Things You Consider to be 'True'

[Blueberry]

Marriage is a investment into future misery

 

[cumrobbery]

Life's too short to be pissed off all the time.

 

[RepQuest]

Most of the world's problems can be traced to people either trying to get out of their responsibilities or being willing but unable to uphold their commitments.

 

[KingGeedorah]

Child porn is awful. Fuck those people who make that shit.

 

[DuskEngine]

People will work much harder to make the world correspond to their beliefs than vice versa.

 

[Bronchitis that Lingers]

Marriage is a investment into future misery

not sure if you're trolling or not, but I am very against marriage. I'm basically married, just without a ring on my finger and a title, and my heartsweet and I intend to keep it this way. I've watched couples marry young and fall apart, or spend years miserable because they don't have the money to get divorced. It's depressing as fuck, even more so when the people married only did it because:
A) They have a child
B) Pressure from family
C) The title
Knowing that if my current relationship goes south, I can leave and not have to go through with the court system, makes my relationship stronger. There is nothing tying my heartsweet to me other than a mutual commitment to each other. I have never put my name with anyone else's on a lease (dodged a bullet with my last relationship on that since the person I was with got evicted), went half and half on a huge purchase, or furthered my cohabitation with an engagement. It's meaningless to me.
I'm also very adamant about being child-free, so this also ties into a lot with my views on marriage.

 

[Boundman]

Why should they do anything about it if they're happy? Like really, fatness is a bad thing, in absolute terms, but no one lives a 100% healthy life. Like, you might as well go around judging every person for not jogging every day and living like a monk. Also, no, actually fat people can look beautiful. Genuinely. For a big part of human history, fatness was attractive. Tastes change, of course, but you can't really say, categorically, "you're fat and thus not beautiful".

Like, see, the big problem is that you can see fatness, while you can't see other health issues. It reminds me of racism (in design, not in extent). Like, as far as racism goes, I don't think black people or dark people exist as a special category of stereotyping. All ethnicities get stereotyped. Polish, Italian, French, whatever, they all get stereotyped. But the difference is that you can't see frenchness. I think I mentioned elsewhere, but it's like my roommate. My roommate is italian, and he can indulge in his italianness when he's telling a funny family story or talking about his ethnic heritage. But when he needs to, he can drop any ethnic identity and get all the benefits of being white. Like with his job. Black people can't really do that.

Similarly, fatness is one of the few health issues that you can see. Someone can drink like a fish, and they don't get judged by how they look. Someone can be a pack-a-day smoker and they don't get judged (unless they're caught in the act).

I mean, not that I blame people for this. Reacting to someone's appearance is a very natural, human response. But I'd hope people would think about it a bit more and try to temper their reactions.

What do you do when you have a drug addict who's happy? Would you leave them be too?

These are both things that are unhealthy addictions, if you place stigma on the addictions, you dissuade people from it.

I'm also not saying "anyone overweight is absolutely ugly", you can be overweight and still have your health, just less ability. These are people I would exclude from judgement. The people I'm talking about are the plain and simple unhealthy ones, people who are goddamn massive and see nothing wrong with that. One third of America is obese, and I very much doubt every single one of those people are I'll or just don't have access to healthy foods.

Smokers have been stigmatised, past the right point in my opinion. If someone is a smoker, especially in Britain, they definitely are looked down upon by society. Everyone complains that they're a strain on the NHS and should be taken off, but no-one wants to apply that logic to the very fat. All because to tell someone they're enormous and it's not beautiful and we won't treat your type-2 diabetes or your arthritis is apparently awful.

 

[Bronchitis that Lingers]

Smokers have been stigmatised, past the right point in my opinion. If someone is a smoker, especially in Britain, they definitely are looked down upon by society. Everyone complains that they're a strain on the NHS and should be taken off, but no-one wants to apply that logic to the very fat. All because to tell someone they're enormous and it's not beautiful and we won't treat your type-2 diabetes or your arthritis is apparently awful.

Here's the double standard I don't understand. I just saw a Truth ad today with trap music and kool kids acting awesome and NOT SMOKING because SMOKING IS BAD, followed by a Mickey D's commercial. If you smoke everyday, you will have health problems. If you eat McDonald's everyday, you will also have health problems. They're both choices one makes knowing full well what they're getting into. One is stigmatized and one isn't. Obesity and smoke cause some of the exact same conditions and you don't see anti-obesity commercials on TV.

Why are people allowed to call smokers "disgusting" but not people who stuff their face with fast food? I understand second hand smoke to a degree, but if you don't want to inhale the smoke, no one is forcing you now that smoking isn't allowed 15 feet in front of a business, in bars, on planes, etc. yet the stigma attached to it is worse than in the times where you could smoke everywhere.

Outside of a cigar on a blue moon, I don't even smoke, and it still annoys me.

 

[DuskEngine]

Why are people allowed to call smokers "disgusting" but not people who stuff their face with fast food? I understand second hand smoke to a degree, but if you don't want to inhale the smoke, no one is forcing you now that smoking isn't allowed 15 feet in front of a business, in bars, on planes, etc. yet the stigma attached to it is worse than in the times where you could smoke everywhere.

The whole secondhand smoking thing is seriously overhyped. The chance of you getting cancer from breathing in a stray puff of smoke is absurdly negligible. It was only an issue, as I understand it, with bartenders and other people who worked in closed environments that were filled with smoke.

 

[NobleGreyHorse]

All because to tell someone they're enormous and it's not beautiful and we won't treat your type-2 diabetes or your arthritis is apparently awful.

1. Has anyone succeeded in getting smokers removed from the NHS, or told that they were not entitled to treatment for COPD or lung cancer?
2. There are many more variables involved in the two conditions you listed (type 2 diabetes, arthritis) than weight. My boss is skinny as a rail and has severe arthritis, to the point where she has to receive chemotherapy infusions -- which weaken her immune system -- in order to stop the damage her type of arthritis would otherwise keep causing.

And actually, yeah, if a drug addict is kept healthy -- whether it is something like methadone, suboxone, or needle exchange programs -- they are not out spreading diseases to the rest of the population. You'd be utterly shocked, I think, at how many addicts to very hard drugs are functioning members of society. Yet alcohol, a well-known life-wrecker, is legal unless you live in a country literally run by Muslim law, and others in this thread have discussed how cigarette smokers have a tremendous stigma nowadays (kindly keep out of the doorway, please, because I have to pass through that door and I'm violently allergic to tobacco) despite the fact that tobacco can be harder to quit than heroin. But I would tell the tobacco addict to stand in a way such that their smoke is not blowing in my face, and I stay out of cigar shops, hookah bars, and the like, and yet I do not tell them to quit. It is a severe addiction, physiologically and psychologically, and I have even bought my good friend cigarettes during hard financial times because it helps her do the menial jobs that keep her and her permanently disabled husband alive. It is not for me to judge other people's survival mechanisms, and I support a harm-reduction approach (e.g. the needle exchanges I mentioned) rather than throwing the person into the for-profit prison system taking over the US so they can detox in complete misery.

That is a true thing. As long as the person is not directly harming another person with their pot, hallucinogen, hard drug, alcohol, tobacco, or whatever (like, spending your kid's food money on meth, then yes, I'd call child services if I knew this to be true), I am not going to say "Do not do this" because it won't do any damn good anyway. That is another true thing I have discovered in life! I will say "Please stand over there" to a friend lighting up, and I'll stay out of places where people want a peaceful smoke. There are also many more medicinal marijuana users than will admit to doing this (in places where it is not legal for medical use), and since I'm not their doctor, I can't tell by looking at them whether they really have excruciating pain conditions; you certainly can't tell by looking at me that I do. I tell an editing client "The goddamn comma goes right the fuck here, you pillock" (without the swears) but I can't reason someone out of a drug addiction.

Poor people, by the way, have much more fatty, cheap fast food available to them than quinoa salads with arugula under a light vinaigrette. Look up "food desert." It's not just the amount of food you take in, it's the kind of food you take in. How many pounds of broccoli can a senior citizen, especially one who is already fat, carry home on the bus? "Food deserts" are real things and they are a cause of some of the harm done via obesity.

@DawnMachine - It is sadly possible to be allergic to tobacco. I can't even wear perfumes that use the tobacco flower as an ingredient. It's that bad.

 

[Bronchitis that Lingers]

Poor people, by the way, have much more fatty, cheap fast food available to them than quinoa salads with arugula under a light vinaigrette. Look up "food desert." It's not just the amount of food you take in, it's the kind of food you take in. How many pounds of broccoli can a senior citizen, especially one who is already fat, carry home on the bus? "Food deserts" are real things and they are a cause of some of the harm done via obesity.

@DawnMachine - It is sadly possible to be allergic to tobacco. I can't even wear perfumes that use the tobacco flower as an ingredient. It's that bad.

You bring up a very good point that a lot of people (myself included) forget about. I've personally never lived in a food desert, I've spent all 23 years of my life in cities, and it's easy for me to take a health food market or even a halfway decent supermarket up the road for granted. I know McDonald's are often the closest thing to a person's house in some areas, let alone some people just have no idea how to cook because they never learned, and a one dollar hot and spicy and a soda for every meal seems more economically feasible than buying 20 dollars of groceries to last the week. A lot of it has to do with location and how the person was raised.

 

[Boundman]

1. Has anyone succeeded in getting smokers removed from the NHS, or told that they were not entitled to treatment for COPD or lung cancer?
2. There are many more variables involved in the two conditions you listed (type 2 diabetes, arthritis) than weight. My boss is skinny as a rail and has severe arthritis, to the point where she has to receive chemotherapy infusions -- which weaken her immune system -- in order to stop the damage her type of arthritis would otherwise keep causing..

Not yet, but there is definitely pressure building to do such a thing. Considering the way the NHS is now, it definitely will be soon. Which I'm fine with, you make the choice to smoke or eat shit or take drugs, no-one else should take the brunt of your continued choices. If someone said they want to quit and they're trying to quit, that's when I think it's fair for others to give them a hand.

And actually, yeah, if a drug addict is kept healthy -- whether it is something like methadone, suboxone, or needle exchange programs -- they are not out spreading diseases to the rest of the population. You'd be utterly shocked, I think, at how many addicts to very hard drugs are functioning members of society. Yet alcohol, a well-known life-wrecker, is legal unless you live in a country literally run by Muslim law, and others in this thread have discussed how cigarette smokers have a tremendous stigma nowadays (kindly keep out of the doorway, please, because I have to pass through that door and I'm violently allergic to tobacco) despite the fact that tobacco can be harder to quit than heroin. But I would tell the tobacco addict to stand in a way such that their smoke is not blowing in my face, and I stay out of cigar shops, hookah bars, and the like, and yet I do not tell them to quit. It is a severe addiction, physiologically and psychologically, and I have even bought my good friend cigarettes during hard financial times because it helps her do the menial jobs that keep her and her permanently disabled husband alive. It is not for me to judge other people's survival mechanisms, and I support a harm-reduction approach (e.g. the needle exchanges I mentioned) rather than throwing the person into the for-profit prison system taking over the US so they can detox in complete misery.

Getting back to "beauty at any size" and stigma, I'm not against people making choices. Far from it. I'm against the glorification of choices that should ultimately be stigmatised by society. You wanna eat shit or shoot up? Fine, but accept the stigma placed on you if you do. Stigmatise bad choices like eating loads or doing smack through the eyes, that way people stop before they even start because they don't want the stigma.

If you do anything in excess, I have no sympathy for you, whether it be drugs or alcohol or food. People have a responsibility to moderate their intake of things, even if they're using it to cope. If they say they want off then great, give them a hand. But if they continue down a path they've been informed of, then they have no-one to blame but themselves.

That is a true thing. As long as the person is not directly harming another person with their pot, hallucinogen, hard drug, alcohol, tobacco, or whatever (like, spending your kid's food money on meth, then yes, I'd call child services if I knew this to be true), I am not going to say "Do not do this" because it won't do any damn good anyway. That is another true thing I have discovered in life! I will say "Please stand over there" to a friend lighting up, and I'll stay out of places where people want a peaceful smoke. There are also many more medicinal marijuana users than will admit to doing this (in places where it is not legal for medical use), and since I'm not their doctor, I can't tell by looking at them whether they really have excruciating pain conditions; you certainly can't tell by looking at me that I do. I tell an editing client "The goddamn comma goes right the fuck here, you pillock" (without the swears) but I can't reason someone out of a drug addiction.

I live in Britain, if you do things (like eat or smoke or drink) to the extent where you require medical help, that does directly harm everyone else. The money spent on that liposuction surgery could be used to treat cancer or make sure a hospital has the anaesthetics to help the person in a car crash, the money spent on the lung transplant could go to someone with serious lung issues. If these things were private, and they wanted to go out and eat McDonalds every day then pay for private liposuction, then I wouldn't care. Those who do these things in excess (where I'd place the stigma), do affect other people in a big way.

Poor people, by the way, have much more fatty, cheap fast food available to them than quinoa salads with arugula under a light vinaigrette. Look up "food desert." It's not just the amount of food you take in, it's the kind of food you take in. How many pounds of broccoli can a senior citizen, especially one who is already fat, carry home on the bus? "Food deserts" are real things and they are a cause of some of the harm done via obesity.

I agree with this, if someone is in circumstances out of their control then obviously they should be accomodated for. I think where we each respectively draw the line on that is different however.

 

[Marvin]

There's nothing more despised than a smoker these days, and no habit that more people will not openly criticize someone for, even (especially) their friends and family. And the rate of smoking has sharply declined as it has been increasingly stigmatized. It's not like the fact that it's bad for you is recent news. However, the social stigma and actual legislation and regulation burdening the choice to smoke is.

Oh, no, you're definitely right. Smokers get seriously dogged on. And that has produced measurable benefits for the US, as far as lower smoking rates go. But at the expense of being assholish to smokers.

My big point is that being fat is a negative indulgence that people can observe visually, as opposed to smoking or drinking, which isn't immediately apparent. And the people criticizing fat people aren't necessarily that healthy themselves. I think people would be a lot less shitty to fat people if everyone had a "health score" on their forehead.

What do you do when you have a drug addict who's happy? Would you leave them be too?

Yes. A family member of mine has been a long term heroin user. They're very much aware of the risks. They've been pestered for years about it and have been in jail for it and are still going strong. There's not more I can do, aside from drop them from my life.

Like @NobleGreyHorse, I very much favor harm reduction, things like safe injection sites. It's way more cost efficient way of reducing the costs of addiction on society.

These are both things that are unhealthy addictions, if you place stigma on the addictions, you dissuade people from it.

Eh, in practice? I don't know if stigmatizing addicts does all that much. It's comparable to abstinence-only sex education.

 

[SpessCaptain]

I think that everyone wants to be a good person.
Those who say otherwise are edgelords.

 

[Bronchitis that Lingers]

I think that everyone wants to be a good person.
Those who say otherwise are edgelords.

I'm on the fence about this. Some people do want to watch the world burn (and not just start a flame in your heart) to mirror the loathing they have on the inside. Then on the other hand, good and evil are just opinions, clearly Hitler believed he was doing a "good" thing, so that raises an entirely different question about the definition of "good".

 

[RepQuest]

I think that everyone wants to be a good person.
Those who say otherwise are edgelords.

Likewise, those who claim to be "bad" or "evil" themselves are edgelords.

 

[Joan Nyan]

Don't stop questioning yourself. If a lot of people disagree with your beliefs, you might want to listen to them and consider what they have to say. SJWs seem to have a huge problem with this.

also

Most events that hurt one group of people help another and vis versa. Almost nothing is inherently "good" or "bad". Things like the holocaust were bad but things like that are few and far between. As a hopefully not too controversial example, some people hate Walmart for driving small businesses out, but there are also single mothers on welfare who rely on Walmart's low prices to feed their kids.

 

[Boundman]

Don't stop questioning yourself. If a lot of people disagree with your beliefs, you might want to listen to them and consider what they have to say. SJWs seem to have a huge problem with this.

Completely agree with this, a lot of people take them not being convinced by others as strength in their arguments and that they're correct, when in actuality they're right in some areas and wrong in others. Those who question themselves and correct those things will find they're much more well balanced than those who are content to just be as they are now.

 

[autisticdragonkin]

Don't stop questioning yourself. If a lot of people disagree with your beliefs, you might want to listen to them and consider what they have to say. SJWs seem to have a huge problem with this.

Your mind is a prison. If you don't constantly try to avoid falling into problematic modes of thought by methodical analysis you will get wrong beliefs and they will hurt you. That is the basis of science

 

[Tragi-Chan]

Don't stop questioning yourself. If a lot of people disagree with your beliefs, you might want to listen to them and consider what they have to say. SJWs seem to have a huge problem with this.

This is absolutely a rule I try to live by. If I believe something, it's important to ask why I believe it, and if my belief is right.

I also believe that no one is as clever as they think they are, and there's no point trying to change people's minds on this.