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Opinion on the argument comparing women getting breast jobs, nose lifts and other cosmetic surgeries as empowering for women but trans surgeries are fetishistic skin walking and mutilation?

Technically, they’re not different. The difference is only in degrees. But trans women are trying to overwrite reality when they claim that they’re the same as women. A transwoman can’t be a seen as a female or a woman.
 
Opinion on the argument comparing women getting breast jobs, nose lifts and other cosmetic surgeries as empowering for women but trans surgeries are fetishistic skin walking and mutilation?
On one hand, there are similarities; you could say that women getting cosmetic surgery are trying to make their bodies look like their ideal version of themselves, and that’s broadly the same motivation as someone getting FFS.
But on the other hand, I think women who get cosmetic surgeries are doing so to change how they look, whereas trans people are getting them to change what they are. I don’t think most women who get a boob job do it to become a new person or because they don’t feel like Real Women, and aside from extreme examples like bimbofication fetishists, getting cosmetic surgery doesn’t usually entail rapidly changing your identity.
Also, I don’t think most cosmetic surgeries involve the level of brutality that SRS does. A cis woman’s vaginoplasty (which is both cosmetic and functional) is going to be way less risky and gruesome than a trans woman’s (which is cosmetic considering it does not function as part of a female reproductive system). No one is flaying women’s skin to give them big titties.
I think it’s also worth considering how we look at people who get these surgeries. When people get cosmetic work done, there’s some judgment involved—are they insecure? Are they succumbing to pressure from Instagram, media, etc? Why don’t they love themselves? Don’t they realize they’re perfect the way they are? But when trans people get them, I don’t think they’re being judged in that way because when they get FFS or a boob job it’s “affirming.”
If Candace decided she wanted to get a boob job, face lift, nose job, Brazilian butt lift, etc, and insisted you start calling her “Candy” because she always knew deep down she was a nasty little slut (and if you try to stop her she’ll kill herself), you’d be worried for her, and you might think her issues would be better solved in therapy than under the knife. But if Dan decides he’s Dani now and he’s going to go on hormones and get a boob job and FFS and sterilize himself via bottom surgery and if you try to stop him he’ll kill himself, somehow that’s cool and affirming and we should all support Dani as he lives his truth.
Idk. I think both point to issues that would be better fixed in therapy, and women aren’t usually threatening to kill themselves if you don’t give them fillers.
 
I think that there can be an argument for plastic surgery in cases of severe deformity/recovery from accidents, but otherwise it's just feeding into the same superficial obsessions that produce troons. Plastic surgery addicts are essentially "cisgender" troons.

Yes, they’re both superficial. But I would argue that troons are people that are using surgery to run away from their problems. While women who get cosmetic surgery or men who spends too much time in the gym are trying to rise the challenge that society holds. That’s why people hold more respect for the latter and hate on the former.
 
hot dyke of the day

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For those of you who don't know, Norm Macdonald was a comedian who died about 6 months ago. While he is generally remembered fondly, he was occasionally offensive, not because that was the only way he could be funny but because that was just who he was. He was a straight white male who liked to make jokes about gays
blacks
and especially women

Still, he has a dedicated fanbase on YouTube including a couple channels that do nothing but upload clips and compilations of him. One of these channels is I didn't even know he was sick. He posted this
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Personally I find it offensive because trans "humor" is one of the least funny things in the world and Norm Macdonald was famously funny. Trans humor (non humor that identifies as funny) is also usually just an excuse for the most depraved horny-posting and Norm pretty much never joked about that kind of thing. Really, the only similarity between Norm Macdonald and trans humor is misogyny, but unlike with Norm you can really believe that these people truly hate women. But other than that there's no reasonable way to get offended by this.
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But surprise surprise, they took yet another opportunity to get offended at something completely inoffensive.
View attachment 3092982View attachment 3092983View attachment 3092984View attachment 3092985 (EDIT: I hadn't noticed that Artturi Hautanen had edited the first comment. He actually ended it with that classic "Do better" nag)

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Anyway, even though some trannies and handmaidens are definitely in the comments IDEKHWS posted this the next day
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Here's a story that we're all familiar with
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I keep on hearing them make the comparison between Michael Phelps' innate advantages and whatever advantages trans-identifying males have over women. I don't know if their claims that he has some sort of unique physiology are true, I suspect that like everything that comes out of a trans activists mouth it's at best half true. I do know that even though Phelps did set records and win like crazy he still lost a lot of races and wasn't leaving his opponents in his wake.

But even if Michael Phelps was really some freak of nature who just straight up made the sport unfair, he would still belong in the races he took part in because there is no league for genetic freaks of nature. If there was then he would belong there, but there isn't so he doesn't. It's that simple.

William Thomas does have a genetic advantage that allows him to win every race (except for a couple random ones that he mysteriously underperforms drastically in) and leave the female racers in his wake. His particular genetic condition is called being male and there is a league for people with this condition, so he should compete with them. If there was no such league then I would not have a problem with him competing against female athletes. It really is that simple.
Pretty hilarious to see TiMs gushing over a comedian that appeals almost exclusively to men (and my mom). They truly have zero self-awareness.

It’d be like a TiF talking about how much she loves Amy Schumer.
 
Kim Petras just posted this on their Instagram. Good thing he got SRS at 16, now he can look like a fat boy prostitute. Hide that male torso Kim!

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Yall is Kim trolling us ? Apparently Kim is in a campaign with honkemoller lingerie. The photographer must be a terf because this is the most mannish he's looked.

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The Lia Thomas thing has me thinking...

What I think we need to break this transgenders in sports things is a man going up against a WELL KNOWN and LIKED female athlete. Right now Lia Thomas is beating people you've never heard of before, and because of that it's sort of a victimless crime to most people.

But what about a tranny showdown between and tranny and a real woman like sprinter Sha’Carri Richardson who everyone was so outraged when she got suspended for having pot in her system?
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Though muscular, she is most certainly a real woman, and not just that, but a "YASSS SLAY QUEEN" strong, sassy, accomplished black woman.

Given black people's pride in their domination in sprinting, can you imagine if some rail-thin, bony little white guy in a ponytail just SMOKED her in the 100m final? And Richardson is still relatively unknown/niche outside of track fans.

If there were a black female on the level of say, Simone Biles' popularity, and some white dude pretending to be a woman just crushed her, that would be hilarious and I don't think people would buy it.
 
The Lia Thomas thing has me thinking...

What I think we need to break this transgenders in sports things is a man going up against a WELL KNOWN and LIKED female athlete. Right now Lia Thomas is beating people you've never heard of before, and because of that it's sort of a victimless crime to most people.

But what about a tranny showdown between and tranny and a real woman like sprinter Sha’Carri Richardson who everyone was so outraged when she got suspended for having pot in her system?
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Though muscular, she is most certainly a real woman, and not just that, but a "YASSS SLAY QUEEN" strong, sassy, accomplished black woman.

Given black people's pride in their domination in sprinting, can you imagine if some rail-thin, bony little white guy in a ponytail just SMOKED her in the 100m final? And Richardson is still relatively unknown/niche outside of track fans.

If there were a black female on the level of say, Simone Biles' popularity, and some white dude pretending to be a woman just crushed her, that would be hilarious and I don't think people would buy it.
I don't know, every time I think 'surely people can see how massively unfair/disgusting/pedo/perverted/sexist this thing is' then somehow the dudes can do what they like imperative just overrides it.
 
I always wondered why some western troons are obsessed with becoming hijabi wearing girls. Why are they like that? Muslims hate troons and treat women like objects. Are they in it for humiliation?
1) Incredibly gendered clothing helps to override people's natural reactions somewhat
2) Same with incredibly gendered roles
3) Covering up more of the jawline, shrouding the oversized skull in dark fabric where the face becomes the main focus, etc. also helps
4) Humiliation
 
I don't know, every time I think 'surely people can see how massively unfair/disgusting/pedo/perverted/sexist this thing is' then somehow the dudes can do what they like imperative just overrides it.
This is also true. And even if it did work, it would only be because it involved another "marginalized group," not because they recognized it was actually unfair.
 

There are certainly a number of people that "were taught to act gay" (for lack of a better term). Ask almost any girl that grew up in the 90's. Lestrenders, shall we say. They just don't necessarily regret it because they didn't irreparably change/damage their body, unlike transtrenders.


"One. Just one tweet. Passed off a gospel..." Someone needs to let James in on the secret that n=1 is the greatest minority. So, based on their rhetoric, their voice should be amplified 10 fold.
 
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Yes, they’re both superficial. But I would argue that troons are people that are using surgery to run away from their problems. While women who get cosmetic surgery or men who spends too much time in the gym are trying to rise the challenge that society holds. That’s why people hold more respect for the latter and hate on the former.

There's a difference between adhering to conventional standards of beauty, and the type of extreme modifications that are occurring more and more in surgeons offices. I wrote a post in the SRS threat that I'm going to quote here:

I don't know, I think part of the problem is that society has been too libertine with plastic surgery, not treating it for the mental illness it is. The earliest plastic surgeries were supposed to fix things like congenital deformities and war injuries, but when it became a commodified procedure, it became lucrative to prey on people's insecurity and mental illness. This is from before COVID, so it feels like another world at this point, but remember this chick:

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Surgery fanatic Nadia Sofia Nahir shows off her bust. She has long been fascinated with the 'fake' look despite the fact her 1100cc bust now prevents her from being able to use the tube

This women is the "cis" equivalent of a trans person. Obsessed with superficial, performative "fake" femininity to the point where she modified her body to non-functional status. It's the same type of body dysmorphic obsession, but because it stays within the bounds of sex we're more willing to write it off as just one crazy person. But it's not really that different in the way the obsession seems mostly to come out of very stereotypical media-driven representations of masculinity and femininity. Now granted, the procedures are less destructive, and the dynamics in terms of men accessing women's spaces are absent in this case. But from the perspective of surgery being given to people with obsessive mental illness, I think there's a lot more than just GRS occurring that could be argued to be "malpractice".

I agree broadly that troons, in what they are trying to do, are asking for a much more radical shift than miss 34JJ here. But I think, from the standpoint of causation, you could say that both she and troons are responding to the same sort of distorted thinking induced by media consumption. The only difference is, people look at Nadia Sofia Nahir and see a side-show freak, whereas they look at troons doing the same thing, and see an empowered woman. But again, I think troons here benefit from the fact that mainstream knowledge of what actually goes into transitioning is very vague and sparse. I really doubt the average troon supported realized the FFS, or chin implants, or any of the other dumb superficial stuff, are things that troons are clamoring for as lifesaving. They depend on the public images of trans status as being an almost mystical, spiritual experience to get around the flesh-sculpting mad scientist truth of transitioning.
 
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