed to ever change with all these weird people comprising the Linux community. With several distros, if you want to access your NTFS volumes, you now need to compile support for that into the kernel, because something, something, reasons. Last time I've had that was like 20 years ago when it wasn't even cool anymore to compile one's own kernel.
I don't know man, I just install Mint then install nvidia drivers and Steam and it just works.
 
Quantity = quality, fantastic thinking that. Seems to be a common defense reaction of the Linux community. "We have the freedom to choose any package you want so it's a good OS!"
View attachment 8085211
While in reality it's just eternal xkcd 927.
Mind giving some actual examples instead if empty statements?

For browsers we have everything all the other systems have. For networking we definitely have proper tools, and things like Wireguard are supported much better on Linux.
 
No one is going to develop for your OS if the way you have to compile and package your software is different across every single distro that you'd wish to target, that every distro will have their own ways of dealing with dependencies and having their own potential issues that'll break your software
It's very rare that I do not have access to the software I want or need. Usually if the software is .deb or .rpm only, and I don't use either Debian or Fedora, someone has already made a package or repo for whatever distro I am using, which in this case it's an arch based one. Either by the devs themselves or some maintainer. Never had issues finding what I need for OpenSuse either for my laptop.

If that isn't an option, then most of the time the devs will have instructions on how to compile, which varies wildly from my experience. Usually the more detailed the better. This rarely happens but sometimes it does, especially if I want the latest version of something and the repo has one several versions behind. But again this is rare. For an everyday user they should almost never worry about this part.

To me it seems that all they care about is that people who use Windows should use Linux no matter what
If someone cannot be bothered to learn some basic ass syntax for installing packages, or especially to copy paste a command in terminal, I don't want them to use Linux. Literally just as easy as typing an address for a website. If you come in expecting everything be exactly like Windows you shouldn't. Doesn't make sense to do the same from Windows to Mac and vice versa. I always tell people this when they show interest in installing Linux.

If you want to run your games, you need to fiddle around with Wine configurations, Proton configurations, and what not.
I RARELY ever have to do this. I've played dozens and dozens of games now on Linux and most of the time it just works no configuration needed. If there is something weird, ProtonDB has the answer. If that doesn't work, then either search it or ask an AI, but this is rare for me. Shit just works.
Granted this won't be the case for everyone, but that's just part of it. Even on Windows I'll get the occasional problem I have to lookup a fix for. I've had far less issues on Linux vs Windows so far.
It's been like that for a quarter century now, and I just cannot see how it's supposed to ever change with all these weird people comprising the Linux community. With several distros, if you want to access your NTFS volumes, you now need to compile support for that into the kernel, because something, something, reasons.
What fucking distro do you use that makes you do this? Every distro I've tried has it detected in the file browser right from the go.
Last time I've had that was like 20 years ago when it wasn't even cool anymore to compile one's own kernel.
Dude come on.
 
Quantity = quality, fantastic thinking that. Seems to be a common defense reaction of the Linux community. "We have the freedom to choose any package you want so it's a good OS!"
View attachment 8085211
While in reality it's just eternal xkcd 927.
Mind giving some actual examples instead if empty statements?

For browsers we have everything all the other systems have. For networking we definitely have proper tools, and things like Wireguard are have better support on Linux. File managers. Etc. For almost every tool you have competent replacements if not better replacements.

The only thing I can think of where people are going to have any kind of real argument for this. Is media processing. And those come down to opinion. People can use kriita, or gimp (and a lot use gimp even on windows) but they are used to things like Photoshop. For 3d animation they probably use blender anyway. If you are streaming, you are probably using obs anyway. For video they are used to aftereffects, even then people can use kdenlive or resolve and do fine. Again most of the arguements I see between those are based on opinion, and being used to using one tool for decades.

And adobe not supporting Linux has nothing to do with anything you talked about.

If it was a long rambling rant about hardware drivers or something. Sure I could agree, gpu's specifically are fucked on Linux.

If someone wants to make software and support linux. They just need to make a portable archive. Of if anything a .deb. Distributions are named that because they distribute the software, that's their whole job. It's not the upstream projects job to package up everything. At least for software people actually want to use. They will make a package for it.
 
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As evil as propriejeet shit is, if you want 100% instant plug and play, Linux is not and should not be the place for you. At this point I don't care if more or less people use it, I don't care about UX/UI, and I certainly don't care about people not willing to invest a few hours into learning to configure their OS. I do not understand the obsession with simplification. I would rather have Linux forever be a small market share OS than measure up to Windows or Mac if it means preserving freedom, including the freedom to fuck up, learn or fuck off. Whoever said it a few posts back was right: the year of the Linux desktop meme should die and the response to people whining about muh yuuuu ekkssss should unilaterlay be "fuck off we're full". RTFM or GTFO, I say, especially with how well documented and easy to set up 90% of software is these days, Wine, Winboat, Lutris et al included.
 
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I don't know man, I just install Mint then install nvidia drivers and Steam and it just works.
I did mention the issues with current-day high-end gaming hardware. You chose to ignore that... And didn't you call it niggercattle hardware? Anyway, I'm not going to repeat my points.

What fucking distro do you use that makes you do this? Every distro I've tried has it detected in the file browser right from the go.
Rocky and CentOS Stream. They used to be great but now can't even access NTFS volumes anymore. CentOS also forces Gnome 4 on you, so it's no option anymore at all. It's just sad what's been happening.

Dude come on.
It do be like that, Mister Uno.
 
I did mention the issues with current-day high-end gaming hardware. You chose to ignore that... And didn't you call it niggercattle hardware? Anyway, I'm not going to repeat my points.
Like I said in the Open Source thread to someone who was showing the same behavior as you:
Please don't feel the need to expand your sphere of ignorance, stick to what you know you're wrong about.
 
Rocky and CentOS Stream. They used to be great but now can't even access NTFS volumes anymore. CentOS also forces Gnome 4 on you, so it's no option anymore at all. It's just sad what's been happening.
They're server Operating Systems. The only reason they have a GUI is for retards who think managing Windows Server from the GUI is pretty neat. And in the olden days, installing Oracle.

I'm also not sure how hard enabling EPEL and installing ntfs-3g really is.
 
So how to people feel about appimages? From my casual user perspective, they seem to mostly solve the issues with targeting every distro, backwards compatibility, and are convenient to distribute and run, but it feels like they almost never get mentioned in discussions of these things. Flatpaks and snaps I guess are also meant to serve a similar purpose and get talked about more often, but I've so far I've found appimages more convenient, run faster, and are more likely to just work. You can also run them like an installed binary if you stick them in the same folder as one with the same name and permissions (I run ungoogled-chromium this way since apparmor would prevent it from running from appimage otherwise).
 
So how to people feel about appimages? From my casual user perspective, they seem to mostly solve the issues with targeting every distro, backwards compatibility, and are convenient to distribute and run, but it feels like they almost never get mentioned in discussions of these things. Flatpaks and snaps I guess are also meant to serve a similar purpose and get talked about more often, but I've so far I've found appimages more convenient, run faster, and are more likely to just work. You can also run them like an installed binary if you stick them in the same folder as one with the same name and permissions (I run ungoogled-chromium this way since apparmor would prevent it from running from appimage otherwise).
I've found the problem with appimages unlike flatpaks is they almost never ship every single dependency
Its to the point I need a distrobox with Ubuntu to run fucking appimages
 
So how to people feel about appimages? From my casual user perspective, they seem to mostly solve the issues with targeting every distro, backwards compatibility, and are convenient to distribute and run, but it feels like they almost never get mentioned in discussions of these things. Flatpaks and snaps I guess are also meant to serve a similar purpose and get talked about more often, but I've so far I've found appimages more convenient, run faster, and are more likely to just work. You can also run them like an installed binary if you stick them in the same folder as one with the same name and permissions (I run ungoogled-chromium this way since apparmor would prevent it from running from appimage otherwise).
I use them whenever possible. I don't use flatpak because I don't need another package manager and a root daemon. Sometimes dependencies get a little wonky. And building them can be a pain for stuff that doesn't bother(KiCad, fuck you).

For other stuff that's not in my distro's main repositories I'll just hack up a quick containerfile and run them that way(KiCad).
 
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