Russian Invasion of Ukraine (2022): Thread 1 - Ukrainian Liars vs Russian Liars with Air and Artillery Superiority

[JägerGoose]

see you Kiev gals and boys

 

[Rustic Ruthenian]

I would appreciate if they just didn’t do that. I’d also appreciate if Russia would be less schizo in general.

 

[celebrityskin]

see you Kiev gals and boys

A E S T H E T I C

 

[Prester John]

I can appreciate that Russia doesn't want the USA messing around in the ex-Soviet bloc. The USA had the Monroe Doctrine (similar concept) and the USA shouldn't want Russia propping up dictators in Venezuela. If Russia invades Ukraine then I think the USA would be justified in forcing a regime change in Venezuela.

 

[JägerGoose]

A E S T H E T I C

russian music is always a blast

 

[benutz]

SAPIs aren't precisely snuggly.

But between freezing to death, which is supposed to be euphoric right at the end, and dying of dengueyellowjackmalariariverblindnessaids while being eaten alive by centipedes. . . yeah I'll take cold steppe over muggy jungle.

One of the major red flags and warning signs of hypothermia is people taking off the rest of what little clothing they have on. I've experienced this myself after going out in summer in only a t-shirt when it was hot. When the sun got obscured by clouds and the evening set in and the wind-chill factor also made things worse, I experienced it myself. It's a bit of a buzz. You just stop shivering and you become numb. It's definitely the method of death I would choose as opposed to be burned alive or dehydrated to death in a desert. You just kind of, well, freeze and your whole metabolism winds down.

Also deserts tend to be very hot during the day, and very not hot during the night. There is even a method for making ice in the desert at night if you want to look it up.

The soldiers will have all the best warm kit I'm sure, but there will be a few that get left out. They will also need to keep warm by drinking hot fluids to keep their core temperature up (this is when hypothermia sets in when it drops below a certain threshold). Still, your fingers will be freezing fucking cold and the desire to keep gloves on will surpass the need to pull triggers. I know that they've thought of that and you can still pull the trigger and whatnot, but the cold saps your motivation and it's a natural instinct of self-preservation to just do as little as possible to stay alive.

Then again, someone behind you with a gun they are prepared to use shouting CHARGE!!! is also a pretty good motivator to do as you are told in the name of staying alive. Something tells me this whole conflict is a lot more theatre and double-bluffs than days of old where that did indeed happen. That's not to say they still won't make an effort to use the element of surprise, but even then, I don't know what the weather is like in Ukraine, but it's fucking cold here in bongistan all the way up to Spring. I imagine it's no different there. Plus, lying low in a trench limits your movement to an extent and therefore your ability to stay warm.

And that's why anyone who ever served in the armed forces gets extra kudos for me, apart from risking death, the other shit you have to put up with, well... I fucking hate the cold!

Spoiler: Thank you for your service.

Posted from under my double-duvet with electric blanket on, fingerless gloves like Scrooge and no fucking central heating because I'm a europoor who chose 'eating' over 'heating'. Also sporting three pairs of wooly hiking socks and a pair of slippers. No pipe. Also long johns and a very comfy wooly hat. Things aren't so bad. I could be in a trench in Ukraine. Then again, it's so fucking cold, I might as well be in a fucking trench in Ukraine. Thank you for your service.

 

[The golden neckbeard]

American power comes from perception of American power and nothing more.

People are freaking out about rising prices, trying to pay for a world war would absolutely accelerate this. People were literally fist fighting over double cheeseburger rationing last year from covid, imagine asking them to make a major sacrifice to support a world war. Imagine asking the american population to forego CONSOOOMING to support the war effort; yeah i dont think so. There would be a revolt.

Simply put: America can't afford it. Russia know this. If they invade Ukraine or China invades taiwan Americans wont help. We cant. Our hegemony is based on bombing small countries who cant fight back.

In the end I am in the "NOTHING EVER HAPPENS CAMP" but Putin's own book said he relives the day of the Soviet Union's collapse everyday and the humilation had to be avenged at some point.


Ironically Hitler also justified the second world war on the "Bitter defeat" of 1914

We shall see. Russia certainly is in a position to pull this off and hasn't been so strong since 1991 and America has never been so weak. I would be suprised if Putin upended the status quo but then again he is getting old and may want to accomplish something while he is still alive. A quick strike through Ukraine and a land corrider to Kalingrad would certainly seal his legacy in Russian Mythology with the likes of Stalin and Katherine the great.

 

[Elwin Ransom]

On the subject of modern armies fighting in the winter, one thing I haven't seen mentioned is the extreme difficulty of using anything battery-powered once the temperature drops below zero. Battery life drops through the floor in the cold, which isn't such a big deal on an FTX. But when practically every piece of equipment you have (NODS, lights, radios, laser designators, GPS, etc.) runs off a battery with a life of a few hours, it will be difficult to maintain the level of responsiveness required in modern war.

 

[Josterman]

from jimmy dore

 

[Sexual Chocolate]

In the end I am in the "NOTHING EVER HAPPENS CAMP" but Putin's own book said he relives the day of the Soviet Union's collapse everyday and the humilation had to be avenged at some point.


Ironically Hitler also justified the second world war on the "Bitter defeat" of 1914

I don't think there's any good guys in this scenario, but Russia isn't expansionist and I doubt Putin wants the Ukraine. He's been running Russia since the late 90's and hasn't yet launched a war of aggression (unlike the US and its little butt buddies, who made unprovoked attacks on Yugoslavia, Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, and Libya over the same timeframe)

This situation has come about thru CIA/EU gayops dating back to the early 2000's to turn Kiev into a satellite state and roll NATO up to the Russian border. Why NATO didn't just declare victory, hand out medals, and go into hibernation when the Soviet Union fell is something historians will try to explain.

 

[DumbDude42]

Russia isn't expansionist

it absolutely is, revanchist/irredentist at the very least.

He's been running Russia since the late 90's and hasn't yet launched a war of aggression

taking south ossetia from georgia, crimea from ukraine, and the ongoing luhansk/donetsk situation are all strong examples to the contrary

 

[Sexual Chocolate]

taking south ossetia from georgia, crimea from ukraine, and the ongoing luhansk/donetsk situation are all strong examples to the contrary

Georgia invaded them, they were never going to let a Ukrainian Manchukuo regime installed by the US kick them out of the Black Sea , and the Donbas war (another direct result of the Kiev coup) has been simmering since 2014 without any Russian invasion. Seems pretty restrained for an evil empire that's desperate to conquer territory, fam.

 

[celebrityskin]

People are freaking out about rising prices, trying to pay for a world war would absolutely accelerate this. People were literally fist fighting over double cheeseburger rationing last year from covid, imagine asking them to make a major sacrifice to support a world war. Imagine asking the american population to forego CONSOOOMING to support the war effort; yeah i dont think so. There would be a revolt.

I don't think there'd be popular support for a boots on the ground conflict there (Let's not forget 90% of Americans supported invading Afghanistan in 2001 and Iraq War support was like 70-75% in 2003)

 

[The golden neckbeard]

I don't think there'd be popular support for a boots on the ground conflict there (Let's not forget 90% of Americans supported invading Afghanistan in 2001 and Iraq War support was like 70-75% in 2003)

Totally different crop of Americans. Americans now are all selfish narcissists bent on CONSOOMPTION. I was a young american at the time who was 19 who enlisted in the army because of September 11th. Kids now don't give a shit about any of that.



When my grandfather was a kid him and his brother would collect scraps of iron off lake Michigan's shoreline to take to the local foundry to support the war effort. Turns out that everyday after school this was almost every Childs responsibility in the small city they lived in....aswell as eating meat only once a week and volunteering in small youth like boyscout movements that taught all sorts of stuff that bordered on making them combatants in the event the homeland was attacked.

Imagine kids like that doing something now. Parents would be outraged, yet this is the sort of sacrifice that would absolutely be needed to have a war with Russia or China or even Iran. Our national stability would waver in the event of a pitched out war with another major power where front lines are a thing for years and pine boxes are mass produced.


That's why I think even if Putin goes into Ukraine we wont do shit. Sanctions and hard language at most. Light Weaponary maybe.

 

[Sexual Chocolate]

I don't think there'd be popular support for a boots on the ground conflict there (Let's not forget 90% of Americans supported invading Afghanistan in 2001 and Iraq War support was like 70-75% in 2003)

I guess if they're desperate enough, they might dust off the ol' Operation Northwoods playbook, but it's probably safer to pull another Gulf of Tonkin / USS Liberty happening.

The levels of naive trust people had in government/media in the wake of 911 are never coming back tho. Putin could personally nuke NYC while laughing maniacally on livestream from the cockpit of his Metal Gear and 30-50% of the population would assume it's a psyop. To a large extent that doesn't matter tho, the establishment never gave a fuck about what the American people think and isn't going to start now.

 

[NevskyProspekt]

Dude Moldova hates Russia for propping up transnistria

Moldova is surprisingly a mixed bag. They go through waves of pro-EU and pro-Russosphere sentiments. It wasn’t long ago they had a very Euroskeptic head of state.

 

[mindlessobserver]

Well as someone who has worn kevlar vests it's not a breathable fabric and it's warm. Chances are you're wearing 2/3 layers when it comes to ones pants and if it's cold most likely one is carrying gloves, armor, all that gear in the wintertime and in cold snowy weather that gear definitely is better to carry then if it's 80f+ degrees outside

Actually it's the opposite. Snow is like Sand. It gets into everything and once the body armor is in it, you start freezing fast. Especially since it's not moisture whicking like the Gortex under gear. The SAPI armor was designed to be worn in those fucking hot climates. As winter gear it fucking sucks. It creates a solid barrier that prevents moisture from properly evaporating, which means it gets trapped between the armor and the Gortex. And then Freezes into ice. Really bad.

In an actual winter war scenario the SAPI has to be taken off. It's more dangerous to wear it then not. This is the reason you never see pictures of Spec Ops dudes in arctic gear wearing modern body armor. You can't wear it. You will be dead within 72 hours of constant exposure to sub freezing temperature.

 

[Mepsi Pax]

That's... not exactly true. besides I've noticed that winters come much warmer than a decade ago. hell, it's a middle of the damn December and I have seen a snow only once, for a very short period of time. Close to the lunch time there was no snow at all.

Maybe, but it was still like -20C in St. Petersburg last week.

I can appreciate that Russia doesn't want the USA messing around in the ex-Soviet bloc. The USA had the Monroe Doctrine (similar concept) and the USA shouldn't want Russia propping up dictators in Venezuela. If Russia invades Ukraine then I think the USA would be justified in forcing a regime change in Venezuela.

Except Venezuela is pretty far away in beaner land, the better comparison would be Russia trying to set up BRICS missiles in Cuba (sound familiar?) or even Mexico, considering Ukraine is jammed up Russia's ass with a massive land border. GEE WHIZ why don't Russia like it when NATO tries (again, and again) to fuck around on their borders? It's a real mystery, fucking amnesiac US policy, eternal cold wars in a never-warming cycle

 

[Shrek]

Alright lads if things really get hot I wouldn't be shocked about about a weird amount of Ukranians holding American made recoiless rifles or something. But hypothetically, how insane would Russia and the global community at large would go if say, tomorrow, we announce a deal where Ukraine can buy a few F35's with a nice discount? (edit to say I absolutely know that would be stupid from an american strategic perspective if one were to be captured or something)

 

[The golden neckbeard]

But hypothetically, how insane would Russia and the global community at large would go if say, tomorrow, we announce a deal where Ukraine can buy a few F35's with a nice discount? (edit to say I absolutely know that would be stupid from an american strategic perspective if one were to be captured or something)

I dont think Russia cares about F-35's or F-22's

They know how to detect them for awhile now.

F-35 is a cute plane but it entirely relies on stealth for survival, otherwise its slow, cumbersome and maintenance heavy and doesn't stand a chance if you know where its headed.