Titanic tourist submersible goes missing with search under way

  • 🔧 At about Midnight EST I am going to completely fuck up the site trying to fix something.
As far as the commentariat goes about James Cameron being just another Hollywood guy with opinions, I feel this is a rather unfair characterization. Manned Ocean Floor exploration is an incredibly niche line of activity, and as far as it goes Cameron is probably the only guy deserving of his masters certificate in the enterprise. More people have been in orbit then have been on the floor of the Atlantic Ocean (alive). Lets also not forget the dude literally reached the lowest elevation geologically possible on Earth, and then came back, so I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt when he claims to know what he's talking about.

This incident has probably shown there needs to be a more formal process about the whole thing. Not necessarily government, but maybe something similar to PADI, that serves as a non-governmental certification organization for scuba diving, and does everything from testing equipment to surveying commercial diving locations. Cameron is probably uniquely situated to start just such an organization.
The organization exists. They're the ones that a bunch of people signed a letter to Oceangate to express their concerns about the Titans design. Rush lied to them and blew them off.

If you go back a few pages I posted a video from whats hoing on with shipping. Where he looks into the Coast Guard requirements for passenger carrying submersibles. Apparently they do exist and they apply not just to vessels operating in US waters, but any built in the US. The Coast Regs also state the requirement for certification from an industry engineering body or organization. It turns out Rush did have a legal requirement for certigication.
 
Has anyone mentioned the name of the company itself? It's clear this incident has been producing a lot of commotion in many spheres. With the trend of suffixing some big fiasco where shenanigans could be at play with "-gate," it's quite funny this company has that in its name preemptively. It's not an Oceangate yet, but it appears to be getting there since big money is at play.
An Oceangategate?
 
One fun thing I noticed is that people have been memeing the Iron Lung movie trailer because of this



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But besides the jokes, they do make the interesting point of the movie maybe getting cancelled becaused of the tragedy

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Obviously, the trailer and the game it's based of came out way before this happpened, but not only would the normie audiences not know this, but the incident in general would take the air of the conversation when it comes to this movie, anyway it would be interesting to see if how it would affect the film, if at all.

Don't forget the game on Steam as well.


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As far as the commentariat goes about James Cameron being just another Hollywood guy with opinions, I feel this is a rather unfair characterization. Manned Ocean Floor exploration is an incredibly niche line of activity, and as far as it goes Cameron is probably the only guy deserving of his masters certificate in the enterprise. More people have been in orbit then have been on the floor of the Atlantic Ocean (alive). Lets also not forget the dude literally reached the lowest elevation geologically possible on Earth, and then came back, so I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt when he claims to know what he's talking about.

This incident has probably shown there needs to be a more formal process about the whole thing. Not necessarily government, but maybe something similar to PADI, that serves as a non-governmental certification organization for scuba diving, and does everything from testing equipment to surveying commercial diving locations. Cameron is probably uniquely situated to start just such an organization.
Aha! I found the video I was looking for with the Female Engineer real sub builder Liz Taylor.
She's a member of the type of organization you are talking about, that already exists. The Marine Technology Society's Manned Underwater Vehicles Committee. That's the group that all signed the letter and tried to warn Stockton Rush. They are one of the Certifying Bodies for manned submarines.

Their main beef with Rush was they didn't trust the Carbon Fiber. Wanted some actual testing, and wanted a 3rd party engineering review. You can guess Stockton's response to all of that.
 
This is a documentary about the making of the Triton DSV Limiting Factor, that achieved the Five Deeps dive, the deepest point of all 5 Oceans.
Its quite something to compare, watching everything that went into this (the Titanium pressure hull milled to a perfect sphere with a tolerance of 1000th of a millimeter, pressure testing it to 20%+ the pressure of Challenger Deep at a facility in St Petersberg etc) and then watching the Ocean Gate guys slopping on epoxy to glue the Titanium end caps on in a dirty warehouse, Rush bragging about buying his lights from Camping World...
Before it even touched the water, this team made sure Limiting Factor was safe to a depth of 14000 meters deeper than its even possible to go in any ocean on Earth, as far as we know, (unless someone finds some crevasse deeper than Challenger Deep).
Its just jaw dropping the sheer difference in standards between a team set on doing everything right, and that fucking Nimrod winging it with his carbon fiber tomb.

 
Their main beef with Rush was they didn't trust the Carbon Fiber. Wanted some actual testing, and wanted a 3rd party engineering review. You can guess Stockton's response to all of that.
Now this might strike some viewers as harsh, but I'm glad everyone involved in this story died.
 
If you go back a few pages I posted a video from whats hoing on with shipping. Where he looks into the Coast Guard requirements for passenger carrying submersibles. Apparently they do exist and they apply not just to vessels operating in US waters, but any built in the US. The Coast Regs also state the requirement for certification from an industry engineering body or organization. It turns out Rush did have a legal requirement for certigication.

When you're a billionaire, laws don't apply to you (unless you run for President on an anti-establishment agenda, then they make up new laws just prosecute you).
 
He'd be considered a reckless asshole and probably be looking at charges, and definitely sued into bankruptcy because whoever he sold it to would have presumably kept using it and this would have still happened.
Only difference is he'd still be alive to face the music.
He'd have had to go into hiding.
Don't think anyone looks upto people whose ideas cause well publicized disasters that cost lives.
Nah. Selling your company involves a shit-ton of diligence, which in this case would have included deep dives (heh) on both the physical equipment and the tecnology/specs/ip. All prior inspections, reports, etc.,plus new, etc. Unless he had hid information and they dumbly didn't do their own vetting, almost certainly he would not have been legally liable for anything disclosed by seller or assessed by buyers. They'd basically have warranties that said, "except as disclosed in schedule x, as of x date, there are no known existing [probably long technical description of specific types of defects]," with acknowledgment by buyers that they've had an opportunity to do any testing they want and understand vessel is experimental and not certified, and seller isn't warrantying the thing for any specific purpose. And buying the company means assumptions of all assets and liabilities, again subject to carveouts for, e.g.., specific known existing or threatened litigation and other negotiated types of potential liabilities.

Then once they own and run the operations, every next choice to reuse the thing or not, maintain it or not, etc., is theirs.

Short version: if he'd been able to find someone lunatic enough to buy an extremely risky business that was a long way from scaling that would make the numbers make sense (if ever a possibility), they would have been stuck with the liability, absent fraud in disclosures and the like.

Of course you could try suing the designer on some idea that it was inherently flawed (design defect, in product liability parlance), but if they weren't responsible for deciding to send it out to sea with people in it and didn't misrepresent anything, not sure how you get there especially if they had sold the thing as experimental only.
Its equally retarded because all Zuck did was make Facebook (from which he stole from people to rake in the profits himself), so breaking things in that space didn't really herald any major consequences other than shitty social media sites or failed sources of revenue. Not actual harm.

Now its applied from everything to submersibles to fucking lab grown meat to drugs to medical testing, shit I'm pretty sure he didn't fucking intend for that methodology to be used on. And its having disastrous consequences.
Venture capital isn't new, guys. And it works/has worked in many cases, for all stakeholders. Someone has an idea, builds a little thing, needs money and expertise to take to a functioning level, then more, then it hits ceiling growth and it's either up or out.

Agree it's short-circuited now, and often there is no pretense of these reaching "functioning business" level, but rather are often gobbled up by a larger firm too lazy to build their own, so they get a pre-built thing and competition elimination all in one move. And there is a ton of money going to mediocre buzzword-heavy companies providing much less actual value than they or pushy VCs think (cough, honeycomb.io, cough). But SV specifically has been roaring for nearly 30 years now.
That’s not how tort lawyers work. They sue you, they sue the previous owner, they sue the manufacturer, or more than one if they can, they sue whoever made the parts, they sue some dude you talked to in a bar, they sue your mom, etc.
Anyone can sue for anything. And product liability is lucrative for a reason. But just being sued doesn't mean losing a suit, though it is an expensive headache and maybe there's a settlement.

In this hypothetical case, though, there's really no "product manufacturer" in the sense of a car parts maker or ski binding fabricator. It's going to be harder to win a design defect or manufacture argument for a one-off experimental thing. (The fact it had been used commercially is a wrinkle but not necessarily fatal.). So if they had sold the company or the submersible, I'd say a good lawyer would have strongly advised a disclaimer of commercial fitness or fitness for any purpose and emphasized the experimental nature of the thing, all up and down the deal.

And after sale it's the new ownership that chooses whether to improve the design/manufacture and get certified or inspected, manages upkeep, determines testing/monitoring cadence, and decides whether to take civilians underwater in it, so none of that goes toward the seller.

Eta: only a fool would have bought this company, obviously.
 
This is a documentary about the making of the Triton DSV Limiting Factor, that achieved the Five Deeps dive, the deepest point of all 5 Oceans.
Its quite something to compare, watching everything that went into this (the Titanium pressure hull milled to a perfect sphere with a tolerance of 1000th of a millimeter, pressure testing it to 20%+ the pressure of Challenger Deep at a facility in St Petersberg etc) and then watching the Ocean Gate guys slopping on epoxy to glue the Titanium end caps on in a dirty warehouse, Rush bragging about buying his lights from Camping World...
Before it even touched the water, this team made sure Limiting Factor was safe to a depth of 14000 meters deeper than its even possible to go in any ocean on Earth, as far as we know, (unless someone finds some crevasse deeper than Challenger Deep).
Its just jaw dropping the sheer difference in standards between a team set on doing everything right, and that fucking Nimrod winging it with his carbon fiber tomb.


Youtube has been suggesting old and interesting videos from about a decade ago.





 
Youtube has been suggesting old and interesting videos from about a decade ago.





Lol I've learned more about submersibles and their construction, the Titanic sinking, deep sea habitats and wildlife, black smokers and volcanic vents, and Cold War submarine accidents since Rush's sub imploded than I ever imagined I'd be interested in.
Rush may have been a reckless faggot but at least his death has been an educational experience.
 
Lol I've learned more about submersibles and their construction, the Titanic sinking, deep sea habitats and wildlife, black smokers and volcanic vents, and Cold War submarine accidents since Rush's sub imploded than I ever imagined I'd be interested in.
Rush may have been a reckless faggot but at least his death has been an educational experience.
I reckon that for a solid 36 hours a surprising number of people worldwide became, even if only momentarily, extremely grateful for the very air they breathe.
 
Now this might strike some viewers as harsh, but I'm glad everyone involved in this story died.
I'm a little sad about the kid. His goal was to be the first person to solve a Rubiks Cube 13,000 feet on the ocean bottom. Autism that incandescent would have made an extra special cow worth getting a few years milk out of.
 
I'm disapointed. I really wished we would see the dead bodies covered in curry sheeeeit, or sub turned on its side so that bodies would pile up on each other(and smeared in shit and piss). Anyway, I was waiting for dead people marinading in feces, not this. Implosion my ass. They better show us the gore so that we can gloat over disfigured remains. Also, fuck that autistic kid and his rubic cube, little narcissistic bitch, and especially fuck his father, a parasitic shitskin and a member of wef. Every one on board got what they deserved.
 
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