Culture Why Did the Novel-Reading Man Disappear? - Men are leaving fiction reading behind. Some people want to change that.

By Joseph Bernstein
June 25, 2025 Updated 2:17 p.m. ET

27ST-STRAIGHT-MEN-READING-01-mbh.webp
In the mid-20th century, when this man browsed bookstore shelves, fiction was a boys club. Today, the situation has changed. John Murray/Hulton Archive, via Getty Images

For the first meeting of his book club for men, Yahdon Israel, a 35-year-old senior editor at Simon & Schuster, asked the participants to bring a favorite work of fiction. Not everyone completed the assignment.

One man brought “Watchmen,” a graphic novel. Valid, technically.

Another scoured his home bookshelf and realized he did not own a single novel or short story collection. So he showed up to the meeting with a nonfiction book about emotional intelligence. (Mr. Israel posted a photo of the seven millenial-ish men in the group, each holding his selection, to his Instagram account.)

Mr. Israel, who has hosted another book club for nearly a decade, started this group last December in an effort to inspire heterosexual men to read more fiction. He solicited members over social media. For the second meeting, he assigned a story collection by Jamel Brinkley, “A Lucky Man,” which examines contemporary masculinity. For two hours, the men discussed the book, and the theme.

The next day, Mr. Israel had a panic attack. Two days later, he said, he was diagnosed with depression.

He has spent the months since grappling with painful realizations that came out of the discussion, about how toxic masculinity has harmed his own marriage, especially the idea that real men do not share their feelings. It was an epiphany out of James Joyce, unlocked, he said, by that conversation in the book club.

Indeed, while Mr. Israel might have convened the group to help other men read more fiction, he has since realized that there’s an even deeper reason.

“I’m doing this because I need it,” he said in an interview.

25ST-STRAIGHT-MEN-READING-add-bm.webp
Yahdon Israel, center, and members of his “Fiction Revival” book club, aimed at inspiring straight men to read more fiction. Porsalin Hindsman-Israel

So do lots of men — at least according to a robust debate unfolding in opinion pages and news articles, on social media platforms and inside the publishing world. By turns a maligned or suspicious figure in decades past — in the case of the “Infinite Jest” lover, for instance — or a fetishized one — consider the enormously popular “Hot Dudes Reading” Instagram — the figure of the literary male reader is now disappearing, some say, and his disappearance is a matter of grave concern.

These articles, which focus explicitly or implicitly on straight men, connect the fact that these men are reading fewer novels to a variety of social maladies, up to and including deleterious effects on American democracy itself. If more men were reading like Mr. Israel, the thinking goes, the country would be a healthier place: more sensitive, more self-aware, less destructive. As more American men fill their hours with the crude talk shows of the “manosphere,” online gambling and addictive multiplayer games, the humble novel — consumed alone, requiring thought and patience — can look like a panacea.

It’s a lot of pressure to put on the reading man, who for many people remains a fittingly prosaic sight, unworthy of deeper thought or further comment. Perhaps he is passing the time on a commute, or taking a break from the stresses of the day. Little does he know, he’s been drafted into a new front in the culture war over the future of men.

On a recent afternoon in June, Jack Kyono, an assistant manager at McNally Jackson, the stalwart New York book chain, walked the floor of the store’s SoHo location. Mr. Kyono was quick to point out that not all men read in the same way. International tourists are buying different books from older American men, who are buying different books from young professionals. But he broadly agreed with the idea that when it came to reading fiction, straight men were followers, not leaders. They might read Sally Rooney or Ocean Vuong, he said, but only after an audience of straight women and queer people had made them cultural touchstones.

Earlier on the phone, he told me he had noticed a gender divide among the stacks: When groups of women wandered into the store, they frequently browsed together, pointing out books they had read and making suggestions for their friends — an act that booksellers call “the handsell.”

Meanwhile, when men came into the bookstore with other men, they typically split up and dispersed to far corners of the store.

“It’s solo browsing time,” he said.

Navigating the aisles, Mr. Kyono, 27, led us to a cubicle-size display near the back dedicated to science fiction and fantasy, where the shelves were heavy with multipart series with names like “Iron Gold” and “Light Bringer.” Nearby, an alcove of the American fiction section from F through K contained many of the most famous male writers of what Mr. Kyono called the “American high school reading curriculum”: Faulkner, Hemingway, Heller, Kerouac.

“This is a hot corner for men,” he noted.

So, too, was a nook featuring literature in translation. Here, said Mr. Kyono, another kind of male reader snaps up long, ambitious novels from Czech, Romanian and Austrian writers — someone who may fit into the much-debated trope of the “high brodernist,” male readers and critics who prize esoteric, challenging texts in translation.

Inside the store, the customers were overwhelmingly women. But there were a few men. Some, like Daniel Schreiner, 38, were fans of the fantasy star Brandon Sanderson. He said he thought men read less fiction than women because “we’re less literate than they are.” Another man, Louis Nunez, 41, said he did not read fiction, and typically picked out nonfiction books related to spirituality.

“But spirituality is like fiction to some people,” he said.

There was at least one man in the store who planned to buy a work of fiction: Bob Ryan, a college literature professor, holding a novel about a Japanese architect. Mr. Ryan, 37, said he had trouble getting many of the young men in his courses interested in the material, because they did not see the benefit of novels. “They’re more interested in the instrumental,” he said.

Eventually, Mr. Kyono took me to the front to look at an attractive “customer favorites” display. Here, pastel and vivid colors dominated the covers of books by romance and “romantasy” stalwarts like Carley Fortune and Sarah J. Maas, the author of the popular “A Court of Thorns and Roses” series.

Beyond the bookstore, much of the architecture of book discovery is informally targeted at women. Celebrity book clubs are mostly led by female celebrities and increasingly court women of all ages, from those who are fans of Oprah Winfrey and Reese Witherspoon to those who are more interested in the tastes of Dua Lipa and Kaia Gerber. (Former President Barack Obama, the obvious straight male exception, releases a single list of his favorite books every year.) #BookTok, the vast community on TikTok that has become a best-seller machine, is largely populated by women recommending books by other women, like Colleen Hoover’s “It Ends With Us.”

27ST-STRAIGHT-MEN-READING-03-mbh.webp
Reese Witherspoon started Reese’s Book Club in 2017. Mireya Acierto/Getty Images

27ST-STRAIGHT-MEN-READING-02-mbh.webp
Oprah Winfrey started “Oprah’s Book Club” in 1996 to recommend favorite titles to her audience. Sara Krulwich/The New York Times

There are counterexamples that prove the rule. C.J. Box, the author of a long-running series about a Wyoming game warden who solves murders, has expanded his audience to include younger men by appearing on a series of podcasts about hunting, fishing and other outdoors subjects.

But literary novelists — the kind who populate prestigious lists and publish the “big” books of the year — have not seemed to crack the code with straight guys, at least on social media.

One common argument focuses on supply: that men are not reading fiction because the subject matter of contemporary fiction does not speak to men. Jordan Castro, a novelist whose books inhabit the minds of frustrated men, wrote in an email that “the general tone and etiquette of the literary world is certainly hostile to masculine expression.” Conduit Books, a new indie press that debuted this year, will focus on books by male authors, and will center “overlooked” themes of “fatherhood, masculinity, working-class male experience, sex and relationships, and negotiating the 21st-century as a man.”

These arguments hark back to a midcentury culture of fiction writing dominated by men writing about masculine subjects and the male experience. But it was not always thus. In the 19th century, the most popular novels were written by women for a female audience. Their output was considered “paltry entertainment,” according to Dan Sinykin, a professor of English at Emory University and the author of “Big Fiction: How Conglomeration Changed the Publishing Industry and American Literature.”

Many of these titles were so-called sentimental novels, whose virtuous heroines illustrated proper moral conduct. In 1855, Nathaniel Hawthorne described American novelists to his publisher as “a damned mob of scribbling women, and I should have no chance of success while the public taste is occupied with their trash.”

A century later, the story had changed, and publishing had become a boys club with cultural cachet, according to Mr. Sinykin. Literary form was prized above social instruction.

Starting in the 1980s, a new generation of women came to dominate the publishing industry. The “feminization” of the industry, as Mr. Sinkyin called it, resulted in a business that “assumes its primary audience is white women between 30 and 65” and publishes books to suit their tastes.

27ST-STRAIGHT-MEN-READING-04-mbh.webp
Some people are worried about the disappearing figure of the literary male reader. In the mid-20th century, publishing catered more to his tastes. Evening Standard/Hulton Archive, via Getty Images

In one sense, then, for men to read more fiction as the world of the novel exists today would not just require more stereotypically masculine subject matter. It might be a matter of men approaching their reading lives a little more like women do — getting recommendations online from celebrities and influencers, browsing together, forming book clubs.

One thing that may help: brick-and-mortar bookstores giving traditionally male-focused genres the romantasy treatment, said Shannon DeVito, the senior director of books at Barnes & Noble. According to Ms. DeVito, over the past six months, the chain has had growing sales from contemporary science fiction and fantasy authors like Matt Dinniman and James Islington.

“It’s not a concerted effort to get men to read more,” said Ms. DeVito. “It’s just great books that appeal to that audience.”

Book culture is not a monolith. According to BookScan, some 782.7 million books were sold in 2024, and the rapid growth of the self-published book market means that there is fiction to suit almost every taste. In this context, what Mr. Sinykin called the “worst version” of the critique of contemporary fiction — that liberal politics have destroyed the space for male readers — seems like a huge oversimplification. And many people who care about the future of the male fiction reader are keen to avoid it.

Mr. Israel deliberately did not include the words “man” or “men” in the name of his book club. He called it “The Fiction Revival,” to underline the idea that there was a kind of reading experience for men that needed to be resuscitated.

Max Lawton, a translator who frequently works on long European novels, scoffed at the “corny idea of the male reader” who is interested only in stereotypically masculine subjects and austere prose.

“Being a reader is not a two-party system — you can read whatever you want,” he said.

Even Mr. Castro, the novelist, rejected the idea of a countermovement in the name of masculine identity. “Resentment, performing or embodying a self-consciously ‘masculine’ identity at the expense of literary value, is cringe,” he wrote in an email. “‘Identity’ is not a literary value.”

One real challenge at hand is a frenzied attention economy competing for everyone’s time, not just men’s. To present the sorry state of the male reader as having solely to do with the gendered quality of contemporary fiction misses a screen-based culture that presents nearly unlimited forms of entertainment.

“Our competition isn’t other publishers,” said Sean Manning, the publisher of Simon & Schuster. “It’s social media, gaming, streaming. All these other things that are vying for people’s time, attention and financial resources.”

Asked whether the publishing industry needed straight men to read more fiction as a purely economic matter, Mr. Manning focused instead on the social benefits of reading.

“It’s a problem if anyone isn’t taking advantage of an incredible artistic medium,” he said. “It’s hurtful not to be well-rounded.”

In an effort to get more people — yes, among them, men — to pick up his books, Mr. Manning is trying to make his own back catalog speak more to the culture at large. He has commissioned Taylor Sheridan, the creator of such man-approved shows and movies as “Yellowstone” and “Sicario,” to write the introduction to a new edition of Larry McMurtry’s classic western, “Lonesome Dove.” (Another guy-friendly introduction to an old title: the Metallica drummer Lars Ulrich on Hunter S. Thompson’s “Screwjack.”)

27ST-STRAIGHT-MEN-READING-05-mbh.webp
Simon & Schuster asked Lars Ulrich of Metallica to write an intro to a work of Hunter S. Thompson’s. Kevin Winter/Getty Images

27ST-STRAIGHT-MEN-READING-06-mbh.webp
And asked Taylor Sheridan, the creator of “Yellowstone,” to write the introduction to a new edition of Larry McMurtry’s “Lonesome Dove.” Monica Schipper/Getty Images

Mr. Manning might be happy to reach a book club like the one Andy Spackman, 46, started in the Lawrence, Kan., area three years ago. A former construction worker married to the best-selling memoirist Sarah Smarsh, Mr. Spackman said he felt that he did not have anyone to talk to about books, and that a book club might be a good way to bond with other men.

“I’m always seeing women out doing things and being friendlier toward each other than men are,” he said.

Since convening the group, the men have read Cormac McCarthy’s “Blood Meridian,” Donna Tartt’s “The Secret History” and James McBride’s “The Good Lord Bird,” among others. Dissecting and reassembling the ideas in these books, Mr. Spackman said, has led to a level of depth and intimacy with other men that he never got from inviting friends over to play video games, or from hanging out at the bar.

That does not mean, however, that there is no role for that time-tested male social lubricant, and subject of much great writing by men.

“Full disclosure,” Mr. Spackman said. “There is alcohol at the book club.”

Source (Archive)
 
I'm currently reading the Hyperion Cantos for the first time and I'm on the third book. It really is an excellent series and since I've also read everything John Keats has ever written it holds even more appeal. The first book is one of the best SF works I've ever read.

I couldn't agree more. I'll reread Hyperion every year even if I don't always do all 4 books. It sets up such a compelling universe with each of the stories of the main characters told in a "Canterbury Tales" rounds style, each from a different sub-genre of SF you can tell Simmons knows his shit as well as knowing how to tell a gripping story. And that cliff hanger at the end...

I'll be interested to hear what you think of the conclusion of the story in book 4. In some ways it's brilliant, in other ways a bit of a cop out.
 
PKD and Pohl are great mainstays of mid-century SF. I'd also throw in Kornbluth if people want to read Pohl's buddy that died young. For more PKD-esque stuff, there's probably A.E. Van Vogt but he's not quite as good and is more pulpy. (He's a predecessor from the '40s that PKD liked)

Pohl's Gateway Series is great, probably the best 'pulp trope grab-bag' I have ever read. It touches so many Sci-Fi topics in such a cohesive way, you watch some of these TV shows and it's like the world building get's rewritten between seasons if not episodes, in Gateway it all ties in perfectly and the pacing is pulp speed, there is always a reason to turn the page. My college astronomy professor recommended them to me because he was a black hole sperg, lol. Phil K. Dick is great for a mindfuck, A Scanner Darkly was very unsettling, Androids was not really what I expected but was deeper than Hollywood's take on it.

I would also add Larry Niven to the list, his Sci-Fi world building and creature craft is top notch. Draco Tavern is just pure fun, The Mote In God's Eye is fantastic, The Fleet of Worlds stuff might even be better than that but kind of wants you to read at least the first Ring World (before Halo, and not like a Halo novel at all)

Everyone also needs to read Heinlein...and Dune of course, you have to read that, but probably only the first one, because the rest are drier than Arrakis... and if you like it dry you might as well get into Azimov's Foundation for the politics (also 'I, Robot' is genuinely brilliant and more relevant than ever and it's not like the Will Smith movie at all) or go to Clark for the Jules Verne tier autism (Rama, the first book at least, was probably my favorite, The 2001 stuff is good but is basically the movie since it was written in tandem and I thought Childhood's End was kind of shit).
 
Last edited:
I can recommend Glen Cook as well. Those first three Black Company novels are so good.
I'm glad Dan Simmons is getting love as well. The guy gets weird, but he is skilled enough to pull it off, and his horror novels are great as well.
Christopher Ruoccio's Sun Eater series is great if you're looking for something new. He's young and endlessly talented. He makes the aliens come across as truly horrific creatures.

It's sad that publishing has gotten so weak that this is all we have. But it does rejuvenate the old classics, and introduce new readers to them.
 
Going into a book store is a terrible experience.
All the covers look the same, the non fiction section is 50% Trump Derangement Syndrome, the history section is just surface level World War 2 slop, and the literary porn section for women is slowly taking over the store.
I think the last time I read a book was when I went on a month long vacation in 2023 and needed a book or two to slam through so I read through the First Law trilogy by Joe Abercombie as it came recommended as fantasy that isn't up its own ass
It's about 50/50 here if I go to half price books they're trying to proudly display the newest leftist liberal slop from msnbc journalist as front and center. Meanwhile the neocons books tend to be best sellers.
Outside of bill Maher or hiring a non political comedian like Jon lovitz. You have to sell liberal slop for the cheap Meanwhile the newest book from Glenn beck or Laura Ingram will sell a million copies simply because neocons buy books.
Liberals often get upset that people find conservative books more appealing without forcing them to read.
 
Pohl's Gateway Series is great, probably the best 'pulp trope grab-bag' I have ever read. It touches so many Sci-Fi topics in such a cohesive way, you watch some of these TV shows and it's like the world building get's rewritten between seasons if not episodes, in Gateway it all ties in perfectly and the pacing is pulp speed, there is always a reason to turn the page. My college astronomy professor recommended them to me because he was a black hole sperg, lol. Phil K. Dick is great for a mindfuck, A Scanner Darkly was very unsettling, Androids was not really what I expected but was deeper than Hollywood's take on it.

I would also add Larry Niven to the list, his Sci-Fi world building and creature craft is top notch. Draco Tavern is just pure fun, The Mote In God's Eye is fantastic, The Fleet of Worlds stuff might even be better than that but kind of wants you to read at least the first Ring World (before Halo, and not like a Halo novel at all)

Everyone also needs to read Heinlein...and Dune of course, you have to read that, but probably only the first one, because the rest are drier than Arrakis... and if you like it dry you might as well get into Azimov's Foundation for the politics (also 'I, Robot' is genuinely brilliant and more relevant than ever and it's not like the Will Smith movie at all) or go to Clark for the Jules Verne tier autism (Rama, the first book at least, was probably my favorite, The 2001 stuff is good but is basically the movie since it was written in tandem and I thought Childhood's End was kind of shit).
It also helps that the other gateway books aren't really of much interest to non-enthusiasts anymore. So you can scoop all 6-7 easily.

Speaking of which,

Asimov, Heinlein, Clarke. These are the big trio of the golden age. Add in Bradbury as an honorary fourth. PKD, le Guin, Vonnegut, Herbert are the big ones from the sort of New Wave-ish era.

For people who really like more of the Golden Age/50s era, I can strongly recommend the following despite not having read super deeply.

  • L. Sprague de Camp - a Fun sci-fi writer who did a lot of time travel tales. He also did homages to Burroughs and Howard as well. He's usually fun light reading. The man did some historical fiction and fantasy as well. NESFA Press has his major SF in two volumes, but the guy lived for almost all of the 20th century and was a consistently fun writer. He did The Enchanter series with Fletcher Pratt, revived Conan with Lin Carter, and can be called a bit of a chud.
  • Lester del Rey- Another golden age SF writer. He'd go on to found the del Rey brand with his wife and help get tons of 70s-80s-90s SF/F published. He's very inspired by folktales, myths, and fairy tales. He's not quite what I'd call a cerebral writer, but he has this ability to craft timeless retreads into a classic sci-fi package. Well worth looking into.
  • Edmond Hamilton- One of the grandfathers of modern SF and known for space operas and weird science. Nicknamed "The World Wrecker". He's a capable and entertaining writer who extensively wrote space operas. He also worked on DC comics throughout the 40s-60s and brought a lot of the old pulpy weird science/menace stuff into mainstream comics. The man is very well worth reading and there's a lot in public domain.
  • Leigh Brackett- Woman pulpster married to Edmond Hamilton. Known for her space opera and Sword &Planet tales. Think of her as taking the torch from both Robert E. Howard and Edgar Rice Burroughs. But, wait, that's not all. She became a prominent hollywood screenwriter and worked on Hatari, The Big Sleep, and her final work was the first draft of some movie called The Empire Strikes Back. She's a masterful writer in terms of pure entertainment and it's a damned shame she doesn't get recognized. She wrote tons of adventurous sword and planet tales, space operas, and all that good stuff. But she also wrote tons of mysteries as George Sanders. One book that's highly spoken of from her '50s SF output is The Long Tomorrow, which is a post-apocalyptic bildungsroman set in a world in which the Amish and Mennonites have taken over in the aftermath of nukes. Another good novel by her is The Sword of Rhiannon, which is a short and tight sword and planet tale.
  • C. L. Moore and Henry Kuttner - another husband and wife team. Moore crafted the first female sword and sorcery protagonist (Jirel of Joiry) and a proto-Han Solo (Northwest Smith). She's a very adept writer. Kuttner's been called "The Neglected Master" due to dying young and not having gotten to some great novel quite yet. He's an enjoyable writer with rock-solid execution and great imagination. At some point, they began to work collaboratively on everything, so it's rough trying to figure out who did what after they got married. One major story attributed to Kuttner, but likely done by both of them, is "Mimsy were the Borogroves" and that shit was baller.
  • Alfred Bester- Only has about 8 books of SF. But is widely known for "The Demolished Man" and "The Stars, My Destination" novels from the 1950s. Very well written and very influential on cyberpunk. The rest of his work is excellent too.
  • Jack Vance- Excellent SF-F writer that wrote from the late 40s and was still writing in his old age in the 00s despite being blind. The Dying Earth quadrology is fun. He's great at building worlds and having human characters.
  • Poul Anderson- The ultimate jobbing writer in the biz. Wrote from the late 40s all the way to his death in 2000. He was one of a handful of SF writers in the '50s who could sustain their income solely on writing. Famous for his wide variety of work, from the classic fantasy "The Broken Sword" to hard SF such as "Tau Zero". He was a workhorse who had a mantra of writing to entertain. Often, his work got described as "fantasy with rivets". Anderson's work is usually worth checking out. "Brain Wave", "The High Crusade", "Ensign Flandry" and "Orion Shall Rise" all came recommended to me.
  • Clifford Simak- The great humanist of the Golden Age SF writers. He's comfy. Very comfy. Look for City and Way Station. Those two are great.
  • Stanley G. Weinbaum - An SF writer who only had two years of work in the '30s, but was largely considered to be some of the finest SF of the era. Very much someone capable of wonderful worldbuilding, aliens, and imaginative use of hard SF. His friend, Murray Leinster, tried to help keep his stuff in print. Leinster himself was an extraordinarily prolific pulpster and SF writer, being the first SF writer to be honored with the title of "Dean of Science Fiction".
  • There's plenty of good writers from this rough era. Cordwainer Smith, Damon Knight, Andre Norton, H. Beam Piper, John W. Campbell, and Gordon Dickson are all fun.
Now for a more 60s & onward grouping
  • Roger Zelazny- Mythopoetic SF-F writer that veered very much into soft SF and fantasy. Neil Gaiman made a career out of aping Zelazny's style. This writer is capable of hitting you in the feels. Read "Rose for Ecclesiastes", a short story from the '60s. His "Lord of Light" and "This Immortal" are also excellent novels.
  • John Brunner- A very interesting SF writer who did a lot of work on predicting societal trends in "Stand on Zanzibar" and the rest of his "Quartet of Rome". While still respected, he's one of the great "could have been" writers. He had a stint where he spent all his time trying to write a great historical fiction work, only for it to flop. He never quite got the mojo for SF back after that failure. But his prime works are all still highly regarded. He's also considered a proto-cyberpunk author.
  • A. Bertram Chandler - You like Horatio Hornblower? This writer was an Aussie navy officer that wrote SF for fun. His John Grimes character was essentially Horatio Hornblower in a space opera setting.
  • Keith Laumer - A former military diplomat turned SF writer. Very fun. His Retief! series was about an intergalactic diplomat. He also had good military SF and time travel novels like Dinosaur Beach.
  • Philip Jose Farmer - An odd writer who's known for being very pulp fiction influenced. His stuff's not for everyone.
  • Brian Aldiss- A classic british SF writer, people pass over him. He wrote Non-Stop and Hothouse, which had great worldbuilding and execution.
  • J. G. Ballard - A big New Wave Brit writer who wrote a bunch of post-disaster novels. Fun stuff
  • Stanislaw Lem- Polish writer and one of the most respected SF writers of the latter 20th century.
  • Again, the 60s-70s produced tons of splendid writers. D.G. Compton, James Tiptree Jr., Walter Tevis, Gene Wolfe, etc.
I can recommend Glen Cook as well. Those first three Black Company novels are so good.
I'm glad Dan Simmons is getting love as well. The guy gets weird, but he is skilled enough to pull it off, and his horror novels are great as well.
Christopher Ruoccio's Sun Eater series is great if you're looking for something new. He's young and endlessly talented. He makes the aliens come across as truly horrific creatures.

It's sad that publishing has gotten so weak that this is all we have. But it does rejuvenate the old classics, and introduce new readers to them.
Dan Simmon's "Song of Kali" is great and it's so funny how some people get upset over it being racist. I just simply agree with the ending sentiment of dreaming of nukes being dropped on Calcutta.
It's about 50/50 here if I go to half price books they're trying to proudly display the newest leftist liberal slop from msnbc journalist as front and center. Meanwhile the neocons books tend to be best sellers.
Outside of bill Maher or hiring a non political comedian like Jon lovitz. You have to sell liberal slop for the cheap Meanwhile the newest book from Glenn beck or Laura Ingram will sell a million copies simply because neocons buy books.
Liberals often get upset that people find conservative books more appealing without forcing them to read.

Shitlibs only buy books to posture. It's why a lot of shitlib oriented comics may get a first issue that sells super well, and then the rest of the run sells like shit.

If you're at a Half price Books, try looking for vintage sci-fi, fantasy, and other genre fiction. You may be surprised.
 
Shitlibs only buy books to posture. It's why a lot of shitlib oriented comics may get a first issue that sells super well, and then the rest of the run sells like shit.
They like the idea of something, not the actual thing. Which is why entertainment is so fucked right now.

At the end of the day it's about low effort content for them. A tiktok or a tweet.
 
don't know who this is talking about. probably some guy who didn't want to fuck the writer. there's one solid guy at work that i've given over a dozen books (cause i need to get rid of them) and he's read half of them and an equal amount of his own.

seriously, who's the writer trying to shame into fucking them. i give a dude a book and he's like "hell yeah i'll read that". i got a dude at work that's like "you're getting rid of your calculus text? hell yeah i'll read that."

...

lmao, holy shit. men read calculus / history and fags read victorian swoon romance and that's the problem? holy shit, this dude is a fag.
also, didn't simon and shuster {ethan ralph voice: YOU MEAN SIMOON AND SHYSTER A HAHAHAHA} like collapse a decade ago? aren't they equal to penguin publishing? which is to say there but not.
 
Last edited:
They like the idea of something, not the actual thing. Which is why entertainment is so fucked right now.

At the end of the day it's about low effort content for them. A tiktok or a tweet.
and, note, when there's some half-decent creator in charge of something, they get fucked over.

Warren Ellis, Jonathan Hickman, Dan Abnett & Andy Lanning, etc.

All involved in mainstream pop culture media, got shafted due to corporate or faggots co-opting stuff.

don't know who this is talking about. probably some guy who didn't want to fuck the writer. there's one solid guy at work that i've given over a dozen books (cause i need to get rid of them) and he's read half of them and an equal amount of his own.

seriously, who's the writer trying to shame into fucking them. i give a dude a book and he's like "hell yeah i'll read that". i got a dude at work that's like "you're getting rid of your calculus text? hell yeah i'll read that."

...

lmao, holy shit. men read calculus / history and fags read victorian swoon romance and that's the problem? holy shit, this dude is a fag.
also, didn't simon and shuster {ethan ralph voice: YOU MEAN SIMOON AND SHYSTER A HAHAHAHA} like collapse a decade ago? aren't they equal to penguin publishing? which is to say there but not.
they really really want to be the hero of their story, but they're too mentally malfunct to do so
 
the magazine short story era of SF is where a ton of Hollywood/TV show plots are taken from. Harlan Ellison went to war with Hollywood over them not crediting the original inspirations, iirc.

Lots of these stories were thrown into anthologies too and you can't go too wrong with them. Pohl, Silverberg, Gold, Dozois, Asimov, and a few others were excellent anthologists. It's a dying specialization and I fear that Silverberg, John Betancourt, and Mike Ashley are the only good anthologists left.


Heinlein was excellent at writing fun things that made good points, until he went a bit batshit crazy. And then he just make stuff with. . . weird points.
Like what?
I’ve read three of his so far, Starship Troopers, Moon is a Harsh Mistress and Stranger in a Strange Land.
 
Huh I thought it was just me. I was waiting for an appointment a few weeks back so I walked into a Barnes and Noble bookstore for the first time in like two decades. I wandered over to the scifi and fantasy section to browse. I checked out book after book, but they were almost all either erotic smut or plucky female leads at some sort of magic academy, leading a rebellion or captured by some enemy force lead by a hot male general. Maybe one out of either had a male lead, and most of those were older books that I already knew about.

I just figured that B&N store was run by some purple-haired feminist, but maybe it's an industry-wide thing lol Looks like I'll stick to games, podcasts and streaming services. RIP my return to reading, looks like they don't want male readers lol oh well.
 
I don't know if anything has changed or if they even exist anymore but when I was an avid reader in my teens/early twenties I loved going to weird thrift/book stores and trying to find old/obscure versions of classic books I wanted and usually I could them for pretty cheap and it was awesome. The smell of a perfectly preserved old fucking book that hasn't been opened in decades or 100+ years is something I will always remember. Fuck buying modern books I have no idea why you would.
 
Miserable fucking book. Kept pausing in the middle of scenes for the author to rant about how much he hated Ronald Reagan.
Never heard of the book until this thread. Looked up a plot synopsis. I know you can't exactly pull the full tone and cadence and nuance of a story from a Cliffnotes reading, but the plot struck me as a series of fart huffing "then everyone clapped" moments. Then it struck me that both the main character of the novel and the author took the same life trajectory: he voluntarily left the US to become a fucking leaf and apparently spends his free time sperging about Trump.
 
I invite you all to post in/read my effort thread:

My own list is missing some recent ones (like Stranger in a Strange Land).
 
This whole thread is fucking great.

Another old master in seeing missed here is Fritz Leiber. Not only is the Fafhrd and Gray Mouser series a massive influence on Dungeons & Dragons, it's rollicking great escapist fantasy as well. None of the books suck.

His SF work is also great. Gather Darkness! stands out but his short stories are great too. There is a particular one I can't recall the name of but it was about a space ship in perpetual orbit around the inner solar system and the viewpoint from a man mentally and physically damaged from a disease so that his perception of what was going on around him was messed up, it was great.
 
  • H. Rider Haggard - You know the whole deal with the "gentleman explorer" hero? The kind that winds up finding lost races or lost places? He's one of the people that started it. His Allan Quatermain stories began with King Solomon's Mines and he went on to write a fuckton. He had a sort of female protagonist-goddess figure called Ayesha that shows up in She. He also had a zulu warrior as a major supporting character and we all got to see him in some stories as the protagonist. This guy would keep writing Allan Quatermain books into the 1920s and they'd get pretty fucking weird, with a few involving strange herbs being smoked in order to reincarnate into an ancient semi-mystical past. Haggard also influences Sword & Sorcery fiction with the likes of Eric Brighteyes.
  • Talbot Mundy - Read up on this guy. He was an adventurer turned occultist and writer. Man wrote tons of great adventure tales of british explorers and agents traipsing around the world. Sometimes there's ancient conspiracies, other times it's weird mystical bullshit. He wrote the Jimgrim stories and also portrayed plenty of orientals and arabs in heroic supporting roles. I think he also had a tibetan monk as a protagonist in some novels. Easily in public domain.
  • Harold Lamb- This guy used to be pretty well respected. He wrote tons of historical fiction and swashbucklers. There's a long set of stories about Khilit the Cossack and his legendary sword. Lamb is great if you can find his work, but plenty of it's in the public domain. He also wrote about cool historical figures like Alexander the Great, Saladin, Omar Kayam, Genghis Khan, and etc. Tons of his work are about the Crusades and the era of knights.
All solid suggestions, but I'd like to commend you for bringing up these three in particular. They are not well known today because they don't fit into the fantasy label comfortably, but Haggard, Mundy and Lamb are among the all time greats. Lamb, especially, is a damn genius of a storyteller; clever plotting, strong characters, and impeccable historical detail. He is easily Robert E. Howard's equal, and I'm happy for having read his books. Howard Andrew Jones (RIP) deserves an enormous amount of praise for bringing his writings back into print, because Lamb is tremendous.
 
Back