What We Left Behind: The DS9 Documentary - The Whole Series Was Actually A Sci-Fi Novel Roseanne Wrote to Cope With Dan's Heart Attack

[Tookie]

lol Yeah, up until Seven of Nine and T'Pol, Nana Visitor and Terry Farrel (Jadzia) were probably the hottest Trek actresses to date, even though my dad and others always had a huge crush on Marina Sirtis. But Kira's Bajoran uniform made her look like a Minecraft character (which was the point anyway), so I could see how Evil Kira might have sparked a whole subclass of Trekkers.

Jadzia > T'Pol/7of9.

 

[queue-anon]

I didn't get the impression that they were trying to paint the Federation as ultimately evil, but rather show the reality of "peace". You could likewise argue that the Federation itself was a social justice machine, absorbing planets into its ranks and forcing political correctness and tolerance in the pursuit of its own idealist vision of peace. The showrunner, Ira Behr, has said he wanted to portray the Federation with the concept that everyone and everything exists as a shade of grey, without pointing and saying these are the good guys and these are the bad guys. For example, Major Kira was a hero on Bajor, but her actions to help her people directly and indirectly resulted in the deaths of thousands of arguably innocent Cardassian civilians and so she was seen as a terrorist by the Cardassian goverment. She had no regrets for what she did (as she felt she did what she had to do to free her people from Cardassia's occupation), and the show never forced her character to repent or overtly justify herself, but she was forced to come face to face with her past on occasion and she is a classic example of DS9's use of the moral grey area. DS9 prided itself on creating character-driven stories, as opposed to TNG's story-driven characters, so I feel like this is a natural next-step in that process, seeing as the Federation as an ever present concept is a character in itself.

Edit: I'm currently watching S3,Ep15 of DS9 right now, and Odo has a line that I think sums up the above pretty well:

"I'm not suggesting anything, but it's been my experience that all humanoids have an agenda of some sort, and their agendas can influence them without them realising it."

My opinion about the newer Treks vs. TOS tends not to go over well, but I think the Federation as a flawed government that tries to do good, but occasionally fails, is a much better concept than what Roddenberry was originally attempting. It makes for better writing and more interesting stories and is actually consistent. TOS tried so hard to make the Federation seem like a utopia but constantly failed. There were a lot of massively stupid episodes where the Other is demonized and humans are made out to be the master race which was the opposite of what the show was supposed to be about. And they never followed the prime directive.

 

[Tragi-Chan]

My opinion about the newer Treks vs. TOS tends not to go over well, but I think the Federation as a flawed government that tries to do good, but occasionally fails, is a much better concept than what Roddenberry was originally attempting. It makes for better writing and more interesting stories and is actually consistent. TOS tried so hard to make the Federation seem like a utopia but constantly failed. There were a lot of massively stupid episodes where the Other is demonized and humans are made out to be the master race which was the opposite of what the show was supposed to be about. And they never followed the prime directive.

What I liked about DS9 was the way it deconstructed the utopia of Trek. Under Roddenberry, the philosophy behind the 24th century was that interpersonal conflicts simply wouldn’t exist. DS9 dared to say that actually, maybe utopia isn’t that simple. Maybe someone has to get their hands dirty behind the scenes.

 

[gobbogobb]

It was also the first trek show that had the balls to tell the viewers that there were real people with real lives and real families on all those other ships that blew up on the next generation. I could even make the argument that the first episode of the series puts the question to the viewer whether or not the Enterprise crew did the right thing saving Picard from the borg.

 

[drtoboggan]

Jadzia > T'Pol/7of9.

Truf. Jadzia was a sweet piece of spotted ass.

 

[Sprig of Parsley]

Overall, Terry Farrell surpasses Jeri Ryan and Jolene Blalock, I would say. Gates McFadden was Terry's equal in her prime, and was Marina Sirtis' better IMO. I think Linda Park was actually cuter than Blalock in Enterprise.

 

[gobbogobb]

Terry knew how to do sexy without going completely over the top. I'll give Joline Blalock a pass since Vulcan character meant her "sexy" scenes had to be stupidly pandering by necessity.

 

[Sprig of Parsley]

Who was the actress who did Ezri? She was sort of cute.

EDIT: Nicole De Boer. Yeah, she's pretty cute.

 

[gobbogobb]

This thread is now "kiwis thirsty for star trek women."

Ezri's actress was cute but the character was just so bad it was a huge bonerkiller.

 

[Sprig of Parsley]

This thread is now "kiwis thirsty for star wars women."

Ezri's actress was cute but the character was just so bad it was a huge bonerkiller.

Unfortunately, yeah.

I'm poring through TOS actresses now. Nichelle Nichols in her prime is hotter than a fucking steel mill.

 

[gobbogobb]

Ensign Rand best ever

 

[Stab You in the Back]

I think Linda Park was actually cuter than Blalock in Enterprise.

What is wrong with your eyes? Blalock is a stunningly beautiful woman.

Maybe its some kind of beta male thing where you're more attracted to the woman you find more attainable, but come the fuck on. Blalock is an Olympic Athlete in the looks department. Linda Park is junior varsity, at best.

 

[Sprig of Parsley]

Eh. I'll take Hoshi any day, twice on Sunday. YMMV.

EDIT: tbh I'm almost flattered that you think that I think I can land Park or Blalock but whatever. Park kind of strikes a chord with me somehow, and I liked Hoshi as a character more than I liked T'Pol.

 

[Doc Cassidy]

Jeri Ryan is way less hot without Seven's Borg eyepiece, idk why.

 

[Sprig of Parsley]

Jeri Ryan is way less hot without Seven's Borg eyepiece, idk why.

It's the slight asymmetry it causes without being an actual eyesore. It's the same reason a mole on the one cheek is actually an IMPROVEMENT for a lot of people when they see a face. They make fake "beauty marks" so everyone can get that effect, and it honestly works.