Why do certain people act as if "punching down" is an intrinsically bad thing? - And for that matter, why is "punching up" considered an intrinsically good thing by those same people?

[Ashy the Angel]

In 2008 or thereabouts Occupy Wall Street was kicking off. The leaders - almost exclusively straight white males - made plans, openly debated the merits of different tactics, and generally got shit done. This scared the shit out of the elite finance parasites - and (((parasites))) - and shortly thereafter a bunch of gays, brown people, and women showed up. These newcomers demanded to be heard above and beyond the original leaders, so everyone agreed to implement the progressive stack. That is, straight white males speak last, have the least decision making authority, and can be interrupted at any time. The newcomers spent their newfound power airing their petty grievances over largely imagined slights.

The original, effective leaders threw up their hands in disgust and gave up.

Periodically, whenever someone on the left stands up against finance/capital, a horde of grievance-mongers crawl out of the woodwork and howl about their oppression before returning to wherever it is they come from.

It isn't necessary to do this to right-populists because of course everyone knows Republicans are Nazis. The media tells me so, and the media never lies!

Like everything else in America today, woke politics is a scam inflicted on us by finance capitalists and perpetuated by useful idiots happy with a few crumbs from their table. Most of the idiots don't see any profit from it, but they are re-enacting what they see on the internet and in movies and shows; they have internalized the beliefs finance wants them to have. This is a sort of psychological reward in lieu of wages.

The original leaders of OWS were middle class and upper middle class white collar professionals, what Orwell called the Outer Party. They are the smartest and best trained people in the USA, and are thus the greatest threat to uninterrupted, eternal rule of our finance/capital overlords - who, let's be honest, are more lucky than smart or hard-working.

The finance/capital upperclass employs elite managerialists - usually sons and daughters of upper class aristocracy - to manage their empires. The managers respond to the threat of middle class revolutionaries in two ways:

1. Disemploying straight white males (and increasingly straight white females) via outsourcing and importing foreigners to act as middle managers and trained professionals.

2. Pushing identify politics into corporate environments, especially increasingly granular, obscure, and esoteric manifestations such as transgenderism. This divides potential revolutionaries among arbitrary lines, preventing mutual empathy which precedes solidarity.

Source: I was an Communist before I became a racist.

tl;dr

Woke politics is a fat banker getting all the losers and morons in society to gang up on the banker's rivals.

So you spent all those paragraphs explaining how the bankers used PoC and LGBT people as pawns to destabilize leftist movements...and you somehow managed to become a racist anyway?

It seems like you missed the point of your own theory. It sounds like bankers are still your enemy, and racial divisions are simply a smokescreen to distract from that. So why be racist anyway? That makes literally no sense.

 

[HeyYou]

So you spent all those paragraphs explaining how the bankers used PoC and LGBT people as pawns to destabilize leftist movements...and you somehow managed to become a racist anyway?

It seems like you missed the point of your own theory. It sounds like bankers are still your enemy, and racial divisions are simply a smokescreen to distract from that. So why be racist anyway? That makes literally no sense.

You're taking this shit way too seriously, as usual, Ashy.

Personally, who the fuck cares if it's punching down or not. If someone's being an asswipe, call them out on it. No one is free from criticism.

 

[No Exit]

Anyone who hates punching down is probably a manlet.

 

[Give Her The D]

So you spent all those paragraphs explaining how the bankers used PoC and LGBT people as pawns to destabilize leftist movements...and you somehow managed to become a racist anyway?

It seems like you missed the point of your own theory. It sounds like bankers are still your enemy, and racial divisions are simply a smokescreen to distract from that. So why be racist anyway? That makes literally no sense.

I think you'd benefit taking a Klonopin or two, Ashy. You need to relax.

 

[Twitter Hate Mob]

So you spent all those paragraphs explaining how the bankers used PoC and LGBT people as pawns to destabilize leftist movements...and you somehow managed to become a racist anyway?

It seems like you missed the point of your own theory. It sounds like bankers are still your enemy, and racial divisions are simply a smokescreen to distract from that. So why be racist anyway? That makes literally no sense.

because the bankers are jews hth

 

[???]

So you spent all those paragraphs explaining how the bankers used PoC and LGBT people as pawns to destabilize leftist movements...and you somehow managed to become a racist anyway?

It seems like you missed the point of your own theory. It sounds like bankers are still your enemy, and racial divisions are simply a smokescreen to distract from that. So why be racist anyway? That makes literally no sense.

The issue is that we would have actual justice if these people weren't so stupid, self-absorbed, and willing to sell out their ideals (assuming they had any to start) for chump change. Most of them do it for ass pats instead of material benefits, which is at least understandable.

Anyways, you're mistaken. Racial issues aren't a smoke screen. Brown people, gays, women, and all the other freaks in the freak show are the lumpenproles used by finance/capital to hammer the working and middle classes. They enjoy terrorizing people better than them. There can be no solidarity with someone who sees you as prey.

We're getting off topic and my bitterness is showing, make a new thread about why people are racist.

 

[Syaoran Li]

So you spent all those paragraphs explaining how the bankers used PoC and LGBT people as pawns to destabilize leftist movements...and you somehow managed to become a racist anyway?

It seems like you missed the point of your own theory. It sounds like bankers are still your enemy, and racial divisions are simply a smokescreen to distract from that. So why be racist anyway? That makes literally no sense.

Eh, if I were to wager a guess, a lot of them try to avoid racism at first and just say "Fuck it" when they get branded a "Nazi" for not liking communism or mildly disagreeing with a tranny and decide to just go all out and meet leftist stupidity with their own brand of equal and opposite stupidity by deciding to go full /pol/ tard.

There's also the issue of leftist hypocrisy. It doesn't help that the Far Left is also very fucking racist despite their harping and claims of moral superiority, but their racism is seen as socially acceptable because they'll either cloak it in all sorts of insane intersectionality and critical race theory doublethink (the whole "muh power and privilege" bullshit nonsense)

They will try and obfuscate some forms of racism with anti-capitalist and anti-Zionist rhetoric as seen in the case of left-wing antisemitism.

Hating Jews and loving authoritarianism are the two things equally beloved by the far left and the far right, even though both sides love to deny it and insist that only their opponents are in favor of it.

Personally, I think becoming a racist or a fascist just because you are pissed off about the Left's own brand of racism and love of Marxism is fucking stupid and a classic example of shooting yourself in the foot.

The rise of the 2010's Woke Left and the sheer insanity of SJW identity politics is one of the greatest recruitment tools that the far right ever had and is the textbook definition of a self-fulfilling prophecy. It's sickening, really.

Sorry, Ashy, but while Trump may be an asshole, he's not a real fascist. If the United States was really a fascist country like you Antifa tards say it is, then CNN wouldn't be going into full TDS mode and you'd be jailed as a dissident.

America is not an example of fascism and Trump is not a fascist, even if he is a loud-mouthed asshole.

However, the Soviet Union, Maoist China, and North Korea are all examples of real communism, no matter how many times willfully ignorant commie punk chuds like yourself say otherwise.

 

[Jarolleon]

The issue is that we would have actual justice if these people weren't so stupid, self-absorbed, and willing to sell out their ideals (assuming they had any to start) for chump change. Most of them do it for ass pats instead of material benefits, which is at least understandable.

Anyways, you're mistaken. Racial issues aren't a smoke screen. Brown people, gays, women, and all the other freaks in the freak show are the lumpenproles used by finance/capital to hammer the working and middle classes. They enjoy terrorizing people better than them. There can be no solidarity with someone who sees you as prey.

We're getting off topic and my bitterness is showing, make a new thread about why people are racist.

Being more detached myself I think it's like leaving sugar on the floor and wondering why the ants keep coming back. If a superpowered Moon Man or Red Terror showed up and murdered all the "banksters" and then vanished again the niche once occupied by them would soon be filled by another group. Because the population & political system selects (in the evolutionary sense) their methods of acquiring & maintaining power and riches.

 

[Drunk and Pour]

"I can make fun of you, but you can't make fun of me back" is the basic gist of it, to me.

 

[???]

Being more detached myself I think it's like leaving sugar on the floor and wondering why the ants keep coming back. If a superpowered Moon Man or Red Terror showed up and murdered all the "banksters" and then vanished again the niche once occupied by them would soon be filled by another group. Because the population & political system selects (in the evolutionary sense) their methods of acquiring & maintaining power and riches.

You're right that the issue is systematic. We wouldn't have so many problems if:

1. We didn't have a winner-take-all political system which prevents third parties from forming and silences large minorities of voters. See the Hillary vs Bernie DNC debacle for a real world example.

2. Our federal and state governments weren't so large relative to county and local governments - centralization makes most fights existential, which polarizes politics and increases conflict.

Switzerland's official name is the Helvetica Confederacy. They barely have a federal government. They are made up of several different ethnicities and speak two or three different languages, but they were and are extremely stable and peaceful (though it helps that they are possibly the hardest nation to invade).

If you know that some asshole 50+ miles away can't decide your fate - or chop off your son's dick, or let Pakis gang-rape your daughter - then you don't care what he does. If he fucks up anything, it will occur in his own backyard and thus he has an incentive not to fuck up (or he'll learn the hard way and get lynched by his neighbors).

I really don't care what a bunch of hippies do in California, jews do in New York, or niggers do in Atlanta ... as long as they don't do it here.

3. Corporations weren't allowed to exist. They can access several orders of magnitude more capital than sole proprietorships and partnerships, which in other words means they scale better.

A giant corporation isn't harmed by new regulations because it already has a platoon of lawyers, while a mom & pop store has to close up shop. Corporations, since they can scale larger, have more opportunities to harm us and they are better at harming us. One asshole can cause only so much trouble, but a battalion of normal people just trying to get paid can do much, much more.

A nice side effect is total destruction of the jew casino investment banking. Without the constant boom-bust cycle of the stock markets and harebrained jew schemes to "stabilize" it, the life and wealth of the average joe becomes much more stable.

Without corporations, our laws and regulations don't need to be as complex, and we gain efficiency in reduced overhead.

On a similar note, we could put 100% tariffs on everything, eliminate the imcome tax, and save by not employing tens of thousands of IRS assholes.

We could eliminate the department of education and leave it all to the states, which would destroy woke BS in universities literally overnight. Education costs would drop to 5% of current costs because we wouldn't need to employ thousands of paper pushers to ensure no one called Dequavious a nigger for stealing their weed. We would just pay professors, students could do all the other work on campus as part of their education.

We could close all our overseas bases, bring all our troops home, and switch 99% of all units to reserves. Only training units, special forces, and nuke bombers/subs/missile units and their support units should remain active.

Society is way too complex. Simplifying saves money, reduces overhead costs, and puts people back in charge of their futures rather than faceless bureaucrats 2000 miles away.

I stopped being a Communist when I realized what it means in a centralized, multiracial society: being a paypig for the worst humans (if you can call them that) to breed. If I were living in a 100% Scotch-Irish-English-Dutch mix country (my ancestry) with thousands of other gingers, I could accept it.

---

I don't want to kill bankers, jews, niggers, spics, chinks, fags, trannies, queers, Mitt Romney, furries, or dog-botherers... though I will laugh if someone else does. I just want to live far away from them, and not have my livelihood depend on their schemes.

I'm sorry for going off topic with walls of text, I'm going senile in my old age.

 

[Book Thief]

It's because the people using this term want certain minority classes to be above criticism, while shifting all responsibility onto other majority classes (i.e. white, male, heterosexual, cisgenders). They want to make any sort of criticism or joke be on the same level as using ethnic slurs so that you do not question their behavior or beliefs. There really isn't much more to it than that.

 

[Mrs Paul]

I think some of it is that old "pick on someone your own size" sentiment, you know, at least in theory. And when you have someone who's sole idea of comedy is "derp derp derp, niggers are stoopid, derp," well, you get the idea.

However, as Mel Brooks once said, "Tragedy is me cutting my finger. Comedy is you falling into a manhole and dying." Making fun of someone's misfortunes is a tradition. I guess you just have to be GOOD at it. Not like the losers at Chimpout, or Niggermania. That's part of the problme -- too many people think they're like the second coming of George Carlin, when they're really just another moron at Open Mic Night. If you're not funny, it shouldn't matter who you're mocking.

At least, that's my theory, and I'm sticking with it.


(And NOBODY is above criticism. Again, it's all in HOW you do it)

 

[Ira the Weatherman]

So you spent all those paragraphs explaining how the bankers used PoC and LGBT people as pawns to destabilize leftist movements...and you somehow managed to become a racist anyway?

It seems like you missed the point of your own theory. It sounds like bankers are still your enemy, and racial divisions are simply a smokescreen to distract from that. So why be racist anyway? That makes literally no sense.

I'm guessing it's quite hard to be the social revolutionary idealist when you see your former comrades gladly accept the opportunity to portray you as the villain because of your race or sex because there's short-term gain in it for them, despite you knowing that they know better. There's no shortage of people among the supposedly oppressed who are willing to bogeyman someone based on immutable characteristics when they have nothing to lose and are promised the world, and on the other side the supposed oppressor group will instinctively recoil at being targetted based on factors they have no say over, especially when the only choices presented are proskynesis or resistance.

There's a reason this intersectional tribalism is such a destructive thing: it works. It divides people into easily categorisable groups and makes those divisions both personal and banal, simultaneously shutting down any meaningful discussion and cooperation. Good luck trying to rise above it when you're being opposed by people who hate the very fibre of your being, knowing there's nothing that you can do to turn you into anything but a subhuman in their eyes. All the while all this abuse is tickling the caveman part of your brain into doing the same thing back to them, and congrats, instead of a united working class of rational actors you've now gotten a sixway Hutu-Tutsi divide.

 

[Jonah Hill poster]

the posts on here are TL;DR so to sum it up as best I as I can:

pee pee poo poo PROJECTION 101

 

[Xarpho]

If the whole "punching down" is an intrinsically bad thing, then shouldn't it matter who's actually doing it? In that world, it would be wrong of the elitist West Coast types to mock working-class whites in flyover country while working-class whites in flyover country can mock elitist West Coast types since they're on the upper echelon in societal pecking order.

 

[???]

If the whole "punching down" is an intrinsically bad thing, then shouldn't it matter who's actually doing it? In that world, it would be wrong of the elitist West Coast types to mock working-class whites in flyover country while working-class whites in flyover country can mock elitist West Coast types since they're on the upper echelon in societal pecking order.

Hence why upper-class white coastal elites take up wokeness; it gives them a chance to lay their "white sins" at the feet of their defenseless cousins in the heartlands, thereby staving off the woke hoard for a little longer.

 

[Syaoran Li]

Given the predominance of the Progressive Stack ideology in media and academia right now, wouldn't attacking "trans women of color" be the ultimate form of "punching up"?

Seriously, left-wing trannies are some of the most over-privileged fucks in Current Year America. They need to be rightly mocked and ridiculed for their insanity and audacity. Humor and mockery is a powerful weapon against tyranny. There's a reason why the first person murdered by the Bolsheviks was a clown who made fun of the Tsars.

 

[Übertroon]

Punching down isn't intrinsically bad, you just have to make it seem like the people you're beating aren't underdogs, and present yourself as oppressed

That's why you can have a ethnic group that's 300% over represented in government while presenting themselves as oppressed

 

[???]

Given the predominance of the Progressive Stack ideology in media and academia right now, wouldn't attacking "trans women of color" be the ultimate form of "punching up"?

Seriously, left-wing trannies are some of the most over-privileged fucks in Current Year America. They need to be rightly mocked and ridiculed for their insanity and audacity. Humor and mockery is a powerful weapon against tyranny. There's a reason why the first person murdered by the Bolsheviks was a clown who made fun of the Tsars.

Humor isn't a weapon against tyranny, it's simply a weapon. It's neutral.

The left switched tactics from the 60s (when they were the underdogs and benefited from humor and free speech) to today (when they are almost as powerful as they ever were and are most vulnerable to humor) because it makes no sense to allow mockery when you're in power, especially if your entire ideology is a power grab masked in lies.

They are absolutely correct, from a pure power perspective, to crush mockery. It is the biggest threat they face. It has nothing to do with principles.

 

[The best and greatest]

I thought "Punching down" was stuff like kicking the crutches out from under disabled people or pushing around people who can't/won't stand up for themselves.