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- Sep 13, 2018
We are Blue Checkmark. We have analyzed your Twitter history. Based on your political leanings you will be cancelled.
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Star Trek - Space: The Final Frontier
- Thread starter Snorlaxative
- Start date
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- Dec 3, 2013
If there had been a season 4, I bet the plot would have been an evil white male billionaire that becomes the “Borg King” who steals control of the
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- Mar 29, 2014
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- Mar 21, 2019
I also want to point out re: the Picard episode -
In Lower Decks there's a joke in an episode where Boimler (main character boy) is surprisingly hyper competent in his simulation challenge, and the pinnacle of the joke is when he - after about 12 hours of groundhog day resets - "teaches the borg queen the value of friendship and ends the tyranny of the Borg".
This. Is. A. Joke.
But apparently Picard decided to take a scenario meant to be absurd to the point of comedy and do it as a serious plot point. And this is another reason why I think Lower Decks is the only halfway decent show among NuTrek, and the only one people will look back on less harshly than they did when it initially came out.
Reluctantly, I say this not wanting to give Picard any undue credit, but if you were to reason with the borg it actually does make sense that it would only be in a scenario where the actual collective is gone, it is no longer the borg, and you're truly interacting with an individual.
This. Is. A. Joke.
But apparently Picard decided to take a scenario meant to be absurd to the point of comedy and do it as a serious plot point. And this is another reason why I think Lower Decks is the only halfway decent show among NuTrek, and the only one people will look back on less harshly than they did when it initially came out.
Reluctantly, I say this not wanting to give Picard any undue credit, but if you were to reason with the borg it actually does make sense that it would only be in a scenario where the actual collective is gone, it is no longer the borg, and you're truly interacting with an individual.
- Joined
- Dec 3, 2013
But this is a Borg Queen who was a part of the collective until the evil mirror universe humans captured, imprisoned and tortured her before planing on making her execution a party event. She should 100% be about “fuck all humans, I’m gonna enslave all of them.” A sad depressed lady who got tricked into killing her lover and faced no repercussions from doing so should not be the one to connect her to “be a good guy and give the broken humans who can’t handle being alone a place to belong” or whatever hippie bullshit is going on with this.
Also Seven claiming the Borg aren’t human before killing them all when she herself should know better than anyone how bullshit that is EVEN WITHIN THE CONTINUITY OF THIS SHITTY SHOW(season 1) is just….fuck, man.
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- Mar 21, 2019
I can believe Seven justifying and rationalizing the killing of Borg because while she knows it isn't true, she's also still Borg at heart and that means she can do horrifying things without blinking when she thinks it's justified. She's also capable of lying to manipulate others, so that in a vacuum isn't an issue. The real issue is that's clearly not what the show is trying to convey and what they're really doing is trying to make the heroes look good while they massacre humans.
What should have happened with Dr I-don't-care-what-her-name-is is that the Borg Queen should have used her depression and her feelings of isolation to trick her into joining the Borg collective and start a new pod of the collective in the Alpha Quadrant (or "trick", as the Queen should be programmed to believe what she is doing is right, because she is the essence of the Borg, and part of the horror of her evil would be that seducing the murderer into joining the Borg is something she does believing she's helping) Also I was talking about this to someone and we couldn't help but realize that this 'better, softer' Borg is not in fact actually any better. "We only assimilate derelict ships and people at the brink of death" actually translates into turning the Borg from a conquering plague of locusts into a plague of carrion. Imagine your ship breaks down in space and immediately two Borg cubes appear, ready to cannibalize your ship and assimilate your crew as soon as it goes kaput and your crew start to collapse (and even if they go more benevolent, they'll return you safely home for the low cost of seizing your tech and assimilating your wounded)
A plague sweeps over a planet, and when the Enterprise arrives to render aid, there's already a swarm of cubes there trying to offer a cure to the plague in the form of assimilating the planet. Voyager gets wrecked in a battle and their sickbay is overflowing while they're venting plasma and who shows up but the borg, harassing them with constant hails offering to assimilate the crew and scrap the ship. Like crows on a battlefield, whenever a space battle happens the Borg will start swarming around space waiting to pluck up destroyed ships and assimilate dying crews. And this will still lead to violence, because the Ferengi will absolutely lose it over salvage rights to their ships and the Romulans and Cardassians will not be okay with people holding classified information getting absorbed by the Borg.
Unlike the traditional Borg, they won't be immediately resisted (or fled from) when they appear, because they're essentially carrion eaters and salvagers, so they'll infiltrate the galaxy more fully while people like the Federation mostly view them as annoyances instead of a threat to be repelled. If, then, the Borg ever decide to go back to the way they were for any reason at all, the galaxy would be in a far worse position, because instead of them being a slow-marching threat, they'd be dispersed all over the galaxy already when they suddenly went violent. The result would be devastating.
This is the "solution" that the show thinks is so great. At least with Lower Decks they didn't specify how Boimler taught the Queen the meaning of friendship and stopped the Borg, just that he did.
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- Dec 23, 2019
So, like JJ did after George fucked up the Star Wars prequels
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- Mar 21, 2019
This feels accurate to me because Voyager and Enterprise weren't nearly as terrible as people said and neither were the Star Wars prequels.
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- Mar 17, 2018
To this day I cannot fathom why some people say the Prequels were "convoluted" and hard to understand. If 14 year old me can figure it out, then you can too unless you're a drooling mental patient.
At least I can watch the Prequels and even enjoy them. NuTrek? I can't. I just fucking can't. Even the NuTrek shit that people say is less shit, like the 2009 reboot movie. I can't enjoy that shit because of how absolutely garish the unnecessary lens flares are, how absolutely butchered the characters are (Kirk smugly eating an apple and making finger pew pews during the Kobayahi Maru being a prime example of not understanding a character for shit.), and how utterly un-entertaining almost all of them are compared to almost any other Trek film.
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- Mar 21, 2019
It's because the prequels made a vague attempt at allegory and depth. The original Star Wars trilogy made no attempt whatsoever to do so, because it was basically just Lucas ripping off old shows like Buck Rogers and pretending he wasn't. The prequels aren't exactly deep, but a shallow puddle on a hot day has more depth than the original trilogy, so in comparison it feels like it's complex. For the drooling peanut brains that make up the majority of the Star Wars fandom, that equates to absolute mind melting convolution.
NuTrek isn't convoluted at all, it's just bad. The new movies are halfway decent as spectacles (as evidenced by how many people actually got into the original Star Trek shows after the movies because they hungered for more) but the new tv shows lack even that. Discovery can be pretty sometimes, but it fails to even be a fun ride, because it's too busy trying to laser focus in on a super boring character. Picard actively hates the world it's set in and the audience watching it, Prodigy is literally just a children's Star Wars show with Janeway thrown in to pretend it's Star Trek, and Lower Decks is a cartoon parody skit, so doesn't qualify to be in the running. Discovery almost pulls off being convoluted, until you realize it's not convoluted, it's just outright confused because of its constant rewrites. If the shows were merely convoluted, they could be good (NuWho season 6 is a convoluted mess, but most people still enjoy its entertainment value despite this), but unfortunately for them they lack the ability to become convoluted.
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- Jun 6, 2020
I can't belive they made the Borg good!!!! Seriously I'm sick and tired of every villain needs to be reedem trope. I want good old irredeemable villains
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- Jul 30, 2017
The prequels are garbage requiring external material to make any sense.
They're still a coherent vision though and superior to the sequels.
He never pretended he wasn't ripping off the old serials, it was clear and admitted to from the start.
And aiming for allegory is exactly why we have the modern shit trek we have now! Give me classic SW which at least was able to tell a competent, solid story in its running time than all this "well the Borg is all about people being sad" bullshit attempt to comment on modern day isolation.
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- Jun 25, 2020
They needed to make the Borg good because NPCs need someone to look up to.
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- Aug 29, 2019
He showed them old Holo-files of My little Pony.
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- Jun 6, 2020
Honestly the leftist collectives looking up to the borg is not a surprise
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- Jan 10, 2014
I'm presuming this is just going to be a separate sub-group of "good" Borg rather than the entire collective suddenly finding redemption. Which isn't even that original of a concept, since Voyager already did it in the Unimatrix Zero two-parter.
On another note, I have to LOL at the inadvertent retconning of Nemesis. The latest revelation about Jean-Luc's childhood turns the theme of that film from "Picard is a good person because he had a good childhood, Shinzon is a bad person because he had a bad childhood" to "Picard is a good person because he's subconsciously trying to make up for unwittingly killing his mom, Shinzon's just an angry, genocidal asshole for no real reason."
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- Mar 21, 2019
Allegory doesn't make a story bad. Hamfisted attempts to preach at the audience through the medium of fiction unaided by a single drop of skill or talent is what makes a story bad. The Borg were always an allegory, the previous writers just did a better job of making a story with the allegory before. NuTrek - and Picard in particular - completely lacks the ability to tell any kind of story at all and instead just angrily pounds its fist on the desk and screams Stewart's feelings and beliefs at the audience over and over for hours on end.
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- Mar 5, 2021
I can get that anytime. I can drive over to see my boomer relatives.
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- Mar 21, 2019
If your boomer relative wrote Star Trek it would come out looking something like Picard, but tailored to their specific brand of crazy.
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- Jan 18, 2017
This is unironically more interesting and vaguely thought provoking than anything nuTrek has come up with at all. With some decent writing this could be an interesting conundrum and having a ship with wounded crew that are most likely going to die and here comes a race that can save their lives but at the cost of being assimilated... Obviously needs some finessing but still, could be compelling.
There are just zero difficult moral dilemmas in any of these shows. It's all so obviously black and white because there's no respect for the audience and the writers have a Message™ that has to be expressed at all costs so fuck you, here's a lecture about immigration and fascism.