War Invasion of Ukraine News Megathread - Thread is only for articles and discussion of articles, general discussion thread is still in Happenings.

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President Joe Biden on Tuesday said that the United States will impose sanctions “far beyond” the ones that the United States imposed in 2014 following the annexation of the Crimean peninsula.

“This is the beginning of a Russian invasion of Ukraine,” Biden said in a White House speech, signaling a shift in his administration’s position. “We will continue to escalate sanctions if Russia escalates,” he added.

Russian elites and their family members will also soon face sanctions, Biden said, adding that “Russia will pay an even steeper price” if Moscow decides to push forward into Ukraine. Two Russian banks and Russian sovereign debt will also be sanctioned, he said.

Also in his speech, Biden said he would send more U.S. troops to the Baltic states as a defensive measure to strengthen NATO’s position in the area.

Russia shares a border with Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania.

A day earlier, Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered troops to go into the separatist Donetsk and Lugansk regions in eastern Ukraine after a lengthy speech in which he recognized the two regions’ independence.

Western powers decried the move and began to slap sanctions on certain Russian individuals, while Germany announced it would halt plans to go ahead with the Russia-to-Germany Nord Stream 2 pipeline.

At home, Biden is facing bipartisan pressure to take more extensive actions against Russia following Putin’s decision. However, a recent poll showed that a majority of Americans believe that sending troops to Ukraine is a “bad idea,” and a slim minority believes it’s a good one.

All 27 European Union countries unanimously agreed on an initial list of sanctions targeting Russian authorities, said French Foreign Minister Jean-Yves Le Drian, and EU foreign affairs head Josep Borell claimed the package “will hurt Russia … a lot.”

Earlier Tuesday, Borell asserted that Russian troops have already entered the Donbas region, which comprises Donetsk and Lugansk, which are under the control of pro-Russia groups since 2014.

And on Tuesday, the Russian Parliament approved a Putin-back plan to use military force outside of Russia’s borders as Putin further said that Russia confirmed it would recognize the expanded borders of Lugansk and Donetsk.

“We recognized the states,” the Russian president said. “That means we recognized all of their fundamental documents, including the constitution, where it is written that their [borders] are the territories at the time the two regions were part of Ukraine.”

Speaking to reporters on Tuesday, Putin said that Ukraine is “not interested in peaceful solutions” and that “every day, they are amassing troops in the Donbas.”

Meanwhile, Ukraine President Volodymyr Zelensky on Tuesday morning again downplayed the prospect of a Russian invasion and proclaimed: “There will be no war.”

“There will not be an all-out war against Ukraine, and there will not be a broad escalation from Russia. If there is, then we will put Ukraine on a war footing,” he said in a televised address.

The White House began to signal that they would shift their own position on whether it’s the start of an invasion.

“We think this is, yes, the beginning of an invasion, Russia’s latest invasion into Ukraine,” said Jon Finer, the White House deputy national security adviser in public remarks. “An invasion is an invasion and that is what is underway.”

For weeks, Western governments have been claiming Moscow would invade its neighbor after Russia gathered some 150,000 troops along the countries’ borders. They alleged that the Kremlin would attempt to come up with a pretext to attack, while some officials on Monday said Putin’s speech recognizing the two regions was just that.

But Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin told reporters Tuesday that Russia’s “latest invasion” of Ukraine is threatening stability in the region, but he asserted that Putin can “still avoid a full blown, tragic war of choice.”

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A lot of people might be interested in this. A while ago Russian drone "Orlan" was captured by Ukrainians, here's uh... unboxing of it:
Impressive! You could build that thing in an afternoon using off the shelf shit from Hobbytown and Microcenter. The Saigon engine is unsurprisingly an RC Model plane engine. Total costs? Maybe $5000-8000 USD. And that’s estimating high.
 
Russia has repeatedly outlined what the actual provocations were for years.

I will summarize, but these provocations were outlined since fall of USSR. "Remember Cuba? We don't want your missiles on our borders, either. Just like you didn't want a nation on your doorstep to house our missile systems, we don't want a nation on our doorstep to house your missile systems. If you do that, we will invade like you did in Cuba, but better. Oh look, we invaded like you did, but better. Why are you acting all surprised, this is silly."

You can disagree with Russia, most of world does. But it's not like they didn't warn NATO about the provocations (in their eyes, if not yours) for decades.

And now they're getting their butts kicked. Should've just used politics and remained peaceful. Now their dying nation is on the fast track to oblivion.

Also, it's not the West's fault that former Soviet puppet states want to join NATO or the EU. It's Russia's fault for being such a bad neighbor that damn near everyone wants to join the other team.
 
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Russia has repeatedly outlined what the actual provocations were for years.

I will summarize, but these provocations were outlined since fall of USSR. "Remember Cuba? We don't want your missiles on our borders, either. Just like you didn't want a nation on your doorstep to house our missile systems, we don't want a nation on our doorstep to house your missile systems. If you do that, we will invade like you did in Cuba, but better. Oh look, we invaded like you did, but better. Why are you acting all surprised, this is silly."

You can disagree with Russia, most of world does. But it's not like they didn't warn NATO about the provocations (in their eyes, if not yours) for decades.
I am hoping you are using nuclear weapons systems as an allegory for something else, given that the nuclear systems placement in Cuba meant they could reach the US, whereas modern systems do not require local proximity to their targets. They haven't for decades.

The US acted like an Imperial Power in Central and South America during the cold war, so using that behaviour to justify modern Russian behaviour is really just an indictment of Russia in the eyes of most.

It is not that Russia never states it's intentions out in the open, I think they do sometimes - like the schitzononsense about Ukraine not being a real state - just that this is often indecipherable from cynical nonsense they trot out. This idea that NATO enlargement is a provocation is one of these examples of cynical nonsense - Russia does not care about NATO enlargment. They already knew Ukraine was not going to join NATO in the foreseeable future whilst the status quo ante bellum was in place, yet they invaded Ukraine regardless of this. If NATO nations claimed - contrary to the Atlantic Charter which underpins NATO - that Ukraine would never be allowed to join Putin would still have decided to invade Ukraine.

The reality is this is nothing to do with provocation and everything to do with Putin's view that Russia must remain a great power, and an imperial power. Therefore, invading and dominating those nations which were historically under their yolk is part of this grand vision for a new Russia Empire. That's the reality.

Seriously, how stupid can someone like Putin be - if he is genuinely afraid of NATO expansion how can his thought process be to invade smaller neighbouring states, which will obviously just push other nations into NATO. I do not know about the Finns, but the Swedes are a highly professional force and no joke militarily - they will be a boon for NATO, and this increasing NATO presence in Scandinavia will be a headache for a Russia that has already kicked itself in the nuts repeatedly.
 
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The image is just so ever applicable to Putinists.

Russia thinks it has a right to regulate the foreign policies of its neighbors. That is the sort of fake provocation that a schoolyard bully trades in. It does not and instead it has been shown to be a pathetic non power, only advancing in Mariupol with 40-1 odds in their favour, and abusing those prisoners it takes there. Honestly Sweden could probably emulate Charles XII and maybe win, which exaggerates a little, only a little.
 
Russia has repeatedly outlined what the actual provocations were for years.

I will summarize, but these provocations were outlined since fall of USSR. "Remember Cuba? We don't want your missiles on our borders, either. Just like you didn't want a nation on your doorstep to house our missile systems, we don't want a nation on our doorstep to house your missile systems. If you do that, we will invade like you did in Cuba, but better. Oh look, we invaded like you did, but better. Why are you acting all surprised, this is silly."

You can disagree with Russia, most of world does. But it's not like they didn't warn NATO about the provocations (in their eyes, if not yours) for decades.
And how’s that plan working out for you all? Better to let your enemies think you are dangerous, than absolutely prove to them that you are not. “Special Operation Ukraine” is now on par with the Battle of Tsushima Straight in unmasking what a corrupt and ineffectual power Russia is.
 
Russia has repeatedly outlined what the actual provocations were for years.

I will summarize, but these provocations were outlined since fall of USSR. "Remember Cuba? We don't want your missiles on our borders, either. Just like you didn't want a nation on your doorstep to house our missile systems, we don't want a nation on our doorstep to house your missile systems. If you do that, we will invade like you did in Cuba, but better. Oh look, we invaded like you did, but better. Why are you acting all surprised, this is silly."

You can disagree with Russia, most of world does. But it's not like they didn't warn NATO about the provocations (in their eyes, if not yours) for decades.
This is a false equivalence. The US and NATO has not moved nuclear weapons in to the newer NATO states. As I am aware there are no nuclear weapons in the Baltics or Poland. There are Nuclear weapons in Turkey, however those aircraft delivered bombs and not ICBMs/SRBMs and have been there since the Cold war era. Also the US did not invade Cuba due to fears of nuclear weapons being stationed there but for other reasons. The Cuban missile crisis happened AFTER the bay of pigs invasion.
 
Nah there's no point. They already have an unfinished one of their own rusting away in port: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_cruiser_Ukraina It was mostly finished but then spent 30 years sitting in port falling apart, although ironically was probably safer and in better condition than it's sister ships apparently are/were.
As much of a waste of money it would be, I would love to see the Ukraina be refurbished and put into service just to spite the Russians.
 
This is a false equivalence. The US and NATO has not moved nuclear weapons in to the newer NATO states. As I am aware there are no nuclear weapons in the Baltics or Poland. There are Nuclear weapons in Turkey, however those aircraft delivered bombs and not ICBMs/SRBMs and have been there since the Cold war era. Also the US did not invade Cuba due to fears of nuclear weapons being stationed there but for other reasons. The Cuban missile crisis happened AFTER the bay of pigs invasion.
Oh, there’s going to be nukes in them now after Putin’s little shitfit.
 
Impressive! You could build that thing in an afternoon using off the shelf shit from Hobbytown and Microcenter. The Saigon engine is unsurprisingly an RC Model plane engine. Total costs? Maybe $5000-8000 USD. And that’s estimating high.
The worst part is, you don't need highly skilled and educated engineer to make it. Even a graduate from a vocational school can build it provided they have the manual. It's just pure corruption
 
“Special Operation Ukraine” is now on par with the Battle of Tsushima Straight in unmasking what a corrupt and ineffectual power Russia is.
They even might've engaged a fishing fleet along the way; but for the micks having a long memory, and recalled what happened the first time Russians came around.
It gets better. A Russian article about the Neptune, and another comment about it:
View attachment 3179505
The comments are hilarious; or kino, as they say:
Screenshot_20220414-174954.png
 
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I am hoping you are using nuclear weapons systems as an allegory for something else, given that the nuclear systems placement in Cuba meant they could reach the US, whereas modern systems do not require local proximity to their targets. They haven't for decades.
Tbf, proximity does allow for much faster travel times in first strikes; an SSBN sitting right off the coast could put warheads on target in mere minutes with a depressed trajectory launch. That's the thing though, America wouldn't need to put missiles in bordering countries where they'd be easily identifiable targets when a couple of Ohio SSBNs would do the job much better. And as Russia is proving they would be very hard pressed to actually stop them.
 
The Russian Ministry of Defence said that a fire had caused munitions to explode, and that the ship had been seriously damaged and the crew fully evacuated, without any reference to a Ukrainian strike.[56][57][58] The ministry added on 14 April that the missile systems of the cruiser were undamaged, the fire was contained by sailors, and that efforts were underway to tow the ship to port.[47][59] Later that day, the Russian Ministry of Defence stated that Moskva had sunk while being towed during stormy weather.[5][60] If Russian claims are true, then the last time a Black Sea flagship was destroyed by accident was in 1916, when the battleship Imperatritsa Mariya exploded.[7]
"oops we accidentally set out own flagship on fire and it sank haha"
this cope story makes russia look so much worse than if they had just accepted the "ukraine blew it up with missiles" version
 
"oops we accidentally set out own flagship on fire and it sank haha"
this cope story makes russia look so much worse than if they had just accepted the "ukraine blew it up with missiles" version
First thing I thought of.
They're going to deny deny deny deny it being sunk by enemy action. We might never know for sure, but no matter what happened, the Russian Federation Navy has proven itself a worthy inheritor to the traditions of the Imperial Russian Navy - losing a flag ship in one of the dumbest ways possible.
Just for reference. The utter incompetence of Russian Naval Forces.
 
There’s no way there aren’t any. Plus this was the Black Fleet Flagship. It flew the Admiral’s flag. So the Uke’s might have added one or two Admiral’s to their score card. Alongside the 7 Generals. If nothing else this war seems a remarkably efficient way of clearing out the upper tiers of the Russian Military. Leaving room at the top for fresh blood. (Do please try not to slip on all the flesh blood splattered about)
There used to be a toast among Royal Navy midshipmen back in the Age of Sail: "To a short war and a bloody victory!" Of course, the war isn't exactly short and it looks to be a bloody defeat, but the same ethos probably applies. Getting that full commission is easy if everyone above you is dead, after all.
The torpedos would also be near the supply of Aviation Fuel for the helicopters.
Helis don't use avgas. They're turbine engines, so diesel, same as everything else in a modern military, including Moskva herself since she too has turbine propulsion. Only stuff that flies that uses avgas would be piston engines, but turboprops exist as a lovely intermediary. More power than a piston, less fuel usage than a jet, no need for specialized avgas logistics.
Or a mild storm in the Black Sea has taken out a ship designed for those rough seas.
The Russians may actually be telling the truth... from a certain point of view. If the ship is hit, a fire breaks out, and an ammunition cookoff blows a hole in the side... yeah, I can see rough sea conditions finishing the job given its no longer completely seaworthy.
Unsurprisingly given they sank the dry dock it was in, then set it on fire, then couldn't get the replacement dock ready on time, the Kutnetsov isn't capable of operations right now (not that it ever really is tbh). It's not scheduled to re-enter the fleet until next year some time, and if you combine regular Russian incompetence/delays with every thing going on with Ukraine right now I honestly wouldn't be surprised if she wasn't back til 2025 or so.
A bit optimistic, IMO. Try 2030.
Microcenter
RiP Microcenter. When I lived down in SoCal they were the only place in town for quality tech shit after Fry's decided to take a giant leap down the tubes.
Nah there's no point. They already have an unfinished one of their own rusting away in port: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_cruiser_Ukraina It was mostly finished but then spent 30 years sitting in port falling apart, although ironically was probably safer and in better condition than it's sister ships apparently are/were.
Wouldn't shock me if Ukraine, unlike Russia, had performed basic maintenance that entire time to ensure it at least stayed in good condition. Odds on the West giving them money and weapons to finish building it? We're likely going to see Ukraine become the Black Sea's new naval power as part of the aftermath. Especially since that would be a lovely way to also rein in Turkey's ambitions by reminding them they're not the Ottoman Empire at its height.
One century later, Vodka Boy hasn't gotten any better at naval battles.
I'm afraid its going to take about 3/4 of an hour just to explain in sufficient detail what an absolute disaster that mission was.
 
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