Do you think they'll ever deliver on pve?
I feel sorry for you guys most of the time if the sequel sucks you can always play the first one but obviously that's not the case here
Apologies. I didn't proofread my anger management post, I'd meant PvE. I'll be editing it now.
PvP by itself should really be renamed Players vs OWL and the band-aids they apply to that shit fire instead of relenting to the fact that it'll never be the next big eSport and focusing on the casual players instead.
The moment they included healing as a class, hope for this being a primarily competitive game were dashed. And I'm grateful. The idea of a casual shooter I can play is what attracted me to this game in the first place. Make a mistake? Healed up, heroes never die. Can't headshot the enemy Widow? It's fine, step behind this shield and try your best to whittle her down. Can't shoot for shit? Don't worry, hold up this shield or throw out that heal bomb.
Reading posts here I often feel like I'm in the minority. For example, I was happy with the idea of role queue. Getting casuals to create functional comps instead of picking 4 DPS they all want to practice on or just fuck around with was often impossible in QP. Comp had fallen into a 2-2-2 mindset by that point but frustration-switching and blind decision-making/character swapping could sometimes upheave that - it was a good starting point but when switching to accommodate what you went up against, it was rarely 'this additional damage character will help melt that tank or work on picking off supports' and was more often 'FUCK YOU I'M NOT BEING DPS MOIRA ANYMORE YOU SUCK I'M A GOD I'LL PLAY GENJI, 6v1, AND WE'LL WIN! FUCKING SCRUB DPS SCRUB TANKS SCRUB TEAM!'.
Enforcing some level of safety net to offer people a chance at victory by requiring 2 tanks and 2 supports for those DPS players felt like a good compromise. Tanks and Supports are generally more subservient because they're picking support roles so they're probably more likely to adapt to those in their team, and even an overly aggressive tank can be a good distraction with enough healing to allow the DPS time to fumble and pick off the opposite team's smaller targets.
If any change should have come to the system, it should have been something along the lines of requiring at least 1 tank and 1 healer per team at any given time and then allowing the remaining 4 to pick whoever they wanted. This plus introducing varying tanks and healers to the roster I think would have alleviated some of the problems with the queue time and placate the people who just wanna shoot stuff in their shooty bang bang game.
Also, just eliminate one shot kills for the love of god. They go against the design of this team game within PvP, it's ridiculous.
But instead, the developers are chasing the desires of people who do not play this game to have fun or even to challenge themselves in competitive. They're focusing on people who have this game as their job. With money on the line, why would any team not pick the most efficient comp possible? Why would any team risk running anything risky or not 99.99% guaranteed to thwart the bulk of what the enemies can put out?
The state of the game right now is fucking horrendous. I don't really have fun playing any role anymore. Every decision is a do-or-die scenario, no space for risks or taking chances. Every casual match feels like the culmination of what 5 comp matches in a row felt like on OW1.
Example 1: I have games as a tank where I realize that if I'm not bothering the Widow/Soujourn/Ashe/Hanzo in their perches deep into enemy territory, my healers are going to be picked off and our entire push/defence will crumble. Automatically, my pool of options has shrunk down to D.Va and Winston, or maybe Sigma if we have a DPS on our team hindering at least one of the enemy DPS. However, I do not have a second tank to support my team while I run off or to aid in my plan so I either need to 1.) perfectly execute an ambush or dive attack on my own while hoping and praying my healers aren't being bothered by flankers, the aforementioned enemy DPS, or happen to be busy trying to heal the rest of the team, or 2.) bunker down and do what I can to protect the healers or help my DPS kill whatever is on the ground and lacks mobility. This isn't even accounting for the fact that, as a tank, I also have a priority to make sure we've captured the point, kept the robot/payload moving in the right direction, or are actively hindering the enemy team from pushing it too far in the opposite direction.
Example 2: I have games as DPS where the enemy tank, usually Zarya/Orisa/Roadhog/Winston, is throttling us. No matter which hero I pick - mind, I'm not the best DPS player to fucking start with - if our tank doesn't know who to focus or where to be to help, if our supports refuse to pick heroes that can pump out more healing to increase survivability, if the whole team would rather spread out than group up to try and focus the healers helping this monster tank, and if my fellow DPS is as out of sorts as I am, we have lost. These games are especially hopeless because with the focus now being damage output, utility has fallen to the wayside and there is no way for me to compensate for my shit-tier skills and help my team that way. I can't freeze the annoying Genji, I can't duck behind two shields to buy time for my terrible aim, I can't stun the Roadhog when he hooks our healer and prepares for the kill or even when he's healing up, and I cannot miss a single shot because if I do, that Zarya will have melted me, the two healers, the tank, and all our extended families within the next second.
Example 3: I am a healer. If I'm not playing Moira to keep myself alive in the face of enemies in my space and that of the other healer, Kiriko to assist the 5 other characters on twelve corners of the map whilst offering a way to help with ults like D.Va's/Junkrat's/Reaper's and assisting with damage output, or Ana for her sleep ability and anti-healing, we are probably screwed. Any other healer requires you to be engaging in a team roll match where outside factors hamper the enemy team's performance, blind teamwork and miraculous team composition that helps the healer help the team (Brig, Lucio, Zen), or a level of skill most of us do not fucking possess.
Tank picks are often reactionary. DPS choices are proactive, reactionary, and really the only role that can still afford to be selfish in any capacity, even if they're trying to win. Support picks boil down to "one of you better choose Moira or a lot of you are going to die very quickly and very often" for most of the games these days. And here's hoping the enemy doesn't have two long-range murderers in their court because if they do, Moira either needs to become a flanker if her team fails to reliably kill them or resign herself to death at long range and the deaths of her teammates because the enemy tank was applying too much pressure to ignore healing in favour of supporting damage and there aren't enough enemies in close quarters to keep her healing gauge topped up.
And yet, even with DPS being the one role with any real freedom left in their options, you learn very quickly that raw skill and one shot heroes are superior and all the bells and whistles OW keeps trying to strip away are what kept a lot of teams afloat in the first game. All for one and all that. Everyone covered up everyone else's flaws, everyone else's asses. Now, none of that happens. With the push game mode, it doesn't even feel like that matters. It's everyman for himself or bundling around whichever teammate is the strongest and effectively carrying you to victory. God forbid if they buckle under all the stress or have a good first round then devolve in the second because of a map change or a difference in the map's layout later down the line.
And that's ON TOP of the fucking atrocious matchmaking happening right now. And on top of THAT, with all this big brain play required of everybody constantly, there are no fluff piece rewards to placate you after you lose your billionth match because it's all locked behind a paywall.
Do you think they'll ever deliver on pve?
I feel sorry for you guys most of the time if the sequel sucks you can always play the first one but obviously that's not the case here
Welcome to the brave new world where video gaming is now SaaS.
Thank you for purchasing OW1 and probably spending money on lootboxes, not go get fucked and pay the assrape prices for OW2 skins.
In case people havent realized it OW is a game on life support and Blizzard knows that so is acting accordingly. Changes like 5v5 and only 1 tank are meant to combat ever increasing queue times due to a dwindling player base. And to take advantage of what whales remain, Blizzard revamped the cash shop by massively increasing the prices on skins all the while making it insanely slow to acquire them without paying for them.
If people believe the game is healthy now it is F2P, then they are on actual crack. Since the release of 2 q's are longer, there is absolutely fucking 0 individual progression and the price of skins is so extortionate it makes Venuzula cum.
Things that make the marketing employee in me know they are somewhat fucked;
Changing the price of legendary skins, 100% reactionary. Blizzard knows they are not popular with any press at all and did so to signal change. The truth is people are not buying skins and we as players know this. I saw 1 witch Kiriko and that is it. I see none of the store skins in games.
Number touting; classic dude bro logic to say numbers, it's somewhat archaic now as a lot of companies know people can see through it. Sure you get From Software and CDPR quote numbers of sales but this is because they are legitimate achievements. Elden Ring was one of the very few delayed and anticipated games to carry through with very minor bugs. Giving a number is a credit to that team but also a boon to investors.
With Blizzard, wow 35 million clicked install. Amazing but guess what most of us are not seeing this 35 million because finding a fucking game takes forever.
A massive reason why I believe I am done is that the q's I end up either browsing here or doing housework or playing with the dog whilst I wait. Do you know how that breaks immersion Blizzard because it makes you feel like an experimented lab rat and not a player.
They put a new game mode in January meaning it's not even fucking done yet, Blizzard if you want to get people to play the season put it in at the beginning not at the end for 2 weeks.
The problems with the game are the core of the design and approach but with how fucking lazy the team is. They are so arrogant and out of touch but the second investors leave that's when they will get scared. Blizzard already is losing all of its cash cows. Wow is in the worst state it's been, it is basically an MMO co-opted by SJWs and makes scaley porn now. Diablo 4 has so much cynicism that people are dreading it. Overwatch is on life support because they fucked over the original players so badly.
Well Blizz treat your audience and good employees like shit and then you find out.
Reading posts here I often feel like I'm in the minority. For example, I was happy with the idea of role queue. Getting casuals to create functional comps instead of picking 4 DPS they all want to practice on or just fuck around with was often impossible in QP. Comp had fallen into a 2-2-2 mindset by that point but frustration-switching and blind decision-making/character swapping could sometimes upheave that - it was a good starting point but when switching to accommodate what you went up against, it was rarely 'this additional damage character will help melt that tank or work on picking off supports' and was more often 'FUCK YOU I'M NOT BEING DPS MOIRA ANYMORE YOU SUCK I'M A GOD I'LL PLAY GENJI, 6v1, AND WE'LL WIN! FUCKING SCRUB DPS SCRUB TANKS SCRUB TEAM!'.
Enforcing some level of safety net to offer people a chance at victory by requiring 2 tanks and 2 supports for those DPS players felt like a good compromise. Tanks and Supports are generally more subservient because they're picking support roles so they're probably more likely to adapt to those in their team, and even an overly aggressive tank can be a good distraction with enough healing to allow the DPS time to fumble and pick off the opposite team's smaller targets.
The main issue with the Role Queue (and the game in general) is that while 2/2/2 is a much more "stable" team dynamic - it doesn't address the core issues that plague the game. Simply put, that DPS is much more fun for 90% of the playerbase. Instead of making the other roles more fun, they just forced players into the less fun roles and called it a day.
It introduced several issues that weren't there before - 2/2/2 is based around the players all playing the roles similarly, but some of the healers are just there because they didn't want to wait in a 20 minute queue for DPS/Tank and can get a lootbox/priority pass for throwing. Having different SRs for different roles means that you care even less about those games because you have a separate "main" SR as well. Healing in OW2 is pretty braindead and there are a -lot- of fast kills and one shots that don't facilitate a healing game at all. It's also a very low skill ceiling - Mercy has a single heal and Lucio just has a "heal everyone" button and that's it - it's not like a healer can "step up" and do an extra great job if needed. Mercy will do X HP/S in healing (and X+2 for her ult, but whatever) - there's no thought behind it.
TF2's Medic - conversely - has an extremely complicated system for healing. Short version - the longer someone goes without healing, the faster they heal. Meaning there's a decision making system involved (and a single medic can effectively heal a team up and having 3 medics is not 300% better). They also have an optional ranged heal and a selectable ultimate that can be turned into offense very easily.
WoW also has role queue, but they tuned the game around DPS wherever possible. A dungeon is 1/1/3, a raid is 1-2/4-6/everything else. FFXIV does 1/1/2 and 2/2/4 (or 1/2/5 or 3/6/15). Healers in those games have a lot more varied tools so healing isn't so brain dead.
OW's solution needs to be "Make healing more fun and worthwhile" and not "force/trick people into doing it".
Then proceeded to nerf her into nothing more than a very niche counter for characters like Reaper or Tracer for most of OW then eventually rendered her completely useless in OW2.
Damn when the new hero is announced and no one is excited. This might be it boys, I might be legit done with this series now. I cannot stand the idea of grinding 60 hours just to play a new hero when it was just given before. Fuck this company seriously, obviously, Microsoft cannot intrude yet because I feel they would just blast it out already. It's the fact there is no progression at all, the season pass is a joke.
Agreed, having to grind for a new hero goes against the original principle from OW1. Hell, not even heroes, having to grind or BUY skins and decals. Everything about OW2 is worse than the original. UI, balance, progression, all regressed from before. What a shame.
Agreed, having to grind for a new hero goes against the original principle from OW1. Hell, not even heroes, having to grind or BUY skins and decals. Everything about OW2 is worse than the original. UI, balance, progression, all regressed from before. What a shame.
people shit on the role queue because they understand it's a bandaid, nothing more. it doesn't fix the issue of people not giving a shit or being scrubs, worse it forces those people to play as roles they never had any interest in or don't enjoy. look at any mmo with the tank/heal/dd trinity, which overwatch is modeled after.
the only way to get what you're really after is dump ranked and give people community servers, this way they can form their own sub-community with their own interest in mind, among them sweaty high-coordinated matches. this still wouldn't guarantee you won't end up with shit matches, but the amount and effects would be far more limited.
but since blizzard is after the e-sports money and it's much easier to bait people with MUH RANK, that's never gonna happen.
same with battleborn (shoutout to gigantic-fags, brothers in spirit).
gearbox should really just re-release it, I'm curious what the reaction would be now, given people are going back to old games because the modern offerings are so shit.
Agreed, having to grind for a new hero goes against the original principle from OW1. Hell, not even heroes, having to grind or BUY skins and decals. Everything about OW2 is worse than the original. UI, balance, progression, all regressed from before. What a shame.
I’m legitimately giving them one more “Season” to see if they can recapture the proverbial magic, but I’m not optimistic enough to have any hope that Blizzard can unfuck this game. Ram-boi is either going to be completely busted, or just Junker Queen levels of mid.
I miss when video games couldn’t use the shield of being “Early Access” - no seriously, I’ve seen people try to say Overwatch 2 is an early access game - to hide the fact the game was just shit.
Wow I am actually impressed they have messed this game up this badly
Characters that use to be alright are now a joke and some of the new characters aren't anything to sneeze at either (what the fuck is Kiriko supposed to do?). For some reason Dv.a is one of the most powerful tanks right now and most people have idea how to deal with her becaues despite this being a new game people still play like it's year 1 launch of Overwatch 1. I just started playing the game personally i might wait and check out the new hero when he drops then i might be done. People must be insane if they think this game going F2P is helping it because shit it takes you longer to get into matches despite how much people scream about how many players are playing the game.
people shit on the role queue because they understand it's a bandaid, nothing more. it doesn't fix the issue of people not giving a shit or being scrubs, worse it forces those people to play as roles they never had any interest in or don't enjoy. look at any mmo with the tank/heal/dd trinity, which overwatch is modeled after.
the only way to get what you're really after is dump ranked and give people community servers, this way they can form their own sub-community with their own interest in mind, among them sweaty high-coordinated matches. this still wouldn't guarantee you won't end up with shit matches, but the amount and effects would be far more limited.
but since blizzard is after the e-sports money and it's much easier to bait people with MUH RANK, that's never gonna happen.
The irony is that this new system gives more of a reason to be a dickhead instead of negating it. nobody likes playing healer i compared it to running a day care by yourself.
The irony is that this new system gives more of a reason to be a dickhead instead of negating it. nobody likes playing healer i compared it to running a day care by yourself.
I just queue Flex for Dailies, whenever I get Support (which is most of the time) I just play Baptiste. At least he has a chance to defend himself, and the “Fuck Death” field is always clutch.
Otherwise I stick to Open Queue. It tends to devolve into “who tanks better”, but that I can blame on Blizzard more or less converting Tanks into Bigger DPS’s
I just queue Flex for Dailies, whenever I get Support (which is most of the time) I just play Baptiste. At least he has a chance to defend himself, and the “Fuck Death” field is always clutch.
Otherwise I stick to Open Queue. It tends to devolve into “who tanks better”, but that I can blame on Blizzard more or less converting Tanks into Bigger DPS’s
I get some plays with Junkrat because he is as lame to play as ever and that is how you are supposed to play him which upsets parts of the community. Baptise is probably the most fun healer as Zen use to be my main but is now more dependant on his team because unlike OW1 i notice it seems like you die a bit faster.
If I am gonna play this game i bit more i might just do what i did in the final months I played of the first game and just play Game Browser games
I miss when video games couldn’t use the shield of being “Early Access” - no seriously, I’ve seen people try to say Overwatch 2 is an early access game - to hide the fact the game was just shit.
that label lost all meaning long ago, with games that are in early access for years or get criticized like a full fledged game in their first month of EA. anyone bringing that up in an argument is a complete idiot.
