What's really The Devil.

[Little oak tree]

Is it really some spooky supernatural entity, or is it humans and their organizations, systems and greed.
From "Babalon Unveiled" by Oliver St. John:

The Tarot card of the Devil shows a male and a female enslaved by the world of illusion and materialism, as well as doctrine and mindless obedience to the authority in turn.
IMO religions, cults, sects and organizations are for weak people.

 

[Uncle Sid]

"We create that bad among ourselves. We create it; then we try to call it devil, satan, or evil. But man creates it. There is no devil. Man creates the devil." —Wallace Black Elk, LAKOTA

 

[Little oak tree]

"We create that bad among ourselves. We create it; then we try to call it devil, satan, or evil. But man creates it. There is no devil. Man creates the devil." —Wallace Black Elk, LAKOTA

Great quote, and if there's something that can be called "evil" in this planet is Masonry that is the boot of the so called "Illuminati"

All the high members of the "orders", cults and religions know it's all a massive scam and laugh watching the members in low positions carry on their "duties" which are giving the idiots on top even more power to secure their lifestyles.

 

[TurdFondler]

There exists metaphysical evil, yes. Is it personified into a weird goat man? Probably not.

 

[Little oak tree]

There exists metaphysical evil, yes. Is it personified into a weird goat man? Probably not.

Can you at least develop your idea a bit more, why do you believe that?

 

[TurdFondler]

I believe in platonic forms I guess, I don't think there's anything really inherent in a man's soul. Confuscian thought seems to have a more nuanced approach to someone's being, and I kind of prefer that model than the monotheistic one. Not sure how one fits in with the other, but I like the ideas.

Evil exists, but the idea that evil comes from man doesn't sit right with me. Would there be evil without man? I don't know, I want to say probably not because how do you prove it? The fact that every culture through time has known inherently that evil exists seems significant to me, though. I don't want to think of evil as a force or presence or something personified, but as a metaphysical concept. I feel like it has to exist since we immediately know what things are evil.

 

[Butterschmalz]

I m a catholic but I always liked the protestant definition of hell: the absence of reason. And the devil must be the king of it.

 

[Little oak tree]

The fact that every culture through time has known inherently that evil exists seems significant to me, though. I don't want to think of evil as a force or presence or something personified, but as a metaphysical concept. I feel like it has to exist since we immediately know what things are evil.

It's just the inability of humans to acknowledge our own inherent darkness, the undifferentiated libidinal impulses in our unconscious.

 

[TurdFondler]

How do we know the contrast between good and evil, then, if both are inherently human? Why is there a reoccurring theme of succumbing to evil temptations, it's treated like an external force.

 

[Little oak tree]

How do we know the contrast between good and evil, then, if both are inherently human? Why is there a reoccurring theme of succumbing to evil temptations, it's treated like an external force.

Temptation are distractions from the essential.
People project their own evil to the outside world and to vulnerable people, and some recipients buy it and become "evil"
Most people become diabolical when confronted with their own nature, and their pride doesn't even allow them to see that, they cloak themselves in a fake "righteousness" and justify the most fucked up actions with it.

 

[Haim Arlosoroff]

The Mount of Temptation is the supposed location of part of the Temptation of Jesus described in the Gospels of Matthew, Mark, and Luke in the New Testament, during which the Devil took Jesus to a "high mountain" and offered him rule over all the kingdoms of the world.

The devil tempts men with glory and material wealth, and most fall. We are allowed to hold glory and wealth, but only in service to family or God. Never as an end onto itself. Everyone who does has that moment when their pride doesn't allow them to see how far they've fallen, and the devil has them in their self-made delusion thereafter.

Great quote, and if there's something that can be called "evil" in this planet is Masonry that is the boot of the so called "Illuminati"

Those that choose to rule only because of its rewards and its relative lack of labor, cheat the rest of humanity of proper leadership. I have met masonic people, and they're always trying to cheat some benefit rather than earn a thing through honest labor. They see it as a mark of their intelligence rather than their immense immorality. Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law and other garbage. They push their wills onto others to dominate rather than to push themselves through hard work into great accomplishments, and they cannot understand that what is made only socially requires society to maintain it and it can always be undone by a shift in society. Society cannot take from you that you climbed a tall mountain, or sailed a great distance yourself. Society cannot say your love or your family wasn't true or meaningful. These people want nothing to do with those things, they only want to seem like great men in the eyes of a trusting society. They cheat, and are only sorry that they are caught.

I m a catholic but I always liked the protestant definition of hell: the absence of reason. And the devil must be the king of it.

Yes, I'm partial to that as well. When everything is trickery and deceit, then nothing has any reality to it. The awful fog of never understanding if you've progressed or fallen behind. The sin of usury where the rewards are quick but fleeting, and the cost is unrecoverable. Nothing has any meaning outside of the moment, and so non-one can feel like they've accomplished anything in the past but they still feel compelled to exist and labor in each separate moment until confusion shifts their focus onto another thing on and on like Sisyphus.

 

[SouthernBitchBob]

I'm not religious, but I've always found irony in the edgy "proud satanist" types. I especially like one of the reoccurring quotes I see them throw around, something like "God is a judging patriarch, but the devil doesn't judge. We take you as you are". My first impulse is to roll my eyes at the smug edge in that statement, but there's too much truth in it, and not in the way the speaker likely intends. It seems to me there's a sinister wickedness in the nu-liberal "come as you are" rejection of traditionalism. It sounds so nice on the surface, and underneath it's a re-wording of "never improve". What could be more demonic than that?

 

[emilyFromLittleBear]

I like the line "the devil speaks to you through other people." Evil is like water, it can move through almost anything.

 

[Little oak tree]

We are allowed to hold glory and wealth, but only in service to family or God.

“If anyone comes to me and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be my disciple."
Luke 14:26

Never as an end onto itself. Everyone who does has that moment when their pride doesn't allow them to see how far they've fallen, and the devil has them in their self-made delusion thereafter.

Very true, pride and fear are the biggest dangers IMO.

I have met masonic people, and they're always trying to cheat some benefit rather than earn a thing through honest labor. They see it as a mark of their intelligence rather than their immense immorality.

Bro, coming from someone whose family are masons this is so spot on

Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law

This is from Thelema, the cult Aleister Crowley founded and it's the least shitty cult I've seen (I don't like cults tho)
It doesn't mean you should do whatever you want but rather seek your "True Will" which is the will of "God"

They push their wills onto others to dominate rather than to push themselves through hard work into great accomplishments, and they cannot understand that what is made only socially requires society to maintain it and it can always be undone by a shift in society.

They are expert manipulators, and they have a whole arsenal of methods.

I'm not religious, but I've always found irony in the edgy "proud satanist" types. I especially like one of the reoccurring quotes I see them throw around, something like "God is a judging patriarch, but the devil doesn't judge. We take you as you are". My first impulse is to roll my eyes at the smug edge in that statement, but there's too much truth in it, and not in the way the speaker likely intends. It seems to me there's a sinister wickedness in the nu-liberal "come as you are" rejection of traditionalism. It sounds so nice on the surface, and underneath it's a re-wording of "never improve". What could be more demonic than that?

Those Anton LaVey "Satanists" are cringy boomers and atheists, and the ones who supposedly worship a supernatural "evil" are just plain stupid

I like the line "the devil speaks to you through other people." Evil is like water, it can move through almost anything.

Bro the devil ARE the other people, and you and us