Ukrainian Defensive War against the Russian Invasion - Mark IV: The Partitioning of Discussion

[Snekposter]

They tried with the bmpt terminator

And it turns out that unmanned and unprotected turret is a liability in serious combat. Whoops!

 

[Prester John]

 

[GatorAids]

>Be Russian tank
>Drive into easily visible mines
>Get out, sit on porch squat in the road
>Eat fried chicken chew sunflower seeds,
>Have gigantic nostils display microcephalic cranium
>Wonder why yakub make de white man Ponder why the west is so russophobic and calls us suitless white niggers
>Smoke low quality cigarettes

 

[Snekposter]

You know... time to post something that actually has aged extremely well.

https://twitter.com/eeriknkross/status/1507080906334425089

 

[Pocket Dragoon]

It better be mechs or I'm gonna be very disappointed. Not Gundam fairy unicorn mechs, I want my fuckin' Steel Batallion VT mechs that look like they run on diesel and black sludge.

Like these? I was always partial to the ones in Rifts, particularly from the German megacorp faction; Triax.

 

[namai337]

Well its offical they are refurbishing BTR-50 question remains for what role

 

[Elämällä on väliä]

I Wonder if they're gonna invent a new death machine that's going to end it.

They had robodogs. In ruzzkie 'dog' is callad sabaka, so this is autosabaka.

Alright, call me a vatnik but you two are out to lunch. [Powerlevel] For a decade I was a zogbot in a NATO military [/powerlevel] and this was exactly what we were told to do.

Try to hit a small thing using a rusty AK-shitty. When you are guarding for several days a cold and wet trench without proper boots or a fucking meal.

Of course as last resort using small arms against tonk-tonk is better than shitting pants, but still - this is last resort, not something to do as viable anti-tank duty.

These tanks, especially the earlier designed Russian MBTs were designed to roll round in nuclear wastelands with nasty anti infantry weapons blowing up around them.

What ruzzia designed and what they finally get is sometimes extreme different.

For those who didn't watch that Paper Skies video I linked, "smekalka" is a word that best translates out as "Russian problems require Russian solutions".

Smekalka is more like ability to find this shitty solutions than name of shitty solutions, but still it is funny as shit.

Repeat ad nauseum.

Ad mortem defecatam!

 

[MG-34]

Russian milblogger releases some really gnarly footage of a Russian BTR torn open in flames with a crew member still alive and pinned to his seat.

 

[Vince McMahon]

Yeah I get that but the Kiev Kyiv debacle was also a whiplash for me. In an instant all the news outlets, governments and media started using a name I've never heard once before that point.

Ukrainian government and organizations have been pushing the Kyiv spelling since 2014, FYI. The reason you noticed it now is because you noticed the war. Simple as.

 

[Astro Galactic Megalul]

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Russian milblogger releases some really gnarly footage of a Russian BTR torn open in flames with a crew member still alive and pinned to his seat.

I'm instantly reminded of this scene:

But being birthed by the smoldering remains of an armored vehicle on the battlefield is arguably cooler, if context wasn't what it is. This dude is extremely lucky.

 

[I faked the autism]

With Xi meeting Putin next week in Moscow then Zelensky, I expect there will be an ultimatum made to Ukraine. Ukraine can't last forever and Zelensky knows this despite the massive amounts of Training and funding from Nato and the EU. in fact he's even said so. It's why Zelensky continues to negotiate with Putin for the use of the black Sea to export grain to Africa (the only thing that they can sell) That's like having somebody choking you and you ask them if they can let up because you can't breathe. Also with the mounting pressure internally from the EU for oil so the citizen's don't die in the Winter it's why I suspect biden Agreed to open up an oil drilling site in Alaska to help mitigate that. However nobody talks about the fact of what a slave state Ukraine will be when this is over. You think the US, UK, France, Germany, Sweden, and Poland are just going to forget all the billions of dollars in weapons equipment that they Loaned Ukraine? That all has to be paid back and Ukraine being such a poor shithole before the war and even more so after they have literally no way of paying that back short of Selling their people as slaves or giving up territory. Putin doesn't have to encircle Kiev to "win" and he is willing to throw Russian bodies at Untested US made weapons systems the Ukrainians and Russians are the guinea pigs for its no secret Russia's military is poorly funded and under equipped for a first world Nation but that doesn't matter. With Ukraines only lifeline to export GDP and sustain itself in any way being controlled by Russia (Crimea) Zelensky must negotiate with Putin on his terms. With the growing Oil problems the EU faces with Ukraine holding up the flow of Russian gas into Europe is why I think biden is easing up on the green policies. To counter the US, China will attempt to broker a deal that favors Putin and threaten they will arm Russia if Zelensky doesn't comply because China is more than happy to have Russia owe them in debt because Russia is one of the world's largest oil exporters. and the deal with Ukraine will look something like this.
1.Eastern Ukraine is Russian territory

2. Western Ukraine remains sovereign

3. China will offer 1-2 trillion in infrastructure rebuilding

4. Zelensky will most likely have to resign or live in exile
Something like that.
Everybody gets to walk away a "Winner" for Ukraine they can say they won the battle of David and Goliath and fended off Putin. For Russia they can claim they won in getting Ukraine to secede half of their land. For China it makes them look outstanding on the world stage of the country that brokered a peace deal that The US and Nato could not. For Nato, the US and EU they can claim that this a win for liberal democracy and rake in the coffers of Ukrainians GDP for the next 150 years until their debt is payed off.

 

[Techpriest Mk II]

There's been some gigabrain retard takes posted here and that's pretty high up there among them, congrats.

 

[Elämällä on väliä]

Everybody gets to walk away a "Winner" for Ukraine they can say they won the battle of David and Goliath and fended off Putin. For Russia they can claim they won in getting Ukraine to secede half of their land. For China it makes them look outstanding on the world stage of the country that brokered a peace deal that The US and Nato could not. For Nato, the US and EU they can claim that this a win for liberal democracy and rake in the coffers of Ukrainians GDP for the next 150 years until their debt is payed off.

You shold waste less time on Europa Universalis.

You think the US, UK, France, Germany, Sweden, and Poland are just going to forget all the billions of dollars in weapons equipment that they Loaned Ukraine?

Which hardware was loaned? All was selled or donated.

1.Eastern Ukraine is Russian territory

2. Western Ukraine remains sovereign

3. China will offer 1-2 trillion in infrastructure rebuilding

4. Zelensky will most likely have to resign or live in exile

5. John Paul the Second will use necro on failed ruzkie soldiers and smashed ruzzkie tanks.

6. Putin will be gifted with one dead lion from Ghaza necro-zoo.

7. Cutted off balls of tranny vatniggers from kiwifarms will be boiled and donated to Chris Chan.

It's why Zelensky continues to negotiate with Putin for the use of the black Sea to export grain to Africa (the only thing that they can sell)

Black Sea deal was based on wishes of Turkey and other third world countries who are importing ukrainian grain. Also ruzzkie has on this moment no navy forces able to block any seaport.

In this moment it can be revoked, didn't change anything - to close a seaport by force you need force. Snow niggas have around nothing in Black Sea.

 

[Bungus Scrungus]

That said, while yes neither China nor the USSR would have accepted the complete take over of North Vietnam, but the US could have still curb stomped North Vietnam's troop concentrations. You can look at Sino-Vietnamese War and see what an acceptable curbing would have looked like: A punitive invasion to fully sack-tap the North, clearly denoted to the USSR and China as a non-permanent incursion.

Your post is nice and informative, but I was always under the impression that the Sino-Vietnamese war was embarrassing for China, considering the Western estimates of the death toll were fairly even between the two nations. Maybe my first mistake was considering the Western estimations; but still, I'm curious to learn more, albeit not here in this thread cause this is veering more into off-topic territory.

 

[CaptainAutism69]

Black Sea deal was based on wishes of Turkey and other third world countries who are importing ukrainian grain. Also ruzzkie has on this moment no navy forces able to block any seaport.

Spain, Turkey, The Netherlands, China and Italy are not third world countries. Ok Turkey maybe but still, the grain for the most part has not been going to Africa (because noone cares about Africans)

https://www.un.org/en/black-sea-grain-initiative/vessel-movements

 

[Blatant hypocrite]

I mean, in the particular situation in the video I don't see why he'd risk it. I can see the benefit of small arms fire at distracting the tank crew from antitank assets, especially when you're dug into a defensive position, and I've seen a recommendation of machinegun fire to damage APS' as a last resort. I wouldn't bank on hitting its optics though, especially if it's firing back.
Maybe I'm off-base though. I am just a hobbyist.

I think the caveats in war are always:

1. If you have the chance
2. If you get lucky
3. If you have no better option

Hypothetically say there's a 10%* chance you hit something important, and 90% chance the tank wipes out your squad instead. The best case is you're supplied with a proper ATGM, the second best case is you retreat, but failing that... just shoot it and see what happens. It's gonna kill us anyway.

*numbers are not representative, and depend on direction, aim, and what weapon you're shooting at what tank

Everybody gets to walk away a "Winner" for Ukraine they can say they won the battle of David and Goliath and fended off Putin. For Russia they can claim they won in getting Ukraine to secede half of their land. For China it makes them look outstanding on the world stage of the country that brokered a peace deal that The US and Nato could not. For Nato, the US and EU they can claim that this a win for liberal democracy and rake in the coffers of Ukrainians GDP for the next 150 years until their debt is payed off.

The general public knows that a "peace deal" with big amounts of territory surrendered is not a win. Everyone knows about North/South Korea.

You should see what the NATO folks are saying about the war.

It's a really fucking long video but the Ukraine-relevant parts are like an hour.

TLDR their attitude is pretty much that they're basically guaranteed to win in a couple years time, and Ukraine will be friendly to them. Then they talk about putting hundreds of billions of dollars in economic aid, basically like the Marshall Plan (their words not mine).

Doesn't take a genius to guess they're eager to bring Ukraine's natural resources into the Western sphere of influence. Especially their oil and gas and agriculture, a lot of which is in the East.

I don't think they're expecting any less than a total victory with 2013 or at least 2015 borders restored. You may call it arrogant and it probably is, but those are simply not the words of someone who's expecting to negotiate and concede.

Your post is nice and informative, but I was always under the impression that the Sino-Vietnamese war was embarrassing for China, considering the Western estimates of the death toll were fairly even between the two nations. Maybe my first mistake was considering the Western estimations; but still, I'm curious to learn more, albeit not here in this thread cause this is veering more into off-topic territory.

You're not wrong. I think most people consider the Paraguayan war to be a slaughter, and the Sino-Vietnamese war to be an embarrassment for the Chinese.

 

[DumbDude43]

the mounting pressure internally from the EU for oil so the citizen's don't die in the Winter

bro have you looked at a calendar recently? it's march. winter is over, and precisely zero people froze to death.

about the debt: it really isn't a big deal. westoids are prepared to write it off as a loss, maybe do some greece style debt restructuring shenanigans to soften the blow to their banks, whatever. economically and financially, ukraine is really tiny compared to the combined financial capabilities of burgerland, anglosphere and eurozone.

regarding comparisons to marshall plan: it's nowhere near the same size. marshall plan was done by america alone, and applied to half of europe (britain and france, west germany, austria, belgium, netherlands) much of which lay in ruins.
with ukraine the rebuilding effort would be much smaller in scale, and it wouldn't be done by just america alone but also by most of the other european and anglo countries. economically this is super tiny compared to the gargantuan effort that went into rebuilding half a continent after the largest war in history.

 

[Techpriest Mk II]

Your post is nice and informative, but I was always under the impression that the Sino-Vietnamese war was embarrassing for China, considering the Western estimates of the death toll were fairly even between the two nations. Maybe my first mistake was considering the Western estimations; but still, I'm curious to learn more, albeit not here in this thread cause this is veering more into off-topic territory.

It was extremely embarrassing for the PLA. They got ground to a stalemate by an enemy that on paper was quantitatively and qualitatively inferior to them. Vietnam didn't even have its best troops on the Chinese border, and it was those formations returning from Cambodia (airlifted by the Soviets) that made the Chinese claim victory and go home. The PLAAF was totally useless, the PLA took higher casualties than the second line and militia troops they were facing, and their arguable objective of grabbing Hanoi and putting in a Chinese puppet completely failed. It was as much a punitive expedition as the war in Ukraine.

 

[Ookoo Squad]

Your post is nice and informative, but I was always under the impression that the Sino-Vietnamese war was embarrassing for China, considering the Western estimates of the death toll were fairly even between the two nations. Maybe my first mistake was considering the Western estimations; but still, I'm curious to learn more, albeit not here in this thread cause this is veering more into off-topic territory.

I'd say it's on-topic, since it was in many ways a similar war to this one. Vietnam has often been, in some senses, the "Ukraine" of China: an oft-vassal state that China considers a natural part of its sphere, but which tends not to return the love, to put things lightly. In both cases the aggressor thought it would roll over its tiny neighbour in an easy war, and discovered its military's limitations the hard way.

 

[Bungus Scrungus]

It was extremely embarrassing for the PLA. They got ground to a stalemate by an enemy that on paper was quantitatively and qualitatively inferior to them. Vietnam didn't even have its best troops on the Chinese border, and it was those formations returning from Cambodia (airlifted by the Soviets) that made the Chinese claim victory and go home. The PLAAF was totally useless, the PLA took higher casualties than the second line and militia troops they were facing, and their arguable objective of grabbing Hanoi and putting in a Chinese puppet completely failed. It was as much a punitive expedition as the war in Ukraine.

Oh wow, I wasn't aware it was that bad. Extremely is an understatement, considering 4 years prior to the war Vietnam had just gotten done with a two decade long guerrilla/civil war.

I'd say it's on-topic, since it was in many ways a similar war to this one. Vietnam has often been, in some senses, the "Ukraine" of China: an oft-vassal state that China considers a natural part of its sphere, but which tends not to return the love, to put things lightly. In both cases the aggressor thought it would roll over its tiny neighbour in an easy war, and discovered its military's limitations the hard way.

Now that you mention it, you're not wrong. I wonder how Ukraine compares to the Soviet-Afghan war, and if it's as similar a situation as the Sino-Vietnamese one?