War Invasion of Ukraine News Megathread - Thread is only for articles and discussion of articles, general discussion thread is still in Happenings.

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President Joe Biden on Tuesday said that the United States will impose sanctions “far beyond” the ones that the United States imposed in 2014 following the annexation of the Crimean peninsula.

“This is the beginning of a Russian invasion of Ukraine,” Biden said in a White House speech, signaling a shift in his administration’s position. “We will continue to escalate sanctions if Russia escalates,” he added.

Russian elites and their family members will also soon face sanctions, Biden said, adding that “Russia will pay an even steeper price” if Moscow decides to push forward into Ukraine. Two Russian banks and Russian sovereign debt will also be sanctioned, he said.

Also in his speech, Biden said he would send more U.S. troops to the Baltic states as a defensive measure to strengthen NATO’s position in the area.

Russia shares a border with Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania.

A day earlier, Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered troops to go into the separatist Donetsk and Lugansk regions in eastern Ukraine after a lengthy speech in which he recognized the two regions’ independence.

Western powers decried the move and began to slap sanctions on certain Russian individuals, while Germany announced it would halt plans to go ahead with the Russia-to-Germany Nord Stream 2 pipeline.

At home, Biden is facing bipartisan pressure to take more extensive actions against Russia following Putin’s decision. However, a recent poll showed that a majority of Americans believe that sending troops to Ukraine is a “bad idea,” and a slim minority believes it’s a good one.

All 27 European Union countries unanimously agreed on an initial list of sanctions targeting Russian authorities, said French Foreign Minister Jean-Yves Le Drian, and EU foreign affairs head Josep Borell claimed the package “will hurt Russia … a lot.”

Earlier Tuesday, Borell asserted that Russian troops have already entered the Donbas region, which comprises Donetsk and Lugansk, which are under the control of pro-Russia groups since 2014.

And on Tuesday, the Russian Parliament approved a Putin-back plan to use military force outside of Russia’s borders as Putin further said that Russia confirmed it would recognize the expanded borders of Lugansk and Donetsk.

“We recognized the states,” the Russian president said. “That means we recognized all of their fundamental documents, including the constitution, where it is written that their [borders] are the territories at the time the two regions were part of Ukraine.”

Speaking to reporters on Tuesday, Putin said that Ukraine is “not interested in peaceful solutions” and that “every day, they are amassing troops in the Donbas.”

Meanwhile, Ukraine President Volodymyr Zelensky on Tuesday morning again downplayed the prospect of a Russian invasion and proclaimed: “There will be no war.”

“There will not be an all-out war against Ukraine, and there will not be a broad escalation from Russia. If there is, then we will put Ukraine on a war footing,” he said in a televised address.

The White House began to signal that they would shift their own position on whether it’s the start of an invasion.

“We think this is, yes, the beginning of an invasion, Russia’s latest invasion into Ukraine,” said Jon Finer, the White House deputy national security adviser in public remarks. “An invasion is an invasion and that is what is underway.”

For weeks, Western governments have been claiming Moscow would invade its neighbor after Russia gathered some 150,000 troops along the countries’ borders. They alleged that the Kremlin would attempt to come up with a pretext to attack, while some officials on Monday said Putin’s speech recognizing the two regions was just that.

But Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin told reporters Tuesday that Russia’s “latest invasion” of Ukraine is threatening stability in the region, but he asserted that Putin can “still avoid a full blown, tragic war of choice.”

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Wasn't Russia supposed to be linking their currency to gold or something?.

Edit: Yup. 5k rubles to one gram gold. Through June 30.

Russia’s Move To Gold May Jolt Your Company

Given the current state of Russia as a kleptocracy one would think this would blow up in their faces. We shall see, I guess.
If they got as far as a gold standard currency, all it would mean is exports become extraordinarily expensive (if purchased heavily in a real market), but it helps with imports and post Soviet relies on basic foreign tech (brakes, ignition, engine management for whatever vehicles they make). I suppose for a plutocrats and the poor class structure that post Soviet Russia has, maybe it suits the ruling class. Cheaper Italian handbags and Maseratis.

I see a report that Egypt refused to allow a Russian grain ship to dock in Alexandria as its contents had been stolen from Ukrainian grain silos. Good.

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source, edited in the Tweet image
 
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But I keep thinking about the fact that it was valued much higher compared to dollar back in USSR, though you could buy fuck all with it, so the comparison was ultimately meaningless, all of which comes at a cost.
Being a Westerner with hard currency in the USSR gave you near-unlimited purchasing power. That's why Bernie Sanders enjoyed his time so much there. You were also a rich man for trading everyday goods like ballpoint pens. Now yeah, the ruble's value on paper is high but it doesn't mean much when the trading is restricted. Looks like this is another thing with Russia that hasn't changed much, I just don't trust anything when it comes to statistics and them. Whether they're their own statistics that are just made up or based on half-truths, or Western statistics based on obfuscated reality (if there's something the commies were good at, it was hiding their conditions to the rest of the world to the point that the West would give them too much credit). I mean the USSR was considered to have "very high" HDI in 1990.
 
Ruble supposedly bounced back, so vatniks are high on copium currently. But I keep thinking about the fact that it was valued much higher compared to dollar back in USSR, though you could buy fuck all with it, so the comparison was ultimately meaningless, all of which comes at a cost.
Current situation is not that far off, and they only achieved this by restricting trade and obligating companies to sell currency, among other things.

Any economists to weigh in? From where I stand, Russian economy isn't any less fucked than it was a month ago.

yeah, it bounced back in lala-land.

From 20th of May, RF banks remove restriction on buying foreign currency. The only exception is Euro and US dollars. :story:

This applies to mere mortals, not some companies who are in direct or indirect control of the state. EU and USD is the only link to reality and the rest of the world. You might as well have unlimited right to buy my monopoly money or some Martian currency.

Also worth to note, that right after the invasion there were no restrictions to buy foreign currency, RF banks just didn't have any in. The official exchange rate was 130Rub - 1USD, but no bank had USD to sell. You can call every bank in St. Petes and no one had USD to sell you, they were just "out". On black market the price was 250-300Rub-1USD, but those were limited quantities too.

During the Soviet times, 2Rub=1USD, but it was illegal to possess, buy/sell foreign currency at all, so unless there is free circulation and exchange, the exchange rate is meaningless.



С 20 мая российские банки смогут продавать физлицам без ограничений наличную иностранную валюту. Исключение коснется только евро и долларов. Об этом сообщает пресс-служба Банка России.
Источник : https://realnoevremya.ru/news/25110...ryadok-prodazhi-nalichnoy-inostrannoy-valyuty
 
yeah, it bounced back in lala-land.

From 20th of May, RF banks remove restriction on buying foreign currency. The only exception is Euro and US dollars. :story:

This applies to mere mortals, not some companies who are in direct or indirect control of the state. EU and USD is the only link to reality and the rest of the world. You might as well have unlimited right to buy my monopoly money or some Martian currency.

Also worth to note, that right after the invasion there were no restrictions to buy foreign currency, RF banks just didn't have any in. The official exchange rate was 130Rub - 1USD, but no bank had USD to sell. You can call every bank in St. Petes and no one had USD to sell you, they were just "out". On black market the price was 250-300Rub-1USD, but those were limited quantities too.

During the Soviet times, 2Rub=1USD, but it was illegal to possess, buy/sell foreign currency at all, so unless there is free circulation and exchange, the exchange rate is meaningless.


So my understanding of it is more or less correct, and they're stupid for being gleeful over this.
 
just to keep Kiwis appraised of the current state of meme wars ...

Putin's elder daughter from the first marriage has been dating a Russian born ballet dancer living in Munich (who only quit his job a mo ago) She has been visiting/living with him for the past two years and has a two y.o. daughter together.

dude's last name .... Zelensky

hence all the memes about Zelensky fucking both Putin and his daughter, Putin's graddaughter being Zelensky, I'm your father, invading the wrong country etc.

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Dude is 52 now, this was obviously in his younger days

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Vladimir Putin's daughter Katerina Tikhonova has a lover called Zelensky - the same name as the Ukrainian president - according to reports.

Sanctions against the 35-year-old - imposed over her father's invasion of Ukraine - have stopped her regular flights from Moscow to Munich to live with her new man, during which she would be accompanied by Russian secret service guards.

Her new partner - with whom she has a two-year-old daughter - is Igor Zelensky, 52, a leading professional ballet dancer and top director who until recently headed the Bavarian State Ballet.
 
During the Soviet times, 2Rub=1USD, but it was illegal to possess, buy/sell foreign currency at all, so unless there is free circulation and exchange, the exchange rate is meaningless.
That's not entirely true. There were two different currencies, hard currency rubles and the standard ruble that was used internally inside the Soviet bubble, the latter of which, despite fixed prices, they comically lost control of in '91.

Hard rubles were very difficult to obtain externally, because the Soviets had to trade gold for them if anyone requested it, and nearly impossible internally. A few trickled out to state companies to hand out to good workers as motivation because they could be used in hard currency stores. I got a few from my host family on a student exchange as a gift after giving him $15 when I found out he liked collecting coins and currency. I think he gave me 5 different 1r coins.

I think I wasn't technically allowed to leave with them, but I wasn't supposed to have some of the military stuff I had, either. Customs in NY was kind of fun. Do you have any alcohol, weapons, yadda yadda yadda? "Um, yes, yes, yes, yes, technically yes". I was 15. Different times, lol.
 
That's not entirely true. There were two different currencies, hard currency rubles and the standard ruble that was used internally inside the Soviet bubble, the latter of which, despite fixed prices, they comically lost control of in '91.

Hard rubles were very difficult to obtain externally, because the Soviets had to trade gold for them if anyone requested it, and nearly impossible internally. A few trickled out to state companies to hand out to good workers as motivation because they could be used in hard currency stores. I got a few from my host family on a student exchange as a gift after giving him $15 when I found out he liked collecting coins and currency. I think he gave me 5 different 1r coins.

I think I wasn't technically allowed to leave with them, but I wasn't supposed to have some of the military stuff I had, either. Customs in NY was kind of fun. Do you have any alcohol, weapons, yadda yadda yadda? "Um, yes, yes, yes, yes, technically yes". I was 15. Different times, lol.

There was only one ruble. The ruble coin, that you probably speak off, was probably first introduced after the Olympic games, but we (USSR people) just called them "olympic ruble", they were not popular because they are heavy and large.

You were not allowed to bring Soviet currency outside of the Soviet Union. Also, unlike in the free world, Soviet Union had "exit customs" which checked your luggage and papers when you left the country (or were trying to).

I've heard similar stories that any Soviet currency outside of USSR could be exchanged for gold equivalent, but frankly, I'm not sure if that's just a myth. I don't even know if Soviet bank offices existed outside USSR.

Inside USSR, any foreign currency was prohibited (with some rare exceptions) and there were specific criminal statues associated with posession and circulation of foreign currencies. Any mid-tier operators who may have traded them on the black market could also be charged with treason or similar charges that allowed capital punishment, so regular criminals stayed the fuck away from foreign shit because it was literally less danger to murder someone rather than getting caught with a dollar bill, because then your crime would be investigated by KGB.
 
There was only one ruble. The ruble coin, that you probably speak off, was probably first introduced after the Olympic games, but we (USSR people) just called them "olympic ruble", they were not popular because they are heavy and large.

You were not allowed to bring Soviet currency outside of the Soviet Union. Also, unlike in the free world, Soviet Union had "exit customs" which checked your luggage and papers when you left the country (or were trying to).

I've heard similar stories that any Soviet currency outside of USSR could be exchanged for gold equivalent, but frankly, I'm not sure if that's just a myth. I don't even know if Soviet bank offices existed outside USSR.

Inside USSR, any foreign currency was prohibited (with some rare exceptions) and there were specific criminal statues associated with posession and circulation of foreign currencies. Any mid-tier operators who may have traded them on the black market could also be charged with treason or similar charges that allowed capital punishment, so regular criminals stayed the fuck away from foreign shit because it was literally less danger to murder someone rather than getting caught with a dollar bill, because then your crime would be investigated by KGB.
Every city I was in had at least one hard currency store, and they would accept certain rubles and not the normal ones. The "hard" rubles were exchangeable when we left, the regular ones were not. You could go into any bank and get the worthless ones, and the official rate to purchase those was about 12r/$1 when I first got there (25/1 on the black market), and then a couple weeks later went into freefall as Moscow tried to undercut them. It went from 12/1 to 67/1 from state banks over something like 2 weeks.

Even McDonald's in Moscow had a special line for hard currency if you didn't want to stand in the line behind a few thousand people.

These things may have been a result of Gorbechev spending 5 years trying to reform things as they failed around him, I don't know.
 
Every city I was in had at least one hard currency store, and they would accept certain rubles and not the normal ones. The "hard" rubles were exchangeable when we left, the regular ones were not. You could go into any bank and get the worthless ones, and the official rate to purchase those was about 12r/$1 when I first got there (25/1 on the black market), and then a couple weeks later went into freefall as Moscow tried to undercut them. It went from 12/1 to 67/1 from state banks over something like 2 weeks.

Even McDonald's in Moscow had a special line for hard currency if you didn't want to stand in the line behind a few thousand people.

These things may have been a result of Gorbechev spending 5 years trying to reform things as they failed around him, I don't know.

what time frame was it? I speak from pre-1991 collapse. Post collapse there were all kinds of crazy reforms and fiat that frankly, I don't know much about. They had some UAE or something like USD equivalents.

In other news; a Dutch company has developed a rotary magazine for drones:

lol, i.e. rotary bomb dispenser. I bet the fucking thing will jam and I don't want to be the lucky bro to recover a drone with shitload of armed mortar rounds jammed up in a tight bundle.
 
what time frame was it? I speak from pre-1991 collapse. Post collapse there were all kinds of crazy reforms and fiat that frankly, I don't know much about. They had some UAE or something like USD equivalents.
I was there until a 5 or 6 weeks before the coup attempt in '91, but things weren't any different for the group from a year before. My guess is a lot of it is from about 1988 on when US/USSR exchanges like the one I was on started to be a thing, but I didn't really know anyone in my highschool's Russian program before one year ahead of my.

The only thing customs in Moscow dinged any of us on was a bronze sculpture one kid forgot to declare.

The beaurocratic strangeness of the USSR was kind of interesting, especially at the border. They didn't stamp our passport on entry or exit, just the visa, which they confiscated when we left. I wish I could have kept it just to have it. It was an interesting time, especially as a Cold War kid. The constant background threat of things going nuclear, even if it was unlikely in reality, and the easing of that pressure was really noticeable. But my passport just says I left New York and came back with no record of where I went.

At least I have the pile of military propaganda posters I bought. The art style of those was still classicly Soviet.
 
During the Soviet times, 2Rub=1USD, but it was illegal to possess, buy/sell foreign currency at all, so unless there is free circulation and exchange, the exchange rate is meaningless.
As an anecdotal sidenote: I've heard stories that during late Soviet times cops sold dollars to tourists in Leningrad.
Perhaps they know actual exchange rate, but it's probably bad idea to ask while not being foreigner.
 
Russians have attempted another offensive over in the East, Ukranian Defence ministry reports.

Once again, either been thrown back, done nothing or captured a village or two. We had nearly a solid week of artillery before this as well, suggesting russian artillery abilities and ammunition is ineffective against more mobile or better defended.

View attachment 3300942

They have however created a bubble around Popasna which certainly presents a fun opportunity for the Ukranians to slam shut the door and keep them there.

Around Kherson, the Ukies have now shoved the russians back to about the same positions they were in on the 03rd of May, and euronews has an inadvertedly hilarious soft video with depty commander creampuff here.

So basically, the Russians made another push into Ukrainian land, got themselves beaten back, and now a good portion of their army is close to being surrounded and will probably either surrender or be used for target practice. How many bodies are they willing to throw just to save face?
 
So basically, the Russians made another push into Ukrainian land, got themselves beaten back, and now a good portion of their army is close to being surrounded and will probably either surrender or be used for target practice. How many bodies are they willing to throw just to save face?
If the map is correct, there really is some idiocy involved. "No, we totally need to leave a small chokepoint, comrades!"
 
I agree with this sentiment entirely.

I just don't think Patriots (even less so THAAD) are systems you can just gift to a third party that's untrained on them in any reasonable timeframe. And by that I mean at least the eastern front will have either stabilize into a long term stalemate or even some kind of ceasefire before truly consequential equipment is operational and in the field in numbers that would allow the Ukrainians to decisively win this and take back everything sans Crimea that Russia and their puppets have held since 2014.

I don't doubt they will get the means to do so, maybe even Patriots if necessary, which is why I said Russia is fucked if this is genuine because its not out of the question. But we should expect Russia to hold onto the southern territory as well as whatever eastern territory they can brut force their way into before the fronts settle for for a year or two at least before things like Patriots, aircraft, anti-ship weapons and new armor are able to be fielded in numbers that make a difference.
Qe managed to teach the Saudi's and Qatari's to use them and not shoot down their own planes. So not the highest learning curve.
 
Qe managed to teach the Saudi's and Qatari's to use them and not shoot down their own planes. So not the highest learning curve.
as far as i remember, all the fancy high tech american hardware the saudis have isn't actually operated by saudi military, it's basically just in storage and they expect that if saudi arabia ever comes under attack (from iran most likely) then america will send troops and personnel to operate the stuff for them
something to do with them being paranoid about having a competent army because competent armies can be a coup risk

i do think that teaching ukrainians to operate systems like patriot would be relatively easy, the bigger issue would probably be teaching them maintenance and repair, that tends to be very complicated with these ultra high tech modern systems
 
There was only one ruble. The ruble coin, that you probably speak off, was probably first introduced after the Olympic games, but we (USSR people) just called them "olympic ruble", they were not popular because they are heavy and large.

You were not allowed to bring Soviet currency outside of the Soviet Union. Also, unlike in the free world, Soviet Union had "exit customs" which checked your luggage and papers when you left the country (or were trying to).

I've heard similar stories that any Soviet currency outside of USSR could be exchanged for gold equivalent, but frankly, I'm not sure if that's just a myth. I don't even know if Soviet bank offices existed outside USSR.

Inside USSR, any foreign currency was prohibited (with some rare exceptions) and there were specific criminal statues associated with posession and circulation of foreign currencies. Any mid-tier operators who may have traded them on the black market could also be charged with treason or similar charges that allowed capital punishment, so regular criminals stayed the fuck away from foreign shit because it was literally less danger to murder someone rather than getting caught with a dollar bill, because then your crime would be investigated by KGB.
He's talking about the Beryozka cheques, you silly goose.

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