Thoughts on Horseshoe Theory?

[ShahOfIran1979]

What are some interesting examples of Horseshoe Theory in modern politics? This is the concept that both the left and right extreme wings share more in common than they differ. Black Agenda Report is a fun example I often read. They are a black, far-left outlet that have praised Trump for being anti-elitist and opposing the Ukraine war. In the past, black nationalists have teamed up with Neo-Nazis, producing strange results.

https://www.blackagendareport.com/trump-exposes-elite-classes

 

[Gorton Colu]

Horse shoe theory only kind of works if you buy into spatial political paradigms like right vs left which were born out of the French Revolution era.

Otherwise it doesn't work at all. Even shit like the political compass is more useful a political and ideological paradigm than right vs left and horse shoe theory

 

[I Shidded I Farded I Came]

People can be very far apart on the political spectrum and extremely close on the autism spectrum.

 

[SSj_Ness (Yiffed)]

It's nonsense bullshit cope libertarians and liberals spew to muddy the waters. Conservatives aren't trooning out kids on their side of the alleged horseshoe or opening the border wide to gangs, because there is no horseshoe.

There's some overlap, like the extremes wanting to wipe each other out, but the ideologies are largely different.

 

[I (Don't) Have A Gun]

Horse shoe theory only kind of works if you buy into spatial political paradigms like right vs left which were born out of the French Revolution era.

Otherwise it doesn't work at all. Even shit like the political compass is more useful a political and ideological paradigm than right vs left and horse shoe theory

If you don't look at it very closely you can draw some similarities (so it's perfect for character limited social media "gotchas"). Granted when you dig into it you find it's really just superficial. But the horseshoe theory isn't exactly ever used to actually analyse political viewpoints to any meaningful degree.

From the top of my head would be that both the far right and far left want racial segregation. Granted in the details it gets messy, with the far left marketing it as BIPOC independence from the oppressive white normative society and the right marketing it as a matter of personal and social cohesion and safety. So only really superficially the same, but again that's really what the horseshoe theory is, pointing at superficial similarities.

The not-so-far left and right are both rather prudish when it comes to depictions of sexuality. Again it gets muddled in the details with the left throwing words like "objectification" and "exploitation" around and the right making a moral argument for purity and the negative effect of sexuality on society. But superficially both sides don't like seeing sexy ladies in revealing clothes in media.

There's some overlap, like the extremes wanting to wipe each other out, but the ideologies are largely different.

Ah yes and of course the propensity towards violence as a tool for political change. But again look at it any deeper and what they want to achieve and why they want to use violence differs a lot.

 

[Angry Alt Right Nerd]

You mean like how both right-wingers and SJWs are both unintelligent sociopaths with an extreme persecution complex and love to incessantly gaslight people?

 

[SSj_Ness (Yiffed)]

Ah yes and of course the propensity towards violence as a tool for political change. But again look at it any deeper and what they want to achieve and why they want to use violence differs a lot.

Yep, exactly.

 

[millais]

An alliance so powerful that it could not be allowed to stand.

 

[GameratePTSD]

Cope for retards. "Oh this thing I disagree with is the same as the other" legit tard Ideocracy 'put square through the square part' thing. All political discussions on this should end in a mass suicide.

 

[Schwarzwald]

I can tell you that a lot of the modern, especially younger, right wingers are kneejerk reactionaries following a trend or taking part in a cult of personality as opposed to having any genuine convictions or holding true conservative beliefs. They are every last bit as embarrassing as their mirrored batch of lefty counterparts back when that was en vogue, if not more so because they have a lesser ability to gauge and less regard for how they come across.

 

[GratsTheat783]

I think the idea comes from looking at how extreme ideologies acted when they got into power rather than what their goals were (both fascism and communism used a heavy hand to deal with perceived threats, they restricted the rights of the individual, placed heavy emphasis of the state over the individual, etc). If you look at it in a really abstract sense, it can make a bit of sense, but falls apart when you get to specifics.

 

[Lach]

Horseshoe theory is probably only correct in that the political extremes start to behave identically in terms of their sentiments of violence, upheaval, bitter-babyness. They also tend wig out the same way whenever a moderate liberal politician of the left or right wins an election that are opposite to them. A funny real life example is when Donald Trump won the popular vote as well as the electoral recently and all the bluesky commies started behaving exactly as the 'millions must die' chud memes

 

[i440BX]

I think horseshoe theory doesnt make sense. Especially today when politicians dont even follow principles anymore and dont respect their promises. They work in their interest and their beliefs. Western world suffers a lot from that.


I see that the current neoliberal order has similarities to aristocratic regimes. Instead of being upfront that they are aristocrats, now they move from parties, institutions, roles. They arent PMs or Presidents forever but they still control a lot from behind the curtain. Especially in the cultural sense.

It's a mix of harmful moderation (no firm stance or respect on principles) and forced ideological orthodoxy. The issue today is that regimes dont do that anymore transparently, they merged the government with corporate world and persecute the infidels through "corporation rights to ban you" "laws that are applied only to alt right and not all people breaking that law."

If some clear injustice happened to the second class citizen, they will not care, but they will surely care about their protected groups. Orthodoxy is always imposed over the citizens and rivals of the current order, while they get away with breaking it. One example is Green New Deal. If they followed their principles and truly believed in that, they would actually go after China and India, they would reject using renewables and use nuclear, they would let people use old cars. Instead they go to performative actions that are either in their benefit of them or make them look better. All those end up worse for all citizens immediately, but at a certain point it will bite in the ass the political class.

My biggest confusion is that they all do these schemes but they dont see how it harms them or are idiots. Its like they dont care if themselves or their own descendants will suffer from the consequences of their actions. They care about short term gains.

After all it seems that the West breaks all principles. It doesnt fully follow free market principles (only for the rich). It contradicts socialist principles (performative help for immigrants and poor countries while oppressing the native citizen), violates democratic principles (rejecting a voted candidate). The Western world LARPS as Democracy, Socialism, Free market, but they arent either one of them. But people still believe in those lies.

One example I think is how corporate executives enjoy enshittifying their own products. Its like they enjoy using their slop (it doesnt matter they have perpetual access, they use an inferior, slower, buggier product).

How do apple executives employees and other companies enjoy limiting themselves to wireless headsets that are inferior to better wired headsets, having to charge the headphones or the phone if using the dongle.

How do the media conglomerate executives enjoy having their audio destroyed by loudness war. Do they exclusively limit to old releases or they enjoy their shit?

How do Adobe executives and employees enjoy using their shitty software.

How do car companies employees enjoy having ugly cars?

Its the same thing with politicians.

 

[Whatevermancer]

It's a funny meme, nothing more.

 

[WielkiWapiesz2137]

It is garbage that you get once you decide that somehow international and national commies are exact opposites.

 

[XL xQgg?QcQCaTYDMjqoDnYpG]

Horseshoe theory is only relevant insofar the left wing and right wing are relevant
The left and the right are wings on the same bird, so it's obvious that there are bird characteristics
But the horseshoe itself is kind of retarded
So far I have yet to see a single correct example of "the extremes on the opposite ends are ackshually very close to each other"

 

[Type 10 MBT]

I tend to think it comes down to coincidence, an overlap in views or an over simplification of a stance or opinion. If horseshoe theory was completely true then it would be observed all the time in multiple nations around the world. In reality it's just that at times, political ideologies align on a subject even at opposite ends of the spectrum. This also has to do with labels and trying to fit a person's ideology in to a box, which is what everyone does unless you have your own political party with your own sperg-esque accurate stances. For instance someone can become ultra right-wing and support eugenics programs that abort fetuses with genetic issues or extreme physical deformities. This person at one point in their centrist or moderate right life was an anti-abortion absolutist but now think in some cases it's a good idea. A Xitter user would shout "horseshoe theroy cuz leftists support abortion!" in reality it's the same word, different application. The nuance of the stance is paved over with "lol horseshoe" and makes your average centrist feel exceptionally smart.

 

[Sangue e terra]

It's a very mid-wit idea. Just because you use the same tool or argument point for something doesn't mean you mean or want the same thing. I often hear "centrists" promoting the "horseshoe theory" and I suspect it's their way to justify their fence sitting by telling others that both ends are "le not as intellectual as me".

Other in the thread has also pointed out that the context it's often used in, is applied to dumb concepts, specifically the "left vs right wing" and "political compass" categorizations. No shit that these personality test level of retardations are going to result in stupid conclusions.

 

[Brap God]

The only thing the far left and far right have completely in common is the proclivity for grifting. The examples you've given aren't representative of Horseshoe Theory, it's very common in politics to set aside differences when necessary to further a goal or agenda. It's why the communists worked with the nazis to topple the socdems. Politics makes strange bedfellows.

 

[W'rkncacnter]

'avid 'uke?
'oot 'avid 'uke