Better Call Saul

[CAPTAIN HAPPY]

Been rewatching Bitcoin Sun in the past few weeks. I was surprised how well the first 3 seasons held out in quality, I wasn't expecting them to be as good as they were. After the fiery finally, the show to get kinda random and felt like it lost direction for a while until Lalo showed up. I'll be done with the show in the next couple of weeks, then I'll rewatch BB and see if people who say that BCS is better. Currently, I still think BB is better.

 

[Pringles Can]

Been rewatching Bitcoin Sun in the past few weeks. I was surprised how well the first 3 seasons held out in quality, I wasn't expecting them to be as good as they were. After the fiery finally, the show to get kinda random and felt like it lost direction for a while until Lalo showed up. I'll be done with the show in the next couple of weeks, then I'll rewatch BB and see if people who say that BCS is better. Currently, I still think BB is better.

I still would agree with the people who say BB is better. But BCS is not that far behind BB for me. If BB is a 10/10 then BCS for me is a 9/10. Which considering what we have gotten on TV in the US as of late is still a masterpiece.

 

[AnOminous]

Been rewatching Bitcoin Sun in the past few weeks. I was surprised how well the first 3 seasons held out in quality, I wasn't expecting them to be as good as they were. After the fiery finally, the show to get kinda random and felt like it lost direction for a while until Lalo showed up. I'll be done with the show in the next couple of weeks, then I'll rewatch BB and see if people who say that BCS is better. Currently, I still think BB is better.

BB is better but that's hardly a dis. BB is better than pretty much anything.

 

[nym]

I generally avoid TV shows, finally started watching Breaking Bad last month, probably will finish it next week... I generally like it but there's a lot of things that drive me crazy about it, and I'm looking forward to what I assume will be the law aspects in BCS over this.

One thing in particular, halfway through season 4 as I am, that I still can't get over because it would have circumvented the whole course of the show: dammit, Walter White had the EASIEST cover story for his second cellphone, his disappearances, and his extra money. He coulda just said "a guy I used to work with at Los Alamos came to me after school one day, he's a bigshot now, said he's got some big hush-hush black program going on, needs me to come in to do some contracting crystallography on samples every once in a while, they call me up suddenly and I go there and they're giving me like $800/hr in cash, but I don't even know what it's all about, no one there does, but I'm not supposed to even acknowledge it exists". Something like that.

Holy crap, imagine how easy of an alibi that would have been to pull off. I mean, he already literally worked at least adjacent to secret government programs and was considered at the top of his field. There's no stretch involved whatsoever.

Also, do people ever actually like your protagonist, like, as a person? or is it just me who constantly wants to slap the shit out of him and be like "why are you still ______???" ?

 

[AnOminous]

Also, do people ever actually like your protagonist, like, as a person? or is it just me who constantly wants to slap the shit out of him and be like "why are you still ______???" ?

You're supposed to figure out Walt is an asshole at some point. Vince Gilligan got kind of annoyed at people simping for him to the point he would have him do more and more fucked up shit (like poisoning a child just as a gambit) to see if they'd figure it out.

 

[nym]

You're supposed to figure out Walt is an asshole at some point. Vince Gilligan got kind of annoyed at people simping for him to the point he would have him do more and more fucked up shit (like poisoning a child just as a gambit) to see if they'd figure it out.

It was funny because after I posted that, I started the next episode, and what I said I was waiting for (that blank in my mind) immediately occurred -- holy crap Walt actually apologized for something for the first time in the show... when 80% of the show is over with.

But I'm sure you're right, I can see it. Got annoyed by people simping for him so he intentionally turned his unlikeability up to 11 as it the show went on. Makes a lot of sense.

Amazing looking at the comments underneath where I'm watching the show, talking about what a badass he is as a character or whatever. Like maybe, in a way he certainly is, sure, of course; what's weird is the comments are clearly coming from kids who think he's something of an asshole worth emulating, when it's clear he's such a self-absorbed prick he's pretty much irredeemable.

 

[God of Nothing]

It was funny because after I posted that, I started the next episode, and what I said I was waiting for (that blank in my mind) immediately occurred -- holy crap Walt actually apologized for something for the first time in the show... when 80% of the show is over with.

But I'm sure you're right, I can see it. Got annoyed by people simping for him so he intentionally turned his unlikeability up to 11 as it the show went on. Makes a lot of sense.

Amazing looking at the comments underneath where I'm watching the show, talking about what a badass he is as a character or whatever. Like maybe, in a way he certainly is, sure, of course; what's weird is the comments are clearly coming from kids who think he's something of an asshole worth emulating, when it's clear he's such a self-absorbed prick he's pretty much irredeemable.

what do you expect from another generation of men who lack father figures?

 

[Trig.Point]

You're supposed to figure out Walt is an asshole at some point. Vince Gilligan got kind of annoyed at people simping for him to the point he would have him do more and more fucked up shit (like poisoning a child just as a gambit) to see if they'd figure it out.

The same with all of them including Mike and Jesse. When they shot that kid during the train robbery, they casually dispose of the body knowing his parents will never know what happened to him. At that point I just thought they all deserve to hang.

 

[JimiHendrix]

honestly thought it was extremely clear that Walter intended to kill Jesse at the end, that's the entire reason he manipulated Jack into bringing Jesse into a room with a machine gun pointed at it.

Walter even accuses Jack of cutting a deal with Jesse, it's only when Jesse is brought into the room, visibly looking like shit and in literal chains, that Walter realizes he made a mistake. why else would Walter intentionally provoke Jesse to be brought into a room, that he plans to kill everyone in if he didn't intend to kill Jesse?

sometimes I understand the arguments you kids have about interpretations of scenes, but I really thought this was very clear-cut in intention.

 

[AnOminous]

honestly thought it was extremely clear that Walter intended to kill Jesse at the end, that's the entire reason he manipulated Jack into bringing Jesse into a room with a machine gun pointed at it.

Walter even accuses Jack of cutting a deal with Jesse, it's only when Jesse is brought into the room, visibly looking like shit and in literal chains, that Walter realizes he made a mistake. why else would Walter intentionally provoke Jesse to be brought into a room, that he plans to kill everyone in if he didn't intend to kill Jesse?

sometimes I understand the arguments you kids have about interpretations of scenes, but I really thought this was very clear-cut in intention.

I think killing literally everyone except his own family was his conscious intention but I think on some level he also knew that what he did to Jesse was wrong. Once he knew for a fact he'd done something worse than outright killing him his plan changed instantly.

 

[JimiHendrix]

I think killing literally everyone except his own family was his conscious intention but I think on some level he also knew that what he did to Jesse was wrong. Once he knew for a fact he'd done something worse than outright killing him his plan changed instantly.

thought the whole deal was Walter was under the impression, to save his own life, Jesse agreed to work with Jack, which Walter took offense too.

since keep in mind, the last time Walter saw Jesse, Jesse indirectly caused the deaths of Hank and Gomez, at least in Walts eyes.

unless I am misreading/misremembering?

 

[Ishtar]

So, I watched seasons 1-5 of BCS. I haven't seen Season six yet.

It does make me wonder what things would look like when all is said and done-you have the greatest criminal mastermind in American history, a partner that remains at large until the present, and the consigliere being arrested, charming and pleading his way down to a sweetheart deal then blowing it up and confessing to everything and getting functionally life in prison.

There'd be loads of books, documentaries, TV shows, probably a biopic about Walter White in universe. Speculation about Jesse Pinkman's whereabouts, and questions of Saul's motives. Gus Fring's empire also would encourage loads of investigation-both by journalists and documentarians, and the Feds as they were first humiliated by the utter embarrassment of Gus Fring fooling them all.

Heads would roll in both the DEA and Alberqurque Police Department, and the Walter White case would be studied for decades.

 

[AnOminous]

There'd be loads of books, documentaries, TV shows, probably a biopic about Walter White in universe. Speculation about Jesse Pinkman's whereabouts, and questions of Saul's motives. Gus Fring's empire also would encourage loads of investigation-both by journalists and documentarians, and the Feds as they were first humiliated by the utter embarrassment of Gus Fring fooling them all.

People would also probably lionize Saul for helping other convicts with their cases and likely he'd even bring Kim in for appellate work where an actual licensed lawyer was required. There'd eventually be a campaign that he'd been given a raw deal in a case the DEA obviously utterly fucked up and was getting revenge on the one guy they had access to.

Since Son of Sam laws are probably unconstitutional he'd have a documentary, a TV series, a movie, maybe even a videogame, and people would overlook what a complete piece of shit he'd been in reality.

 

[Oilspill Battery]

The ending was completely retarded and makes zero fucking sense.

Jimmy went 8 years not feeling a single ounce of guilt, instead comitting more crimes just because he was bored and missed sceming, managed to get himself a practically nothing sentence and walk scot free right back into his old life that he so dearly missed (He was watching the tapes nonstop to the point where they literally melt down and his modern "boring" life is in greyscale to signify how boring it is), then decided to throw it all away in the name of (basically) imaginary pussy that he'd never get to claim.

You can't do 5.9 seasons of remoseless crime, spend the intro of every season and every episode outlining how much the main character loves crime and misses the good old days, then have the finale be "I confess to everything I'm so sorry and so guilty lock me up and throw away the key "

And since when did jimmy give a *fuck* about chuck since the tape incident? Yes, jimmy did care about chuck AT FIRST, but after the truth came out its repeatedly made abundantly clear that the only feeling he (rightfully) had toward chuck after that point was indifference and/or hatred. Him confessing to chuck's suicide makes no sense on additional levels.

The ending just does not fit the show or the characters.

I think a big reason is very simple:

Vince Gilligan knew when to end it, let alone have an ending in mind.

Let's not suck vince's cock *too* hard, both BB and BCS are great series but the endings get more retarded the more you think about them. I outlined BCS above, but breaking bad isnt' far behind.

The last season downgraded the villain from gus to a bunch of shallow no effort cardboard cutouts, casting nazis as your antagonists is shorthand for "I can't be fucked writing an antagonist" and the ending involves walter using a homemade machine gun turret he built in his basement to blindfire into a room he is in and miraculusly killing all the villains but saving himself and jesse.

I'm pretty sure even vince has admited that he hates the machinegun, was hoping to drop it without the audience noticing, and wishes it was never introduced in the first place.

 

[Ishtar]

I guess it's more about retaining Kim's respect. Which yeah, that's white knightery of the highest degree.

But even if you think he's trying to ensure his ex-wife doesn't think he's an awful scumbag as they go their separate ways (and I think Seehorn said she'd try to get his sentence reduced), its still a very stupid decision.

The only argument I could see is Jimmy wants the uncertainty and misery of life as Gene to end, and so he got the seven-year deal to show he was the greatest conman ever and being the most popular inmate and being a legendary lawyer is worth the sacrifice.

Or...the motivation does revolve around Kim-he was going to take the sweetheart deal, saw Kim in the courtroom and wanted to make all right-so uh...she could not think badly of him? Or more poetically-would see him as Jimmy again, not Saul.

Which, I don't think that's simpery-well maybe, but wanting the person you care about most to not think badly of you, is not an unreasonable motivation. Its still dumb, if he wanted atonement in Kim's eyes(even if no one else's) he could have taken the seven-year deal and gone on to just...a legitimate life afterwards. Life in prison just so his ex wife can think of you as a man who "finally came clean" is...well its stupid. 7 years fine? Disbarment and permanently disavowing your past lifestyle, fine, there are any number of ways he could demonstrate to her that he had changed or was facing consequences and accepting responsibility without throwing his life away.

I dunno.

TLDR: Wanting Kim's respect isn't bad per se, throwing away his life for it is however stupid.

 

[RurkerHivemind]

Where do you guys go to watch online for free?

 

[Oilspill Battery]

Or...the motivation does revolve around Kim-he was going to take the sweetheart deal, saw Kim in the courtroom and wanted to make all right-so uh...she could not think badly of him? Or more poetically-would see him as Jimmy again, not Saul.

He specifically baited kim into coming in the courtroom. He implied he was going to betray her just to get her to show up, so him looking at kim and changing his tune all of a sudden makes no sense.

Basically, he literally was doing this whole thing so his ex wife would think higher of him as she fucks her current husband while he rots in prison for crimes they both commited. He's worse than a cuck, he is -may allah forgive me for uttering this word- a simp.

Where do you guys go to watch online for free?

Piratebay

 

[Serbian Peacekeepers]

The ending was completely retarded and makes zero fucking sense.

Jimmy went 8 years not feeling a single ounce of guilt, instead comitting more crimes just because he was bored and missed sceming, managed to get himself a practically nothing sentence and walk scot free right back into his old life that he so dearly missed (He was watching the tapes nonstop to the point where they literally melt down and his modern "boring" life is in greyscale to signify how boring it is), then decided to throw it all away in the name of (basically) imaginary pussy that he'd never get to claim.

You can't do 5.9 seasons of remoseless crime, spend the intro of every season and every episode outlining how much the main character loves crime and misses the good old days, then have the finale be "I confess to everything I'm so sorry and so guilty lock me up and throw away the key "

And since when did jimmy give a *fuck* about chuck since the tape incident? Yes, jimmy did care about chuck AT FIRST, but after the truth came out its repeatedly made abundantly clear that the only feeling he (rightfully) had toward chuck after that point was indifference and/or hatred. Him confessing to chuck's suicide makes no sense on additional levels.

The ending just does not fit the show or the characters.

A few things
1: BCS takes place between 2010 and 2012.
2: The first crime gene commits is to make sure jeff can't rat him out to the cops, but afterwards he falls back into his old habits of scamming people.
3: The show isnt greyscale because of how boring genes life is, its greyscale because all the happiness was sucked out of it post breaking bad, his true happiness with kim is gone and the fake happiness he had as saul is also gone, all his money and comforts were ripped away from him and all he is left with is memories and the fear of being found out.
4: The entirety of season 4 was about jimmy's remorse over chucks death, he kept pawning it off onto howard but jimmy was remorseful over it.

Jimmy never took responsibility for his actions, he always found a way out of whatever trouble he was in, even if he apologized he always fell back into his same old habits time after time, the confession to the court was a confession he couldn't find his way out of and was a way to prove to him, and more importantly kim, that he HAD change and could be better.

 

[Oilspill Battery]

A few things
1: BCS takes place between 2010 and 2012.

I'm including the entirety of breaking bad and all his years as gene.

2: The first crime gene commits is to make sure jeff can't rat him out to the cops, but afterwards he falls back into his old habits of scamming people.
3: The show isnt greyscale because of how boring genes life is, its greyscale because all the happiness was sucked out of it post breaking bad, his true happiness with kim is gone and the fake happiness he had as saul is also gone, all his money and comforts were ripped away from him and all he is left with is memories and the fear of being found out.

Yeah that's my point. He misses being saul. He rewatches the saul tapes every night to the point where they wear down. He has no joy or happiness in his life because he's not comitting crimes or scamming people.

He takes the 7 year sentence he can dive right back in to what he missed.

4: The entirety of season 4 was about jimmy's remorse over chucks death, he kept pawning it off onto howard but jimmy was remorseful over it.

I'm confused as to how he was remorseful. When he was pulling off the scam to get his licence back he seemed more annoyed at having to pretend to care about chuck.

Jimmy never took responsibility for his actions, he always found a way out of whatever trouble he was in, even if he apologized he always fell back into his same old habits time after time, the confession to the court was a confession he couldn't find his way out of and was a way to prove to him, and more importantly kim, that he HAD change and could be better.

He could find a way out of the confession lol, just stick with the story he already had.

You can prove you change without destroying your life. If he wanted to show that he's a changed man what stopped him from serving 7 years then just going clean?

 

[Serbian Peacekeepers]

He takes the 7 year sentence he can dive right back in to what he missed.

He could find a way out of the confession lol, just stick with the story he already had.

You can prove you change without destroying your life. If he wanted to show that he's a changed man what stopped him from serving 7 years then just going clean?

He built the 7 year sentence off a lie, him being forced to work with walt under fear of death, so even if he took it and then went clean he would only be a free man because he scammed the court system and the families of walts victims, he wouldnt face justice for his crimes.

Him being remoresful about chuck is a bit harder to pinpoint a exact scene for off the top of my head, i think how he tried to pawn off the shrink to howard, how he acts distant during the chuck mcgill library unveiling, and even his reaction to chucks death even after their big fights in the past season shows that jimmy still loved chuck to a degree, even if he at the end had nothing but venom to say about the guy.