🐱 The problem with being anti-woke

CatParty

I'm going to do something that will likely annoy you, dear reader: I am going to make an argument about a certain class of people without naming names.

If I do name names, any response will devolve into a debate over whether I am unfairly tarring the individuals in question. That’s beside the point, because the phenomenon in question is undoubtedly real.

That phenomenon is anti-wokeness curdling into reactionary crankery. Don’t get me wrong: as I’ve previously written, I think there’s a moral panic afoot in many liberal institutions. Whether you want to call it 'wokeness' or something else, it seems undeniably the case that a culture of illiberalism has corroded these spaces. I still think the Harper’s letter I signed in 2020accurately captures things:

“Editors are fired for running controversial pieces; books are withdrawn for alleged inauthenticity; journalists are barred from writing on certain topics; professors are investigated for quoting works of literature in class; a researcher is fired for circulating a peer-reviewed academic study; and the heads of organisations are ousted for what are sometimes just clumsy mistakes.
Some on the left still deny this, but they’re wrong. It’s undeniably real and harmful to liberal institutions.
Whether to speak out is one question; whether to make this fight central to one’s identity is another. And there’s a group of individuals who have gone full anti-woke, much to the detriment of their thinking.
What usually happens is this: some academic or other thinker or creative type is cheerfully chugging along in their career, living and working in progressive spaces. Maybe he is a professor, maybe he is a TV writer. Then, he commits some offence, or is perceived as having done so, and suddenly faces an onslaught of censure. Sometimes the opprobrium is wildly disproportionate to the offence. And there’s a very real walls-closing-in feeling, because the hate is coming from people he viewed as members of his 'tribe,' sometimes friends or close colleagues.

These campaigns, I know from first- and second-hand experience, almost always involve sociopathic backchannel efforts to cut the victims off from their social and professional networks; anyone who is seen as 'defending' them (by questioning the charges or the punishment at all) risks getting subsequently un-personed themselves. So, many people denounce or ignore their friends, rather than sticking up for them.

The person at the centre of all this, suddenly finding themselves diminished in status, as well as friendless or close to it, becomes understandably resentful of certain contemporary left-of-centre beliefs and mores. At the same time, he is flooded with support from conservatives and woke-sceptical liberals. The pull must be irresistible – if during this dark moment, one group despises you and tries to destroy you, and another group defends you, who are you going to want to interact with?
This can lead people down a dark path, though. It’s not a good idea to make anti-anything the centre of your identity. Among the most ardent anti-wokesters I’ve noticed an obsessive fixation that causes the rest of the world to fade into an indistinct background fuzz. For example: radical lefty professors are annoying. Sometimes they do bad things, such as leading campaigns to get their colleagues fired or calling everything – everything – 'fascist.' But they are not, in fact, one of America’s hundred most pressing problems. Yet if you followed the most brain-melted anti-wokesters, you would think that professors have more power than any other group in America.

Elsewhere there are anti-wokesters who in one breath decry the illiberal nature of 'wokeness,' and who in the next declare their support for… Donald Trump. This is a crazy position! If liberalism is an important part of your identity, it should be impossible to support Trump, full stop. That doesn’t require you to embrace the frequently dislikable Democratic party with every fibre of your being or anything, but please: a little common sense.

I’d also be remiss if I didn’t point out that many anti-woke types develop an exaggerated suspicion of mainstream authority that leads them to weird places, such as scepticism of Covid vaccines and the embrace of 'alternative' (read: bunk) treatments.

It’s important to recognise that this illiberal moral panic isn’t even particularly popular among Democrats themselves. The Democratic tent is much bigger than the Republican one – it is a much more politically diverse coalition, ranging from exurban centrist 'security moms' who aren’t averse to voting for moderate GOP members to genuine socialists who hold their noses to vote for Biden and Hillary centre-left types.

If you despise wokeness, you should realise your beef is not with the median Democrat. Pro-wokeness is a deeply unpopular movement (if you can call it that), and a very contentious one even on the left, where a range of thinkers, from neoliberals to Marxists, have published thoughtful critiques of it.

I understand why some might believe otherwise. This illiberal belief system is disproportionately influential in many media, academic and nonprofit settings. But even there, there are often silent majorities whose mouths are agape at how weird things are getting – I know because they often email me. So if you’re sceptical of the moral panic roiling many parts of the left, I’m sympathetic. But I don’t think you should make that fight central to your identity, or abandon all belief in American liberalism. The people most responsible for making progressive spaces toxic are too-online weirdos. Don’t become one yourself.
 
Someone seems to have forgotten, or didn't do the research, that before 2015 and campaign season Donald Trump was essentially a Democrat. He only ran on the Republican platform because they(the party and Trump) found they had a mutually beneficial alliance despite not being 100% aligned.


They haven't interacted in years, but Zoe's fat faggot tranny attack dog Jake Alley never let go of Singal's pant leg, lol
The list of things that were democrat that are now republican are probably too big to really list.
 
the hole woke antiwoke shit is n ancien meme at this point. very 2017 which was 5 years ago. woketards lost the culture way years ago. chappelle is proof nobody givs a shit about them that way they keep ging him special. now we call them pedos wich is mch better at triggering them and getting people to turn against them. if we had done that rom the start we wouldnt have had breatube.
 
There is one problem with being anti-woke, and its those people that go "LOLZ, LOOK AT THIS MARVEL FAGGOTRY". Just fucking stop. Everyone knows its garbage. Everyone knows its boring. You don't NEED to keep doing it. I grew tired of culture warrior Youtubers ages ago. You know what? I don't NEED to know about it.

If you're still a 'fan', you're a dumbfuck. There's nothing to reclaim, it is time to move the fuck on. Read independent comics, read older comics, look and watch something else. I used to love Star Trek, gave up on it. Kinda liked Star Wars. Gave up on it. Used to read comics. Read manga instead now. Used to watch Western Entertainment. Now I watch classic movies I never saw, shows critics 'hate' or non-Western entertainment. I avoid new novels and read old ones I missed. I don't buy progtarded videogames or translations, I play older ones or mod them.

There's tons of other shit out there. There's no reason to pay attention to modern entertainment unless you want to get angry about something. I'm through with that phase. When I see people getting angry "THEY'RE SHITTING ON THE FANS". I'm like, 'No, they're shitting on fucking idiots like you who will hate watch it anyway and think you make a point. Don't watch it. Stop watching it.'

I can't stand those Youtubers anymore, its the same shit over and over. There's no fucking need to talk about it. Just ignore it and move on.
 
Singal's alright and the piece is mostly reasonable. I won't shit on his head for not being able to resist low quality bait, as the internet as a whole simply can't help itself these days.

Using "full stop" in conjunction with a period (or in anything not a telegram) should be grounds for having a professional writer's thumbs broken, however.
The piece may sound mostly reasonable because it doesn't try to argue anything specific, so if you feel charitable to Jesse you can fill in the blanks yourself to imagine the reasonable point you imagine he must have been intending to make.

What is considered right wing today is oftentimes what would have been normal for the left a decade ago. Most don't care about gay marriage and they want abortion as open/restricted as France, because what is right wing today is pretty fucking moderate. It's a bit of a stretch to try and suggest that turning to Trump or whatever on the right somehow is illiberal.
 
There is one problem with being anti-woke, and its those people that go "LOLZ, LOOK AT THIS MARVEL FAGGOTRY". Just fucking stop. Everyone knows its garbage. Everyone knows its boring. You don't NEED to keep doing it. I grew tired of culture warrior Youtubers ages ago. You know what? I don't NEED to know about it.

If you're still a 'fan', you're a dumbfuck. There's nothing to reclaim, it is time to move the fuck on. Read independent comics, read older comics, look and watch something else. I used to love Star Trek, gave up on it. Kinda liked Star Wars. Gave up on it. Used to read comics. Read manga instead now. Used to watch Western Entertainment. Now I watch classic movies I never saw, shows critics 'hate' or non-Western entertainment. I avoid new novels and read old ones I missed. I don't buy progtarded videogames or translations, I play older ones or mod them.

There's tons of other shit out there. There's no reason to pay attention to modern entertainment unless you want to get angry about something. I'm through with that phase. When I see people getting angry "THEY'RE SHITTING ON THE FANS". I'm like, 'No, they're shitting on fucking idiots like you who will hate watch it anyway and think you make a point. Don't watch it. Stop watching it.'

I can't stand those Youtubers anymore, its the same shit over and over. There's no fucking need to talk about it. Just ignore it and move on.
It wouldn't be that bad if the commentary were funny or amusing, but that well has been bled dry. Metokur was maybe the last of that breed and now look at him.
 
I absolutely loathe this low tier damage control from people who should know better by now. If you get ass raped by the lefty mob and still run damage control for them, you should be forced to watch your girlfriend take nigger dick for coke money.

double post
 
Yet if you followed the most brain-melted anti-wokesters, you would think that professors have more power than any other group in America.
"I'm not trying to name a group because it's going to incur the wrath of the people I'm complaining about, but I will use hostile language like 'brain-melted'."

And here's the problem. Academics, in various fields, have shaped the direction of public policy and public discourse for decades, if not centuries. Whether it is economists, political scientists, psychologists, philosophers, sociologists or legal experts, these folks have had a significant impact on creating change within the world.

And that's ignoring the impact folks from more 'techie' areas have had in more meaningful/direct but just as important change.

To say that there isn't a significant amount of influence being wielded by these folks is disingenuous. Medical experts, typically from academic circles, are advocating for 'woke' treatment of trans children. There's an encroachment on the free exchange of ideas and speech and is being encouraged by these types who are molding the next generations of thinkers, policy makers and influencers (not in the TikTok sense, in the actual, real-world sense of influence.)

And there are examples of how damaging this shit can be. That bakery that had the full force of Oberlin brought against them because they dared to do something they didn't approve of is a small scale example of such.

If the academics and a learning institution can inflict such damage to the 'outside world' like that, how you can say that there isn't any power being wielded by these nonces?

Elsewhere there are anti-wokesters who in one breath decry the illiberal nature of 'wokeness,' and who in the next declare their support for… Donald Trump. This is a crazy position! If liberalism is an important part of your identity, it should be impossible to support Trump, full stop. That doesn’t require you to embrace the frequently dislikable Democratic party with every fibre of your being or anything, but please: a little common sense.

I fucking hate this shit. I'm probably more left-leaning that most users on this site, do not support Trump at all, but still rail against a lot of the 'left wing' shit that goes on. It's hilarious that this asshole is advocating for 'common sense' when he straight up contradicts himself within this passage. Yes, you can be 'anti-woke' without hating the Democratic party (who are replete with issues that are driving voters away in droves. See also the other A&N post titled 'With Roe v Wade overturned ,why aren't we winning?' or whatever it was) but you can also not be a fan of Donald Trump/the GOP and still be 'anti-woke.' They are not mutually exclusive things.

I’d also be remiss if I didn’t point out that many anti-woke types develop an exaggerated suspicion of mainstream authority that leads them to weird places, such as scepticism of Covid vaccines and the embrace of 'alternative' (read: bunk) treatments.

This is a problem in general and is hardly exclusive to 'anti-woke' types, it just manifests differently. The type he's talking about here go down weird conspiracy holes and become 'radicalized' while the type he's not talking about become sexual deviants/predators and 'radicalized' because they're going down different rabbit holes.

It’s important to recognise that this illiberal moral panic isn’t even particularly popular among Democrats themselves. The Democratic tent is much bigger than the Republican one – it is a much more politically diverse coalition, ranging from exurban centrist 'security moms' who aren’t averse to voting for moderate GOP members to genuine socialists who hold their noses to vote for Biden and Hillary centre-left types.

This is the issue with the current Democratic party in the States. It's trying to be everything to everyone and ends up being nothing to no one. The GOP has their voter base more or less locked in and whether you agree or disagree with their policies, you know more or less where they stand. The Democrat platform is built on quicksand and constantly shifts and churns. This is a problem, not a strength.


If you despise wokeness, you should realise your beef is not with the median Democrat. Pro-wokeness is a deeply unpopular movement (if you can call it that), and a very contentious one even on the left, where a range of thinkers, from neoliberals to Marxists, have published thoughtful critiques of it.

We go from talking about academics in Ivory Towers to talking about your Joe Sixpack Democrat voter. These are not the same things and it's this bullshit conflation that is driving people up the fucking walls with this nonsense.
 
The anti-woke crowd is 99% man-children sitting in a room covered in funko-pops watching shit "woke" series and movies while bitching about it.

OH no, they made spider man "insert thing here" better go watch all the movies and buy merchandise so i cant rant about how WOKE it is.
I stooped watching it and consuming it if it is preachy.
We're not anti-woke, wokeness is just a different brand of Marxism. You take the class struggle of traditional marxism and apply it to things like race, gender, etc. I'm anti-marxist. Also, you leftists are currently made up of sheboons, drag queens who perform sex acts in front of children, and Portland ANTIFA who likes to fuck that city up because mommy was a reactionary bigot when they tried turning their sister into a sex-addicted revolutionary. You are a fat degenerate and are only on here to subvert this forum because people have the wrong opinions.
 
There is no such thing as "anti woke." Just as there is no such thing as "anti-fascist." The left keeps making these titles to muddy the waters on these concepts.


It's like saying "Anti-Nazi" instead of just normal people and Nazis. Many people are falling for left wing propaganda when they even indulge in "anti-X" rhetoric.

You can be anti-X to a concept or ideology, there's nothing incorrect with such a statement. The problem is wokeism is an extremist ideology, so being "anti-woke" is basically going "I'm normal."

In regards to people calling out bad business practices pulling this shit if people do nothing in regards to that culture it will be the dominant one forever, yeah some "anti-woke" commenters don't create a good atmosphere it's no different from typical propaganda sealing the seeds of doubt on those against it.
If you think there's anything such as "anti woke/etc." Then you are being fooled or being used by those of that ideology to attack those who are normal and against it and if something is characterized by being woke, then even if it seems "justified" it's done as a slippery slope to get one to accept it no amount of muddied waters will change that overall notion.

Just wait until the left rolls out "anti-criminal" "anti-pedophile." and more.
 
The anti-woke crowd is 99% man-children sitting in a room covered in funko-pops watching shit "woke" series and movies while bitching about it.

OH no, they made spider man "insert thing here" better go watch all the movies and buy merchandise so i cant rant about how WOKE it is.
I stooped watching it and consuming it if it is preachy.
Hey! I pirate all the manchild stuff I consoom.
 
the funny thing about 'reactionary' is that most of the human race functions that way
we don't fix problems until they become blatantly apparent, which is happening right now
Someone should call climate change policies "reactionary" and watch them melt down faster than the near-zero emissions nuclear plants they refuse to put in their states because of the environment or some bullshit.
 
There is one problem with being anti-woke, and its those people that go "LOLZ, LOOK AT THIS MARVEL FAGGOTRY". Just fucking stop. Everyone knows its garbage. Everyone knows its boring. You don't NEED to keep doing it. I grew tired of culture warrior Youtubers ages ago. You know what? I don't NEED to know about it.
Being anti-woke is reactionary in nature (as it is a reaction to woke ideology) and accomplishes little more than playing into their hands. As you said, the best option is to stop playing their game and look into the treasure trove of old media and overseas material as the Japanese have little use for the West's cultural hang-ups. The MCU is essentially a simulacrum of comic book stories from the sixties to the oughts and now the widely-panned All-New, All-Different Marvel of 2016 for Phase Four that I am prepared to walk away from. Having looked at Marvel Studio' plans for Phases Five and Six, it's obvious that they are still coasting on the leftover inertia from Infinity War hoping that Kang will be the next Thanos. Most of the "anti-woke" commentary is a simulacrum of that, which is why it gets tedious even quicker.

At some point it is just better to walk away.
 
The anti-woke crowd is 99% man-children sitting in a room covered in funko-pops watching shit "woke" series and movies while bitching about it.

OH no, they made spider man "insert thing here" better go watch all the movies and buy merchandise so i cant rant about how WOKE it is.
I stooped watching it and consuming it if it is preachy.
and every woke person is child rapist
 
Just more verbal masturbation.

If you are in your right mind, a normal person, you are anti-woke. You use common sense, treat people with courtesy and respect. You tolerate certain things, such as homosexuality, without glorifying them, and don't tolerate perversion aimed at children at all. These are not qualities of the "woke".

"Woke" is anti-American and anti-human at its' core. "Wokeism" denies the freedom to be different, the freedom to disagree, the freedom to think for oneself. "Wokeism" is terrified of those who think for themselves, that's why they attack so savagely. All you need do is ignore them, or better yet, subvert and ridicule them. No bully does well when ridiculed, and you can't be bullied if you don't acknowledge the bullying. The "woke" are terrified of physical violence unless there are many, many of them.

Open ridicule isn't always possible at work, but quiet subversion is.

"Wokeism" cannot win. Too many ways to express opposition, especially with one's dollars.
 
Article reminded me of some odd comments the other day from Jesse. It's regarding the 10 year old wanting an abortion story. Some right wingers were commenting on how they were skeptical at first because there didn't seem to be evidence it happened, then realize the reason the story was obfuscated was because the mom was trying to cover up the rape.

Jesse then takes the comments about this realization to mean right wingers are imagining the rape was a hoax, even though it was right wingers stating the story was real. It's a weird act of malicious misinterpretation, which is typical with Jesse (likely because he's not accustomed to interacting with right wingers due to being so block happy).



1/ What's fascinating about this is you have a situation where the guy confessed to the crime and is being charged and DNA samples are being taken, but conservatives -- generally pretty law and order-y -- have decided it's a hoax b/c the mom seemed to defend him in a TV interview
2/Why would she defend him? I dunno! This sounds like a pretty fucked up dynamic. A 10-year-old was raped. Almost all the available evidence suggests he did it. That people are harping on the one tiny, strange piece of evidence pointing in the other direction tells you something.
3/ It's particularly weird to make a big deal about this given that we'll likely have a DNA match pretty soon, at which point there is no other explanation. But people will sink to all sortsa depths for ideological reasons.
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Coming back to this piece of his, I doubt he understands what it is that makes people see the Democrats as so extreme or tolerant of the extremism, because he actively avoids trying to understand what right wingers are criticizing.
If you despise wokeness, you should realise your beef is not with the median Democrat. Pro-wokeness is a deeply unpopular movement (if you can call it that), and a very contentious one even on the left, where a range of thinkers, from neoliberals to Marxists, have published thoughtful critiques of it.

I understand why some might believe otherwise. This illiberal belief system is disproportionately influential in many media, academic and nonprofit settings. But even there, there are often silent majorities whose mouths are agape at how weird things are getting – I know because they often email me. So if you’re sceptical of the moral panic roiling many parts of the left, I’m sympathetic. But I don’t think you should make that fight central to your identity, or abandon all belief in American liberalism. The people most responsible for making progressive spaces toxic are too-online weirdos. Don’t become one yourself.
 
There is one problem with being anti-woke, and its those people that go "LOLZ, LOOK AT THIS MARVEL FAGGOTRY". Just fucking stop. Everyone knows its garbage. Everyone knows its boring. You don't NEED to keep doing it. I grew tired of culture warrior Youtubers ages ago. You know what? I don't NEED to know about it.

If you're still a 'fan', you're a dumbfuck. There's nothing to reclaim, it is time to move the fuck on. Read independent comics, read older comics, look and watch something else. I used to love Star Trek, gave up on it. Kinda liked Star Wars. Gave up on it. Used to read comics. Read manga instead now. Used to watch Western Entertainment. Now I watch classic movies I never saw, shows critics 'hate' or non-Western entertainment. I avoid new novels and read old ones I missed. I don't buy progtarded videogames or translations, I play older ones or mod them.

There's tons of other shit out there. There's no reason to pay attention to modern entertainment unless you want to get angry about something. I'm through with that phase. When I see people getting angry "THEY'RE SHITTING ON THE FANS". I'm like, 'No, they're shitting on fucking idiots like you who will hate watch it anyway and think you make a point. Don't watch it. Stop watching it.'

I can't stand those Youtubers anymore, its the same shit over and over. There's no fucking need to talk about it. Just ignore it and move on.
While I fully and completely agree with you on the “Focus on old media” thing I’ll never fault anyone for milking outrage for money.

Say what you want about them but there’s clearly a demand for their content and yes, it’s helping to prolong the woke shit but that’s bleeding the assholes dry, pushing more people to “Our” side (The side of “Check out the old shit you missed as you ignore the modern shit) and ultimately ensuring the pain of “Woke shit” is prolonged to the point where we’re setting a really good example of why this shit won’t work.

It sucks but sometimes you have to let the kid touch the hot burner so maybe they’ll get it through their thick fucking skull that the FUCKING BURNER IS HOT.
 
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