Megathread SRS and GRS surgeons and associated horrors - the medical community of experimental surgeons, the secret community of home butchers

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I did I a search of Antti Mikkola as I recognised it as a native Finnish name. Found an article where he speaks about treating trans people:

"I am a plastic surgeon, graduated as a licentiate in 2009 and as a specialist in plastic surgery in 2016. 80% of my working time is spent examining and treating patients suffering from gender dysphoria. I work in Karolinska's plastic surgery clinic, where I perform both thoracic and genital reconstructive surgery.

Gender reassignment is a multidisciplinary process, not just a plastic surgery procedure. In charge are the psychiatrists of the polyclinic for gender identity research, who coordinate the treatment. We are just one executing branch in the whole, but still perhaps the most "marked" for this process in many ways. Surgery is often the most awaited treatment by patients.

Sometimes you hear stories from patients that they go to the doctor's office because of the flu and the doctor shuts down about the trans thing. And suddenly the patient realizes that he is a therapist or a psychologist for the doctor. In this society, gender minorities get enough stares, wondering and questioning without the doctors adding to it at all. That overall feeling of alienation, fear of being rejected and everyday self-justification, we cis people don't even really understand. But pity doesn't help here.

Sometimes my colleagues are surprised, even questioning, towards my work. However, they often imagine themselves working in a specialty that would not treat patients belonging to the gender minority. I think I'm so ready for words that I hit such commenters with a "bone in the throat" pretty quickly. The medical profession also has colleagues whose strong spiritual or religious background is reflected in their world of values. No matter what the value background is, it must not affect the encounter with patients negatively. I have strong faith in the young generation of doctors.
Any treatment that is offered in public health care can be questioned and a price tag can be found for it. However, this patient group is basically young people who return to working life and are full members of society after recovery. But if they are not taken care of, then unfortunately a large part of them will be marginalized and depressed. In addition, they have a significant risk of suicide. I am proud of my work. I feel that I can add a lot of quality of life to these people. I just wish they had more humane waiting times for treatments.
I encounter these patients in exactly the same way as any other patient at the reception. I don't have any silk gloves for this activity. And there is no need to put this patient group on a pedestal. Anyone can succeed in meeting them. Of course, it requires openness and open-mindedness.

In my own opinion, I am very LGBTIQ-friendly, but still I find myself carrying learned gender roles inside me. Each of us has some sort of subconscious need to classify fellow human beings as feminine or masculine. However, the scale of masculinity and femininity is wide, and in society it is expanding all the time. Many of the patients are in the process of gender reassignment. Human dignity does not increase or decrease depending on which stage of the process they are in or whether they have already stated that they are satisfied at some point. In addition, there are also detransitive ones.

I don't always succeed either. Even though I work with these patients every day, there are always mistakes. I think that my skills are strong and I know how to deal with these patients well, but the patient may experience my dealing style as the complete opposite. But by meeting the patient as a person, you can easily forgive small mistakes.
I've gone to take care of gender minorities in Sweden, where I don't even speak about these things in my own mother tongue, and I'm doing well. An unhurried and accepting atmosphere helps. Even if there are no words for everything, you can convey understanding and empathy at the reception. These patients are perhaps especially sensitive to the idea that they will be rejected in health care or that the doctor will belittle their problems and ailments. You can say out loud that I'm on your side."



910B5663-28F0-4135-AEE3-563BD3B686A0.png

The doctor in question. He is (unsurprisingly) also gay cause I found some home decor article about his and his partner’s home.

Anyway, I found no further flayed Christmas ham amholes of his making but I found some interesting Finnish article about detransitioning and the permanent changes that can not be corrected after the transition, also apparently cowritten by him. I can translate and post it if anyone is interested.
 
I did I a search of Antti Mikkola as I recognised it as a native Finnish name. Found an article where he speaks about treating trans people:

"I am a plastic surgeon, graduated as a licentiate in 2009 and as a specialist in plastic surgery in 2016. 80% of my working time is spent examining and treating patients suffering from gender dysphoria. I work in Karolinska's plastic surgery clinic, where I perform both thoracic and genital reconstructive surgery.

Gender reassignment is a multidisciplinary process, not just a plastic surgery procedure. In charge are the psychiatrists of the polyclinic for gender identity research, who coordinate the treatment. We are just one executing branch in the whole, but still perhaps the most "marked" for this process in many ways. Surgery is often the most awaited treatment by patients.

Sometimes you hear stories from patients that they go to the doctor's office because of the flu and the doctor shuts down about the trans thing. And suddenly the patient realizes that he is a therapist or a psychologist for the doctor. In this society, gender minorities get enough stares, wondering and questioning without the doctors adding to it at all. That overall feeling of alienation, fear of being rejected and everyday self-justification, we cis people don't even really understand. But pity doesn't help here.

Sometimes my colleagues are surprised, even questioning, towards my work. However, they often imagine themselves working in a specialty that would not treat patients belonging to the gender minority. I think I'm so ready for words that I hit such commenters with a "bone in the throat" pretty quickly. The medical profession also has colleagues whose strong spiritual or religious background is reflected in their world of values. No matter what the value background is, it must not affect the encounter with patients negatively. I have strong faith in the young generation of doctors.
Any treatment that is offered in public health care can be questioned and a price tag can be found for it. However, this patient group is basically young people who return to working life and are full members of society after recovery. But if they are not taken care of, then unfortunately a large part of them will be marginalized and depressed. In addition, they have a significant risk of suicide. I am proud of my work. I feel that I can add a lot of quality of life to these people. I just wish they had more humane waiting times for treatments.
I encounter these patients in exactly the same way as any other patient at the reception. I don't have any silk gloves for this activity. And there is no need to put this patient group on a pedestal. Anyone can succeed in meeting them. Of course, it requires openness and open-mindedness.

In my own opinion, I am very LGBTIQ-friendly, but still I find myself carrying learned gender roles inside me. Each of us has some sort of subconscious need to classify fellow human beings as feminine or masculine. However, the scale of masculinity and femininity is wide, and in society it is expanding all the time. Many of the patients are in the process of gender reassignment. Human dignity does not increase or decrease depending on which stage of the process they are in or whether they have already stated that they are satisfied at some point. In addition, there are also detransitive ones.

I don't always succeed either. Even though I work with these patients every day, there are always mistakes. I think that my skills are strong and I know how to deal with these patients well, but the patient may experience my dealing style as the complete opposite. But by meeting the patient as a person, you can easily forgive small mistakes.
I've gone to take care of gender minorities in Sweden, where I don't even speak about these things in my own mother tongue, and I'm doing well. An unhurried and accepting atmosphere helps. Even if there are no words for everything, you can convey understanding and empathy at the reception. These patients are perhaps especially sensitive to the idea that they will be rejected in health care or that the doctor will belittle their problems and ailments. You can say out loud that I'm on your side."



View attachment 3520287
The doctor in question. He is (unsurprisingly) also gay cause I found some home decor article about his and his partner’s home.

Anyway, I found no further flayed Christmas ham amholes of his making but I found some interesting Finnish article about detransitioning and the permanent changes that can not be corrected after the transition, also apparently cowritten by him. I can translate and post it if anyone is interested.
Honestly I'd be interested if you were to translate that article. I appreciate the translation!
 
Will all these people’s lives end early because of their surgeries? When are these troons gonna start noticeably dropping like flies?

Doubt.

While I’m sure suicidal rates are higher than average (mental illness and mutilating yourself tends to do that) troons are also deeply selfish and narcissistic creatures.

Some victims of this medical malpractice will undoubtedly 41% because of pain etc.

But most will cope exactly in the way that is typical of their kind. By becoming seething shut ins, who live a life of cooming, coping and performative happiness online.

Speaking of misinformed trannies who have no idea about the procedures performed on them, that Swedish dude I posted about has made this post wondering exactly what SRS technique was used on him.
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Archive
HOW?!?

Just fucking how?!?

You go for any minor operation, and they hand you a whole little brochure about the nature of the procedure and what will be done.

And these basket cases apparently just shake their head and say: “I don’t care about the details, I just want a vagina!”
 
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Given troons shitty health bevause of their tendency to cluster bomb their bodies with dangerous surgeries and drugs, there’s a more than reasonable chance that they’ll need some kind of organ transplant at some point.

I refuse to leave this mortal coil, knowing that I might be used as spare parts for D00ley & co.
From the conversation yesterday, the only way I'd let my parts get donated to troons would be on two conditions:

1. They have to be told that this strong, beautiful heart/liver/kidney/etc. came from a flaming TERF, and
2. They can't be told until after the surgery is complete.

If only I could be there to see their face when the realization dawns that TERF fury is the only thing keeping them alive. Their next Reddit post? "My new transplant is from a TERF and it's doing me ACTUAL HARM!!"

:story::story: :story:
 
From the conversation yesterday, the only way I'd let my parts get donated to troons would be on two conditions:

1. They have to be told that this strong, beautiful heart/liver/kidney/etc. came from a flaming TERF, and
2. They can't be told until after the surgery is complete.

If only I could be there to see their face when the realization dawns that TERF fury is the only thing keeping them alive. Their next Reddit post? "My new transplant is from a TERF and it's doing me ACTUAL HARM!!"

:story::story: :story:
You’d definitely feed into tranny magical thinking.

“Ever since I had my liver transplant, I’ve noticed that estrogen doesn’t seem as effective and my levels have dropped. I assume it’s my TERF liver causing this and wanted to hear if any girls have any helpful suggestions? My doctor has NOT been helpful and has taken a very ableist “it’s all in your head!” Attitude.”
 
No wonder his skin is falling off. I wonder if dilation is causing the issue.

It seems there is no end to Am(ity)hole horror. There is always new awful shit happening.
For some reason, either mental block, delusion, or retardation, these lunatics do not grasp the fact that all skin sheds heavily. It just isn't noticeable with clean healthy skin. They hear that vaginas are self-cleaning but they don't grasp that it means that the tissue gets expelled each month. Being that they drill a cavity into their abdomen and squish an inverted flesh sock in between two organs and scar it in place, even the most complication-free result will have filthy characteristics. Skin is not meant to be constantly moist, which will lead to extra shedding and a weird pH. Instead of being lined with a mucous membrane that is able to tolerate moisture and that sheds itself each month, they have skin both driven to slough off by moisture and shed skin that incessantly collects inside. The moisture inside consists of sweat and whatever peritoneal membrane exudes, but the darkness and temperature probably drive microbe levels through the roof. Please, the funk, the absolute stench of it all.

These manmade horrors will never not be disgusting.
 
From the conversation yesterday, the only way I'd let my parts get donated to troons would be on two conditions:

1. They have to be told that this strong, beautiful heart/liver/kidney/etc. came from a flaming TERF, and
2. They can't be told until after the surgery is complete.

If only I could be there to see their face when the realization dawns that TERF fury is the only thing keeping them alive. Their next Reddit post? "My new transplant is from a TERF and it's doing me ACTUAL HARM!!"

:story::story: :story:
They'd probably get some sort of twisted pleasure from using parts of a dead TERFs body. Like it would be a variation of their TERF breeding camps fantasy, a TERF organ farm. Those people are more than deranged enough to think like that lol
 
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I have real questions. Is it really that bad? Are there happy trans people who have gotten SRS? People point to Buck Angel as a trans success story, but Buck Angel never got phalloplasty. And plus it's not like she is without issues, as the testosterone fucked her up. But it seems like most of the "success" stories of trans people are of those who never messed with their genitals. Are there people who have had SRS 30, 40, 50 years ago and are still happy with their new parts without constant UTIs and other issues? Are there phalloplasties that have lasted several decades? And is the stench really that bad? I mean, it sure seems like it would be, but I will never know firsthand.
 
I have real questions. Is it really that bad? Are there happy trans people who have gotten SRS? People point to Buck Angel as a trans success story, but Buck Angel never got phalloplasty. And plus it's not like she is without issues, as the testosterone fucked her up. But it seems like most of the "success" stories of trans people are of those who never messed with their genitals. Are there people who have had SRS 30, 40, 50 years ago and are still happy with their new parts without constant UTIs and other issues? Are there phalloplasties that have lasted several decades? And is the stench really that bad? I mean, it sure seems like it would be, but I will never know firsthand.
The stench was bad enough that There was a scientific study that mentioned the odor of neovaginas as an aside even though it wasn’t part of the study subject.

The study has been linked a few times in this thread. Perhaps someone with more motivation can find it for you. Sorry.
 
I have real questions. Is it really that bad? Are there happy trans people who have gotten SRS? People point to Buck Angel as a trans success story, but Buck Angel never got phalloplasty. And plus it's not like she is without issues, as the testosterone fucked her up. But it seems like most of the "success" stories of trans people are of those who never messed with their genitals. Are there people who have had SRS 30, 40, 50 years ago and are still happy with their new parts without constant UTIs and other issues? Are there phalloplasties that have lasted several decades? And is the stench really that bad? I mean, it sure seems like it would be, but I will never know firsthand.
SRS hasn't been around for long enough to do a meaningful study on people who got mutilated that long ago. Until + or - the 2010s, the standard practice was gatekeeping: HRT was not recommended unless/until the therapist was confident the patient really had gender dysphoria and the patient had been living as the opposite sex for an extended period of time, then SRS was not recommended unless the patient was responding appropriately to HRT and the dysphoria persisted. On top of that, insurance did not cover it and SRS doctors were extremely rare.

In short you'd have to really dig for patients who got SRS 30-plus years ago and any data you got from them would be so suspect (self-selection, small sample size, anyone who did 41% wouldn't show up by definition) that it would not be useful from a statistical/medical perspective. It's the same issue we are going to face with pediatric transitioners in the coming years, they are just too rare to get a sufficiently large and representative sample.

Edit to avoid double post:
The stench was bad enough that There was a scientific study that mentioned the odor of neovaginas as an aside even though it wasn’t part of the study subject.

The study has been linked a few times in this thread. Perhaps someone with more motivation can find it for you. Sorry.
Ask and ye shall receive, here is the NIH study you're thinking of and here is an archive in case it gets memory-holed or rewritten.

Relevant quotes:
First, the one we all know and laugh at:
Although this was not a study criterion and therefore not scored, a foul smell of the vagina was observed in most patients.
But don't worry, they documented and measured it too:
Eight out of 34 (23.5%) had frequent episodes of bad-smelling vaginal discharge. There was no correlation between malodorous vaginal discharge and vaginal irritation
And if I am understanding this correctly the neovagina is so weak (not sure if the authors meant structural stability or lack of self-cleaning capability) that regular, heterosexual sex still increases the risk of fecal bacteria entering it:
Enterococcus faecalis was significantly and strongly associated with heterosexual orientation and penetrative sexual contact, indicating that the migration of this uropathogen to the vagina is strongly enhanced by intercourse, an observation that has previously been made for E. coli and Enterococcus species [15]. This finding is of importance to transsexual women's health as vaginal colonisation with uropathogens is generally known to precede urinary tract infection
 
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The study has been linked a few times in this thread. Perhaps someone with more motivation can find it for you. Sorry.
True, I remember it now that you mention it. A few pages back.

SRS hasn't been around for long enough to do a meaningful study on people who got mutilated that long ago. Until + or - the 2010s, the standard practice was gatekeeping: HRT was not recommended unless/until the therapist was confident the patient really had gender dysphoria and the patient had been living as the opposite sex for an extended period of time, then SRS was not recommended unless the patient was responding appropriately to HRT and the dysphoria persisted. On top of that, insurance did not cover it and SRS doctors were extremely rare.

In short you'd have to really dig for patients who got SRS 30-plus years ago and any data you got from them would be so suspect (self-selection, small sample size, anyone who did 41% wouldn't show up by definition) that it would not be useful from a statistical/medical perspective. It's the same issue we are going to face with pediatric transitioners in the coming years, they are just too rare to get a sufficiently large and representative sample.
True. I have seen a lot of regret stories (Walt Heyer, etc.) but no long-term success stories, and I wondered if it was just that I was missing something somehow.
 
Someone wants to know if it's okay to decline a neovagina and have a preference for the real thing.

r/asktransgender unanimously says transphobic


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I found this response interesting


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Gynos can't tell the difference 🤣



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Comments are worth a read

Comments are gold, thank you.

In particular, this semi-based troon shares some facts.
Screenshot_20220723-215024.png

Which produces this cope from a MtF (I profile dived him and he is "No Op" which means he loves his dick?) who has a tranny 'girlfriend' and is T4T so has probably never touched a real vag.

Screenshot_20220723-214911~2.png

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The utter confusion about female anatomy is incredible. Vaginas don't push out babies, wombs do.

This thread makes me swing between feeling as if surgeons are butchers exploiting the vulnerable and feeling that the victims deserve it for their complete ignorance of biology.

Edited because fucking autocorrect.
 
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Comments are gold, thank you.

In particular, this semi-based troon shares some facts.

View attachment 3521462

Which produces this cope from a MtF (I profile dived him and he is "No Op" which means he loves his dick?) who has a tranny 'girlfriend' and is T4T so has probably never touched a real vag.


View attachment 3521472

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The utter confusion about female anatomy is incredible. Vaginas don't push out babies, wombs do.
What a self-own! Some women struggle with pleasure? That might be a you problem, sir. All I'm hearing is "I've never touched a real woman before."

"being a man is a disorder some women have to suffer through"
 
They hear that vaginas are self-cleaning but they don't grasp that it means that the tissue gets expelled each month. [...] Instead of being lined with a mucous membrane that is able to tolerate moisture and that sheds itself each month, they have skin both driven to slough off by moisture and shed skin that incessantly collects inside.
I'm under the pretty clear impression that it's the uterine lining that sheds every month if no egg implants. Surely not the lining of the actual vagina?

(srsly please say it doesn't work that way, that is mfing horrifying)
 
And if I am understanding this correctly the neovagina is so weak (not sure if the authors meant structural stability or lack of self-cleaning capability) that regular, heterosexual sex still increases the risk of fecal bacteria entering it:
The "heterosexual orientation" in the study means MTF subjects who have a male partner. I wonder why they would be more likely to have fecal bacteria?
 
The doctor in question. He is (unsurprisingly) also gay
Hey remember all those times when we wondered if SRS doctors had ever seen a real vagina?

Which produces this cope from a MtF (I profile dived him and he is "No Op" which means he loves his dick?) who has a tranny 'girlfriend' and is T4T so has probably never touched a real vag.

"Some squirrels don't have any fur due to genetic abnormalities or extreme stress. Some of them are allergic to nuts. Some of them lost their tails or were born without them. Some of them are disabled and can't climb trees. Just because you don't have fur or a tail and don't eat nuts and climb trees doesn't mean you aren't a valid squirrel"
 
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