Why the Galactic Empire and First Order are the good guys in Star Wars

[UQ 770]

>inb4 they acknowledge darth blinks and make him the big baddie playing 5d chess this whole time

Please tell me they make him a metaphor for Trump like every other woke outlet has. I would actually torrent and watch the movie in order to see them ineptly inserting Trump memes via Jar-Jar speech.

 

[Creep3r]

>inb4 they acknowledge darth binks and make him the big baddie playing 5d chess this whole time

I think they might be desperate enough to actually do it.

Spoiler

This Disney SW comic released last year sent redditors into such a tizzy that they started making theories about how this proves Jar Jar is a Jedi/Sith.

 

[MW 590]

Its pretty clear that you're working backwards from this point. Pick up Asimov's Foundation trilogy and then start reading actual scifi instead of cheap trash. If you want a really morally ambiguous galactic empire, Jerry Pournelle will be right up your alley, especially the stuff he collaborated with Stirling on. The Galactic Empire is a cookie-cutter excuse villain that is literally Corporate Hollywood dressed like Nazis. The writing just isn't good enough to reinterpret them as anything but evil and inept, and the universe is too shallow besides.

I read canon books licensed by Disney called the Aftermath Trilogy which is about how the Empire fell after ROTJ. The writing is good at allowing the readers to reinterpret the Empire. It portrays the rebels as causing chaos in their “damn fool idealistic crusade.”

"This is Grand Admiral Rae Sloane, commander of the Imperial Navy and de facto leader of the Galactic Empire. The Empire remains vigilant in combating the anarchist criminal government calling itself the New Republic. The dream of a safe, sane, and unified galaxy did not die with the glorious Emperor Palpatine. The Galactic Empire continues to march forward, tirelessly diligent in its quest to return order and stability where none before existed. Meanwhile, the New Republic continues its own mission to destroy what we have built together. Crime has returned to the galaxy tenfold as the underworld dynasties have regained dominance over worlds once kept free of their toxic influences by the Empire. Supply lines have been cut, and many worlds are now starving without adequate food. The corrosive influence of the New Republic has caused a seemingly insurmountable loss of jobs, income, and even lives. But fear not. The Empire remains, as sure as a mountain, as certain as the stars across all the systems. We will defeat the insurgency. We will make this false government pay for its crimes against you. Even now we are building new ships, new bases, and founding new technologies to keep you safe. The Empire is coming. We will deliver you from harm. And we will strike back against our enemies. Remain calm. remain loyal. With true hearts, victory for us—and for the whole galaxy—will soon be at hand."

Another thing to keep in mind is that George Lucas as a liberal, admitted that he partially based the Empire off of the United States.

 

[Webby's Boyfriend]

I read canon books licensed by Disney

What a waste of time.

I would actually torrent and watch the movie

I've pirated Solo: A Star Wars Story and stopped it after like 20 minutes. Now where I'm into Star Wars again, I've re-readen many old EU comicbooks, but still didn't watch this flick until the end credits. But surely it cannot be worse than TLJ.

 

[Creep3r]

I read canon books licensed by Disney called the Aftermath Trilogy

The writing is good

>the Aftermath Trilogy
>by Chuck Wendig
>with Space-Hillary Clinton as the main protagonist
>good writing
You're baiting right? Even the shitty Jedi Prince novels look like works of art compared to that mess. Hell, the author was such a sperg that even Disney had to fire him.

https://kiwifarms.st/threads/chuck-wendig-charles-wendig-terribleminds.48930/page-45

 

[UQ 770]

>the Aftermath Trilogy
>by Chuck Wendig
>with Space-Hillary Clinton as the main protagonist
>good writing
You're baiting right? Even the shitty Jedi Prince novels look like works of art compared to that mess. Hell, the author was such a sperg that even Disney had to fire him.

Yeah, I choked and bled from the eyes when I read that guy's post.

 

[MW 590]

>the Aftermath Trilogy
>by Chuck Wendig
>with Space-Hillary Clinton as the main protagonist
>good writing
You're baiting right? Even the shitty Jedi Prince novels look like works of art compared to that mess. Hell, the author was such a sperg that even Disney had to fire him.

https://kiwifarms.st/threads/chuck-wendig-charles-wendig-terribleminds.48930/page-45

I never said that they were great books, I was saying that Chuck Wendig inadvertently did a good job portraying the Imperials as the good guys by making the rebels bring disaster to the Galaxy much like the Democrats and by having the protagonist be like Hillary Clinton.

I read the books thinking they would give great hints about Snoke’s identity. They only gave vague hints about something being in the unknown regions.

However the redeeming parts of the book was Admiral Gallius Rax fulfilling Palpatine’s contingency plan to create a brand new better Empire and the chapter with Jar Jar Binks that hints that he’s a Sith Lord looking for an apprentice.

 

[Webby's Boyfriend]

I never said that they were great books, I was saying that Chuck Wendig inadvertently did a good job portraying the Imperials as the good guys by making the rebels bring disaster to the Galaxy much like the Democrats and by having the protagonist be like Hillary Clinton.

I read the books thinking they would give great hints about Snoke’s identity. They only gave vague hints about something being in the unknown regions.

However the redeeming parts of the book was Admiral Gallius Rax fulfilling Palpatine’s contingency plan to create a brand new better Empire and the chapter with Jar Jar Binks that hints that he’s a Sith Lord looking for an apprentice.

Sounds like somethin' straight out of an edgy 14 year old's daydreams.

 

[UQ 770]

I never said that they were great books, I was saying that Chuck Wendig inadvertently did a good job portraying the Imperials as the good guys by making the rebels bring disaster to the Galaxy much like the Democrats and by having the protagonist be like Hillary Clinton.

I read the books thinking they would give great hints about Snoke’s identity. They only gave vague hints about something being in the unknown regions.

However the redeeming parts of the book was Admiral Gallius Rax fulfilling Palpatine’s contingency plan to create a brand new better Empire and the chapter with Jar Jar Binks that hints that he’s a Sith Lord looking for an apprentice.

Dude, I was no-shit not joking that you should pick up some Asimov or Pournelle. Its clear you have an interest in this topic but your sense of taste is so tragically bad that I'm getting acute radiation sickness reading it. If you want to go hardcore you can also just start with Stirling right out of the gate like I did.

 

[MW 590]

Dude, I was no-shit not joking that you should pick up some Asimov or Pournelle. Its clear you have an interest in this topic but your sense of taste is so tragically bad that I'm getting acute radiation sickness reading it. If you want to go hardcore you can also just start with Stirling right out of the gate like I did.

Stirling’s Nantucket Series sounds interesting. What Pournelle novels are similar to Star Wars?

 

[UQ 770]

Stirling’s Nantucket Series sounds interesting. What Pournelle novels are similar to Star Wars?

I have a very small snapshot of your personality, but already I'm of the opinion you'd like Pournelle the best out of my suggestions. His works are pretty short by modern standards, but in the Golden Age of SF fiction they learned how to make do with less. You should read his CoDominium universe, starting with King David's Spaceship. Its a story very in tune with the sense of cultural disillusionment I notice a lot of angry young people are feeling these days. Pournelle was also noted for being very politically incorrect along with his friend Larry Niven, but I always found Niven's work to be really goofy and uninteresting.

SM Stirling is good if you like down-in-the-mud combat mixed with the psychological problems I'm sure the man has. The first Draka book, Marching Through Georgia is a fun head-crushing slaughterfest filled with unsettling meditations on the psychology of slavery. Its very polemic though and that its lack of realism really pissed some people off.

This is an outlier I agree, but if you can find it, In Conquest Born by Celia Friedman is really fucking weird and uncomfortable to read. Its one of my favorite SF books ever just because it went to disturbing places I wasn't expecting while also the same time having a pretty good sense of humor. Its also worth noting that she's been largely overlooked in an age where people keep sperging about women writing sci-fi. Dunno if its your style though, I reccomend you start higher up on this list.

Of course there's always Asimov. George Lucas flat-out admitted the Galactic Empire of Star Wars is named after the Galactic Empire of Foundation. Additionally, if you you want something more fun to read, Harry Harrison's Stainless Steel Rat was one of the only books that actually had me laughing out loud at some of the descriptions and dialogue. I'm absolutely positive the character of Han Solo is a total ripoff of Slippery Jim.

 

[Slap47]

I've heard alot of cool stuff from those old books that Disney declared no longer canon.

"The Force" itself was a force that was actually evil. The Galaxy was invaded by extra-galactic invaders and that Death Star had to be remade after trillions of deaths, etc.

 

[UQ 770]

I've heard alot of cool stuff from those old books that Disney declared no longer canon.

"The Force" itself was a force that was actually evil. The Galaxy was invaded by extra-galactic invaders and that Death Star had to be remade after trillions of deaths, etc.

Basic sci-fi bitch.

 

[Corbin Dallas Multipass]

OP, you have a very weird thing about "legitimate authority". The ones that strangle people with their magic powers, or allow their officers to strangle people with their mind powers, or blow up entire fucking planets as a demonstration are the bad guys, it's not hard.

Now, I'll give you that all the various republics seemed wildly ineffective. But ineffective but well meaning vs effective and murderous is still an easy choice. I mean shit, maybe humans and various species of aliens just can't coexist and the real answer is space racism? Or... speciesism? Planetism? I don't even know what you'd call it at that point.

 

[{o{P]

I think they might be desperate enough to actually do it.

Spoiler

This Disney SW comic released last year sent redditors into such a tizzy that they started making theories about how this proves Jar Jar is a Jedi/Sith.

This was so ridiculous i wrote it off as being from a tales issue

 

[MW 590]

OP, you have a very weird thing about "legitimate authority". The ones that strangle people with their magic powers, or allow their officers to strangle people with their mind powers, or blow up entire fucking planets as a demonstration are the bad guys, it's not hard.

Now, I'll give you that all the various republics seemed wildly ineffective. But ineffective but well meaning vs effective and murderous is still an easy choice. I mean shit, maybe humans and various species of aliens just can't coexist and the real answer is space racism? Or... speciesism? Planetism? I don't even know what you'd call it at that point.

The Empire was legitimate authority because Palpatine became Emperor with the approval of the elected senate.

Darth Vader’s Force choke was just a method of disciplining those who disobey the Empire and interrogating rebels. And in my original post I explained how the destruction of Alderaan as a method of trying to end war by forcing opponents into submission is no different than the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. It cost lives, but it saved many more by ending the war.

The Empire’s goal was to bring peace to the galaxy through military might much like the Romans under Pax Romana. And they were speciest. All the stormtroopers and all the officers except for Thrawn were human. They rightfully considered aliens a threat since the Separatists in the Clone Wars were largely composed of aliens.

 

[Syaoran Li]

Now @Jacob Harrison is trying to tie in Star Wars into his monarchist fantasies?

Holy fuck, that is autistic even by my criminally low standards.

Star Wars, a massive franchise comprised of over ten movies and countless spin-offs, and only the Original Trilogy is any good, although I have yet to see Rogue One.

Three movies were enough. Although, I think the best thing to come out of the Star Wars franchise is the disco version of the original theme song...

May the Funk be with you, always....

 

[UQ 770]

May the Funk be with you, always....

And I thought I was the only one who enjoyed that song. Maybe signing up for this autistic shithole wasn't a total waste of time after all.

 

[Creep3r]

and only the Original Trilogy is any good

I could argue about this, but at least give the pre-Disney video games a shot my dude. Also there's a lot that could be said about ROTJ (minus the perfection of the Luke+Vader+Emperor scenes), but ROTJ is so ingrained into our culture and childhoods that most people can overlook its flaws despite how nonsensical they are.

although I have yet to see Rogue One.

Its basically a less memorable retelling of Dark Forces but with more forgettable characters and an edgy robot based on the one from KOTOR. Also excellent choice of music.

 

[Red Hood]

Dude, I was no-shit not joking that you should pick up some Asimov or Pournelle. Its clear you have an interest in this topic but your sense of taste is so tragically bad that I'm getting acute radiation sickness reading it. If you want to go hardcore you can also just start with Stirling right out of the gate like I did.

I've tried Foundation, and Asimov is an awful writer. Great ideas, shit execution. I've read a lot of pulp in my time, and Asimov in what I read has zero feel for characters.

Pournelle is good, but...

Star Wars borrows some ideas from science fiction but recommending Hard SF to someone interested in Star Wars is a non-starter. I would recommend dipping one's toes in some softer or more action heavy SF while trying to move from Star Wars to something deeper.

Star Wars is at its heart about action and emotion. It's not about how things actually work.

At least give the pre-Disney video games a shot my dude. Also there's a lot that could be said about ROTJ (minus the perfection of the Luke+Vader+Emperor scenes), but ROTJ is so ingrained into our culture and childhoods that most people can overlook their flaws despite how nonsensical they are.


Its basically a less memorable retelling of Dark Forces but with more forgettable characters and an edgy robot based on the one from KOTOR. Also excellent choice of music.

Why do I feel like I'm the only one that remembers Dark Forces has more than one level? Stealing the Death Star plans is the first (very small) level of a game with 10(?) very large levels.